TX TX - Virginia Carpenter, 21, Denton, 1948

[scriptgirl]

Fascinating case. Not really sure what to think

 

[Philigumbo]

We recently saw several stories here in Dallas for the 15th anniversary of Kelli Cox's disappearance...still no leads...Her baby is now grown up without her mother. Sad case.

 

[Veidt]

I just got into this case, but the cab driver sounds really suspicious. What strikes me as weird from the whole story is that nobody saw or knew the yellow convertible. I'm sure that a vehicle like that is memorable, especially back then. I wonder if anyone else confirmed seeing her after she supposedly got out of the cab. I think that if these were people she knew, someone else would have known them too, I doubt very much that she was involved with the kind of people who are very secretive about their identities and in any case that kind of guy doesn't drive around in such a showy car. :what:

 

[cjstooks]

In 1979, I worked for Jerry Stout, owner of The Denton County Enterprise, a weekly newspaper. Jerry told me that he and a couple of his friends got a tip that
Virginia Carpenter had been buried under Bell Street, which was under construction at the time that Virginia disappeared. He also told me that she was on the Rifle Team at TWU and that they thought her rifle was buried with her. They somehow procured City of Denton overalls and a backhoe and about midnight one night, they dug up the section of Bell Street that they thought was about the right spot. They used a metal detector to look for the rifle. They did not find anything and left the street dug up for the city to repair. He didn't think anyone ever knew who dug up the street. I don't know when this occurred. It could have been in the sixties or seventies. I have never seen a reference to the
Rifle Team in anything else that I've read.

 

[zasx150]

In 1979, I worked for Jerry Stout, owner of The Denton County Enterprise, a weekly newspaper. Jerry told me that he and a couple of his friends got a tip that
Virginia Carpenter had been buried under Bell Street, which was under construction at the time that Virginia disappeared. He also told me that she was on the Rifle Team at TWU and that they thought her rifle was buried with her. They somehow procured City of Denton overalls and a backhoe and about midnight one night, they dug up the section of Bell Street that they thought was about the right spot. They used a metal detector to look for the rifle. They did not find anything and left the street dug up for the city to repair. He didn't think anyone ever knew who dug up the street. I don't know when this occurred. It could have been in the sixties or seventies. I have never seen a reference to the
Rifle Team in anything else that I've read.

cjstooks, I was wondering if you knew if there was any way one would be able to directly contact Mr. Stout. I have searched extensively but was unable to find any contact information; do you know of any work phone number or email I could reach him at?
Also, would you know if Denton keeps records of road construction and repair that I could use to confirm this information and find a date as to when he searched for Carpenter?
Any information you could provide would be greatly appreciated.

 

[STANDREID]

According to her driver, she got out of the cab a little after 21:00 (9 PM). The sunset at Denton for June 1 is around 8:41 so it would have been getting somewhat dark (more than 20 minutes after sunset) especially if it was cloudy. I wonder how well the cabby could have seen the guys and the car at that point. It also sounds a little suspicious that he was close enough the hear what she said to them.

This is assuming that Denton was then on daylight time. If it was on Standard Time then it would have been dark as midnight by 9 o'clock.

 

[STANDREID]

The year before her disappearance, five Texarkana teens were murdered by a person who has never been identified. The press dubbed him the ``Phantom Killer.'' Miss Carpenter and her family were friends with three of the five victims.

The site that contains this information is not very accurate. Actually, only three of those murdered in Texarkana were teens and all were quite a bit younger (3-5 years) than Virginia; that doesn't mean she didn't know them however. The victim who survived the Phantom was the closest to Virginia's age being one year younger.

 

[Stella]

According to her driver, she got out of the cab a little after 21:00 (9 PM). The sunset at Denton for June 1 is around 8:41 so it would have been getting somewhat dark (more than 20 minutes after sunset) especially if it was cloudy. I wonder how well the cabby could have seen the guys and the car at that point. It also sounds a little suspicious that he was close enough the hear what she said to them.

This is assuming that Denton was then on daylight time. If it was on Standard Time then it would have been dark as midnight by 9 o'clock.

Texas didn't do Daylight Savings Time back then.

 

[STANDREID]

Texas didn't do Daylight Savings Time back then.

OK, then it would have been totally dark at 9 PM.

 

[Stella]

I've tried searching for info on it but can't find anything about pre-daylight savings time in Texas. I remember from my 1950's summer childhood that I had to be inside by dark and I think that was around 9:00 pm. but I can't state it as fact.

 

[Stella]

Has anyone else read this? It offers a more in depth account of Virginia and what happened. Disappearance of Virginia Carpenter - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

A few years back, WFAA channel 8 in Dallas reported extensively on the new info that resulted in the digging operation to find her body. The man who called in the tip claimed that he knew the 2 young men in the convertible but because one of them came from a wealthy and influential Denton family, LE looked the other way. I hope that's not true.

 

[chesterfieldkings]

I was reading about the Texarkana Moonlight Murderer, a case that has fascinated me for years, at the same Wikipedia page referenced above and I clicked the link for Virginia Carpenter and realized I had read her case file before at The Charley Project. It is possible that she ran away, if any of the alleged sightings are true, but I really think the taxi driver is good for the crime, despite the fact that he passed more than one polygraph.

 

[Tulessa]

[video=youtube;MPhKFYQBiD0]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MPhKFYQBiD0[/video]

 

[MelmothTheLost]

The man who called in the tip claimed that he knew the 2 young men in the convertible but because one of them came from a wealthy and influential Denton family, LE looked the other way. I hope that's not true.

According to Wikipedia, the population of Denton in 1950 was 21,372 so I would imagine that if any local young man owned a yellow convertible it would be well known in the area.

 

[STANDREID]

From the video-who the heck is Daniel Mock and why was he being questioned regarding Virginia's Case?

 

[reportertype]

I wondered the same; first time I've heard that name. I don't remember hearing she shared a cab to the school, but maybe I've just forgotten. The person behind those videos has a whole series of them, many of them really old cases.

 

[Route666]

Hello, websleuths! Long time lurker, first time poster. I've always been fascinated by this case, and finally got to put my two cents in.
So I was looking up some new information or deatils on this case and stumbled across a website of Decatur Bowling Association. There I saw a photo of a lady whose name was Virginia Carpenter. This is her photo:


The website says that she started playing bowling in the middle 1950's, became a professional bowler and later became a coach.

I must say that I do see a resemblance between this lady and the missing Virginia Carpenter. The smile, the chin, the nose... Here is a combined picture of them:


And, of course, the name! But, in my opinion, if she had decided to run away deliberately and start a new life, then she would have changed her name. But, who knows. What do you guys think?

Here is the original link: http://decaturusbc.com/hof.php?hofyear=1990

 

[STANDREID]

Hello, websleuths! Long time lurker, first time poster. I've always been fascinated by this case, and finally got to put my two cents in.
So I was looking up some new information or deatils on this case and stumbled across a website of Decatur Bowling Association. There I saw a photo of a lady whose name was Virginia Carpenter. This is her photo:

The website says that she started playing bowling in the middle 1950's, became a professional bowler and later became a coach.

I must say that I do see a resemblance between this lady and the missing Virginia Carpenter. The smile, the chin, the nose... Here is a combined picture of them:

And, of course, the name! But, in my opinion, if she had decided to run away deliberately and start a new life, then she would have changed her name. But, who knows. What do you guys think?

Here is the original link: http://decaturusbc.com/hof.php?hofyear=1990

I agree with you on all your points and welcome to WS participation-hopefully we'll hear more from you. It's most likely not her but it would really be something if she kept her name and still avoided detection. Anything is possible, so who knows !?:thinking:

 

[Route666]

Thanks a lot, Standreid! I guess you're right about this lady not being our missing Virginia, but I find it interesting anyway. Then again, who knows! Maybe I'll try to contact someone from Decatur Bowling Association through their website and ask if they remember something about this woman.

 

[bbking]

Its been a while that this thread was used.

But my 2 cents, what I find very suspicious is the role of the taxidriver, Edgar Ray Zachary, he was the last one seeing her. Dont get me wrong, I mean the guy is dead so I dont want to blame anybody till its proved that they did it indeed or till the day God judges this world and it will be known who the killer was if she was killed ofcourse.

But the taxidriver was accused of attempting for raping a girl years afther Virginia got missing. In fact, there is an newsarticle about it in the Abilene reporter news paper of Texas. On page 15 of august 20, 1957, for those with an account on websites containing historical newspapers you can search it up yourself. Or use google for an other newspaper also mentioning this case: https://news.google.com/newspapers?...AIBAJ&sjid=JVYDAAAAIBAJ&pg=3745,5189669&hl=nl
The taxidriver was also been in and out of trouble with the law years before Virginia got missing.

There is an book written by an old texas ranger Private that investigated the Viriginia Carpenter case, the book is called In the Line of Duty: Reflections of a Texas Ranger Private. You can see parts of the book trough google books, from page 82 till 89 you can read about this case. And also the mentioning of the attemted rape of the taxidriver and that the police thought the taxidriver was the main suspect for while. He past an polygraph test.


The taxidriver had an alibi, his wife told the police that he came home arround 10:00 p:m. But years later I found that she stated that she had lied about this and the her husband came home late in the night. I only found this on an website containing some info about this case.

So all clews are pointing in my opinion to the last person that saw her alive. But stil never convicted so only God knows.