GUILTY UK - Alfie Lamb, 3, noisy, fatally crushed by car passenger seat pushed back by mom's bf, Feb 2018

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bears10 said:
". Why did the driver agree to drive with a toddler on the floor of the car and not in a car seat? Why didn't his mother protect him? And the biggest question is why on earth did that dirtbag kill a little innocent boy? .
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I suspect that the child was forced to sit on the floor so the adults wouldn't be caught driving with a child who is not in a car seat.
 
Littlegreenlady said:
Just everything from this post really. I know we didn't sit in the jury and hear the evidence (I'm very glad I didn't, I don't think I could have listened to what happened to him) but at the same time, knowing what we do know, how could this be a hung jury. Whilst there may have been no intent to actually kill, or even maim, pushing the chair back in that way was clearly an attack on the child. The action itself, regardless of the consequences is child abuse. But to do it twice is even worse. And how the mother could not even move the child from the position is heartbreaking.
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Certainly that was the crown's narrative, and what they tried to convince the jury of. Some of the reports hint at an alternative narrative: wanted to preserve his legroom, thought the child was making a fuss about nothing, didn't realise the damage that was being caused. Legally there are different kinds of manslaughter and routes to a conviction and the legal argument may not have been straightforward. If the prosecution go for retrial, hopefully, they'll have time to refine their case. The sentencing hearing's tomorrow by the way, our time.
 
It's extremely sad. Such irresponsible behaviour which brought to death. But at least it shows the importance of the need for proper baby seats which are unable to harm. I mean, even dog car seats today are made technologically good. You can browse around here to get my point. But anyway, I hope the retrial will reveal more details on this accident.
 
A mother whose three-year-old son was crushed to death by an electric car seat has today been jailed for just two years and nine months for child cruelty.

Hoare was cleared of manslaughter following a trial earlier this year but convicted of child cruelty. [Boyfriend] Waterson faces a manslaughter retrial at the Old Bailey later this year.

Mr Justice Kerr today jailed her for two years for the child cruelty offence following the 'sad case'. She was given eight months for conspiring to pervert the course of justice by making false statements to police and one month, both consecutive, for assaulting Williams.

Alfie Lamb's mother is jailed for more than two years for child cruelty | Daily Mail Online
 
Erm, hang on:

On the day Alfie died Waterson and Hoare had been out shopping in Sutton with Hoare's friend Emilie Williams and another man, Waterson's stepbrother and Hoare's ex Marcus Lamb.

But:
At the age of 15 she left home and by the age of 18 gave birth to her son, Alfie Lamb. [She] lived with her then partner, Richard Lamb, who was 15 years her senior. In 2015, after they split up, Lamb became violent and set light to Hoare's flat while she and the then baby Alfie were out, the court heard. Lamb was jailed for three years and Hoare moved to Blackpool for a 'new start', which was where she met Stephen Waterson in 2016.

Then:
Marcus Lamb, 22, was the cousin of Alfie and connected to Waterson as the son of his biological mother's boyfriend.

I JUST CAN'T DO THE MATH!!

Who is Alfie's dad? Are Richard and Marcus related? Is Waterson also related?
 
Marcus Lamb told the court he knew Hoare through his uncle Richard, Alfie's father, and was dating Miss Williams, 19, who was also in the car.

Stephen Waterson called 999 after Alfie collapsed in the back of his car on the journey home from a shopping trip. His stepbrother Marcus Lamb, 22, who had been behind the wheel, told jurors: "He started bawling out tears, saying something like 'what have I done'."

Alfie Lamb's mum 'hit tot for crying as lover fatally crushed him with car seat'
 
So did Hoare have baby Alfie with Richard, then have a relationship with Richard's nephew Marcus, then move on to Marcus's step brother Stephen?

Anyway, it's by-the-by I suppose... I don't think Hoare's sentence is long enough considering she was abusive, neglectful and put Alfie in danger. But then she's not the one that killed him either. Hoping Waterson gets a stiff sentence when the trial starts in September.
 
CoverMeCagney said:
Anyway, it's by-the-by I suppose... I don't think Hoare's sentence is long enough considering she was abusive, neglectful and put Alfie in danger. But then she's not the one that killed him either. Hoping Waterson gets a stiff sentence when the trial starts in September.
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I think if she had a normal life the sentence wouldn't be enough but it sounds like she had a dire upbringing and an abusive partner so maybe just didn't know any better. I'd hope she isn't able to keep any further children she has.

Her upbringing sounds similar to Shauna Hoares.
 
Ironside said:
I think if she had a normal life the sentence wouldn't be enough but it sounds like she had a dire upbringing and an abusive partner so maybe just didn't know any better. I'd hope she isn't able to keep any further children she has.

Her upbringing sounds similar to Shauna Hoares.
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I haven't read anything about her upbringing other than having to split her time between her parents and her mother having substance abuse problems, but I haven't followed the case closely. What dire things happened to her in her childhood other than divorced parents (one with substance abuse issues)?
 
I said it sounds like she had a dire upbringing, I'm not aware of all the details but I'd guess they're unpleasant. A girl leaving home at 15 and then going on to a relationship with a much older man is not a sign of a wholesome childhood.
 
bears10 said:
I haven't read anything about her upbringing other than having to split her time between her parents and her mother having substance abuse problems, but I haven't followed the case closely. What dire things happened to her in her childhood other than divorced parents (one with substance abuse issues)?
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A bit more detail and an interview with her mother:

'My daughter should have been jailed for life for letting her poor son die'

"Janis admits she and Hoare had a volatile relationship and she chose to live with her dad at 13, moving back in when she was 17. Alfie was conceived after a one-night stand in 2013, when Hoare was 18, and at first she did not know who the dad was."
 
KarenUK said:
A bit more detail and an interview with her mother:

'My daughter should have been jailed for life for letting her poor son die'

"Janis admits she and Hoare had a volatile relationship and she chose to live with her dad at 13, moving back in when she was 17. Alfie was conceived after a one-night stand in 2013, when Hoare was 18, and at first she did not know who the dad was."
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Unfortunate, but not uncommon. Many people have similar upbringings and don’t go on to neglect/abuse/murder their children.
 
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