I agree. Yes, to sell, you would need the charger. Shops rarely want them without.
UK UK - Andrew Gosden, 14, Doncaster, South Yorks, 14 Sept 2007
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jaycool
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Thank you for this, i did not know Sony had done this. An important detail i have missed, back to the drawing board for me.
It must mean Andrew only used the PSP to play games/music/movies. The motive for bringing the PSP must have simply been to pass time.
I agree also that if he really wanted to sell the PSP bringing the charger would make sense, at least at a well known store that buys them.
I predict leaving the charger behind is more indicative he was not going to sell it, leaving a charger behind would be pointless otherwise.
1. Andrew left intentionally. He hid in the park and changed his clothes.
2. Andrew put his uniform in the washing machine. (Buying himself time. "Well, he has been home as his uniform is in the machine, He must have changed and gone out." You need time if you skive off to London from a distance on a schoolday."
3. Andrew took money. He shows the intention to do something other than harm himself. £200 is not a great amount in London, but you can have a good time with it. You can also get back to Doncaster if you need to.
4. Andrew left his PSP charger behind. You would take it if you intended to be away overnight, or to sell the charger. If you go on a day trip, you might leave it as there is nowhere to charge it.
5. Andrew knew where he was going but not where he would return from. (He wanted a one-way ticket.)
6. Andrew intended to go to London. He may have intended to go out of London.
7. Andrew is not hiding from CCTV at Kings Cross (what we don't have is CCTV later, but there is no way of knowing if Andrew hid from it as police did not review CCTV till too late.)
8. Andrew has no luggage and no coat. He is dressed for a day trip on a Summer day.
9. Andrew's bag is the kind you take for the day.
10. Andrew traveled to a place he knew where there are many attractions to fill a day playing truant.
11. Andrew was quiet the evening before and moody the day he left.
12. Andrew had begun to walk home from school.
13. Andrew broke perfect attendance at school. He did this intentionally.
14. Andrew did not make an excuse to the school for his attendance (like pretending to be a parent and saying he was sick.) The school did not let parents know he was not there. However, Andrew would know this was their policy. He would expect his parents to find out about his absence earlier in the day than the end of school.
15. Andrew got to Kings Cross. This is a known place for pickups and grooming.
16. Andrew got to Kings Cross where you can catch trains, boat trains, buses, or walk to a variety of places.
17. Andrew looks small, but while you might look twice or wonder "what is that lad doing out of school?" he is not so young you might worry about him traveling alone.
18. Andrew has not been in touch.
19. Andrew was close to his sister.
20. Andrew had money for a phone call.
21. Andrew left no suicide letter
22. Andrew has not used money placed in his bank account or his bank account.
23. Andrew left money in his room.
24. No art gallery, museum attendant or anyone working at a gig has remembered Andrew.
25. His school friends, and any friend, have been conspicuously absent online. If your friend or someone from your school went missing wouldn't you be all over it like a rash online? Perhaps they are locally, but somehow that online lack of presence concerns me.
26. The man that turned up to the police station with Andrew remains an enigma.
I doubt suicide, think abduction possible, but the indications are he may well not be with us any longer. What I cannot see is an intention to disappear.
2. Andrew put his uniform in the washing machine. (Buying himself time. "Well, he has been home as his uniform is in the machine, He must have changed and gone out." You need time if you skive off to London from a distance on a schoolday."
3. Andrew took money. He shows the intention to do something other than harm himself. £200 is not a great amount in London, but you can have a good time with it. You can also get back to Doncaster if you need to.
4. Andrew left his PSP charger behind. You would take it if you intended to be away overnight, or to sell the charger. If you go on a day trip, you might leave it as there is nowhere to charge it.
5. Andrew knew where he was going but not where he would return from. (He wanted a one-way ticket.)
6. Andrew intended to go to London. He may have intended to go out of London.
7. Andrew is not hiding from CCTV at Kings Cross (what we don't have is CCTV later, but there is no way of knowing if Andrew hid from it as police did not review CCTV till too late.)
8. Andrew has no luggage and no coat. He is dressed for a day trip on a Summer day.
9. Andrew's bag is the kind you take for the day.
10. Andrew traveled to a place he knew where there are many attractions to fill a day playing truant.
11. Andrew was quiet the evening before and moody the day he left.
12. Andrew had begun to walk home from school.
13. Andrew broke perfect attendance at school. He did this intentionally.
14. Andrew did not make an excuse to the school for his attendance (like pretending to be a parent and saying he was sick.) The school did not let parents know he was not there. However, Andrew would know this was their policy. He would expect his parents to find out about his absence earlier in the day than the end of school.
15. Andrew got to Kings Cross. This is a known place for pickups and grooming.
16. Andrew got to Kings Cross where you can catch trains, boat trains, buses, or walk to a variety of places.
17. Andrew looks small, but while you might look twice or wonder "what is that lad doing out of school?" he is not so young you might worry about him traveling alone.
18. Andrew has not been in touch.
19. Andrew was close to his sister.
20. Andrew had money for a phone call.
21. Andrew left no suicide letter
22. Andrew has not used money placed in his bank account or his bank account.
23. Andrew left money in his room.
24. No art gallery, museum attendant or anyone working at a gig has remembered Andrew.
25. His school friends, and any friend, have been conspicuously absent online. If your friend or someone from your school went missing wouldn't you be all over it like a rash online? Perhaps they are locally, but somehow that online lack of presence concerns me.
26. The man that turned up to the police station with Andrew remains an enigma.
I doubt suicide, think abduction possible, but the indications are he may well not be with us any longer. What I cannot see is an intention to disappear.
I think he's almost certainly dead by foul play. The lack of body suggests somebody has hidden it and clearly hidden it well or I think it would have been discovered from a suicide or accident.
Unless the body turns up I don't think we'll ever get answers on this case as the police lost loads of potential evidence in the early days. They didn't even request most of the surrounding CCTV until it was long deleted.
I still believe the guy at Leominster police station was vital. If you look at the police station location you don't just wander by there by chance, he purposely went there. I think they had some sort of information and then bottled it.
Unless the body turns up I don't think we'll ever get answers on this case as the police lost loads of potential evidence in the early days. They didn't even request most of the surrounding CCTV until it was long deleted.
I still believe the guy at Leominster police station was vital. If you look at the police station location you don't just wander by there by chance, he purposely went there. I think they had some sort of information and then bottled it.
You do not bottle information unless you are afraid. If you have information, then you go all out to tell the police that information if you can. I agree the person went there on purpose.
Part of me agrees with you. But the part that does not keeps thinking of the plea that was made by L.E I believe to the National Health and Medical Professionals in general. That came from somewhere.
I apologize if I did not refer to the National Health by the correct name. I spend so much time worrying about US healthcare and all of that that sometimes I tune the whole worldwide topic out in general lol
I apologize if I did not refer to the National Health by the correct name. I spend so much time worrying about US healthcare and all of that that sometimes I tune the whole worldwide topic out in general lol
This has been raised and discounted - however I don't think it was that easy to get wifi in the mid 2000s as it is now?
A non-related thought; September is the beginning of the school year in the UK. I am thinking at 14 he was starting Year 10 - new courses as he would be commencing GCSEs. Probably a lot more intense and in classes with some different people. I am thinking he was 2 weeks max into a new school year with a lot of challenges. Could this have triggered a "screw this, I'm getting out of here" moment?
A non-related thought; September is the beginning of the school year in the UK. I am thinking at 14 he was starting Year 10 - new courses as he would be commencing GCSEs. Probably a lot more intense and in classes with some different people. I am thinking he was 2 weeks max into a new school year with a lot of challenges. Could this have triggered a "screw this, I'm getting out of here" moment?
Al Ka
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This aired last night on Channel 5 special edition of Missing with one of the cases being Andrew's.
Original version was much longer (30 min) with other cases and interviews but it is not on Channel5 FB page.
FB link - Channel 5 News
Original version was much longer (30 min) with other cases and interviews but it is not on Channel5 FB page.
FB link - Channel 5 News
Mrs Marple
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So very sad.
I still think he went to London to meet someone and came to harm. He left some things behind and putting the uniform in the washer indicates he had an alibi when he wasn't home later that night; he came back from school and went out again.
I still think he went to London to meet someone and came to harm. He left some things behind and putting the uniform in the washer indicates he had an alibi when he wasn't home later that night; he came back from school and went out again.
Deathsgrandaughter
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Saw the Channel 5 programme on Andrew the other night. This is one of those cases that sticks with you. I've been reading the thread here and some of the many many threads on Reddit and some things occur to me. Not quite as many as in Jackalyn's insghtful post above
It was the start of a new school year. Andrew's sister was two years older. Was this the first time that she and Andrew had been in different schools, and therefore the first opportunity he had to skip school knowing he would not be noticed quickly by a family member? I am assuming she went to a Sixth form at a different location,.
This also begs the question; did he know about the wrong contact number in the school records? My children's school sends home all the contact information they hold for the children on printed sheets in early September for us to correct and return with the children. It would be easy in such circumstances for Andrew to alter the details. Or as speculated above, maybe as a pupil with a perfect attendance record he just did not realise that the school would contact his parents.
The walking home thing. I have wondered if this was just to make the time that Andrew arrived home later. This would give him potentially more time before his absence was discovered.
Upthread posters have wondered about friends and their silence. A class mate of Andrew's had posted on Reddit (sorry, I can't find the link again; there are umpteen threads on this story and every time someone has a theory (usually heard before) they start a new thread. If I come across it I will post it. He described Andrew as odd, and a loner, but with a couple of close friends. He also said that Andrew had a black book in which he wrote the names of people who had upset him in some way. He did not know of Andrew being bullied, but would not have been surprised and thought this might be why he had avoided the school bus.
There is a Daily Mail article (link at bottom) from 2009 which includes testimony from people who knew Andrew. Alan Murray, the vicar who saw Andrew in the park that morning, said
I saw Andrew as an absent-minded professor, a brilliant mathematician; Kevin used to say you’d have to pack a toothbrush on his behalf.
I wondered if this would explain the lack of PSP charger. The not taking a coat and/or jumper seems to be endemic to that age group.
So, all I can come up with in the end, is Andrew went to London of his own volition. The issue is whether he intended to return or to stay. He did not return, so is his lengthy absence his own doing or someone else's?
The lack of CCTV is so frustrating; that could have answered so many questions. I can't imagine how his family must feel. I am sure all parents are familiar with that sick feeling when you turn around and your child is nowhere to be seen. How can you cope when that is never alleviated?
Link to DM article:
Runaway child: 'How can a kid disappear from the face of the earth?’ | Daily Mail Online
It was the start of a new school year. Andrew's sister was two years older. Was this the first time that she and Andrew had been in different schools, and therefore the first opportunity he had to skip school knowing he would not be noticed quickly by a family member? I am assuming she went to a Sixth form at a different location,.
This also begs the question; did he know about the wrong contact number in the school records? My children's school sends home all the contact information they hold for the children on printed sheets in early September for us to correct and return with the children. It would be easy in such circumstances for Andrew to alter the details. Or as speculated above, maybe as a pupil with a perfect attendance record he just did not realise that the school would contact his parents.
The walking home thing. I have wondered if this was just to make the time that Andrew arrived home later. This would give him potentially more time before his absence was discovered.
Upthread posters have wondered about friends and their silence. A class mate of Andrew's had posted on Reddit (sorry, I can't find the link again; there are umpteen threads on this story and every time someone has a theory (usually heard before) they start a new thread. If I come across it I will post it. He described Andrew as odd, and a loner, but with a couple of close friends. He also said that Andrew had a black book in which he wrote the names of people who had upset him in some way. He did not know of Andrew being bullied, but would not have been surprised and thought this might be why he had avoided the school bus.
There is a Daily Mail article (link at bottom) from 2009 which includes testimony from people who knew Andrew. Alan Murray, the vicar who saw Andrew in the park that morning, said
I saw Andrew as an absent-minded professor, a brilliant mathematician; Kevin used to say you’d have to pack a toothbrush on his behalf.
I wondered if this would explain the lack of PSP charger. The not taking a coat and/or jumper seems to be endemic to that age group.
So, all I can come up with in the end, is Andrew went to London of his own volition. The issue is whether he intended to return or to stay. He did not return, so is his lengthy absence his own doing or someone else's?
The lack of CCTV is so frustrating; that could have answered so many questions. I can't imagine how his family must feel. I am sure all parents are familiar with that sick feeling when you turn around and your child is nowhere to be seen. How can you cope when that is never alleviated?
Link to DM article:
Runaway child: 'How can a kid disappear from the face of the earth?’ | Daily Mail Online
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Mrs Marple
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That's a very interesting article. Something isn't right though, am l the only one getting that? I need time to reflect on it. Could be nothing.
Edit: I'm leaning towards he left of his own accord now, what's happened since is anyone's guess.
The not taking a charger or a coat makes some sense from that article. My teenage son was the same, in fact now at 20 he would still go out in mid winter without a coat.
It sounds like he was beginning to rebel against his parents. Like many teenagers. It's a time for becoming self aware and identifying who you are and where you want to go. Sounds like he was leaning towards an alternative scene.
I'm not sure why you would let a 14 year old read Nietzsche to be honest. It's a delicate time when impressions can be made. Ultimately he decides he's superior to everyone else. I'm wondering if the lack of friends, withdrawing from contact, reading this book has led him down this path of abandoning everything he has known in search of something else.
Everything sounds a bit too perfect in his home life, but I'm getting the impression he aas actually quite a troubled, confused chap who was potentially open to suggestion.
Edit: I'm leaning towards he left of his own accord now, what's happened since is anyone's guess.
The not taking a charger or a coat makes some sense from that article. My teenage son was the same, in fact now at 20 he would still go out in mid winter without a coat.
It sounds like he was beginning to rebel against his parents. Like many teenagers. It's a time for becoming self aware and identifying who you are and where you want to go. Sounds like he was leaning towards an alternative scene.
I'm not sure why you would let a 14 year old read Nietzsche to be honest. It's a delicate time when impressions can be made. Ultimately he decides he's superior to everyone else. I'm wondering if the lack of friends, withdrawing from contact, reading this book has led him down this path of abandoning everything he has known in search of something else.
Everything sounds a bit too perfect in his home life, but I'm getting the impression he aas actually quite a troubled, confused chap who was potentially open to suggestion.
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Deathsgrandaughter
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Andrew's parents sound really great, and it seems as if they were happy and indeed encouraged their children to follow their own path. But that can bring its own kind of stress, It is hard to feel very rebellious if that is your mood if your parents accept everything you do. Probably the only way you can rebel is to get away.
I do like your point about the possible effects of reading Nietzsche. I never restricted my children's reading, and I doubt Andrew's parents did either. I can see how a gifted child, elevated to the Gifted and Talented group above most of his peers, seeing school as a necessary hoop he needed to jump through, could easily believe himself superior, a feeling affirmed by his reading, I think you may be right that he left in search of something else.
forthelost
I hear the angels call my name and I am Winterborn
I don't think you "let" a child that age read something. They'll pick whatever it is they like.
Mrs Marple
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I appreciate that comment sounds judgemental and l suppose it is, because l would question it if it were my son. They can pick what they like, that doesn't mean you have to like or tolerate it if it's potentially unsuitable.
Littlegreenlady
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When I was 13 I wanted to read the exorcist. I bought a copy second hand, and my mum caught me with it and took it away. I went to the library the next day and got it out and made sure it was better hidden
The writing names down in a book - I wonder if his plan was to disappear for a short period of time, and then reappear - a bit like a "they'll be sorry when I'm gone" type feeling and that he thought people might feel guilty at his going? Just a thought really
Deathsgrandaughter
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When I was 13 I wanted to read the exorcist. I bought a copy second hand, and my mum caught me with it and took it away. I went to the library the next day and got it out and made sure it was better hidden
OT, Littlegreenlady you were bad!
I have rediscovered the Reddit thread. It is entitled Possible destination for Andrew Gosden. A few posts in the class mate of Andrew's joins (username
YorkshireASMR)
He clearly did not know Andrew very well, as he has no idea of his familiarity with London, but paints a picture of a clever boy, who was friends with his intellectual equals, (of which there were few) Although not well liked the poster speculates this was probably jealousy to some extent.
cobalt sky
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Ohhh this little cutie , just saw today that there's a thread for him here. I have read a lot about him on other sites. Was just scrolling back through the most recent posts here and this caught my eye:
For some reason I don't recall ever hearing that he attended a Summer Program. @emem1138 (or anyone with info) do you have any other details about the program? You posted "weeks", that would definitely be plenty of time for someone to gain his trust. Was it a local thing, like at the school? It's possible he did meet someone during the program and secretly kept in touch after it was over.
, just saw today that there's a thread for him here. I have read a lot about him on other sites. Was just scrolling back through the most recent posts here and this caught my eye:For some reason I don't recall ever hearing that he attended a Summer Program. @emem1138 (or anyone with info) do you have any other details about the program? You posted "weeks", that would definitely be plenty of time for someone to gain his trust. Was it a local thing, like at the school? It's possible he did meet someone during the program and secretly kept in touch after it was over.
Deathsgrandaughter
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It is mentioned in several articles about him. Not much is said except that he went and was enthusiastic about it. I had assumed it was part of the school's Young Gifted and Talented Program, but that is not made explicit in this article at least:
Andrew was smart. He was a member of the Young Gifted and Talented programme, a scheme designed to enhance the educational development of the top 5 percent of schoolchildren. Teachers at McAuley Catholic High School believed he was a shoe-in for Cambridge.
"Andrew was too clever by half," remembers Kevin. "He tended to say little about school, but we remember him coming back from summer school for gifted and talented kids, and he was absolutely enthused about what he had been doing. To be honest, I think Andrew saw school as something you sort of had to do just in order to have choices open to you for adult life."
FROM:
The Strange Disappearance of Andrew Gosden
Andrew was smart. He was a member of the Young Gifted and Talented programme, a scheme designed to enhance the educational development of the top 5 percent of schoolchildren. Teachers at McAuley Catholic High School believed he was a shoe-in for Cambridge.
"Andrew was too clever by half," remembers Kevin. "He tended to say little about school, but we remember him coming back from summer school for gifted and talented kids, and he was absolutely enthused about what he had been doing. To be honest, I think Andrew saw school as something you sort of had to do just in order to have choices open to you for adult life."
FROM:
The Strange Disappearance of Andrew Gosden
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Deathsgrandaughter
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Just looking to see if I could find another reference to the summer school - all I could find was the identical quote from Andrew's dad.
However I did spot this on the Help us find Andrew site
The police took all Andrew's posters away to look for fingerprints about a year ago - unfortunately they didn't find any.
No CCTV and no fingerprints???
The above quote is dated 6th November 2009 and was originally printed in the Daily Star. (Not the most reliable newspaper, but if it is quoted on the official blog I am assuming it is correct)
In The Press
However I did spot this on the Help us find Andrew site
The police took all Andrew's posters away to look for fingerprints about a year ago - unfortunately they didn't find any.
No CCTV and no fingerprints???
The above quote is dated 6th November 2009 and was originally printed in the Daily Star. (Not the most reliable newspaper, but if it is quoted on the official blog I am assuming it is correct)
In The Press
JSolt1210
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I'm starting to agree with the person upthread who suggested a possible connection with the summer school program.
When I was a kid, I attended a similar type of program. It involved two rounds of summer school at the end of fifth and sixth grades, along with Wednesday evenings and Saturdays during sixth grade. Programs like those mix up the crowd, exposing you to other kids you probably would've never met because you're not in each other's districts.
I don't know how Andrew's program might've worked, but mine included older kids who had already gone through the program and had been offered to return and work with kids just beginning the program. Of course, to me at the time they looked like adults, but in reality they were probably just five or six years older than I.
Could Andrew's program have had a similar structure, and maybe he connected with one of those older kids? Or with a teacher/mentor? Any one of these could've been a pedophile who knew how to groom him.
If so, this might explain the lack of an online presence because they could've exchanged contact info directly. They could've even arranged to meet up at certain times after his regular school started (through pay phones?), which would explain his sudden desire to "walk" home from school.
As for the "walk", I'm sorry, but I don't buy that. If it's true that the distance between his school and home is 5 miles, that's 100 blocks in New York City (where I'm from). I love to walk in the city, but I can't imagine doing that with a backpack full of school books. I think he was using that extra time to meet up with this person.
I do think he had the intention of coming home. I agree that putting the uniform in the laundry was a ruse to buy himself more time in case he was late from his outing. Since he had perfect attendance, would he have known that the school reported an absence directly to his parents?
Just for reference, I discovered that in 2007, £200 was approximately $400. Even in New York City today, there's plenty you can do with $400 in your pocket, and even more if you know how to be frugal—though I don't know how much more things cost on average in Great Britain than they do here in the U.S.
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