GUILTY UK - Helen Bailey, 51, Royston, 11 April 2016 #9

[Legally Bland]

Any thoughts on why IS really made that trip to Tony Hurley a week after Helen died? He admits himself he knew she wasnt with him and the story about confiding him about the kidnappers was clearly BS. So what was the true purpose of that visit?

Was he going to play the worried fiancee who thought Tony might know where she was, in an attempt to get Tony onside for when the will came into play?

Or was he going to ask him about the will?

KC, TH's personal assistant:
_______________

14:41

Mrs Cotter received 'desperate' sounding voicemail from Stewart

“On Monday, April 18, I got a call from Stewart who left a message on my voicemail. He’d said he had driven from Royston to Leatherhead (Surrey) to see Tony Hurley.

“He sounded desperate, upset, said he just didn’t know what he was doing. He said he wanted to speak to Tony.

“I told Stewart to speak to Tony that evening. Tony had looked after Helen’s investments.

“Stewart had not indicated what he wanted to speak to Tony about.

“Stewart left another voicemail on April 20. He wanted to know if Helen was able to access the money from her account and if she was able to, had she.

“He wanted to know if the police had contacted us. I wasn’t prepared to answer any of the questions until I spoke to our CEO to ascertain if it was OK to give this information to him.”


14:47

More calls to Mrs Cotter

“I told Stewart Helen could access the money in her investment management accounts, but that she hadn’t accessed them.

“He asked me to contact him if Helen attended a planned function on April 22.

“On April 27 he phoned me again. I heard from him again on May 4, I received a missed call and another voicemail at 11.36am.

“That was all a bit odd, it [the call] was all muffled. It sounded like a call you’d make when you left your phone in your pocket.

“At the time he sounded desperate and generally upset.”

Mrs Cotter is now being cross examined by the defence. She admitted that she didn’t know Stewart particularly well. She said her boss Mr Hurley was someone who knew Helen for more than 30 years.

“They were also very good friends. Mr Hurley had known Helen’s previous husband very well”, she told jurors. She said Stewart couldn’t understand why police had not contacted her [Mrs Cotter] or the firm she worked for, as he had provided police with her phone details. That’s the end of Mrs Cotter’s evidence.

http://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/news/cambridge-news/live-helen-bailey-murder-trial-12464906

This is all we got from TH on his discussion with IS:
_______________

14:46

Stewart contacted Mr Hurley after Helen's disappearance

Mr Hurley said he had an “unusual” telephone conversation with Ian Stewart on Apri 18, 2016. Stewart had been to his office asking to speak to him while Hurley was out.

Mr Hurley said: “By this time I’d got to know Ian Stewart a little better, we’d been to several functions together. He knew how close I was to Helen.”

“Ian said to me directly ‘I’m in a terrible state at the moment and the reason I drove to your office in Surrey was that I wanted to look at you straight in the eye. I’ve looked at Helen’s emails… and ask is Helen staying with you?

“I answered that by saying Helen was not staying with me.”

He adds he would have made it clear that if she was in distress he would have taken her in and told her to get in touch with the police.

14:49

Hurley said he thought it possible that Helen could have gone to Broadstairs

Stewart told Mr Hurley about the note he claims was left by Ms Bailey saying she had gone to Broadstairs.

Mr Hurley said: “I always had the feeling that Helen could do something quite exciting in that way. As long as Boris was with her.

“To my mind it was something that was not beyond the realm of possibility. She also did have a great fondness for Broadstairs and Stewart had said to me that that was where she had gone.”


http://www.cambridge-news.co.uk/news/local-news/helen-bailey-murder-trial-week-12531416

 

[Alyce]

She usually did the walk after breakfast though so if he gave it her after the walk it wasnt hidden in breakfast.

Maybe he'd just done enough trial runs to know when it usually started to kick in

I have always thought he gave it to her via her vitamin tablets - and also via paracetamol, should she need any

 

[ColourPurple]

Regarding the benefit aspect, as with so many issues around this man I find it disgusting that he has seemingly been receiving this money for years, no questions asked, while we read of tragic cases of suicide when deserving people have had their eligibility reassessed and their monies withdrawn.

Grrr this man seems to have spent his entire life getting away with things - and I feel sure we don't even know the half of it! It was perhaps inevitable he would eventually get caught out, but how tragic that Helen and Boris had to lose their lives before it happened.

Benefit fraud or dubious benefit claims seem to crop up a lot in the big UK cases. Ellie Butler's case was the most recent one that springs to mind. That's not to say that benefit fraud is common , I think it's just common amongst a certain type of dishonest person.

 

[Tiny]

Agree DD with your comment about the leisure centre comp. didn't a poster (sorry forget whom) say that £7k was the equivalent of £40k. I think that definitely set the ball rolling in getting money outside work.
Re Savings - He received £28k from Diane Lim's employer and £16k from Legal and general. I do wonder if she had any other life insurance policies which contributed to the £163k. He had 50k from the house sale.
Re 2k per month - I reckon he might have had a final salary pension scheme, as well as insurance to protect himself in case of injury. IS admitted he liked to barter and we have seen examples of him being economic with the truth. The remainder of his £2k must have been DWP payments. I do wonder if he had received notification that this was going to change.

I dont doubt that that his MF must have been uncomfortable but like posters have stated he could have done a PT job.

 

[ColourPurple]

KC, TH's personal assistant:
_______________

14:41

Mrs Cotter received 'desperate' sounding voicemail from Stewart

“On Monday, April 18, I got a call from Stewart who left a message on my voicemail. He’d said he had driven from Royston to Leatherhead (Surrey) to see Tony Hurley.

“He sounded desperate, upset, said he just didn’t know what he was doing. He said he wanted to speak to Tony.

“I told Stewart to speak to Tony that evening. Tony had looked after Helen’s investments.

“Stewart had not indicated what he wanted to speak to Tony about.

“Stewart left another voicemail on April 20. He wanted to know if Helen was able to access the money from her account and if she was able to, had she.

“He wanted to know if the police had contacted us. I wasn’t prepared to answer any of the questions until I spoke to our CEO to ascertain if it was OK to give this information to him.”

“I told Stewart Helen could access the money in her investment management accounts, but that she hadn’t accessed them.

Ah thanks for that. So not neccessarily the will but possibly other investments

So as he knew she couldn't possibly have accessed money in her investment accounts the true reason for calling was probably to see how much was in them and if he could access them.

 

[Alyce]

Any thoughts on why IS really made that trip to Tony Hurley a week after Helen died? He admits himself he knew she wasnt with him and the story about confiding him about the kidnappers was clearly BS. So what was the true purpose of that visit?

Was he going to play the worried fiancee who thought Tony might know where she was, in an attempt to get Tony onside for when the will came into play?

Or was he going to ask him about the will?

I had forgotten the detail of Karen Cotter and Tony Hurley's evidence ( thank you Legally for posting it up )

So looks as though IS wanted to know if he could access Helen's accounts/investments. Hence his Q to TH as to whether or not Helen could access them.

My guess is, having been knocked back re the POA by the solicitor, he was looking at other ways to get his hands on Helen's money, without having to wait years.

Personal visit better than doing this over the phone. Perhaps knew that TH didnt particularly like him ? and felt the direct appeal, turn on the tears etc, would look better - and even if TH didn't like him, he might react to the situation and do his best for Helen's partner.

No doubt he would work in the stuff about the POA at the same time, to get TH to sort something out for him. All along the lines of keeping everything ticking over for Helen's return.

 

[Tiny]

Re Fay :I remember after the Sadie Hartley case we saw pictures of Katrina Walsh and Sarah Willams. I imagine we will see an image of IS.
I totally agree! From the sketch he looks like he no longer has a beard although Michelle and anyone attending will know more.

 

[jenspired]

Thank you for all the birthday wishes - I won't clog the thread by replying to each one individually but they are greatly appreciated!

Judge Bright delivered a real treat of a speech didn't he. The best bit by far is everyone knowing he masqueraded his anal vineyard as a cancer scare boohoo and JB's subtle inferences of guilt. I have bought a scarf patterned with tiny dachshunds in memory of Boris - can't remember who was wearing stripes in Helen's honour but you inspired me (not sure I can pull off stripes).

We are so close to IS getting his just desserts ('sour grapes in keeping with the piles theme'?) :liar:

 

[BlueMosaic]

Re Fay :I remember after the Sadie Hartley case we saw pictures of Katrina Walsh and Sarah Willams. I imagine we will see an image of IS.
I totally agree! From the sketch he looks like he no longer has a beard although Michelle and anyone attending will know more.

or much of a chin either

My first husband (divorced him) walked through a large glass door at Sussex University in the late 70s. He didn't suffer any permanent facial scarring, more on his hands for a while. No talk of compensation either side. Despite suffering from bipolar disorder he worked until he was 65. Different times/mindsets.

Totally agree how some people end up penniless or suicidal after DWP assessments saying they're fit for work, and have mentioned previously the usual wait/pleading for weeks/months for any mental health care, which IS seems to have managed so easily.

 

[MissTwiddle]

Thank you for today's updates, I've been sneaking reads whilst at work.

Judge Bright was excellent, he delivered delivered the facts and then some. Love his style, love his word choices, love his reference to piles. Total put down whilst sticking with accuracy.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[icemaiden65]

Thank you for all the birthday wishes - I won't clog the thread by replying to each one individually but they are greatly appreciated!

Judge Bright delivered a real treat of a speech didn't he. The best bit by far is everyone knowing he masqueraded his anal vineyard as a cancer scare boohoo and JB's subtle inferences of guilt. I have bought a scarf patterned with tiny dachshunds in memory of Boris - can't remember who was wearing stripes in Helen's honour but you inspired me (not sure I can pull off stripes).

We are so close to IS getting his just desserts ('sour grapes in keeping with the piles theme'?) :liar:

Hi there. It was me with the stripes, but the darling dachshunds sound much nicer! Stripes can be unflattering if you're a bit of a Womble! Enjoy the rest of your Birthday. x

 

[Tortoise]

I've been wondering if he's been visiting the bank of mum and dad over the years. It was something he said when he made that outrageous claim that he'd been asked for half a million ransom money and he said he was considering phoning his dad and asking him for the money.

All obvious untruths but I did think oh, has daddy got that sort of money then?

He's the type that wouldn't hesitate to ask and take, driven by his self-entitlement. Helen was obviously worried about him financially so she probably didn't know the half of it.

 

[Tortoise]

If it's true, then all that's come out about his assets during the trial might have been an eye opener for family.

 

[peter010101]

Mr Hurley said he had an “unusual” telephone conversation with Ian Stewart on Apri 18, 2016. Stewart had been to his office asking to speak to him while Hurley was out.

Mr Hurley said: “By this time I’d got to know Ian Stewart a little better, we’d been to several functions together. He knew how close I was to Helen.”

“Ian said to me directly ‘I’m in a terrible state at the moment and the reason I drove to your office in Surrey was that I wanted to look at you straight in the eye. I’ve looked at Helen’s emails… and ask is Helen staying with you?

Did IS or the Defense offer anything on the otherwise glaring piece of theatrical track-covering quoted above, to explain how it could (in any way) fit with the J&N narrative?
Similarly: was any explanation offered for texting Helen's phone?
Sorry to have missed both points at the time.

 

[Squamous]

Perhaps he could have worked from home as a freelance web designer??

Ahahahahahahaha.

 

[Moll]

I was wondering how Judge Bright will deal with all those overstated and distorted defence claims of doubt - some of which, such as the witnesses who 'saw' Helen, he has already dealt with simply by saying the jury will have to decide whether they think they're believable.

In the course of this wondering I came upon this blog, which is actually advice for barristers giving closing speeches, not judges, but interesting.
http://barristerblogger.com/advocacy-tips/the-beginners-guide-to-the-closing-speech/

 

[hunkerdown]

Perhaps he could have worked from home as a freelance web designer??

Ahahahahahahaha.

Look, this was one he made earlier [emoji23]



Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[janeh]

Also I would also imagine it will be not lost on the jury just how he managed to get a monthly income of nearly 2 grand whilst unemployed.

This is a man who seems not to have worked since his mid-thirties due to ‘ill health’ so hardly time to build up a pension pot. At best he’s only going to get a minimal amount on any investments at today’s rates so has he been fiddling welfare on the grounds of his ‘illness’ despite a doctor saying he is essentially fit and healthy. Questions should be asked!!!

I have been thinking the same. I don't know any work pension entitlement would equate to nearly £2000 per month. If benefits have been paid on top if that I don't know how as one if these wouldn't be paid with having a pension income anyway. Unless IS hasn't been truthful here.

Sent from my SM-N910F using Tapatalk

 

[janeh]

When we first heard in evidence about IS' £7k compensation from the leisure centre door incident, it explained a lot in my eyes. It was his first taste of a big cash payout - money for nothing - he was a young man and back then £7k was a considerable sum. I feel this big windfall set the template for his future life ambitions. To have big payouts land in his lap without working for them. And to seek out ways to achieve this by ruthlessly manipulating other people's perceptions of him.

By the age of 56 he had been incredibly successful in this respect. A house worth nearly half a million plus a sizeable sum in the bank, £2k a month without doing a stroke of work and a millionairess fiance into the bargain. If he hadn't murdered Helen and simultaneously pressed the self destruct button, his life would have been a remarkable success story of minimum effort for maximum reward!

And still not enough.

Sent from my SM-N910F using Tapatalk

 

[janeh]

I've just had a thought - aren't benefits means tested? Was he entitled to claim them, with all that money sitting in the bank?

My thinking too. More fraud potentially.

Sent from my SM-N910F using Tapatalk