GUILTY UK - Libby Squire, 21, last seen outside Welly club, found deceased, Hull, 31 Jan 2019 #25

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Vermont24 said:
I wonder if more pieces of evidence and information will find its way into the public domain after a verdict has been reached.
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I do hope so. Often further cctv and interviews are released. And, in this case, I would not be surprised to hear about other attacks - either from women coming forward after the verdict or from information that is already held on the accused in police files.
 
Vermont24 said:
I wonder if more pieces of evidence and information will find its way into the public domain after a verdict has been reached.
Click to expand...


Myself and some of my fellow long termers here were saying the same. We've all followed many cases and the vast majority get a guilty verdict and then ... the kaboom evidence is made public - the piece of evidence that makes you think 'oh wow! Well yep, I see it clearly now'.

Whether it's journalists keeping the 'good stuff' for the front page or that they're not allowed to publish it until after trial, I don't know but, I'm hoping that will be the case this time too.
 
Just a recap:

12:12
What Pawel Relowicz said happened

Key to the jury's deliberations will be analysing what Pawel Relowicz said on the stand.

Not every defendant chooses to give evidence but Relowicz did.

You can read here what he said happened that night when Libby vanished:

In his own words, Pawel Relowicz's account of the night Libby died
 
mrazda71 said:
Myself and some of my fellow long termers here were saying the same. We've all followed many cases and the vast majority get a guilty verdict and then ... the kaboom evidence is made public - the piece of evidence that makes you think 'oh wow! Well yep, I see it clearly now'. Whether it's journalists keeping the 'good stuff' for the front page or that they're not allowed to publish it until after trial, I don't know but, I'm hoping that will be the case this time too.
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Must be a real art to being a court reporter, don't you think? How do they keep track of what they are and aren't allowed to share during a complex trial like this? I know it does go wrong sometimes eg during the Rotherham abuse trial when a victim was named live on the air who should have been kept anonymous.

BBC Asian Network editor found not guilty of 'honest mistake'
"The journalist involved in the broadcast, Rickin Majithia, had gone to Sheffield Crown Court to hear evidence in a trial linked to the Rotherham sex abuse scandal when a victim's real name was used, the court heard on the opening day of Mr Ansari's trial. Mr Majithia told the district judge, Naomi Redhouse, that he wrongly thought the name used was a pseudonym. His report, including the name which was described as a pseudonym, was broadcast as part of a live news bulletin and the woman - who was a victim of the Rotherham abuse - was listening to the radio when her name was read out. She said she went into "full meltdown", the court heard. The charge was brought against Mr Ansari, in his capacity as editor. Mr Ansari had the role of checking and approving the script before it was broadcast, the court heard."​
 
Zazie said:
Must be a real art to being a court reporter, don't you think? How do they keep track of what they are and aren't allowed to share during a complex trial like this? I know it does go wrong sometimes eg during the Rotherham abuse trial when a victim was named live on the air who should have been kept anonymous.

BBC Asian Network editor found not guilty of 'honest mistake'
"The journalist involved in the broadcast, Rickin Majithia, had gone to Sheffield Crown Court to hear evidence in a trial linked to the Rotherham sex abuse scandal when a victim's real name was used, the court heard on the opening day of Mr Ansari's trial. Mr Majithia told the district judge, Naomi Redhouse, that he wrongly thought the name used was a pseudonym. His report, including the name which was described as a pseudonym, was broadcast as part of a live news bulletin and the woman - who was a victim of the Rotherham abuse - was listening to the radio when her name was read out. She said she went into "full meltdown", the court heard. The charge was brought against Mr Ansari, in his capacity as editor. Mr Ansari had the role of checking and approving the script before it was broadcast, the court heard."​
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Besides they hear horrible details of the crimes daily. They stick in your mind. It is not healthy:( It might cause depression.
 
Seriously, what are the chances that after Libby’s terrifying ordeal, she decides to throw herself in the river to take her own life?

Mental health issues aside, Libby’s fight or flight had already kicked in, we know this due to her screams.

It becomes apparent, after weighing everything up here, that the simpler explanation is the most likely.

Libby put up a fight, he murdered her.
Occam’s razor.

I have good faith, that even if the jury can not fully commit to a murder charge, that any sentence given by the judge will be the longest she can give.
 
I keep refreshing the Hull page every few minutes, but think this may go on until tomorrow at least. The judge may allow a 10-2 if no majority verdict, do you think?

I am sure it is a complex one as they cannot be sure he did murder her in the sense of was seen in the act, and it could not be determined how she died, so largely circumstantial, I think on that. That he did have intercourse/rape her may err more to the latter, but because of lack of physical injury and with clothing still intact, even that may be pulling some in different directions.
 
I found it interesting that even early on PR said that he didn't want his wife to find out he'd been unfaithful as she would leave him and I believe that.
From what we've read he was a good Father, husband and worked hard for his family and we can't ignore that imo.
I would also take his religion into account too, considering he'd been raised a Catholic (granted this was not discussed in court as far as we know).
IMO he wanted to preserve his family unit, although I think his needs were more important, but this could have been the drive for his behavior after the rape.
Also he would have wanted to preserve his 'secret life' in order to carry on with his 'fetishes' and 'problem'.
If he'd had left Libby in the park alive there was a huge risk this would bring his world tumbling down as there was a risk that she would have reported it.
He also said he 'didn't know if it was illegal or not', so he couldn't take that risk.
He made concerted efforts to get rid of evidence and that included making sure that Libby was in the river.
MOO
 
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MsMiniSleuth said:
I keep refreshing the Hull page every few minutes, but think this may go on until tomorrow at least. The judge may allow a 10-2 if no majority verdict, do you think?

I am sure it is a complex one as they cannot be sure he did murder her in the sense of was seen in the act, and it could not be determined how she died, so largely circumstantial, I think on that. That he did have intercourse/rape her may err more to the latter, but because of lack of physical injury and with clothing still intact, even that may be pulling some in different directions.
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I can't see any scope for dispute over the rape charge.
It's proven that he had intercourse with her (DNA).
It's proven that she was not capable of giving consent (multiple witness statements)
QED, he's guilty of rape.
 
Cherwell said:
I can't see any scope for dispute over the rape charge.
It's proven that he had intercourse with her (DNA).
It's proven that she was not capable of giving consent (multiple witness statements)
QED, he's guilty of rape.
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You can't and I can't but, there are definitely still average people on the street who think that if a woman is drunk then it's not rape its 'her asking for trouble'. Let's hope there's not one if those on the jury!
 
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