Found Deceased UK - Libby Squire, 21, last seen outside Welly club, Hull, 31 Jan 2019 #14 *ARREST*

[Audiohoney]

@Audiohoney i know I’ve banged on about it a few times but watching a documentary series I linked on sky (finished it last week) on the east area rapist/original night stalker - Joseph James Deangelo is eye opening. Prolific. How he had time to brush his teeth i do not know, he was a cop for a part of his spree too ! Still on sky now to watch

WHAT?! I hadn’t actually seen you mention this, so thank you for the recommendation. I don’t have Sky but I’ll see if I can get it elsewhere. I just finished watching Manhunt (Levi Bellfield) on Amazon prime after somebody mentioned it here. Fascinating, these strange double lives. I appreciate the share on this one.

 

[yakus1964]

The CCTV released to the public is only a snippet. The car had been parked for around 20 minutes. It's safe to assume he didn't speak to her only the once.

I'm aware of that and I do believe that he may have had more than one interaction with LS. But why would he keep going to her and then going back to the car? Is there footage of him arriving, parking up (he would had to have done a three-point turn to have the car facing towards the right of the camera) , leaving his car and walking towards the bench initially?

 

[Pisces42]

It’s an assumption she didn’t have keys- she may have been too drunk to navigate the locks and gave up. I’ve cleaned at a few student houses and it was two keys to get into hallway and one more for the room. Wasn’t easy when sober doing double locks on a door , let alone drunk. In fact more than once staff left the property unclean citing they couldn’t get in.

Ohh, I thought it had been confirmed that she had no keys - thanks for clarifying.

 

[kate2931]

@Audiohoney I’m pretty sure it’s on you tube too
I can’t bring myself to watch anything on bellfield, having a daughter of similar age who walks to school some of the way on her own makes it too sensitive for me
GSK started with peeping, burglary and escalated from there, well worth a watch x

 

[Vermont24]

I'm aware of that and I do believe that he may have had more than one interaction with LS. But why would he keep going to her and then going back to the car? Is there footage of him arriving, parking up (he would had to have done a three-point turn to have the car facing towards the right of the camera) , leaving his car and walking towards the bench initially?

You've answered your own questions there.

 

[LucyRocket]

This may or may not already have been mentioned, but based on the Haworth Street footage and the time on the camera I have determined the following:
PR(?) unlocks his car and smokes a cigarette by it. He then leaves it again at 00:05:20 and walks towards Beverley Road where the bench is.
He returns with (possibly) LS at 00:06:54 - 94 seconds after he left.
Based on the average walking speed of an adult male, 1.4 m/s, it would have taken about 20 seconds to walk from the car to the bench where LS was last seen.
If we assume it took the same length of time to walk back to the car, we can work out that he would have been at the bench, with LS, for a maximum of 54 seconds.

Now is it possible to persuade a heavily drunk girl to get in a car with you in just 54 seconds? Possibly. Possibly not.

This is of course assuming that he definitely walked to the bench (we don't know that for sure), that he walks at average speed and that he didn't cross Beverley Road to the shops or walk further down the street.

I've been doing some measurements on Google Maps and have worked out the furthest possible distances he could have travelled on a number of different routes from his car.

Also does anyone know where this CCTV of LS actually on the bench is? I've heard loads about it but haven't actually been able to find it - maybe HumbPol haven't made it public? There are bus lane cameras down Beverley Road so it could be from them. If they have ANPR on them which they more than likely do they could be used to determine the owner of the suspect vehicle assuming it drove towards Oak Road Playing Fields.

Also from my own observations on StreetView of the bench area, there are no street lights on that side of the road and with the overhanging trees the area would likely have been very dark or poorly lit at the time, not to mention the weather at the time was cloudy/overcast and the moon was in a waning crescent phase.

It's so good to see someone bringing in more factual observations. This has given me some new food for thought; pointing out the time frames. I'm not very good at visualising what I don't see. If anyone has the capability of posting a video with the cut-out and frozen time frames in real time I'd really appreciate it!

I would like to add that I see frequently 'Libby was last seen on the bench at 12:09am', when MSM reports I have read, quote; 'was gone by 12:09am'. These are 2 very different scenarios. The second, verified quote, means that there was no footage of her leaving, but there was footage at 12:09 which showed she was no longer there. I am not one for joining up dots and yet I can't ignore the coincidence of the close proximity of the spider web cam footage to the time she was seen and then no longer seen. It would be unusual for the police to release potentially incriminating footage, but the fact that they haven't positively identified this footage as being either PR, PR's car, or Libby, or more crucially publically ruled any of these out, is more significant to me

 

[Mommysleuth11]

I heavily suspected LE had cctv of them leaving Bev Rd to Haworth St before they came across spidercam. They were searching houses on Haworth street by Friday afternoon/evening. Park seaches started Saturday, i think that gives a small inducation of what order the police found parts of timeline. They went back to Haworth st to search the drains on the Sunday, after the discovery of spudercam perhaps? Looking for a cigerette end?

 

[yakus1964]

Would have been very difficult to just spot her by chance.

The bench area is unlit - I could find no street lights nearby that would have illuminated the bench. The weather was cloudy/overcast and the moon was a waning crescent that night (if the moon could have made any difference anyway).
LS was wearing a black miniskirt and black leather jacket - her legs and face would have been visible but that depends on how she was sat, unless PR saw GB talking to her and that was what drew his attention to her in the first place.

In addition to my last point, if PR was driving south down Beverley Road, the bench would have been on his right. Looking on StreetView the bench is fairly obscured by the bus stop until very close to it.

If he were driving north up Beverley Road it would have been on his left and would have been obscured by a tree/low wall again until almost passing it.

Again, it would have been very difficult to have spotted her if he was just passing through UNLESS something attracted his eye (again, GB).

 

[Skigh]

Regards the googling of ways to dispose of a body theory ..imo this screams an opportunistic event . .I'd more expect to find internet searches of tides / river flow/ bodies in water etc

I agree completely.
I certainly do not think he looked this up just in case he decided to kill some one.
I do not think he had the understanding of rivers / tides to even consider looking them up.

 

[Vermont24]

In addition to my last point, if PR was driving south down Beverley Road, the bench would have been on his right. Looking on StreetView the bench is fairly obscured by the bus stop until very close to it.

If he were driving north up Beverley Road it would have been on his left and would have been obscured by a tree/low wall again until almost passing it.

Again, it would have been very difficult to have spotted her if he was just passing through UNLESS something attracted his eye (again, GB).

And if he'd have come out of Beresford Avenue, an area we know he has visited before, it would be directly in front of him:
Google Maps

 

[Katykins]

In addition to my last point, if PR was driving south down Beverley Road, the bench would have been on his right. Looking on StreetView the bench is fairly obscured by the bus stop until very close to it.

If he were driving north up Beverley Road it would have been on his left and would have been obscured by a tree/low wall again until almost passing it.

Again, it would have been very difficult to have spotted her if he was just passing through UNLESS something attracted his eye (again, GB).

Hi Yakus. The interaction with grey beard may not have been at the bench but possibly on the side of the road (eg junction of Beverley and Beresford). If so, that would have been easy for PR to spot. Timings fit, or he may have just noticed Libby before or after grey beard interaction and then swung his car right into Cottingham, right into Haworth and then parked

 

[JosieJo]

Do we know she was actually sitting on the bench though ? She could have been anywhere on the pavement? Even nearer the road ?

 

[PaddyOreally?]

So the thing about storing the stuff he allegedly robbed in the boot, it makes sense especially if he hid them under the mat next to the spare tyre. But how would the police know unless they found them there? If he did what he did, would he be dumb enough to leave them in the boot and not dispose of them quick smart? Or did he freeze or think it was too risky to try and chuck them? This is all assuming the boot stuff is right, but the 4 theories mentioned by Paddy did seem to make sense in light of what we do know.

He's dumb enough to have left them either in his house or in his boot I think. I've got a mat in my boot, there's a large space under it where the tyre should be.
I've got a small child and my girlfriend never puts the buggy in the boot ever, it's always me because the buggy was quite heavy! I don't even think she's ever been in the boot! So he could have hidden things in there without her seeing I think.

 

[TheCasual]

Maybe, but not necessarily at Karro as (a) they have a duty of care when people are working travelling in one shifts, especially at unsociable hours, so not allowed extra and (b) they may not have wanted to pay the associated wages.

Another thing you have to remember is Hull has one of the lowest costs of living.

The average house price in Hull is £144k and the UK average is £228k.

 

[Katykins]

He's dumb enough to have left them either in his house or in his boot I think. I've got a mat in my boot, there's a large space under it where the tyre should be.
I've got a small child and my girlfriend never puts the buggy in the boot ever, it's always me because the buggy was quite heavy! I don't even think she's ever been in the boot! So he could have hidden things in there without her seeing I think.

Yes, and it’s horrible to think about but he may have also then got his kicks from driving around town, knowing they are in the boot unbeknownst to anyone else. Shudder.

Edited to add the 3 vibrators charge was December 2017 but the laptop, kindle, sex toys, underwear and photos charge was Jan 25-28, so feasible they could have still been in the boot. Still a bit dumb not to have gotten rid of them. But this is all speculation in any event and doesn’t really help us.

 

[yakus1964]

And if he'd have come out of Beresford Avenue, an area we know he has visited before, it would be directly in front of him:
Google Maps

True.

Hi Yakus. The interaction with grey beard may not have been at the bench but possibly on the side of the road (eg junction of Beverley and Beresford). If so, that would have been easy for PR to spot. Timings fit, or he may have just noticed Libby before or after grey beard interaction and then swung his car right into Cottingham, right into Haworth and then parked

True also, we can't be sure where or how he saw her.

What would help is if that CCTV of her on the bench was made public - we could see PR going up to her, how many times he does this, and whether she walks with him of her own accord, or even if he drags her...

 

[Woollybear]

Depends on how fast flowing and deep the River hull is; in theory she could have taken only a few hours to reach the Humber, or a few weeks.

Also, the water would have been cold, which would have slowed down the decomposition process, or so I read.

It's slow flowing, and shallow

 

[Enquirer-2019]

As always before these live updates start, my stomach is full of knots.

I have never seen live updates of a case before, I didn't know about them, at least here in the UK.

 

[Katykins]

I had initially thought that PR was maybe parked on Haworth to go to Sainsburys local on Beverley which closes at midnight. However, I’ve just been looking at Google Maps and I noticed that near his house, if you imagine his house being in the middle of a clock (this is a rough guide to visualize), there’s a Tesco Metro at 12 o clock and another Sainsburys local at 6 o’clock. Both open until midnight, both closer to his house. Both look easier to park outside rather than the dead end at Haworth. Trying to think why else he might have been on Haworth at that time.

I also noticed that if he drove from Haworth to Oak Road down Cottingham which would make most sense, he would have passed shops and other places with CCTV, most notably Natwest Bank which has CCTV. It would have been on the left side of the car so would have had the passenger closest to view.

Just some ponderings. Although really I guess if he has already said she was in his car it’s a bit irrelevant. Just hoping LE get somewhere with the 4 Oak Road CCTV individuals

 

[yakus1964]

I had initially thought that PR was maybe parked on Haworth to go to Sainsburys local on Beverley which closes at midnight. However, I’ve just been looking at Google Maps and I noticed that near his house, if you imagine his house being in the middle of a clock (this is a rough guide to visualize), there’s a Tesco Metro at 12 o clock and another Sainsburys local at 6 o’clock. Both open until midnight, both closer to his house. Both look easier to park outside rather than the dead end at Haworth. Trying to think why else he might have been on Haworth at that time.

I also noticed that if he drove from Haworth to Oak Road down Cottingham which would make most sense, he would have passed shops and other places with CCTV, most notably Natwest Bank which has CCTV. It would have been on the left side of the car so would have had the passenger closest to view.

Just some ponderings. Although really I guess if he has already said she was in his car it’s a bit irrelevant. Just hoping LE get somewhere with the 4 Oak Road CCTV individuals

There are bus lane cameras on Beverley Road which would more than likely have ANPR capability. Travelling the Cottingham Road route would take him through the traffic lights at the Beverley Road crossroads - could there be red light cameras on them?

If he did drive LS to ORPFs then I would have thought he would have gone down Beresford Avenue. It's a more direct route to the ORPFs car park, passes LS's street of residence (if he had coaxed her into a lift to her home) and would also possibly explain the screams heard on Heathcote Street if for some reason they went down there.