UK- Major incident declared in Southport after multiple stabbings, 29 July 2024

[jackal67]

Jackal if you see a few posts below my post you quoted that I posted that early on and then after i posted that someone posted the then new news that the perp was 17 years on and I mentioned that I didnt know that when I posted it. Sorry not making sense. Basically you are quoting an early on post of mine before age 17 was apparent.

Ah ok thanks no worries .I am only just catching up !

 

[sunflowermomma]

MOO - the US only recently started having a culture of locking school doors and locking doors in places where children are. Before there were mass shootings every week we did not have to lock children in to protect them from it. in places like the UK where there are not mass violence as frequently as it occurs in the US, they do not have the same fears and realities and therefore do not have the "lock in the children for their safety" culture.

 

[ZeroAlpha]

The interview that Sky News are showing now with a man called Joel Verite is astonishing - such a brave man for stepping inside and helping. He says when he arrived (he was a window cleaner passing by in his van with a colleague) he stopped because he saw a ‘girl’ covered in blood who was calling 999 in the street - so I guess she was first to call. I think he said he took over the call when she collapsed.

He then estimated he was there 8-10 mins before the police arrived.

I read that the fire brigade were there before the paramedics, possibly before the police as well

 

[jackal67]

Suppose it's possible, it's not uncommon for side doors to be propped open in the summer. Our buildings are really not built for the heat

Yes I know . My daughter works in childcare and the premises are always locked for safety reasons. H&S rules are very strict

 

[ZeroAlpha]

MOO - the US only recently started having a culture of locking school doors and locking doors in places where children are. Before there were mass shootings every week we did not have to lock children in to protect them from it. in places like the UK where there are not mass violence as frequently as it occurs in the US, they do not have the same fears and realities and therefore do not have the "lock in the children for their safety" culture.

Before it was more about preventing young kids from wandering off - now it's about stopping people coming in to kill them.

 

[Inthedetails]

The interview that Sky News are showing now with a man called Joel Verite is astonishing - such a brave man for stepping inside and helping. He says when he arrived (he was a window cleaner passing by in his van with a colleague) he stopped because he saw a ‘girl’ covered in blood who was calling 999 in the street - so I guess she was first to call. I think he said he took over the call when she collapsed.

He then estimated he was there 8-10 mins before the police arrived.

Thank you, Joel!

We're seeing the worst in people...and the best.

jmo

 

[jackal67]

Indeed, and of course there's playgrounds as you say, and lots of outdoor events this time of year. It's not something that can easily be prevented by securing buildings sadly.

Dont think school playgrounds are accessible certainly not in my area , They are gated and locked. It is as much to stop kids leaving as others entering .There are very strict H&S rules in place for childcare settings. CCTV and buzzer entry only at my grandkids school and also at playschools nurseries for the same reasons. Imagine a child escaping through an unlocked propped open door. !!
Its been this way since Dunblane I believe?
Obviously in a public playground this will not apply.

 

[jackal67]

MOO - the US only recently started having a culture of locking school doors and locking doors in places where children are. Before there were mass shootings every week we did not have to lock children in to protect them from it. in places like the UK where there are not mass violence as frequently as it occurs in the US, they do not have the same fears and realities and therefore do not have the "lock in the children for their safety" culture.

We do lock children in here in the UK , Its also to prevent little children leaving the premises

 

[jackal67]

Is that really the case, in the UK? Schools yes, and I can't comment on things like dance classes, but certainly I've seen events like quite large children's birthday parties in hired venues, such as village halls, and the building wasn't locked.

I believe it is the case when children are left by their parents in the care of other adults such as a class or holiday club. These Adults are responsible for the care of the kids and should be registered and Insured for accidents etc, Parents usually have to sign a consent form to leave kids there.
Obviously at a party in a hall etc the kids are the reponsibilty of the Adults hosting the party and parents leave them at their own risk

 

[QB2022]

RIP to the third angel.

I read that the door was open because of the hot weather

Yes, I read this too. Just looking for the source.

I took my 7YO to his holiday camp today and on arrival the leader was quick to show us all the security processes hed reinforced overnight, I think he'd been scared as realistically his club isn't/wasn't the most secure. (Tennis club on publically accessible tennis courts with just one gate in/out). The shock waves are just rippling through the country.

I wonder if we will ever get a motive I still suspect this was inspired by school shootings.

 

[QB2022]

UK schools are very locked down, no way in or out. My autistic child learnt how to release the doors and within days the school changed all the push release button locks to fob controlled ones as she highlighted a major vulnerability. This was 2/3 years ago.

 

[jackal67]

Before it was more about preventing young kids from wandering off - now it's about stopping people coming in to kill them.

Its for both reasons. Parents who leave their kids in the care of others need to know they are safe.

 

[jackal67]

UK schools are very locked down, no way in or out. My autistic child learnt how to release the doors and within days the school changed all the push release button locks to fob controlled ones as she highlighted a major vulnerability. This was 2/3 years ago.

They absolutely are and so they should be. There have been cases where toddlers and school age kids had left and been found wandering along roads etc.!
Hopefully this horrific incident will encourage all child care settings to review and update their security if needed

 

[Dotta]

UK schools are very locked down, no way in or out. My autistic child learnt how to release the doors and within days the school changed all the push release button locks to fob controlled ones as she highlighted a major vulnerability. This was 2/3 years ago.

Your child should get a reward
for Security Upgrade!

She has my vote.

Ooops!
I don't live in the UK

 

[BaronessWombat]

In my experience, UK school buildings are generally not 100% secure in hot weather. There are always doors propped open. However this is because the perimeter fences, and therefore the grounds are secured and visitors are let in by the receptionist after being scrutinised on a video phone. In my school, we are more concerned about children getting out, than strangers coming on site.

Community halls are generally not secure, unless they just happen to also be used by a pre-school. I can think of many halls that lead straight out into a public area. An extra-curricular activity my child does happens on an industrial estate in a similar building to this dance studio. Really worrying. I am also wondering if part of the reason why this class was targeted was because of the lack of security.

 

[martinwatts5]

What about sports? I have never seen venues for indoor sport such as badminton, basketball or squash locked and there are often juniors involved.

 

[jackal67]

What about sports? I have never seen venues for indoor sport such as badminton, basketball or squash locked and there are often juniors involved.

Not sure about that to be honest, guess it may be age of kids attending . Younger age groups have to have a parent stay there with them so down to them to monitor their own kids ? At our sports centre ( council run ) there is a barrier manned by reception staff and you cant just walk in and out

 

[Lincoln34]

UK schools are very locked down, no way in or out. My autistic child learnt how to release the doors and within days the school changed all the push release button locks to fob controlled ones as she highlighted a major vulnerability. This was 2/3 years ago.

Clever child !

 

[jackal67]

Clever child !

Well done to the school for acting so quickly , Many little escape artists in childcare settings !

 

[SpaceOdyssey]

I have children of the same age group and am in the UK. Schools are very secure - usually a buzzer/intercom system to identify yourself before you are given access to the building during the school day. Playgrounds are opened up at school drop off and pick up times but then gates are locked. Our school has an 8 foot fence surrounding all of the grounds.

Out of school activities can be in a variety of places - some in schools, but others in much more open places. My kids have done cub scouts etc in purpose built buildings with security similar to school premises, but also other groups like music, dance etc where the group has hired a community building for a one off event or a regular weekly slot. These buildings are often owned and run by community groups or charities on a low budget, and are not exclusively used by children. For example, one building my kids have attended would be used for a young children’s dance group on one evening a week, but for adult learning classes, dance groups and craft groups on other evenings. It was used for lunch clubs for elderly people one day a week. You could also hire it for a party at the weekend.

This type of setting being used for kids groups in the UK is absolutely common practice.