UK - Nurse Lucy Letby, murder of babies, 7 Guilty of murder verdicts; 8 Guilty of attempted murder; 2 Not Guilty of attempted; 5 hung re attempted #35

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I don't know why I didn't think of this before, but I wonder if they re-prosecuted baby K's case because of the method she deployed of dislodging her breathing tube. It would then be a similar fact case if they decide to bring further charges for the many instances of dislodged breathing tubes on LL's shifts.

MOO
 
Tortoise said:
I don't know why I didn't think of this before, but I wonder if they re-prosecuted baby K's case because of the method she deployed of dislodging her breathing tube. It would then be a similar fact case if they decide to bring further charges for the many instances of dislodged breathing tubes on LL's shifts.

MOO
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Good point. I was quite puzzled by that decision, but what you say makes sense.
 
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Anxala said:
It is action packed!

And I mean that in the best and most meaningful way, that it's righting all the ignorant wrongs that were allowed to circulate so freely and so unchallenged post verdict.
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If nothing else it should result in a structure people can follow if & when this happens again. And somewhere in there should be 'don't get personally involved'.
 
It sounds to me like Kathryn is on the defensive and I don't think she should be. She did her job and that's that. She did exactly what she should have and obviously wouldn't be able to act then on the situation as it stands today. I hope she doesn't get any negatives from this.

Tbh I don't know how the alder hey visits were not signed off by senior managers but arranged by doc choc. How the hell does that happen? It's not on Kathryn as far as I can see. That's definitely a bit shocking
 
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I think she went much further than doing her job sweep tbh.
She crossed the line from professional to personal massively.
Chatting about recipes and kisses on the end of text messages very poor, yes she was tasked with assisting Letby with her MH but she blurred the lines, we all looking at this with hindsight obviously so you can cut her some slack agreed but she wasn’t there to befriend her.
Jmo obviously.
 
The problem with sociopaths who 'pass' in society is that they are very often charismatic, charming, and highly manipulative. Letby used that with precision. With multiple people, her approach seems to have been to play weak, sweet, fragile, and prey on her collegues' natural urge to help her.

This is in contrast with what else we know of her arrogance, her superiority, and her tendency to drop friends who didn't respond to her need for narcissistic supply.

The ones who could be manipulated by playing shy and weak seem to have been very strongly hypnotised by her. Doc Choc is most obvious, but also the whole array of supervisors and hospital execs who were willing against all evidence to fight for her to be returned to her hunting ground. She seems to have specialised in getting those people to break protocol for her. To email her and feed her information. To get her into wards and line up jobs for her when she was suspected of harming dozens of vulnerable infants. To censor reports of the risk she posed in the hospital environment.

She's like a killdeer, limping along with her 'broken' wing while she leads people around in circles, further and further from the truth. And she enjoyed that just as much as the killing.

I think she's one of the most extreme sadists I've ever read about. Stephen Norton of Christie's Poirot doesn't have a patch on her.

MOO
 
iamshadow21 said:
The problem with sociopaths who 'pass' in society is that they are very often charismatic, charming, and highly manipulative. Letby used that with precision. With multiple people, her approach seems to have been to play weak, sweet, fragile, and prey on her collegues' natural urge to help her.

This is in contrast with what else we know of her arrogance, her superiority, and her tendency to drop friends who didn't respond to her need for narcissistic supply.

The ones who could be manipulated by playing shy and weak seem to have been very strongly hypnotised by her. Doc Choc is most obvious, but also the whole array of supervisors and hospital execs who were willing against all evidence to fight for her to be returned to her hunting ground. She seems to have specialised in getting those people to break protocol for her. To email her and feed her information. To get her into wards and line up jobs for her when she was suspected of harming dozens of vulnerable infants. To censor reports of the risk she posed in the hospital environment.

She's like a killdeer, limping along with her 'broken' wing while she leads people around in circles, further and further from the truth. And she enjoyed that just as much as the killing.

I think she's one of the most extreme sadists I've ever read about. Stephen Norton of Christie's Poirot doesn't have a patch on her.

MOO
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Thank goodness it didn't work on the jury.

Nicholas Johnson KC could win Strictly. My absolute favourite line in the trial -

"I potentially feel the EG tubes were not secured appropriately," she says.
Child K collapsed due to difficulties with her tube at 6.15am on 17 February 2016.
"Just before that desaturation you were with Child K, weren't you," Mr Johnson says.
"I don't recall," says Letby.
Mr Johnson then asks about the admission form Letby filled out. She says she got these from the cot side and took them to the computer.
"I think I know where you are going, we will dance the dance if you want to," Mr Johnson says.
Letby's defense barrister objects to this, saying comments like this are "belittling". The judge agrees and asks Mr Johnson to refrain from such remarks in future.

Lucy Letby trial: Facebook searches of nurse accused of murdering babies read out in court
 
Anxala said:
It's extraordinary. Gobsmackingly so. As is so much of what's emerged in this Inquiry.
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This is beyond appalling. To me it's the same horror as in the UK when they used to (still do?) send Paedophiles miles away from their victims after prison but often send them to the seaside and be allowed outside all day long. Edited to add: JMO
 
I am wondering anyone has here has heard of a case in Canada in the early ‘80’s. A nurse was accused of killing babies but the charges would eventually be dropped.

Here is the link https://macleans.ca/culture/books/baby-killer-turns-out-to-be-rubber/

I’ve just begun reading about Letby. I’m struggling to understand the case and the Canadian case gives me pause Could there be another explanation that has been missed?
 
candycane said:
I am wondering anyone has here has heard of a case in Canada in the early ‘80’s. A nurse was accused of killing babies but the charges would eventually be dropped.

Here is the link https://macleans.ca/culture/books/baby-killer-turns-out-to-be-rubber/

I’ve just begun reading about Letby. I’m struggling to understand the case and the Canadian case gives me pause Could there be another explanation that has been missed?
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If you're joining this late, having missed her ten month trial last year, and her retrial on one of the charges this year, I think the Court of Appeal judgement would be a good place to start, as it provides a really comprehensive background to the case -

R -v- Letby - Courts and Tribunals Judiciary
 
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