UK - Nurse Lucy Letby, murder of babies, 7 Guilty of murder verdicts; 8 Guilty of attempted murder; 2 Not Guilty of attempted; 5 hung re attempted #35

[ColourPurple]

One thing that seems to have been forgotten by those LL apologists who claim that the babies’ deaths weren’t unexpected ( or worse still flippantly say that they were “going to die anyway”) is that after Baby D’s death LL herself referred to them as unexpected. This text message wouldn’t make sense if the deaths had been expected!

“On a day-to-day basis it's an incredible job with so many positives. But sometimes I think, how do such sick babies get through & others just die so suddenly and unexpectedly? Guess it's how it's meant to be... I think there is an element of fate involved. There is a reason for everything.”

And her colleague also points out that Baby D was improving and you can tell by her reaction she’s shocked at the death… because it’s … unexpected!

“The 32-year-old…sent WhatsApp messages to another nurse on June 22 2015 following a shift where a baby, referred to as child D died…Letby sent the following message to a colleague: ‘We had such a rubbish night. Our job is just far too sad sometimes.’
She went on to say: ‘We lost (child D).’

Her colleague replied: ‘What!!!! But she was improving. What happened? Wanna chat? I can’t believe you were on again. You’re having such a tough time.’”

Lucy Letby 'told colleague there was element of fate' to baby deaths

Manchester Crown Court was told Letby sent the following message to a colleague: 'Our job is just far too sad sometimes.'

metro.co.uk

Messages sent by killer nurse Lucy Letby during murder spree

The nurse has been found guilty of murdering seven babies in her care.

www.standard.co.uk

 

[Marantz4250b]

This is beyond ridiculous now. To put it mildly.

IMO

Agreed. People are absolutely losing their minds over this!

And I'm saying this as someone who was convinced she was innocent when I first read about it!

She's guilty. No question.

 

[Sweeper2000]

This is interesting.

"• I write as a retired paediatrician in response to Felicity Lawrence’s article about the evidence in the trial of Lucy Letby.

Before 2005, a procedure known as the “whoosh” test was commonly used to inject air through a nasogastric tube in neonates. By listening for a “whoosh” over the abdomen, the sound of expelled air indicated that the distal end of the feeding tube was correctly sited.

This procedure was subsequently abandoned because of a lack of accuracy rather than safety.

Having reviewed the neonatal literature, I have not been able to identify any evidence of air injected into the stomach causing collapse or death."

The Lucy Letby trial and the limits of expert opinion | Letters

Letters: Jeff Rooker, Ivan Bumenthhal and Simon Lauris Hudson respond to an investigation into the medical and statistical evidence given in the former nurse’s court cases

www.google.com

It's saying air was injected into the NG tube as a routine matter that never compromised safety. Anyone who worked within the field know anything about it?

Does seem to throw some doubt about that aspect of the cases but lacking detail atm. Might not be relevant to the specifics.

 

[Sweeper2000]

"The whoosh test is undertaken by rapidly injecting air down an NGT while auscultating over the epigastrium. Gurgling is indicative of air entering the stomach, whilst its absence suggests the tip of the NGT is elsewhere (lung, oesophagus, pharynx, and so on). The article [1], and an associated guideline [2], outlaws totally the use of the whoosh test."

Nasogastric tube incidents and the use of the 'whoosh test'

www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov

 

[Tortoise]

This is interesting.

"• I write as a retired paediatrician in response to Felicity Lawrence’s article about the evidence in the trial of Lucy Letby.

Before 2005, a procedure known as the “whoosh” test was commonly used to inject air through a nasogastric tube in neonates. By listening for a “whoosh” over the abdomen, the sound of expelled air indicated that the distal end of the feeding tube was correctly sited.

This procedure was subsequently abandoned because of a lack of accuracy rather than safety.

Having reviewed the neonatal literature, I have not been able to identify any evidence of air injected into the stomach causing collapse or death."

The Lucy Letby trial and the limits of expert opinion | Letters

Letters: Jeff Rooker, Ivan Bumenthhal and Simon Lauris Hudson respond to an investigation into the medical and statistical evidence given in the former nurse’s court cases

www.google.com

It's saying air was injected into the NG tube as a routine matter that never compromised safety. Anyone who worked within the field know anything about it?

Does seem to throw some doubt about that aspect of the cases but lacking detail atm. Might not be relevant to the specifics.

None of us knows exactly how she did it, which is why the judge directed the jury to find whether, not how, harm was inflicted. This chap cannot know how much air was pumped in, or how the babies were positioned, or if she did something additional to them (as screams evidenced), like pumping in more air as they were trying to expel air, but the evidence was that some of their stomachs were ballooned. The evidence with baby G of force feeding milk with the syringe, did seriously compromise her, even though she projectile vomited. It is a little too similar to the idea of pumping in large volumes of air to be dismissed out of hand by these commentators who were not sufficiently interested to attend the trial and hear the evidence first hand. Myers KC was not born yesterday. IMO.

 

[ColourPurple]

One thing that seems to have been forgotten by those LL apologists who claim that the babies’ deaths weren’t unexpected ( or worse still flippantly say that they were “going to die anyway”) is that after Baby D’s death LL herself referred to them as unexpected. This text message wouldn’t make sense if the deaths had been expected!

“On a day-to-day basis it's an incredible job with so many positives. But sometimes I think, how do such sick babies get through & others just die so suddenly and unexpectedly? Guess it's how it's meant to be... I think there is an element of fate involved. There is a reason for everything.”

And her colleague also points out that Baby D was improving and you can tell by her reaction she’s shocked at the death… because it’s … unexpected!

“The 32-year-old…sent WhatsApp messages to another nurse on June 22 2015 following a shift where a baby, referred to as child D died…Letby sent the following message to a colleague: ‘We had such a rubbish night. Our job is just far too sad sometimes.’
She went on to say: ‘We lost (child D).’

Her colleague replied: ‘What!!!! But she was improving. What happened? Wanna chat? I can’t believe you were on again. You’re having such a tough time.’”

Lucy Letby 'told colleague there was element of fate' to baby deaths

Manchester Crown Court was told Letby sent the following message to a colleague: 'Our job is just far too sad sometimes.'

metro.co.uk

Messages sent by killer nurse Lucy Letby during murder spree

The nurse has been found guilty of murdering seven babies in her care.

www.standard.co.uk

Another quote where LL refers to the 3 deaths as unexpected and Baby Ds death as another shock!

She described the unexpected death, the third on the unit in two weeks, as “another shock for us all” and said she felt “numb”.
…
On June 26 she messaged another friend and colleague, Minna Lappalainen, and said: “Work has been awful.

“We have had three unexpected deaths, transfer out, few sick ones, unit full.

Lucy Letby told fellow nurse there was ‘element of fate’ in baby deaths

Nurse Lucy Letby told a colleague there was an “element of fate” in the deaths of babies after allegedly killing three children.

www.chesterstandard.co.uk

 

[Marantz4250b]

Linking for those who might be susbscribers to MailPlus -

It's time for this Lucy Letby is innocent madness to stop: I sat through almost every day of her two trials. Here's the evidence I believe proves her guilt, writes LIZ HULL​

It's time for this Lucy Letby is innocent madness to stop: LIZ HULL

That's an excellent article!

I agree with everything in it and I can see very well why the defence didn't call their expert.

 

[ColourPurple]

RSBM
It's saying air was injected into the NG tube as a routine matter that never compromised safety. Anyone who worked within the field know anything about it?

Does seem to throw some doubt about that aspect of the cases but lacking detail atm. Might not be relevant to the specifics.

I think this quote is apt :

"In her hands, innocuous substances like air, milk, fluids - or medication like insulin - would become lethal. She perverted her learning and weaponised her craft to inflict harm, grief and death.”

So, the fact that air or milk in the NGT in certain amounts can cause no problems doesn’t mean that those things cant be used to cause harm in larger amounts .

Also interesting that some LL apologists have protested previously that it would not be possible to inject any amount of air down a NGT. Now they’re arguing that it was commonplace.

Nurse Lucy Letby 'perverted her learning and weaponised her craft'

The Crown Prosecution Service has commented following the conviction of serial baby nurse killer Lucy Letby on Friday, August 18.

www.chesterstandard.co.uk

 

[Sweeper2000]

Valid points tortoise. I don't understand the recent doubt about the convictions, reading them I can only assume they are not bringing all cases into one as the jury were instructed to. As an example you could take that piece by the doctor above as having impact on the NG tube cases but you can't dismiss the other cases at the same time which cumulatively indicate guilt.

Even the defence expert Dr hall said they couldn't explain how one of those children died if one doesn't seem to have an innocent explanation and is surrounded by the evidence we heard does that then mean that case does not have an innocent explanation? To me yes it does.

I'm getting annoyed with how much emphasis ppl are putting on the table showing she was there, to me it only ever meant she was on the unit at the time. It's totally insignificant imo.

 

[Dotta]

I think this quote is apt :

"In her hands, innocuous substances like air, milk, fluids - or medication like insulin - would become lethal. She perverted her learning and weaponised her craft to inflict harm, grief and death.”

So, the fact that air or milk in the NGT in certain amounts can cause no problems doesn’t mean that those things cant be used to cause harm in larger amounts .

Also interesting that some LL apologists have protested previously that it would not be possible to inject any amount of air down a NGT. Now they’re arguing that it was commonplace.

Nurse Lucy Letby 'perverted her learning and weaponised her craft'

The Crown Prosecution Service has commented following the conviction of serial baby nurse killer Lucy Letby on Friday, August 18.

www.chesterstandard.co.uk

She also perverted the symbol of care - a Nurse -
into grief and death.


That is the ultimate betrayal of
the goal of a nurse,
which is to provide
"service to those in need."

 

[Zuleika]

Reading about those texts to work colleagues it entered my head that those were possible ways of showing apparent dismay and concern at what had happened to cover up her actions .
JMO