TGIRecovered
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I just deleted it , sorry I didn't get to it quick enough!
I goofed!
I goofed!
UT UT - Spc. Joseph Michael Bushling, 26, Dugway, 8 May 2011
- Thread starter MsFacetious
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sleuthin4fun
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I took that to mean not literally 15 times a day. MOO I think his father meant that they spoke often ?
JMO
Link: http://www.todaysthv.com/news/article/157699/2/Father-flying-to-Utah-to-find-missing-soldier-son
Quote:
Bushling doesn't believe for one second his son went AWOL. He had a flight the next day to Colorado for out processing and after that, he was on his way to become a nurse in the military.
All of his items were still in his room. "Medication he takes for depression. He's been taking it since high school. That was in his room," says Bushling.
********************************
Hang on here...Joe was diagnosed with depression in high school. His younger brother commits suicide last year. There is a strong suggestion of a familial mental health issue at play here, either due to genetic pre-disposition or environmental factors within the family home.
I do not regard the father as being objective or reliable as to appraising what his son would or wouldn't do in relationship to this situation. The father is too close, he's too raw after loosing one son, he will naturally be reluctant to accept the possibility of losing another son and the emotional ramifications of that reality.
What event or situation prompted contact with a mental health professional in order for Joe to be formally diagnosed and start receiving treatment so many years ago? It would have to be something distinct and difficult to miss for a family to arrange for their teenager to start receiving mental health care and medications.
My understanding is that the efficacy of depression medication declines over time and needs to be changed periodically to maintain maximum therapeutic benefit.
Additional life stressors, i.e. divorce and brother's suicide, may have exacerbated his depression and this could have caused break through symptoms that exceeded his current medication dosage. If this were the case, he would have been on a slow decline that could have gone unnoticed by others or if he was having break through symptoms, people would have attributed it to his recent life events of divorce and brother's suicide and could very well have underestimated his actual degree of depression or the severity of his depressive symptoms.
Since his meds were located in his room, it would be nice to know if Joe was med compliant based upon the number of remaining pills in his bottle vs. date that the medication was dispensed. Even just confirming that his prescription was current and not outdated would be helpful to know.
Quote:
Bushling doesn't believe for one second his son went AWOL. He had a flight the next day to Colorado for out processing and after that, he was on his way to become a nurse in the military.
All of his items were still in his room. "Medication he takes for depression. He's been taking it since high school. That was in his room," says Bushling.
********************************
Hang on here...Joe was diagnosed with depression in high school. His younger brother commits suicide last year. There is a strong suggestion of a familial mental health issue at play here, either due to genetic pre-disposition or environmental factors within the family home.
I do not regard the father as being objective or reliable as to appraising what his son would or wouldn't do in relationship to this situation. The father is too close, he's too raw after loosing one son, he will naturally be reluctant to accept the possibility of losing another son and the emotional ramifications of that reality.
What event or situation prompted contact with a mental health professional in order for Joe to be formally diagnosed and start receiving treatment so many years ago? It would have to be something distinct and difficult to miss for a family to arrange for their teenager to start receiving mental health care and medications.
My understanding is that the efficacy of depression medication declines over time and needs to be changed periodically to maintain maximum therapeutic benefit.
Additional life stressors, i.e. divorce and brother's suicide, may have exacerbated his depression and this could have caused break through symptoms that exceeded his current medication dosage. If this were the case, he would have been on a slow decline that could have gone unnoticed by others or if he was having break through symptoms, people would have attributed it to his recent life events of divorce and brother's suicide and could very well have underestimated his actual degree of depression or the severity of his depressive symptoms.
Since his meds were located in his room, it would be nice to know if Joe was med compliant based upon the number of remaining pills in his bottle vs. date that the medication was dispensed. Even just confirming that his prescription was current and not outdated would be helpful to know.
It seems wrong, but the rules have been bent over the past few years, when there were not enough volunteers or recruiters didn't meet goals.
One famous case, from 2006, involved a recruiter so desperate, he enlisted an autistic teenager. Source: CBS News.
His parents had to go to the press, and publicize the situation, before the Army released the recruit.
One thing that's frustrating about cases like this, is that the family isn't publicly forthcoming about "issues" -- and we hear things like "they wouldn't do THAT". Then we find out later that THAT is exactly what happened.
Maybe they think that no one will help find their son, if suicide really is an option?
Zipper
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His FB page is sad to look at. I sense that they are afraid of suicide but haven't spelled that out. I forgot that he had a brother who committed suicide. There definitely seems to be a genetic predisposition to depression. I can not stand when people say, "Oh (s)he wouldn't do that. I for one "look" like I am not depressed. People always say to me, "you are always smiling". Not true. I've had a few attempts and two successes where I was brought back. Never judge a book buy its cover. That is why I came up with the line on the bottom of my posts.
sophieness
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I did notice a joke to a friend about his military post being a place where dreams go to die. it was clearly a joke, and military guys do commonly joke like that, but it struck me a little bit. a gun is the easiest way to commit suicide though- they said all his weapons were accounted for. men are more likely to use guns/violent means as well.
"What event or situation prompted contact with a mental health professional in order for Joe to be formally diagnosed and start receiving treatment so many years ago? It would have to be something distinct and difficult to miss for a family to arrange for their teenager to start receiving mental health care and medications.
My understanding is that the efficacy of depression medication declines over time and needs to be changed periodically to maintain maximum therapeutic benefit."
antidepressant medication does not always need to be adjusted over time or it loses efficacy. I am on a lower dose now at 28 then when I was 12 of one I have taken off and on- mostly on. it is still a med that works great for me at the standard lowest dosage (right now I'm taking less than standard starting dose) but am trying to go off slowly and am doing alright. everytime people have tried to adjust meds by changing which one I was on they just messed me up so if an md tried to experiment on me I would def tell him no, I went through enough med experimentation as a teen under pressure of my parents. my dad is a doctor so no offense to them, but doctors, and esp psychiatrists, do not always know best. it is not an exact science.
also there is not always a very significant event that prompts parents to put kids on meds. all of my "events" came AFTER I was put on them, the only signs before hand, were a shy oversensitive kid who cried sometimes, which if I had different parents, may not have put me on such a thing.
the military never had any interest in me and it was prob for the best. people who are determined however can sometimes get a waiver. I did grow up on military bases, my fiance is in the military as well.
dreamweaver
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http://myalertnews.com/dover/update-on-joseph-bushling-2
Officials have suspended the search for Dover graduate Joseph Bushling until this week-end.
Officials have suspended the search for Dover graduate Joseph Bushling until this week-end.
Bushling's father spent 12 hours searching for his son, in the area south of Dugway where the car was found.
The spot where the car had been found "was up a spindly little road that looked like it was meant only for ATVs. It looked almost like the car had been concealed."
He said he is not yet satisfied the search efforts have produced even a plausible scenario about what happened to his son, who was due to leave Dugway for Ft. Carson, Colo. the day he went missing.
Source: Deseret News, 21 May 2011.
Everything was left in his room; if he was planning to go to Fort Carson, he'd have been packed and ready.
AWOL?
The spot where the car had been found "was up a spindly little road that looked like it was meant only for ATVs. It looked almost like the car had been concealed."
He said he is not yet satisfied the search efforts have produced even a plausible scenario about what happened to his son, who was due to leave Dugway for Ft. Carson, Colo. the day he went missing.
Source: Deseret News, 21 May 2011.
Everything was left in his room; if he was planning to go to Fort Carson, he'd have been packed and ready.
AWOL?
dreamweaver
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A spindly little road? I think dad may be right. Why would Joseph go up that kind of road?
The whole thing is mysterious.
Was Joseph's room packed up or not? News said everything was there, but did it mention if he was packed,partially packed, ??? I don't know.
I hope his dad took pics of the site where the car was found, where the hat was found, where the cell phone was pinged from.
Was the car forensically searched? Does the friend have it back?
Hoping that Joseph can be found.
This isn't an area where you'd be carjacked. I'm really starting to think he had help leaving the area. If you were due to leave for Fort Carson "the day you went missing" -- why would you be driving all over Dugway PG AT NIGHT?
It doesn't make a bit of sense.
A suicide wouldn't go to this much trouble, that far away.
MsFacetious
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He wasn't supposed to leave for Colorado the day he went missing.
He disappeared on Sunday...
His father was coming to Utah on Wednesday and they were going to take a road trip first.
I am quite sure they were doing that before he went to Colorado because generally they go straight from where they are stationed, to where they are going next.
It also wouldn't make a lot of sense to go over to Colorado and then go back over to California when Utah is closer to California to begin with.
http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/51817520-78/bushling-dugway-vehicle-joseph.html.csp
Joseph Bushling was assigned to a medical clinic at Dugway. He was days away from going to Fort Carson, Colo., then to San Antonio for nursing training.
http://www.ksl.com/?nid=960&sid=15532851
Bushling said his son had just re-enlisted for another five years with the Army and was in his final days at Dugway before beginning training in Texas to become a nurse.
Bushling said he and his son planned a road trip to California, beginning next Wednesday, before Joseph started his nurse training in Texas.
The father said he is still coming to Utah, "If for nothing else, to look for my son."
He disappeared on Sunday...
His father was coming to Utah on Wednesday and they were going to take a road trip first.
I am quite sure they were doing that before he went to Colorado because generally they go straight from where they are stationed, to where they are going next.
It also wouldn't make a lot of sense to go over to Colorado and then go back over to California when Utah is closer to California to begin with.
http://www.sltrib.com/sltrib/news/51817520-78/bushling-dugway-vehicle-joseph.html.csp
Joseph Bushling was assigned to a medical clinic at Dugway. He was days away from going to Fort Carson, Colo., then to San Antonio for nursing training.
http://www.ksl.com/?nid=960&sid=15532851
Bushling said his son had just re-enlisted for another five years with the Army and was in his final days at Dugway before beginning training in Texas to become a nurse.
Bushling said he and his son planned a road trip to California, beginning next Wednesday, before Joseph started his nurse training in Texas.
The father said he is still coming to Utah, "If for nothing else, to look for my son."
I know. I just quoted the father's statement in the Deseret News: "He said he is not yet satisfied the search efforts have produced even a plausible scenario about what happened to his son, who was due to leave Dugway for Ft. Carson, Colo. the day he went missing."
Dugway > Fort Carson, Colorado..
That's logical. The road trip to California is not.
Why wouldn't they both fly to California and meet there, and then drive to Colorado? That would make sense.
Oh well. Probably one of the details that's not important.
MsFacetious
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Maybe there was people/places they were going to stop and see on the way there?
Maybe those people wouldn't be there/open on the way back?
We know there was talk of a road trip to California & going to Arkansas before he started training in Texas.
It doesn't sound like Joseph had his own vehicle.
If indeed both California and Arkansas were both in the plan...
Then it sounds to me like Joseph's Dad was flying to Utah...
Then they would rent a vehicle to make their road trip to California.
Then when they are done in California, from there I see 2 options.
Drive to Colorado to check in and fly home to Arkansas from there.
Fly to Colorado to check in and then fly home to Arkansas to visit.
Then fly to Texas to start training.
Either way, Joseph's Dad was planning on coming and they were planning on going to California and/or Arkansas.
I think it is important to clarify the incorrect statement about when he was leaving, for a few reasons.
Joseph wasn't supposed to leave that day, so there was no reason he needed to be packed.
We don't know that he wasn't packed, just that all of his stuff was left there.
Men, packing in advance? (No offense guys.) Anything is possible... but I haven't had the pleasure of dealing with one that did. Even military guys who were deploying, often ended up packing the night before. I am already mostly packed for our camping trip the first week of July! (A real one, not a Josh Powell one. Promise.) :innocent:
A road trip and/or visit home wouldn't be unusual before he moved to another location.
He's stationed in Colorado
Currently assigned to Utah
Being sent to Texas next
He wants to go on a trip to California
He wants to go back home to Arkansas before starting his new assignment in Texas
Complicated yes, giving me a headache yes, but I don't see anything odd about any of that.
Then again... we made a 6 hour drive to Vegas into a 6 day road trip with two 6 year old kids by stopping at state parks along the way. Rather last minute too. So maybe I am a little too open minded on this. :waitasec:
Kat
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I have a couple of odd questions that we can't really answer at this time but I'm wondering if:
1. He actually had orders to go into the Active Nurses Corps Program? Or if he did have orders and they were either amended or canceled or just didn't get them? Not making a judgement call on him. Just curious. I know it's being reported that he had them but that's what his dad knows, his chain of command and/or the PA spokesperson at the instillation he was currently assigned at hasn't spoken about this in particular (if so I missed it).
2. This might be answerable do we know who he was assigned to in Utah? I couldn't find it when I scanned back through the articles. Do they anticipate movement in the next year or so that might have caused Joseph's orders to have been amended? This does happen if the losing company, BN etc...can't afford to lose the particular postion that Joseph held. They will just delay his incoming assignment until a later date. No biggie happens all the time, he still would have gotten to go to his next assignment just at a later date.
I want to know what his friends have to say about this---and we just haven't heard from them all. I know that he and his Dad were close but my experience is that my adult children will talk to me about certain things but that their friends are far more privvy to their daily activities than I am...KWIM? I'm that way too with my parents. JMHO.
He's out there somewhere. Either still in the desert or he did go AWOL. I'll still be thinking of him and hoping that he still is alive and just decided to leave at the spur of the moment.
1. He actually had orders to go into the Active Nurses Corps Program? Or if he did have orders and they were either amended or canceled or just didn't get them? Not making a judgement call on him. Just curious. I know it's being reported that he had them but that's what his dad knows, his chain of command and/or the PA spokesperson at the instillation he was currently assigned at hasn't spoken about this in particular (if so I missed it).
2. This might be answerable do we know who he was assigned to in Utah? I couldn't find it when I scanned back through the articles. Do they anticipate movement in the next year or so that might have caused Joseph's orders to have been amended? This does happen if the losing company, BN etc...can't afford to lose the particular postion that Joseph held. They will just delay his incoming assignment until a later date. No biggie happens all the time, he still would have gotten to go to his next assignment just at a later date.
I want to know what his friends have to say about this---and we just haven't heard from them all. I know that he and his Dad were close but my experience is that my adult children will talk to me about certain things but that their friends are far more privvy to their daily activities than I am...KWIM? I'm that way too with my parents. JMHO.
He's out there somewhere. Either still in the desert or he did go AWOL. I'll still be thinking of him and hoping that he still is alive and just decided to leave at the spur of the moment.
MsFacetious
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We just know he was at Dugway driving an Ambulance.
We have only heard from his friends on his facebook page.
They have been searching and begging for people to search.
They are now begging for the search to be turned over to the National Guard
Tooele County is stopping the search TODAY if they find nothing else.
Tooele County has not asked for assistance from anyone outside their department.
Nobody else can assist unless they are asked.
Soldiers are searching on their time off.
Search and Rescue do not want civilians (we are wannabes) assisting. (Rugged terrain, I can somewhat understand this if they have enough searchers but they don't.)
Joseph's uncle and father came in to assist in the search.
Joseph's uncle had to stay off of base in a hotel and rent a car.
Joseph's father and uncle searched all day long with two soldiers.
Joseph's family has been made aware of Texas Equusearch... are there any others that search for missing adults that they should be aware of?
I'm leaving this at facts and not giving my opinion because I happen to like my sanity. :banghead:
Joseph's facebook which has turned into a "Find Joe" facebook
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1584832832&sk=wall
More detailed updates on the search from Joe's Uncle/Godfather
http://www.facebook.com/notes/eric-bushling/friends-of-josephplease-read/224055250939023
We have only heard from his friends on his facebook page.
They have been searching and begging for people to search.
They are now begging for the search to be turned over to the National Guard
Tooele County is stopping the search TODAY if they find nothing else.
Tooele County has not asked for assistance from anyone outside their department.
Nobody else can assist unless they are asked.
Soldiers are searching on their time off.
Search and Rescue do not want civilians (we are wannabes) assisting. (Rugged terrain, I can somewhat understand this if they have enough searchers but they don't.)
Joseph's uncle and father came in to assist in the search.
Joseph's uncle had to stay off of base in a hotel and rent a car.
Joseph's father and uncle searched all day long with two soldiers.
Joseph's family has been made aware of Texas Equusearch... are there any others that search for missing adults that they should be aware of?
I'm leaving this at facts and not giving my opinion because I happen to like my sanity. :banghead:
Joseph's facebook which has turned into a "Find Joe" facebook
http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1584832832&sk=wall
More detailed updates on the search from Joe's Uncle/Godfather
http://www.facebook.com/notes/eric-bushling/friends-of-josephplease-read/224055250939023