VA - Couple & two teens found murdered, Farmville, 15 Sept 2009 #1

[Heroine]

That does look more real than some of the previous links. However consider this fake image:

Some more fake images:

This last one came from this link which some might find interesting/provocative regarding this discussion: http://tumeke.blogspot.com/2009/01/kids-covered-in-real-blood-are-concern.html

See also: http://joyphoto.wordpress.com/2008/10/13/the-anatomy-of-a-horror-show/


I agree that this person's MySpace stuff is disturbing, but what I don't know is if it is serious.

As far as the naked pictures, I've seen more nudity on TV in prime time than there is in that picture, but I'll accept that someone got topless/naked in subsequent images. As I have previously stated I strongly condemn the interaction with underage individuals at this event and the unprofessional (possibly illegal?) handling of an all ages show by SKR. But contributing to a murder?

I never said any of these images contributed to murder, I'm just making a point about how they were a very bad influence. As for the pic. , there are way worse ones, where you can actually see everything, but I didn't think it was appropriate to post them here.

 

[absynthminded1]

No I don't.

I remember the early days of punk when my friends would come back from shows beaten and bloodied and say they had the best time ever! At the time I thought they were crazy. I remember rocking out to the Stones Sympathy for the Devil, Black Sabbath's War Pigs, and the Crue's Shout at the Devil. But I didn't become a Satanist. I remember dozens of underground punk parties in LA that ended in huge brawls, but we were right back there the next week. I remember the fears about the KISS Army and the fear and outrage generated pretty much everywhere by the early punks.

As far as the cliques (your term), I remain open minded about this point. I'd like to hear from someone in the scene about how much control is in fact wielded. In general I think these groups are just music "crews" that produce the music and events consisting entirely of the people that organize/affiliate around the music. This is not unique to the horrocore scene and is similar to how raves are organized.

However, I am willing to entertain the notion that more may be going on in some cases. But I don't see any evidence of that here with SKR and WIR frankly. Unless PiXy or someone else in the scene cares to correct me, I believe the so called cliques are a lot less scary than you imagine.

Why can't you see that when a person is willing to commit an act of self mutilation or defacement of a religious institution in the name of a record label/artist, something is drastically wrong?

When that record label and its artists encourage such behavior by posting pictures of blood sacrifices (which is essentially what it is when someone carves a giant SKR in their chest) or an inverted SKR 666 cross on the side of a church, it goes beyond wrong.

Whether these fans are being told to is irrelevant, when you have SKR supporting, encouraging, and enticing their Apostles, Disciples, and Minions to partake in such activities.

SKR (namely its King and Queen) eat up the attention and relish the "devotion" that their fans show them. You are most certainly looking at a culture that encourages the wickedest of tributes. The real question is whether it also encourages deadly dedications? I am not as willing to look past even the remote possibility that this is the case.

This does not indite all of Horrorcore and it doesn't have to do with ICP and the likes.... those are benign entities compared to what has reared its ugly head in New Mexico and possibly Virginia.

 

[Heroine]

I don't know if I agree with your percentages there but assume these are meant to be notional not exact. The real number of trully unbalanced individuals is a bit lower I expect.

Yes, that's true about KISS. A good friend of mine was a member of the "KISS Army" back in the seventies. At the time I recall the news carrying stories that questioned whether the KISS Army was just a ridiculously devoted fan base or some sort of weird future revolutionary militia/gang. Consider the makeup wearing gangs in the movie The Warriors from the same era as an idea of what they were afraid of.

Sound familiar? Thirty years later we can see that concerns over the KISS Army were entirely overblown.

Also, IMO, ICP has a much more positive message than KISS if you dig into it.

I challenge you to find me a KISS song that is equivalent to ICP's Thy Unveiling which reveals the hidden (they say "subliminal") messages in their music:

Carnival of Carnage,
The Ringmaster,
The Riddle Box,
The Great Milenko,
The Amazing Jeckel Brothers,
and The Wraith

looks like were all out of time brother!
Everybodys out of time!
*advertiser censored** It, We gots to tell them
All secrets will now be told
no more hidden messengers
this is it yall
times up
everything be out right here
no need for the reverse talking
the truth.

Now we have been told this carnival s*** has touched many lives.
People have *advertiser censored**in` sworn to us they too can feel it inside.
What is it that draws you in, this magic that compels you?
We`ve been waiting six *advertiser censored**in` joker cards to finally tell you.
This messengers and hints were there, all though most never picked up on them.
We snuck em` in subliminally with that wicked s*** around them.
We mentioned more and more of this on every Joker's Card.
The bottom line always the same, you aint have to look hard.
We wickedly kick it, inflict it, you get it, get with it and dig we don't preach it flat, cause some ninjas don`t wanna get with ya, they quick to forget ya without the hatchet and gat out.
So we rose the hatchet, do or die, now Juggalos standing tall, after all 6 have risen the end of time will consume us all. It aint got nothing to do with us, It aint Psychopathic Records!
All we`re doing is pointing this s*** out to you, we in this together! Who`s behind the Dark Carnival, thet Gatherings and the hatchet? Who`s beind Dark Lotus, the circus and everybody at it?
Who inveted Juggalos and Juggalettes and *advertiser censored**in Faygo showers? What about that feeling you get when bumping our s***, who`s behind these Juggalo powers?
This ain`t no *advertiser censored**in fan club, It aint about making a buck. Don`t buy our *advertiser censored**in action figures *****, i dont give a *advertiser censored**. It aint About Violent J or Shaggy, the Butterfly or seventeen.
When we speak of Shangri-La, what you think we mean? Truth is we follow GOD, we`ve always been behind him, The Dark Carnival is GOD and may all Juggalos find him!

...

I have listened to ICP and I have liked some of it, I am not trying to blame it on the music as you keep saying we are. Mentality and music influenced this. Also everyone keeps saying Sam had problems anyway, feeding those demons with the music and their rituals didn't help his mentality at all.

 

[Heroine]

No I don't.

I remember the early days of punk when my friends would come back from shows beaten and bloodied and say they had the best time ever! At the time I thought they were crazy. I remember rocking out to the Stones Sympathy for the Devil, Black Sabbath's War Pigs, and the Crue's Shout at the Devil. But I didn't become a Satanist. I remember dozens of underground all ages punk parties in LA that always ended in huge brawls, but we were right back there the next week. I remember the fears about the KISS Army and the fear and outrage generated pretty much everywhere by the early punks.

As far as the cliques (your term), I remain open minded about this point. I'd like to hear from someone in the scene about how much control is in fact wielded. In general I think these groups are just music "crews" that produce the music and events consisting entirely of the people that organize/affiliate around the music. This is not unique to the horrorcore scene and is similar to how raves are organized.

However, I am willing to entertain the notion that more may be going on in some cases. But I don't see any evidence of that here with SKR and WIR frankly. Unless PiXy or someone else in the scene cares to correct me, I believe the so called cliques are a lot less scary than you imagine.

Pixy has basically already stated that they scare her.... pixy said....

None of this makes any sense to me and they have my address/phone number too from purchases made which kinda freaks me out.

she also said it was disturbing to her.

 

[ziggy]

When i saw this i have to say that i was disgusted myself and these ppl WERE my friends......
Sick and Raz say they arent really Satanists, they are "occultists"

I did an interview with them in April if anyone wants to listen to find out more about them

http://www.mediafire.com/file/cngqcgqymov/PiXyRazSick.mp3

PS
I no longer associate myself with them or the scene. This murder has disturbed me so bad i cant bear to listen to the lyrics, they just make me wanna cry.

Hugs piXy: I know it's not the music alone that is to blame, it's just that this little family atmosphere reminds me so much of Manson and how he swept up the lost and influenced them with filthy stuff - so much so that some of them ended up in prison for life as murderers...lives ruined by the influenceof his dark teachings.

I'm sure not all the people there are bad, but honestly I don't know how they can continue to write and rap about the gruesome things they do without picturing the bloody end that their beautiful young "unholy apostles" suffered.

This case has made me sad because Emma and Mel were so young and could have had such rich lives full of fun, love, beautiful things and happiness. I'm just SO SAD when I see that young people choose dark negative stuff.

My best to you piXie - I'm sure you are very sad. I applaud you for your honesty.

 

[dangrsmind]

Pixy has basically already stated that they scare her.... pixy said.... she also said it was disturbing to her.

My question is specifically about the level and nature of control these people exert over their fans and to what extent they control life-style and ethical choices. There are a lot of scary people around, but most of them have little or no influence over others in the sort of way that leads to things like the Heaven's Gate deaths or Jonestown massacre.

Also, no offense to you or PiXy intended, but I am not so sure that people in this scene are very good judges of what is "scary" even to themselves. She wasn't scared when they were on her show talking about murder (yes it was discussed!) or at their performances when everyone was covered in blood (real or fake idk) or when listening to their music or ... But now someone associated with SKR commits a crime and she is scared, but not of the person that committed the crime but rather of the SKR crew she previously was tight with. What does she imagine Shrim would do with her address? Also she hasn't removed their imagery from her MySpace page. Why?

I smell some significant cognitive dissonance here.

 

[ziggy]

Read the literature. the decline is real in the U.S. and it is a mystery. I don't know about the global crime rate or whether similar declines are observed elsewhere. Will research this...

Again, most horrorcore fans do not commit murders. Why?

Maybe there have been more issued conceal carry permits

 

[dangrsmind]

Maybe there have been more issued conceal carry permits

Maybe so. There are a number of theories including harsher criminal penalties and larger prison populations for example. My understanding is that none of these theories have withstood rigorous scrutiny, so the cause remains mysterious and therefore debatable.

 

[Heroine]

My question is specifically about the level and nature of control these people exert over their fans and to what extent they control life-style and ethical choices. There are a lot of scary people around, but most of them have little or no influence over others in the sort of way that leads to things like the Heaven's Gate deaths or Jonestown massacre.

Also, no offense to you or PiXy intended, but I am not so sure that people in this scene are very good judges of what is "scary" even to themselves. She wasn't scared when they were on her show talking about murder (yes it was discussed!) or at their performances when everyone was covered in blood (real or fake idk) or when listening to their music or ... But now someone associated with SKR commits a crime and she is scared, but not of the person that committed the crime but rather of the SKR crew she previously was tight with. What does she imagine Shrim would do with her address? Also she hasn't removed their imagery from her MySpace page. Why?

I smell some significant cognitive dissonance here.

Maybe she's afraid to take all of the imagery down from her myspace. And sure it took one of them murdering her friends to make her scared. I'm sorry, but if I were in the same situation I would be afraid too. Murder and death, regardless of who committed the crime or what their reasons were is very scary on ALL levels.
It doesn't sound to me like you're defending the genre of music at all instead it sounds as though you're defending SKR. I never said SKR had anything to do with the murders, but it would definitely make me rethink everything I thought about the music because I would then associate it with death. Psychological or not, who wants to think dark gloomy thoughts when you're already in a bad state of mind due to your friends deaths.
I'm sure the poor girl is thinking, that could have been me. Who wouldn't?

And yes she was tight with them, but I've been tight with a lot of people, who I wouldn't go 10 feet near now. What's your point? And yes there are a lot of scary people around, and it's your choice as a human being to know when it's just too scary for you to be around. She has a right to make that decision for herself. You live and learn.
Edited to say that it seems to me anytime we give you the evidence you ask for you just argue the point anyway. You have definitely turned this thread around. you keep bringing up the music aspect not us, but you still want to argue the point. Every point!

 

[absynthminded1]

It doesn't sound to me like you're defending the genre of music at all instead it sounds as though you're defending SKR.

It also seems like he/she is intentionally ducking some of my posts directed at him/her.


One more time, dangrsmind.....

Why can't you see that when a person is willing to commit an act of self mutilation or defacement of a religious institution in the name of a record label/artist, something is drastically wrong?

When that record label and its artists encourage such behavior by posting pictures of blood sacrifices (which is essentially what it is when someone carves a giant SKR in their chest) or an inverted SKR 666 cross on the side of a church, it goes beyond wrong.

Whether these fans are being told to is irrelevant, when you have SKR supporting, encouraging, and enticing their Apostles, Disciples, and Minions to partake in such activities.

SKR (namely its King and Queen) eat up the attention and relish the "devotion" that their fans show them. You are most certainly looking at a culture that encourages the wickedest of tributes. The real question is whether it also encourages deadly dedications? I am not as willing to look past even the remote possibility that this is the case.

This does not indite all of Horrorcore and it doesn't have to do with ICP and the likes.... those are benign entities compared to what has reared its ugly head in New Mexico and possibly Virginia.

 

[dangrsmind]

It also seems like he/she is intentionally ducking some of my posts directed at him/her.


One more time, dangrsmind.....

Why can't you see that when a person is willing to commit an act of self mutilation or defacement of a religious institution in the name of a record label/artist, something is drastically wrong?

When that record label and its artists encourage such behavior by posting pictures of blood sacrifices (which is essentially what it is when someone carves a giant SKR in their chest) or an inverted SKR 666 cross on the side of a church, it goes beyond wrong.

Whether these fans are being told to is irrelevant, when you have SKR supporting, encouraging, and enticing their Apostles, Disciples, and Minions to partake in such activities.

SKR (namely its King and Queen) eat up the attention and relish the "devotion" that their fans show them. You are most certainly looking at a culture that encourages the wickedest of tributes. The real question is whether it also encourages deadly dedications? I am not as willing to look past even the remote possibility that this is the case.

This does not indite all of Horrorcore and it doesn't have to do with ICP and the likes.... those are benign entities compared to what has reared its ugly head in New Mexico and possibly Virginia.

Show me the money. By which I mean some evidence of SKR involvement in this crime. I don't see it. The kid was working with a different crew, WIR at the party wasn't he?

The horrorcore scene and ICP are intimately related. Check out PiXy's MySpace page, she calls herself a juggalo and says she's down with SKR etc. too. I did my homework on this aspect so MMFCL BTW

Also, I'm a he. And my ex-wife was (is?) a self mutilator so I know a lot more about that aspect than you give me credit for here. A very great lot more.

Anyhow, at least some of this stuff is photoshop and some of the people at the party were wearing fake blood and make up. You can buy Hollywood quality make up supplies in Halloween stores (everywhere around here right now) and over the Internet. I think most of the web banners you are referring to that said unholy apostle or whatever are photoshopped and not real. Hot Topic sells some cheap stuff like fake blood and wounds.

See http://www.photoshoproadmap.com/Pho...blood-and-gore-photoshop-effects-and-brushes/, http://www.trap17.com/index.php/Quotpool-Bloodquot-Effect-Photoshop_t34651.html, etc. etc.

 

[dangrsmind]

Maybe she's afraid to take all of the imagery down from her myspace. And sure it took one of them murdering her friends to make her scared. I'm sorry, but if I were in the same situation I would be afraid too. Murder and death, regardless of who committed the crime or what their reasons were is very scary on ALL levels.
It doesn't sound to me like you're defending the genre of music at all instead it sounds as though you're defending SKR. I never said SKR had anything to do with the murders, but it would definitely make me rethink everything I thought about the music because I would then associate it with death. Psychological or not, who wants to think dark gloomy thoughts when you're already in a bad state of mind due to your friends deaths.
I'm sure the poor girl is thinking, that could have been me. Who wouldn't?

And yes she was tight with them, but I've been tight with a lot of people, who I wouldn't go 10 feet near now. What's your point? And yes there are a lot of scary people around, and it's your choice as a human being to know when it's just too scary for you to be around. She has a right to make that decision for herself. You live and learn.
Edited to say that it seems to me anytime we give you the evidence you ask for you just argue the point anyway. You have definitely turned this thread around. you keep bringing up the music aspect not us, but you still want to argue the point. Every point!

Seemed to me like several people here were making specific accusations against SKR. I don't know these people or give a **** about their music actually, but I do give a **** about justice. What is the evidence against them? Hearsay and nonsense of the worst sort and you don't like their music.

Sorry, I wouldn't want to argue yet another point would I?

Your description is certainly possible.

 

[Heroine]

Show me the money. By which I mean some evidence of SKR involvement in this crime. I don't see it. The kid was working with a different crew, WIR at the party wasn't he?

The horrorcore scene and ICP are intimately related. Check out PiXy's web page, she calls herself a juggalo and says she's down with SKR etc. too. I did my homework on this aspect so MMFCL BTW

Also, I'm a he. And my ex-wife was (is?) a self mutilator so I know a lot more about that aspect than you give me credit for here. A very great lot more.

Anyhow, at least some of this stuff is photoshop and some of the people at the party were wearing fake blood and make up. You can buy Hollywood quality make up supplies in Halloween stores (everywhere around here right now) and over the Internet. I think most of the web banners you are referring to that said unholy apostle or whatever are photoshopped and not real. Hot Topic sells some cheap stuff like fake blood and wounds.

See http://www.photoshoproadmap.com/Pho...blood-and-gore-photoshop-effects-and-brushes/, http://www.trap17.com/index.php/Quotpool-Bloodquot-Effect-Photoshop_t34651.html, etc. etc.

Pixy also has 2 myspace pages. And pixy said that they won't even allow her to be and unholy apostle anymore anyway after she spoke with the press. As I've stated before maybe she's afraid to remove them right now, in fear of Raz thinking she's telling all the secrets she told her not to in fear of getting in trouble for the murders. (as stated by Raz) Why would you try to put this poor girl in this debate? Don't you think she's going through enough? I know that ICP are juggalos if you will, but I don't give 2 s**ts. I speak of the people and circumstances NOT the music, and when I say people i include Sam, yeah the guy who committed the murders.

 

[Heroine]

Seemed to me like several people here were making specific accusations against SKR. I don't know these people or give a **** about their music actually, but I do give a **** about justice. What is the evidence against them? Hearsay and nonsense of the worst sort and you don't like their music.

Sorry, I wouldn't want to argue yet another point would I?

Your description is certainly possible.

Okay, I see what you're saying, and there is no evidence against them, you're right. I'll leave it alone, but I do think that Sam was already sick and the music could have influenced him. I'm not saying it made him do it, I'm just saying that it made his sick mind even sicker. And who knows, even if SKR didn't have anything to do with it or ever would want anything to do with it, maybe Sam thought they would, and that makes sense esp. seeing how he must have already been losing it way before all this.

 

[dangrsmind]

Pixy also has 2 myspace pages. And pixy said that they won't even allow her to be and unholy apostle anymore anyway after she spoke with the press. As I've stated before maybe she's afraid to remove them right now, in fear of Raz thinking she's telling all the secrets she told her not to in fear of getting in trouble for the murders. (as stated by Raz) Why would you try to put this poor girl in this debate? Don't you think she's going through enough? I know that ICP are juggalos if you will, but I don't give 2 s**ts. I speak of the people NOT the music, and when I say people i include Sam, yeah the guy who committed the murders.

She came and posted here. Or someone claiming to be her. I didn't go and post to her MySpace or email her or whatever. I am simply not willing to guess what people in this scene are really doing and she is currently the only person from the scene posting here. She was actually there and knows what is happening, everyone else including me would be making **** up.

As far as the music, I don't really think I was the one that brought up the evils of horrorcore music originally. Numerous other posters here have been trying to attribute the crime to the music in various ways however. You can refer back and easily find some examples I would think.

Really, I'm with you. I agree, it is more important to talk about the people and not the music. The music this guy listened to may have been a factor, see my posts above, but given the current evidence not the primary cause of his actions. In fact, by arguing that the music caused this he's being given a free walk on responsibility. It's the music's fault not Sam's. I say that's bull.

 

[Heroine]

She came and posted here. Or someone claiming to be her. I didn't go and post to her MySpace or email her or whatever. I am simply not willing to guess what people in this scene are really doing and she is currently th eonly person from the scene posting here. She was actually there and knows what is happening, everyone else including me would be making **** up.

As far as the music, I don't really think I was the one that brought up the evils of horrorcore music originally. Numerous other posters here have been trying to attribute the crime to the music in various ways however. You can refer back and easily find some examples I would think.

Really, I'm with you. I agree, it is more important to talk about the people and not the music. The music this guy listened to may have been a factor, see my posts above, but given the current evidence not the primary cause of his actions. In fact, by arguing that the music caused this he's being given a free walk on responsibility. It's the music's fault not Sam's. I say that's bull.

I know I probably am or was coming off as one of the people blaming the music, but really, I listen to ICP, I listen to several heavy metal bands and I've also delve into some death metal, even some rap. I've even gone as far as to download Mayhems album just to see what they sing about. I'm not sure if you've heard their story, but it's one similar to this one, only it happened amongst themselves. Crap I am a suicidegirl, so I'm def. not trying to be holier than thou. Oh and a suicide girl for those of you who don't know is a pinup model kinda like playboy model but for alternative chicks and no it has nothing to do with suicide. My point I'm trying to make is I really ain't as uptight about music as I may have come off. I'm just saying that I think that all these factors attributed, not caused the murders.

 

[Heroine]

Not implying anything, I just find this blog post made by sicktanick interesting....

Thursday, July 31, 2008

Satanism, Suicide Bombing, Intellectual Decompression and YOU!
Current mood:In Deep Thought
Category: Religion and Philosophy

What if the situations were reversed? it wasnt muslims that was doing it, but satanist, theistic or not, what if i strapped C4 to my chest, and entered into a local mosque, temple, or christian place of worship, screamed HAIL SATAN, and killed a couple people? i hope this provokes a thought in your mind, that WHAT IF that us humans always seem to ask ourselves, but refuse to speak outloud in fear of peers thinking your ****ing crazy. I could only hope for a war of this sort, satanists (tho not violent in any nature by trait) have always kinda stood on the sidelines watching all the other religions destroy eachother (which is fine by me, i think ALL religions should be ABOLISHED) but what if your modern satanist turned into what were MADE OUT to be, **** we might as well be considered "suicide bombers" with all the propaganda the holy church puts out about us, just how the U.S. government puts out all this false propaganda about the muslim community, now im no muslim, and i do not support that belief structure whatsoever, i do not support the worship of anything higher than ones self, but i must say i respect them deeply, they ARE willing to die for what they believe in (not ALL muslims but you get the drift) and i must respect this, their land has been invaded wrongfully, and they chose to fight even tho they are outgunned and overpowered with the might of the "us military machine", and yet day in and day out, they fight for their land and against opression from jews and the united states alike, i gotta give it up, that takes some ****in BELIEF, people have lost that, BELIEF in WHATEVER is the missing link of mankind in my opinion, even if its not accurate, belief is one of the strongest emotions in a human. Look at "Prayer" its been provin over and over again, if you get a group of people together, and they all come together in unity to "pray", "worship", or "wish" on something, it happens, is this the result of some *advertiser censored* deity that with magic or supreme enlightenment snaps his ****ing fingers and says "its done"? HAHA! i loathe that possibility, however, energy and manipulation of the magnetic fields around us is what makes things like that enabled. Dont believe me? try it! get 10 friends and "Wish" for something 2 hours a day in a complete meditative state and see the results in front of you, now it cant be something like "let me win the lottery" cause that is something based upon a math equation, hence "you have a 1 in 100000 chance" but something more do-able, its been provin that if hundreds of people wish with all there might for rain, it rains (only if the hundred people are in ONE CONSOLIDATED AND CONCENTRATED AREA)
this disproves the theory of divine intervention via Prayer. Its all about Magnetic Manipulation of the atmosphere around us, and subconcious actions, what do you think a Ritual is? why did lavey refer to the setting of ritual as a "Intellectual Decompression Chamber"? because we have the power locked in our minds to do anything we wish, if we "decompress" our minds and let forth what is held within, the results could be DEVISTATING, i mean we only use TEN PERCENT of our Brains. What if a satanist "EXTREMIST" took it to the next level? thats the point of this, i want you to think about reserved situations in the "Normal" World, and what if the Situations in all of what we know to be true and "wholesome" were reversed!

Thinking is POWER, greater than that of ANY GOD of ANY RELIGION.

HAILS!

-Sick

 

[Kano]

Seemed to me like several people here were making specific accusations against SKR. I don't know these people or give a **** about their music actually, but I do give a **** about justice. What is the evidence against them? Hearsay and nonsense of the worst sort and you don't like their music.

Sorry, I wouldn't want to argue yet another point would I?

Your description is certainly possible.

Last i checked this not a court of law and you not a lawyer.. This is a place for speculation on crimes, people are doing exactly what this place is for. You said your part, and yes people will continue to speculate, that is why we are here.. At this point you are trolling.

 

[dangrsmind]

Not implying anything, I just find this blog post made by sicktanick interesting....

Yes, I saw that. I think I previously mentioned that he was influenced by Alex Jones and conspiracy theories. He talks a bit about this in the interview with PiXy. I'll post my notes on that later today.

 

[dangrsmind]

Last i checked this not a court of law and you not a lawyer.. This is a place for speculation on crimes, people are doing exactly what this place is for. You said your part, and yes people will continue to speculate, that is why we are here.. At this point you are trolling.

You don't know who I am or what I do professionally do you?

And is it speculation or liable? Some of the posters here should be hoping Shrim doesn't have himself a good lawyer yet because they are treading on a very grey area here. Think before you post speculation that harms another person.

As far as the T-word, yes labeling someone as a troll is an easy way to silence them. But it doesn't make what they are saying wrong nor does it make them a troll. If people want to keep bringing up the "music made him do it" theme, I'll keep objecting to it. Why do you want to let this kid off the hook for his actions? It is bordering on ridiculous to hold this position IMO given the known facts in the case and the scientific evidence to the contrary.

Hopefully the conversation can move on to some new information such as Heroine's most recent posting about Shrim's "terrorism" blog, the gematria encryption used in SickTanick's music I mentioned, the PiXy interview, etc. If you have something new to add do it and I'll celebrate your contribution.