VA - Couple & two teens found murdered, Farmville, 15 Sept 2009 #1

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absynthminded1 said:
It would really depend on a whole set of circumstances... What was his actual mental state when he killed the three women? Knowing that at least some victims were sleeping makes it less likely to me that he just "snapped." Had he snapped and Emma was the source of his anger, yes, I believe he would have killed her first and collected the rest as collateral damage.

I believe he was cool, calm, and calculated. Maybe I am being a bit swayed by his post crime demeanor and lack of remorse, but I just have a hard time believing he snapped and killed in the heat of the moment. That's just my read on him.

I picture him creeping in silently... staring down at his first victim, drawing back the bludgeoning object, and whacking whacking until there's nothing left. (Just as he rapped about, substituting whacking for stabbing.)

What happened at this point? Did one or two of the girls wake up startled and rush to the mother's room? Were any of them chased through the house? Did anyone fight back?

This isn't a pretty question, but can anyone answer whether or not the funerals were open or closed casket? :(
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Don't know, but given the report that they were badly decomposed I'd guess closed.

As far as mental states...this is the question isn't it?

You have to be enraged to commit an act like this I think, but rage can play out not only as a sudden violent fury but also a calm calculating determination to commit an act. He certainly seemed calm in the CCTV video footage at the airport.

Also I am wondering about whether Sam was also a follower of conspiracy theories (see my notes Part I & II, SickTanick is very into this stuff) and finally I just have to wonder about meth use.

I know of one person in the rave scene that got very involved with meth and conspiracy theory culture. He ended up becoming violent over a very short time of use, just a few months, threatening to kill a roommate by putting their head in the oven. He also assaulted at least one person and had to leave the area to avoid "complications". Prior to this he had been a pretty mellow intelligent fellow by all accounts.
 
ziggy said:
Good point, he could have been the only one to see it coming.

Sam did have some scratches on his neck that did not look like the hickeys we saw in pics from the concert. Wonder if Sam had any wounds other than those? If Emma's Dad did fight, bless his heart. I feel so bad for them all and the families that they've left behind.

I do remember Atlantica (went to the funeral and knew the folks) saying he really did a number on Mark. I just went back and searched the thread and can't find it. Were some of her posts deleted?

I hope we hear more than the sound of crickets on this case soon.
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BBM

Ziggy, I found that quote by Atlantica. Pg 9, Post 204.
 
dangrsmind said:
Don't know, but given the report that they were badly decomposed I'd guess closed.

As far as mental states...this is the question isn't it?

You have to be enraged to commit an act like this I think, but rage can play out not only as a sudden violent fury but also a calm calculating determination to commit an act. He certainly seemed calm in the CCTV video footage at the airport.

Also I am wondering about whether Sam was also a follower of conspiracy theories (see my notes Part I & II, SickTanick is very into this stuff) and finally I just have to wonder about meth use.

I know of one person in the rave scene that got very involved with meth and conspiracy theory culture. He ended up becoming violent over a very short time of use, just a few months, threatening to kill a roommate by putting their head in the oven. He also assaulted at least one person and had to leave the area to avoid "complications". Prior to this he had been a pretty mellow intelligent fellow by all accounts.
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Rage and anger can build in people over time. Every one of us has had something happen to us to a lesser extent that just kept bothering usmaking us more and more angry or anxious even keeping us from being able to sleep at night. But were normal and we dont act out in violence to feel better. This crime looks far from well thought out, probably the only way to make this case any more air tight would be to have the murders on video.

And these pictures of Sam defiling graves and looking like a bozo, and his music, will come back in court some way. The prosecution may use it to show evidence of his character, or the defense may use it for whatever reason to help his case, insanity, deflect blame.
 
Nikolai said:
And I was giving my opinion that I think he seemed to be more just messing around with his music, from how he made it sound anyways. I actually have agreed with GXM that some sort of failure with Emma is why he committed murder.

And Emma isnt a reason for anyone to kill, but sadly jealousy or obsession are more of the common reasons men kill women. Its stupid but the way it is. I still think it takes a special(in a bad way) person to have murder in them and Sam is one of those people. He probably like most murderers is a sociopath who only has feeling for and about himself. He feels sorry for himself right now, not the persons he killed.
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I'm sorry i must have misinterpreted what you were saying.
 
rainbow said:
I know what you mean. Especially in the first few days after the bodies were discovered. I don't remember the blood pooled thing, but I know I even read somewhere that someone local had heard the weapon of choice was a hammer. But of course I haven't been able to find proof of that anywhere either. It's hard to tell what is small town gossip and what is factual. I think more gossip because LE is not releasing jack to the public.
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You know what I do think though? I think as I said before, the bodies were upstairs, I know this is kind of random, but I just remembered reading in an article that the chief of police of farmville va said that one of his LE officers said something to the effect of "I wouldn't want to go up there again." And earlier i had speculated that maybe the bodies were found upstairs, but because every pic you would see of a cop taking pics they were pointing the camera up towards the bedroom window, but could just be a coincidence or maybe the same pics over and over too.
I don't know.
Let me see if i can find that article again. It was local.....found it

“It’s tough on the officers that worked the crime scene, because I’m sure it was very tragic,“ Spates said. “I had one tell me that he wouldn’t want to go back up there again.“

http://www2.godanriver.com/gdr/news...farmville_no_stranger_to_grisly_crimes/14377/
 
Heroine said:
You know what I do think though? I think as I said before, the bodies were upstairs, I know this is kind of random, but I just remembered reading in an article that the chief of police of farmville va said that one of his LE officers said something to the effect of "I wouldn't want to go up there again." And earlier i had speculated that maybe the bodies were found upstairs, but because every pic you would see of a cop taking pics they were pointing the camera up towards the bedroom window, but could just be a coincidence or maybe the same pics over and over too.
I don't know.
Let me see if i can find that article again. It was local.....found it

“It’s tough on the officers that worked the crime scene, because I’m sure it was very tragic,“ Spates said. “I had one tell me that he wouldn’t want to go back up there again.“

http://www2.godanriver.com/gdr/news...farmville_no_stranger_to_grisly_crimes/14377/
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The upper floor of a house is also hotter usually, sometimes a lot hotter, which helps explain the rapid decomposition.
 
tapu said:
SRSLY?? That's where I crawled out of. Again, glad I went this other route. Whoo-hoo.

Man, those guys are really losers to be from there. Genetic losers. Dangerous, and not only because they are literally mindless animals with nothing to gain.
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Sicktanick and Razakel are from New Mexico not WVA. They stated during the PiXy interview that they had a lot of fans and sold a lot of records in the area.
 
dangrsmind said:
The upper floor of a house is also hotter usually, sometimes a lot hotter, which helps explain the rapid decomposition.
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SOMEONE stayed awake in Rudimentary Science class! ;)

Wonder if the house has central air or individual units? (Most middle age women I know like to keep their rooms/homes somewhat like Narnia. If this holds, I would guess the girls started decomposing first.
 
absynthminded1 said:
SOMEONE stayed awake in Rudimentary Science class! ;)

Wonder if the house has central air or individual units? (Most middle age women I know like to keep their rooms/homes somewhat like Narnia. If this holds, I would guess the girls started decomposing first.
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Well that and I read forensics text books for fun.

Good questions on the AC set up.

A lot of people I know turn their AC off at night to save money unless it is ridiculously hot. What was the weather like on the day of (and day after) the murder?

It is possible he didn't know how to turn the AC back on or didn't turn it on for whatever reason.
 
The recent articles on Deborah Kelley and Emma Niederbrock's memorial stated that the families chose to have them cremated. This was in a recent Farmville newspaper article...possibly yesterday or Monday. I am not sure about Melanie or Mark though.
 
dangrsmind said:
Well that and I read forensics text books for fun.

Good questions on the AC set up.

A lot of people I know turn their AC off at night to save money unless it is ridiculously hot. What was the weather like on the day of (and day after) the murder?

It is possible he didn't know how to turn the AC back on or didn't turn it on for whatever reason.
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Less than 24 hours before the time officers smelled the bodies decomposing, and then discovered the bodies, officers went inside the house to check the basement after Sam called them. I would think there had to have been some kind of smell coming from the bodies at that time, so him putting them upstairs would make sense.

Also somebody earlier in the thread pointed out that the house in pictures looked like it had rooms that stretched into the backyard, sort of away from the main part of the house, like a guest room or something.
 
rainbow said:
"There is a chance that at least some of the female victims may have been bludgeoned in their sleep, the source said, although only the final autopsy report will be able to confirm that." http://www.wtvr.com/wtvr-farmville-murders-new-information,0,31503.story

This is more for me than anything. I could not remember where it had been proven that they had been killed in their sleep. Is this article the only mention of that? Just curious because in this article it states "may" have been....

I too am anxious to hear more facts about what happened but I am afraid we're probably not going to hear anything new for awhile.
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It has not been confirmed by LE that the women were killed as they slept, only hinted at. IMO, it's the only way Sam could have killed all three. The girls might have been sharing a room, as girls often do on sleepovers, which leads to the possibility one of them woke up when the other was attacked. But a groggy girl against a young man with a hammer isn't a fair fight.

The mother's room might have been far enough away that any commotion didn't wake her. There are lots of factors that we aren't privy to such as whether her room had a window unit (noise factor) or if she was a heavy sleeper. I commented on another thread (Georgia multiple murder with sleeping victims) that my husband is a very heavy sleeper and once slept through a row happening right outside our bedroom door.

Right now my hunch is that Sam went after Emma first and Mel was probably in close proximity so she was the second victim. Next he killed the mother. Sam then had days to "cool off" before killing the pastor. It will be very interesting to see how the defense tries to explain that away. IMO, Sam staying with the decomposing bodies makes him appear heartless, a stone cold killer with no remorse.

I'm really stunned that the cops didn't smell the decomposition when they came by on Thursday night. That really makes me wonder what the heck Sam did with the bodies. I understand that LE is trying to protect the evidence for trial but I do wish they'd be a little more forthcoming with the facts.
 
Eclipse33 said:
The recent articles on Deborah Kelley and Emma Niederbrock's memorial stated that the families chose to have them cremated. This was in a recent Farmville newspaper article...possibly yesterday or Monday. I am not sure about Melanie or Mark though.
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Atlantica attended the pastor's funeral. In her comment #283 on page 12, she says that they were unable to embalm his body and that the casket was sealed.
 
All of these are regarding Sam's Dad's band SnM.

l_e6269dc184284bd3bd41b1a17e9bfbfc.jpg


http://www.snmrocks.com/ The website Sam created for his Dad's band

YouTube - SnM Live @ Roosters!

A video of SnM live @ Roosters filmed by Sam

Note the bound torso figure displayed on the stage during the show.

http://www.myspace.com/samandmikerocks SnM MySpace page (I guess these guys are too old for MySpace heh)
 
Wow is right. Someone needs to use a click track.

Poor kid. No visions of sugar plum fairies for him probably ever :-(
 
Has anything new happened in this case? I stopped reading when every other post became "dangrs"

:/
 
gxm said:
It has not been confirmed by LE that the women were killed as they slept, only hinted at. IMO, it's the only way Sam could have killed all three. The girls might have been sharing a room, as girls often do on sleepovers, which leads to the possibility one of them woke up when the other was attacked. But a groggy girl against a young man with a hammer isn't a fair fight.

The mother's room might have been far enough away that any commotion didn't wake her. There are lots of factors that we aren't privy to such as whether her room had a window unit (noise factor) or if she was a heavy sleeper. I commented on another thread (Georgia multiple murder with sleeping victims) that my husband is a very heavy sleeper and once slept through a row happening right outside our bedroom door.

Right now my hunch is that Sam went after Emma first and Mel was probably in close proximity so she was the second victim. Next he killed the mother. Sam then had days to "cool off" before killing the pastor. It will be very interesting to see how the defense tries to explain that away. IMO, Sam staying with the decomposing bodies makes him appear heartless, a stone cold killer with no remorse.

I'm really stunned that the cops didn't smell the decomposition when they came by on Thursday night. That really makes me wonder what the heck Sam did with the bodies. I understand that LE is trying to protect the evidence for trial but I do wish they'd be a little more forthcoming with the facts.
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You know what I've thought about? How do we know that all of this didn't occur over a matter of a couple days or at least hours? I mean maybe he went crazy and before killing them he somehow held them captive. It would probably take him only hurting one of them for everyone else to cooperate.
Also it could have started with an argument with emma, and then things got out of hand, he hurt her, and then his true self came out. Think about it, the mother would've cooperated at this point.
I mean for all we know they were tied up.
 
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