VA - Couple & two teens found murdered, Farmville, 15 Sept 2009 #8

[ziggy]

Honestly, I don't think Sam is a sociopath at all. He has told me about how he's been hurt in the past, and how hard it is for him to trust people because of that. IMO, I think 100% this was a crime of passion.

I see you don't know many sociopaths - I really hope you don't get to know many.

They will TALK FOR HOURS about how they were hurt, how they are such victims, how they don't want to feel vulnerable, how they are "scared" of getting hurt in relationships and on and on. They are just like us, except that they don't really bond and are detached from real relationships. I believe they have the ability to feel hurt or ignored or neglected. They have PLENTY of feelings for THEMSELVES. The problem is they can't connect to what anyone else is feeling and they are never wrong -apologize RARELY, and yes they can even be somewhat reclusive.

Don't be fooled. They know exactly what to say in any given situation and they don't even have to think - it is second nature.

 

[CharlieChan]

Dange said" One thing we don't know in this case is how the forensics link Sam to the crimes. For example, was their blood on his clothes? His fingerprints or DNA on the murder weapons? One supposes that the forensics are solid, but strange things happen sometimes... " If the maul did not hit--you must aquit--Sorry -I couldn' resist> You guys are great!

 

[PAXIMUS]

As much as I love this thread and all you guys I am seriously about to be done with this forum as the amount of adverts make it RIDICULOUSLY SLOW, it takes like 5 minutes to load each freaking post and page and its getting on my nerves to the point I am no longer enjoying it. Every other forum I am visiting is fine its just this one and its because of all these ****ing shamerful ADS that have to load each time.

Does anyone else have this problem?

 

[Woe.be.gone]

Honestly, I don't think Sam is a sociopath at all. He has told me about how he's been hurt in the past, and how hard it is for him to trust people because of that. IMO, I think 100% this was a crime of passion.

Do you have insight into why he acted like he did when he got arrested? I don't have any visuals of him (that would help me) but someone said he was smiling and flippant. Wouldn't a 'normal' kid, at some point, realize the gravity of what he has done and emotionally fall apart. I can picture/side with Pax's theory up to the point of Sam's arrest. If he had acted as a heartbroken, rejected soul, I would think he would show a range of emotions as in fear, sorrow, even anger and be claiming he's the wrong guy, sadness expressed by crying even. The way he's been described upon his arrest, I'm thinking he seemed satisfied.

Let's pretend you (not you SM) woke up with a bad hangover. Slowly you realize you acted really stupid the night before and you embarrassed only yourself . Magnify that by 100,000, could one just carry on as usual after what Sam is accused of doing if he is otherwise normal. Thinking out loud here - we know something was wrong with him because he was spending his life focusing on the macabre.

Also, why didn't Sam take showers? Do you know? A 20 year old who does not realize that an attractive girl would be turned off immediately by his poor hygiene? I find that extremely odd.

 

[PAXIMUS]

Wait a ticky: has it been confirmed what Sam's demeanor was when he called whatshisname? I can't recall that we know for sure he was upset or freaked out.

I just can't wrap my head around a normal yet reclusive kid who "snaps" and starts wielding a fricking wood maulm, mutilating the bodies of three women.

THEN: what comes next is even more out of character for the poor little kiddo that Pax describes.
* calmly tells the cop that they are at the movies (when their bloody remains are right inside where he killed them)
* leaves phone messages for Mrs. Wells
* CALLS more cops to the house with 4 dead bodies therein
* Makes a few trips to Kroger and wherever
* It is rumored he bought some scented candles to hide the smell
* It is rumored he hung out with some college kids and smoked with them
* Calmly encounters the police two more times while reeking of death
* Has casual conversations with cab driver about Emma as if she were still alive
* Has a meal at Huddle House
* Sleeps at the airport
* Doesn't seem too surprised to be arrested
* Smirks and smiles when the cameras catch him being led into custody
* Jokes that "Jesus told me to do it" for the camera

All of this does not add up to a regular soul who acted under the heat of passion and was unable to control his actions for a very short period of provocation...remember - he had plenty of cooling off time prior to killing Mark and all he had to do was LEAVE the house to avoid Mark, not kill him.

This doesn't pass the smell test for a poor, neglected, socially underdeveloped "kid". I think the horrocore also ate away at any conscience he may have had.

Well certainly food for thought. I do like to play Devil's advocate you know but in all seriously I really am not convinced he is a sociopath. He is sick and emotionally ****ed up yes but for some reason I just cant see sociopath in Sam but then again none of us know a damn thing about Sam so this is all speculation at best no matter what side youre on.

 

[PAXIMUS]

Do you have insight into why he acted like he did when he got arrested? I don't have any visuals of him (that would help me) but someone said he was smiling and flippant. Wouldn't a 'normal' kid, at some point, realize the gravity of what he has done and emotionally fall apart. I can picture/side with Pax's theory up to the point of Sam's arrest. If he had acted as a heartbroken, rejected soul, I would think he would show a range of emotions as in fear, sorry, even anger and be claiming he's the wrong guy, sadness expressed by crying even.

Let's pretend you woke up with a bad hangover. Slowly you realize you acted really stupid the night before and you embarrassed only yourself . Magnify that by 100,000, could one just carry on as usual after what Sam is accused of doing if he is otherwise normal. Thinking out loud here - we know something was wrong with him because he was spending his life focusing on the macabre.

Also, why didn't Sam take showers? Do you know? A 20 year old who does not realize that an attractive girl would be turned off immediately by his poor hygiene? I find that extremely odd.

ScaryMary is a personal friend of Sam's if you didnt already know that and she is in touch with him through writing now that he is in jail and she has been kind enough to share some of that insight with us here.

Those are all good questions I wish I had answers for but his sister did make it clear that he didnt shower and bathe much.

 

[Woe.be.gone]

ScaryMary is a personal friend of Sam's if you didnt already know that and she is in touch with him through writing now that he is in jail and she has been kind enough to share some of that insight with us here.

Those are all good questions I wish I had answers for but his sister did make it clear that he didnt shower and bathe much.

Thanks. A personal friend? ScaryMary, It must be tough having a friend who is in this situation. Maybe you have some insight into his thinking though. If a man is embarking on a long anticipated trip to meet a girl, why would he not groom himself? He was hurt when he was rejected repeatedly? I don't know, maybe his mother failed him. It's one thing when we have hindrances to our success that we cannot easily change, but to go around smelling badly and then wonder why girls ain't digging you, well? Have you known many people like this?

The reason I'm pressing this point is because it seems like very self debasing behavior to me that makes no sense in the context of what he went to VA to do - meet and get close to a gf. Antisocial behavior imo.

 

[ScaryMary]

Do you have insight into why he acted like he did when he got arrested? I don't have any visuals of him (that would help me) but someone said he was smiling and flippant. Wouldn't a 'normal' kid, at some point, realize the gravity of what he has done and emotionally fall apart. I can picture/side with Pax's theory up to the point of Sam's arrest. If he had acted as a heartbroken, rejected soul, I would think he would show a range of emotions as in fear, sorrow, even anger and be claiming he's the wrong guy, sadness expressed by crying even. The way he's been described upon his arrest, I'm thinking he seemed satisfied.

Let's pretend you (not you SM) woke up with a bad hangover. Slowly you realize you acted really stupid the night before and you embarrassed only yourself . Magnify that by 100,000, could one just carry on as usual after what Sam is accused of doing if he is otherwise normal. Thinking out loud here - we know something was wrong with him because he was spending his life focusing on the macabre.

Also, why didn't Sam take showers? Do you know? A 20 year old who does not realize that an attractive girl would be turned off immediately by his poor hygiene? I find that extremely odd.

No, I don't know why he acted the way he did because his lawyer is strongly suggesting he talk about NONE of it until the trial is over. He is very much wanting to tell his side of things though, so after trial you all will get your answers.
As far as the not taking showers question, I don't know why his sister said that but I do know that he is a very clean person and he does shower. Actually, in a survey I sent him, one of the questions was "3 things you can't live without", and his first answer was "Showering, because I hate smelling like a duck".

 

[coastal]

As much as I love this thread and all you guys I am seriously about to be done with this forum as the amount of adverts make it RIDICULOUSLY SLOW, it takes like 5 minutes to load each freaking post and page and its getting on my nerves to the point I am no longer enjoying it. Every other forum I am visiting is fine its just this one and its because of all these ****ing shamerful ADS that have to load each time.

Does anyone else have this problem?

Pax, I'm using Google's Chrome browser, and although I do see an ad across the top of this page, and along the right margin, they don't seem to slow things down at all. I love Chrome; it just has basic functions, but since I'd rather go fast than do much, it's fine. Chrome zooms! Try it!

 

[tapu]

I dont know what you mean that I am projecting hurt and anger as I am niether hurt nor angry and I am only speaking in terms of what I see in Sam WRT the evidence we have in front of us.

You may be right and I may be wrong I do not know but I dont see the evidence for sociopathy here at all.

And I love The Tapu also!

There, projecting means that you're imbuing the other person with the feelings you yourself might feel in those circumstances.... But Sam may not have felt those feelings that you or I might feel.

 

[RockDawg]

There, projecting means that you're imbuing the other person with the feelings you yourself might feel in those circumstances.... But Sam may not have felt those feelings that you or I might feel.

"Imbuing", you say ?


That's rather linguisty of you , Tapu !

 

[tapu]

The other 3 murders after Emma was collateral damage, they had to go to buy him time for what he had done to Emma perhaps?


This isnt coming from anywhere my friend I am only debating, none of us know a damn thing when it comes right down to it. I am simply saying I feel this was a crime of passion and he DID NOT go to VA with the intent to kill Emma, as you suggest and which a sociopath would have. He went there to start a new life and when it was all taken from him he snapped.

I just do not see Sam as a sociopath I dont see the hallmarks there.

Correction: I am not saying he went to VA with the intent to kill Emma. He may have, but I doubt it. I think a sociopath could go there without intent to kill, suffer a wrong at the hands of a girl, and kill them all. And then do all the things he did that dangrs and i listed in the original post about this.

 

[RockDawg]

Correction: I am not saying he went to VA with the intent to kill Emma. He may have, but I doubt it. I think a sociopath could go there without intent to kill, suffer a wrong at the hands of a girl, and kill them all. And then do all the things he did that dangrs and i listed in the original post about this.

Yeah , one must take care not to pi$$ off a sociopath !

 

[tapu]

As much as I love this thread and all you guys I am seriously about to be done with this forum as the amount of adverts make it RIDICULOUSLY SLOW, it takes like 5 minutes to load each freaking post and page and its getting on my nerves to the point I am no longer enjoying it. Every other forum I am visiting is fine its just this one and its because of all these ****ing shamerful ADS that have to load each time.

Does anyone else have this problem?

No, I don't at all. That's weird. What ads? There's a banner ad up top, and then a sidebar down the right.... But this site loads as fast as any other for me.... Of course, I AM on a Mac..... Hee!

 

[tapu]

"Imbuing", you say ?


That's rather linguisty of you , Tapu !

Goddammit, I knew somebody was going to call me on that one.

 

[tapu]

Yeah , one must take care not to pi$$ off a sociopath !

Well, precisely.

 

[ScaryMary]

I see you don't know many sociopaths - I really hope you don't get to know many.

They will TALK FOR HOURS about how they were hurt, how they are such victims, how they don't want to feel vulnerable, how they are "scared" of getting hurt in relationships and on and on. They are just like us, except that they don't really bond and are detached from real relationships. I believe they have the ability to feel hurt or ignored or neglected. They have PLENTY of feelings for THEMSELVES. The problem is they can't connect to what anyone else is feeling and they are never wrong -apologize RARELY, and yes they can even be somewhat reclusive.

Don't be fooled. They know exactly what to say in any given situation and they don't even have to think - it is second nature.

Well, not meaning to be argumentative btw, I do know sociopath behavior when I see it. I dated one for 5 (very draining) years. Granted, I haven't met Sam in person, so I can't honestly say that I 'know' him, just the things he says. However, I have heard about (not by him) some of the very ****ed up things a certain ex of his did to him, so I do believe him without a doubt when he says he's been hurt in the past.

 

[ziggy]

Well, not meaning to be argumentative btw, I do know sociopath behavior when I see it. I dated one for 5 (very draining) years. Granted, I haven't met Sam in person, so I can't honestly say that I 'know' him, just the things he says. However, I have heard about (not by him) some of the very ****ed up things a certain ex of his did to him, so I do believe him without a doubt when he says he's been hurt in the past.

OMG 5 years...I bow to you. Yes it's something else and draining probably doesn't even begin to describe it.

So perhaps it's just a multitude of things over the years and Sam decided to become Syko Sam in part- the bad *advertiser censored* evil dude who can't be hurt or if he is he'll just kill you because killing is nothing to him. I still think there has to be a huge sense of detachment in him. Maybe he just hated women too. I mean he could have seriously hated his mother for not being the kind of mom he needed and hated his sister cuz sometimes sibs do that - and then a few girls kick him around and he's got a rage problem.

I still think he fantasized about really murdering at some point. I don't think he went to Emma's with that intent but at some point his fantasies and his need for either revenge or control merged and he decided to have at it.


About not showering; sometimes when I'm at home just hanging out I don't shower every day. Maybe his sister was just catching him at those moments. Heck Mr. zig's son is 16.5 and I think he's a smelly boy and he doesn't shower daily and his room is alive (my dog loves it though) and he plays a lot of x-box. Even when they know girls would be turned off, they just get lazy I think.

 

[CharlieChan]

I was recently contacted by one of my original exes (35 years ago). I told her--the only thing I regret is smackin you in the eye when you were 18. She said..." I would have preferred you had taken a less physical approach. I know what I did was foolish and I'm sorry I hurt you. My foolishness has not served me well over the years. When I saw the picture of your son, my jaw dropped to the ground for 5 minutes." I'm just tryin to provide another scenario about how that gittin hurt thing can end up.

 

[tapu]

Uh... the tapu is lost....


can anyone find me?