Verdict Watch 05/06/2013 and 05/07/2013

[Dewey2Me1MoThyme]

I understand that. I just don't understand how premeditation includes a charge that doesn't require premeditation, according to the quotes I gave.

I'm guessing you are talking about the felony murder1 ? If a felony crime was premeditated, and as a result of that crime the life of another human was taken, then it is felony murder1. If I planned to rob Joe's home, the robbery is premeditated, if I killed Joe in the commission of that crime, then it's felony muder where premdiated murder means the murder of Joe itself was premeditated. That's the way I understood it.

 

[Daydreamer]

You and me both! When I see all these elephants, I think about our rivals across our State.....

It started on the Katiecoolady thread. Gifts were exchanged and they had pictures of elephants on them. Elephants mourn the deceased for a long time.
Go to her thread and search elephants. It's actually pretty cool.

 

[Rosemary Pierce]

Yeah and linebacker pose was pre-fog.

BBM: LOL

 

[Dewey2Me1MoThyme]

It started on the Katiecoolady thread. Gifts were exchanged and they had pictures of elephants on them. Elephants mourn the deceased for a long time.
Go to her thread and search elephants. It's actually pretty cool.

I believe Travis also had a love for elephants and wanted to get involved in saving the species. :twocents:

 

[Bravo]

Yeah. Stranger things have happened. Thanks for clarifying. I can understand that those who didn't believe could at least have a reflection period if not a prayerful one. For those who believe, I'd feel it hard for me to be given God's responsibility to judge. If it's in my hands, I would seek prayer.

Agree. I have what i call a 24 hr. rule. If something has angered me etc. in life I don't react in real time. I take 24 hrs. and reflect once emotions have settled. If i feel the same way after 24 hrs. I then know I need to address whatever the issue.

 

[wasnt_me]

I'm skeered to look! Is that thread like the one that was taken down? And do folks think it was made clear to jury that the timing of gun/stabby and which came first doesn't matter? (or, is that clear to everyone posting also?)

Well, there's a lot of things going on over there. I don't know about the thread that was taken down, so I can't compare.

It seems to have become a debate thread where there's no middle ground on whether the gun or knife came first. There are some who don't believe premeditation was proved. Some who are very critical of Dr. Horn.

A lot of it isn't based in fact, just strongly held beliefs. That's what concerns me. I wonder if any jurors have strongly held beliefs or opinions that are not based in fact that will cause trouble once other jurors assert different opinions or interpretations.

 

[atthelake]

Oh wow Thoughts and prayers to the family.

If he (Sooner's uncle) is still here he'll appreciate it! We lost SoonerFan#1 last year...was just too strange to see her postings tonight after her being gone for that long when I was looking at something else.

That is what the internet does....your words are left for posterity. (as many tell their children, lol!)

And after a long time.....folks will come across after a year, or much longer, of what you were saying prior to passing. And Sooner...........she was special!

 

[wasnt_me]

BBM: LOL

:floorlaugh::floorlaugh::drumroll:

She needs to hang this in her cell.

 

[ShadyLady]

I know this isn't a popular opinion, but from those police tapes of her parents, I do feel sorry for them. They didn't commit the crime.

Once I saw a murder show where a police officer's son killed the girl upstairs from them and set the place on fire. The officer got her son to confess to her and she turned him in. It was gut wrenching to listen to her.

I know you weren't going there with your post but each time I think of a defendant's family, I think of that woman.

Some of the mother's behavior bothered me. The smiling, etc. I just hope they don't try to profit in any way. I don't follow a lot of trials, but followed the Casey Anthony trial, and I think back to her parents. I feel bad for the grandmother, and jodi's father seems pretty straight, but who knows.

 

[Morganhillmom]

Yes! I wish Trump never got twitinvolved. And I wish anything she said was made irrelevant. But most I wish for justice for Travis cause I am jury wary due to my KC PTSD. :scared:

They both are attention loving types, just thinking Jodi is loving all of the attention that she may be thinking she should move to being absolutely notorious. I don't feel she believes in God, so nothing really bad has happened for her. She got to talk about herself for 16 days on national TV. She may even feel that this has been the best thing that has happened to her. I truly feel she would come after the jury one by one if she were released years later and so they have to give her the DP because they know she is off the grid. She had to have thought Travis had a girl at the house and maybe that is why she had two weapons. She was caught with knives and gun when they came to arrest her.(at least knew she purchased one at the time), she liked what she did, and wanted to do it again. That is why she can't cry and needs to hide her smiles. She is freakin scary and is the type that should be put to death.

 

[Tsunvirtual]

How do I explain this, layman's terms over wine at dinner to someone who likes to debate?

How about: having a mental illness does not give you a get out of jail free card. The legal standard is pretty much if you know right from wrong you can't be considered insane.

 

[wasnt_me]

I'm guessing you are talking about the felony murder1 ? If a felony crime was premeditated, and as a result of that crime the life of another human was taken, then it is felony murder1. If I planned to rob Joe's home, the robbery is premeditated, if I killed Joe in the commission of that crime, then it's felony muder where premdiated murder means the murder of Joe itself was premeditated. That's the way I understood it.

Yes, but they put second degree in as a subcategory of premeditated murder. And then they said the difference between the 1 and second is premeditation. That's confusing to me.

"The crime of first degree premeditated murder includes the lesser offense of second degree murder."

"The difference between first degree murder and second degree murder is that second degree murder does not require premeditation by the defendant."

Maybe I'm misunderstanding what "includes" means....?

 

[Dewey2Me1MoThyme]

Some of the mother's behavior bothered me. The smiling, etc. I just hope they don't try to profit in any way. I don't follow a lot of trials, but followed the Casey Anthony trial, and I think back to her parents. I feel bad for the grandmother, and jodi's father seems pretty straight, but who knows.

I blame the aunt more than the mother. the mother seems to want to stay expressionless throughout the trial but the aunt is always grinning at innappropriate times, whispering in JA's mother's ear etc. I wonder if sometimes the mother's smirk or smile is not to appease the aunt so she will just leave her alone. In fact, the aunt reminds me of JA in many ways. Very immature, attention seeking, and doesn't have a good grasp on reality or others' feelings.

 

[AuburnSchnauzer]

The jurors know JA just like we do. She manipulated her parents when she was young and moved in with Bobby Juarez, remember? That is complete control and manipulation - She was jealous of her younger siblings IMO. I really do think she kicked the family dog to death. Here it starts. JA no longer has female friends. She moves from lover to lover and never stops. It goes on and on and then - She meets Travis. In her head, that was the image she wanted (in her sick mind) - She all of a sudden wanted to me a Mormon? Just to match up with what Travis was? Life doesn't happen this way, people. She must be put to death or she will strike again. LWOP will be her maximum pleasure - She will have gotten her way and will be able to control people for the rest of her life. We cannot give that to her. JMO

 

[KBisMe]

"Downstairs" is an area for WS members only. For most threads and trial stuff, it is OPEN to public, like this thread is... to search/view but they cannot comment.

"Downstairs" (there are many threads, and even some cases have been members only!) is for viewing by members only ...not searchable or viewed unless you are a member. WS has many great threads "downstairs" that are members only viewable threads.

MOO

Ooh cool! Thank you! Can you please tell me how to find those threads?

 

[wasnt_me]

I blame the aunt more than the mother. the mother seems to want to stay expressionless throughout the trial but the aunt is always grinning at innappropriate times, whispering in JA's mother's ear etc. I wonder if sometimes the mother's smirk or smile is not to appease the aunt so she will just leave her alone. In fact, the aunt reminds me of JA in many ways. Very immature, attention seeking, and doesn't have a good grasp on reality or others' feelings.

From what you wrote, I'm guessing the aunt is on the left, facing the camera?

 

[AuburnSchnauzer]

I blame the aunt more than the mother. the mother seems to want to stay expressionless throughout the trial but the aunt is always grinning at innappropriate times, whispering in JA's mother's ear etc. I wonder if sometimes the mother's smirk or smile is not to appease the aunt so she will just leave her alone. In fact, the aunt reminds me of JA in many ways. Very immature, attention seeking, and doesn't have a good grasp on reality or others' feelings.

"The nut doesn't fall far from the tree"

 

[Dewey2Me1MoThyme]

From what you wrote, I'm guessing the aunt is on the left, facing the camera?

Yes, the mother has black hair and the aunts is a little lighter in colour.

 

[ShadyLady]

I blame the aunt more than the mother. the mother seems to want to stay expressionless throughout the trial but the aunt is always grinning at innappropriate times, whispering in JA's mother's ear etc. I wonder if sometimes the mother's smirk or smile is not to appease the aunt so she will just leave her alone. In fact, the aunt reminds me of JA in many ways. Very immature, attention seeking, and doesn't have a good grasp on reality or others' feelings.

But remember it was the mother trying to sell the fake letters to national enquirer.

Well, I am getting sleepy...night all.

 

[AuburnSchnauzer]

I know this isn't a popular opinion, but from those police tapes of her parents, I do feel sorry for them. They didn't commit the crime.

Once I saw a murder show where a police officer's son killed the girl upstairs from them and set the place on fire. The officer got her son to confess to her and she turned him in. It was gut wrenching to listen to her.

I know you weren't going there with your post but each time I think of a defendant's family, I think of that woman.

It is pitiful hearing JA's parents claim that "she need help", etc. but they never took charge. JA had total control and even allowed her to move out of the house and move in with Bobby Juarez...