Vermont asked to take down sex offender registry

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Jeana (DP) said:
Duke darlin, you're already on thin ice. I suggest you refrain from your remarks to me.

EVERYONE knows that convicted sex offenders must register whenever they move. Everyone also knows that sex offenders cannot be rehabilitated. So, if someone wants to take the law into their own hands and kill one, why should we care?
For the same reason we care about anyone else deciding they have the right to kill whoever they chose.

So, a 19 year old who has sex with a 16 year old is an offender who can't be rehabilitated? These are the type of offenders who are placed on these lists. Many (I might even say most) are not the dangerous predators you are thinking of.

Don't take my comment so seriously, it was just a friendly reminder. Remember, this is supposed to be fun, too.
 
duke said:
For the same reason we care about anyone else deciding they have the right to kill whoever they chose.

So, a 19 year old who has sex with a 16 year old is an offender who can't be rehabilitated? These are the type of offenders who are placed on these lists. Many (I might even say most) are not the dangerous predators you are thinking of.

Don't take my comment so seriously, it was just a friendly reminder. Remember, this is supposed to be fun, too.


I already told you that in my state, which is the one that I said I knew about, they mention the age of the victim. Since you seem to know about the other states, I invite you to share your knowledge with the rest of us. That apparently is what so upset you that you needed to make a smart a$$ remark to me. And, believe me Duke, if I ever need a "friendly reminder" about anything to do with this forum, you won't be the person I check with. There are a great many threads on this forum that I don't take too seriously, but the ones dealing with child molesters don't fit into that category.
 
Being convicted of a sex offense is the 'process'. The sex offender was found guilty with all due process, sentenced to the standard punishment - jail plus a lifetime on the sex offender registry, where they belong. It's a bit of a compromise between sentencing them to life, and giving them a chance to live as a decent citizen, if they can - but if they can't, and so many sex offenders return to their crimes nearly instantly, we've got to give people a warning.
 
Jeana (DP) said:
I already told you that in my state, which is the one that I said I knew about, they mention the age of the victim. Since you seem to know about the other states, I invite you to share your knowledge with the rest of us. That apparently is what so upset you that you needed to make a smart a$$ remark to me. And, believe me Duke, if I ever need a "friendly reminder" about anything to do with this forum, you won't be the person I check with. There are a great many threads on this forum that I don't take too seriously, but the ones dealing with child molesters don't fit into that category.
I wasn't upset at all, just trying to lighten the discussion. It was meant to be friendly and fun, not smarta$$. Like you, I take child molestation seriously. I also take civil liberties very seriously. My point in this thread is that requiring offenders to register is a form of punishment, and it is administered without process. This is after they have served their sentence and repaid their debt to society. It is patently unfair and against the principles of justice our system was founded on.

And quoting all of the State laws on this issue would be a bit tedious, but this is my understanding of what most contain.
 
It's been discussed before. It's been debated before. What you may not realize is that many of the people on this board have been victims. We've heard their stories. We know how long the affects of sexual assault last. It is a lifetime sentence, no matter what the age the victim was. And they didn't get due process.
We know how frequently it happens, and how it is often not reported. We have read the news articles of known sex offenders being found working with kids in schools, church groups, sports organizations and etc. When the sex registry began, and parents started checking them out- parents started finding sex offenders working with their children. They started finding them next door at trusted neighbors homes. Sex offender registries do work, when parents use them. They help parents to gauge who to trust their kids with. Are they a guarentee of safety? No. But they help.
A sex offender goes to court and gets convicted. He is sentenced. That may involved jail or prison, probation, and/or fines. He is also sentenced to the sex offenders registry. That is called due process.
In some ways he is safer being known, because the shock of finding their child has been assaulted can lead some parents to extreme action. When the 4 offenders were murdered- the first place they looked for suspects were the families of the kids they had assaulted. It was also suspected that the murders may have been committed by a family of a victim who had not reported the offense. A sex offender makes enemies when they commit their crimes. If they commit a crime against a child, then they choose to take that risk. If they don't want to be on the registry, then they can quit before they get caught. It is their choice.
Now if they choose to commit a crime which can put them on a sex offender list, why should I disagree when they end up there? They had freedom of choice over their actions (and often the child didn't). They excercised that freedom. They got caught. Let's just say we are helping them to fulfill their choices.
 
Lets see you do a crime you do the time. And part of that time is to register as a Child Molester for life. And they should not be hunted down and murdered
 
duke said:
I wasn't upset at all, just trying to lighten the discussion. It was meant to be friendly and fun, not smarta$$. Like you, I take child molestation seriously. I also take civil liberties very seriously. My point in this thread is that requiring offenders to register is a form of punishment, and it is administered without process. This is after they have served their sentence and repaid their debt to society. It is patently unfair and against the principles of justice our system was founded on.

And quoting all of the State laws on this issue would be a bit tedious, but this is my understanding of what most contain.


That's where you're wrong. Its part of their debt to society.
 
mysteriew said:
A sex offender goes to court and gets convicted. He is sentenced. That may involved jail or prison, probation, and/or fines. He is also sentenced to the sex offenders registry. That is called due process.
This is not how it happens. Offenders are not sentenced to the registry. They automatically fall under the statute when convicted of certain types of crime. Cases are not evaluated to determine whether or not this person should be placed on the registry.
 
Jeana (DP) said:
That's where you're wrong. Its part of their debt to society.
No, I'm not wrong. Their sentence represents their debt to society.
 
JDB said:
Lets see you do a crime you do the time. And part of that time is to register as a Child Molester for life. And they should not be hunted down and murdered
That's exactly right. If we want to force offenders to register for life, regardless of what type of crime they commit, then just sentence them that way. Make it part of their "time". That would be fair.
 
duke said:
No, I'm not wrong. Their sentence represents their debt to society.

I don't have time to go through every state, but those I did say that its MANDATORY for them to register:

Maryland:


Q1. Who must register?
NOTE: Convicted" is when the person: (1) is found guilty of a crime by a jury or judicial officer; (2) enters a plea of guilty or nolo contendere; (3) is granted a probation before judgment** after a finding of guilt for a crime if the court, as a condition of probation, orders compliance with the requirements of this subtitle; (4) is found not criminally responsible for a crime.
Child Sexual Offenders - These registrants have been convicted in Maryland of the following offenses (or of comparable offenses if convicted in another state, federal, military, or Native American tribal court) that occurred on or after October 1, 1995 (or before October 1, 1995, if in the custody or under the supervision of a "supervising authority" on October 1, 2001):
• Child Sexual Abuse (Criminal Law Article, § 3-602)
• Rape First Degree (Criminal Law Article, § 3-303) of a child under age 15
• Rape Second Degree (Criminal Law Article, § 3-304) of a child under age 15
• Sex Offense First Degree (Criminal Law Article, § 3-305) of a child under age 15
• Sex Offense Second Degree (Criminal Law Article, § 3-306) of a child under age 15
• Sex Offense Third Degree (Criminal Law Article, § 3-307) of a child under age 15
• *Sex Offense Fourth Degree (Criminal Law Article, § 3-308) of a child under age 15 and ordered by the court to register.
*This offense is applicable only to those individuals whose crime was committed on or after October 1, 1995.
Offenders - These registrants have been (1) convicted in Maryland of the following offenses (or of comparable offenses if convicted in another state, federal, military, or Native American tribal court) that occurred on or after July 1, 1997; and (2) ordered by the court to register under the Criminal Procedure Article, § 11-701(d):
• Child Kidnapping (Criminal Law Article, § 3-503) (child under age 16)
• Kidnapping (Criminal Law Article, § 3-502) (victim under age 18)
• False Imprisonment (common law) of a victim under age 18 by an individual who is not the victim's parent
• Sex Offense Fourth Degree (Criminal Law Article, § 3-308) (victim under 18)
• Solicitation of an individual under the age of 18 to engage in sexual conduct
• Child *advertiser censored* (Criminal Law Article, § 11-207)
• Any of the prostitution and related crimes statutes under Title 11, Subtitle 3 of the Criminal Law Article if the intended prostitute or victim is under age 18.
• Any crime that involves conduct that by its nature is a sexual offense against an individual under the age of 18
• Any attempt to commit a crime on this list.
Sexually Violent Offenders - These registrants have been convicted in Maryland of the following offenses (or of comparable offenses if convicted in another state, federal, military, or Native American tribal court) that occurred on or after July 1, 1997 (or before July 1, 1997, if in the custody or under the supervision of a "supervising authority" on October 1, 2001):


IOWA:

On or after July 1, 1995, an individual who has been convicted or adjudicated of a criminal offense against a minor, sexual exploitation, or a sexually violent crime or who was on probation, parole, or work release status, or who was incarcerated on or after July 1, 1995 is required to register. Registration includes individuals that have received a deferred sentence or deferred judgments and can include convictions from other jurisdictions such as other states and/or federal convictions.

VIRGINIA:

First offense child *advertiser censored* possession and burglary with the intent to commit certain felony sex offenses will be new Registry offenses if committed after July 1, 2006. The bill adds a conviction for criminal homicide in conjunction with a violation for child abuse as a registrable offense. The sex offender website will include persons convicted of all registrable sex offenses, not just persons convicted of violent sex offenses as under current law. The bill modifies the registration of a person convicted of murdering a child; registration will be required if the victim is under 15 years of age and if the minor victim is 15 or older and the murder is related to a registrable sexual offense. Persons convicted in a foreign country will be required to register. Offenders will have three days to register or reregister after an address change rather than 10 and have to reregister for any employment change. Sex offenders moving into the Commonwealth will have three days to register instead of 10, as will nonresident visitors, workers and college students who are subject to registration requirements.
The State Police, or the Department of Corrections if a person is under Department of Corrections control or on community supervision, will be required to physically verify or cause to be physically verified registration information within the first 30 days of the initial registration or change of address and semi-annually each year thereafter.

NEW YORK:

The New York State Senate today passed a series of bills aimed at strengthening Megan's Law and cracking down on dangerous sex offenders by: mandating community notification when a registered offender moves into a community, requiring lifetime registration of sex offenders, prohibiting sex offenders from working and living nearby areas where they could pose a serious threat to children, such as schools and day care centers, and increasing penalties for dangerous sex offenders.
"The Senate has a strong record of increasing penalties for dangerous sex offenders who prey on innocent members of our communities, but we know that there is always more that can be done to protect the citizens of New York and ensure that our children are kept safe," said Senate Majority Leader Joseph L. Bruno. "These bills will take measures to keep our neighborhoods better informed about the presence of sex offenders and will increase penalties for sexual predators who pose a threat to our neighborhoods. I urge the Assembly to join us in passing these critically important pieces of legislation."
"Last week, the Senate passed the Megan's Law Reform Act strengthening the Sex Offender Registry in 25 different ways," said Senator Dean Skelos (R, Rockville Center). "Today, we're passing most of the components of that package, including lifetime registration, Internet posting and e-mail notification, so that the Assembly has no excuse for not acting on these vital, lifesaving measures. As the author of Megan's Law, I believe that we must continue reforming and updating the Sex Offender Registry to capitalize on new technologies and provide parents with every tool available to protect their children."
 
When an offender gets convicted, his conviction is evaluated to determine if it falls under the guidelines for the sex offender registry. He is evaluated to determine what level of sex offender classification he falls under. And that info is often included in the registry. So yes, it is determined on a case by case basis.
And again, the offender chose to commit a crime which would fall under the guidelines of the sex offender registry. No one forced him/her to do that. The registry isn't a secret, he/she would have made that choice knowing that if caught, he/she would go on the registry. It is his/her choice.
 
They are automatically sentenced to the registry - that's part of the punishment for the crime, just like the jail time. The debt to society is what the law says it is - and for this crime, their debt to society is not paid by merely time in jail, and it's nothing to be covered by a fine. They did something horrible and heinous, and their debt is lifelong.

Some states, part of the automatic punishment for any felony is to lose your voting rights - for some years, or for life, same for your right to own a gun, work certain jobs, etc. Having to be on a registry is no different than these things.
 
duke said:
That's exactly right. If we want to force offenders to register for life, regardless of what type of crime they commit, then just sentence them that way. Make it part of their "time". That would be fair.
No You missed what I am saying.They need to register after they do the time behind bars. just like felons are told no possieon of a gun is allowed it goes hand and hand. Part of the sentence does state YOU Must register as a Sexaul Predator
 
<H4>canada.com

Published: Thursday, April 20, 2006
The young Canadian man suspected of killing two sex offenders before committing suicide may have been a victim of a notorious pedophile.

Police in Maine are investigating whether Stephen A. Marshall was victimized by convicted sex offender Clark Gerwulf while living in the same Idaho town. Marshall attended high school in the remote community of Culdesac.

Gerwulf, 71, is now serving a life sentence for sexually assaulting several youths.

http://snipurl.com/phd1

</H4>
 
Jeana (DP) said:
I don't have time to go through every state, but those I did say that its MANDATORY for them to register:

Maryland:


Q1. Who must register?
NOTE: Convicted" is when the person: (1) is found guilty of a crime by a jury or judicial officer; (2) enters a plea of guilty or nolo contendere; (3) is granted a probation before judgment** after a finding of guilt for a crime if the court, as a condition of probation, orders compliance with the requirements of this subtitle; (4) is found not criminally responsible for a crime.
Child Sexual Offenders - These registrants have been convicted in Maryland of the following offenses (or of comparable offenses if convicted in another state, federal, military, or Native American tribal court) that occurred on or after October 1, 1995 (or before October 1, 1995, if in the custody or under the supervision of a "supervising authority" on October 1, 2001):
• Child Sexual Abuse (Criminal Law Article, § 3-602)
• Rape First Degree (Criminal Law Article, § 3-303) of a child under age 15
• Rape Second Degree (Criminal Law Article, § 3-304) of a child under age 15
• Sex Offense First Degree (Criminal Law Article, § 3-305) of a child under age 15
• Sex Offense Second Degree (Criminal Law Article, § 3-306) of a child under age 15
• Sex Offense Third Degree (Criminal Law Article, § 3-307) of a child under age 15
• *Sex Offense Fourth Degree (Criminal Law Article, § 3-308) of a child under age 15 and ordered by the court to register.
*This offense is applicable only to those individuals whose crime was committed on or after October 1, 1995.
Offenders - These registrants have been (1) convicted in Maryland of the following offenses (or of comparable offenses if convicted in another state, federal, military, or Native American tribal court) that occurred on or after July 1, 1997; and (2) ordered by the court to register under the Criminal Procedure Article, § 11-701(d):
• Child Kidnapping (Criminal Law Article, § 3-503) (child under age 16)
• Kidnapping (Criminal Law Article, § 3-502) (victim under age 18)
• False Imprisonment (common law) of a victim under age 18 by an individual who is not the victim's parent
• Sex Offense Fourth Degree (Criminal Law Article, § 3-308) (victim under 18)
• Solicitation of an individual under the age of 18 to engage in sexual conduct
• Child *advertiser censored* (Criminal Law Article, § 11-207)
• Any of the prostitution and related crimes statutes under Title 11, Subtitle 3 of the Criminal Law Article if the intended prostitute or victim is under age 18.
• Any crime that involves conduct that by its nature is a sexual offense against an individual under the age of 18
• Any attempt to commit a crime on this list.
Sexually Violent Offenders - These registrants have been convicted in Maryland of the following offenses (or of comparable offenses if convicted in another state, federal, military, or Native American tribal court) that occurred on or after July 1, 1997 (or before July 1, 1997, if in the custody or under the supervision of a "supervising authority" on October 1, 2001):


IOWA:

On or after July 1, 1995, an individual who has been convicted or adjudicated of a criminal offense against a minor, sexual exploitation, or a sexually violent crime or who was on probation, parole, or work release status, or who was incarcerated on or after July 1, 1995 is required to register. Registration includes individuals that have received a deferred sentence or deferred judgments and can include convictions from other jurisdictions such as other states and/or federal convictions.

VIRGINIA:

First offense child *advertiser censored* possession and burglary with the intent to commit certain felony sex offenses will be new Registry offenses if committed after July 1, 2006. The bill adds a conviction for criminal homicide in conjunction with a violation for child abuse as a registrable offense. The sex offender website will include persons convicted of all registrable sex offenses, not just persons convicted of violent sex offenses as under current law. The bill modifies the registration of a person convicted of murdering a child; registration will be required if the victim is under 15 years of age and if the minor victim is 15 or older and the murder is related to a registrable sexual offense. Persons convicted in a foreign country will be required to register. Offenders will have three days to register or reregister after an address change rather than 10 and have to reregister for any employment change. Sex offenders moving into the Commonwealth will have three days to register instead of 10, as will nonresident visitors, workers and college students who are subject to registration requirements.
The State Police, or the Department of Corrections if a person is under Department of Corrections control or on community supervision, will be required to physically verify or cause to be physically verified registration information within the first 30 days of the initial registration or change of address and semi-annually each year thereafter.

NEW YORK:

The New York State Senate today passed a series of bills aimed at strengthening Megan's Law and cracking down on dangerous sex offenders by: mandating community notification when a registered offender moves into a community, requiring lifetime registration of sex offenders, prohibiting sex offenders from working and living nearby areas where they could pose a serious threat to children, such as schools and day care centers, and increasing penalties for dangerous sex offenders.
"The Senate has a strong record of increasing penalties for dangerous sex offenders who prey on innocent members of our communities, but we know that there is always more that can be done to protect the citizens of New York and ensure that our children are kept safe," said Senate Majority Leader Joseph L. Bruno. "These bills will take measures to keep our neighborhoods better informed about the presence of sex offenders and will increase penalties for sexual predators who pose a threat to our neighborhoods. I urge the Assembly to join us in passing these critically important pieces of legislation."
"Last week, the Senate passed the Megan's Law Reform Act strengthening the Sex Offender Registry in 25 different ways," said Senator Dean Skelos (R, Rockville Center). "Today, we're passing most of the components of that package, including lifetime registration, Internet posting and e-mail notification, so that the Assembly has no excuse for not acting on these vital, lifesaving measures. As the author of Megan's Law, I believe that we must continue reforming and updating the Sex Offender Registry to capitalize on new technologies and provide parents with every tool available to protect their children."
We don't disagree that it's mandatory. I disagree that it is part of their sentence. It is automatically mandated for certain offenses.
 
mysteriew said:
When an offender gets convicted, his conviction is evaluated to determine if it falls under the guidelines for the sex offender registry. He is evaluated to determine what level of sex offender classification he falls under. And that info is often included in the registry. So yes, it is determined on a case by case basis.
And again, the offender chose to commit a crime which would fall under the guidelines of the sex offender registry. No one forced him/her to do that. The registry isn't a secret, he/she would have made that choice knowing that if caught, he/she would go on the registry. It is his/her choice.
The offender's crime is evaluated in some states to determine what level of risk he will be classified under. But, outside of the fact that he has been convicted of a certain type of crime, there is no evaluation to determine whether he should be placed on the registry to begin with. Hence, this is done without process. This is a crucial distinction.
 
Exactly like losing your right to own a gun, or vote, or become a police officer when convicted of any felony. What's the difference? The process is being convicted of a crime fitting into this type of punishment, the sentence is jail time plus fine plus other restrictions on your life. The evaluation was done already, by the jury or judge who decided what crime you were charged with, and if you were guilty of it. That's the evaluation - if you committed the crime, then you belong on that list.

What's the deal? It seems like you're just upset about semantics - whether the sentence is just jail time, or whether it's other things.
 
JDB said:
No You missed what I am saying.They need to register after they do the time behind bars. just like felons are told no possieon of a gun is allowed it goes hand and hand. Part of the sentence does state YOU Must register as a Sexaul Predator
This simply isn't true. Being required to register as a sex offender is not part of the sentence handed down by the court. It is required by state and federal statutes. You need to understand the difference.

You also should understand some of the offenses that will land someone on this registry.

For instance, the person who has a few drinks at a party and decides to streak across the lawn? That's right, Indecent Exposure. Join the Sexual Predator club for the next ten years.
And these lists are enforced retroactively in some states. Gay men convicted under outdated sodomy laws years ago are on these registries.
 

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