Found Deceased WA - Cheryl DeBoer, 54, Mountlake Terrace, 8 February 2016 #7

[Beesknees]

Based on?



Such as?


http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...29601+&cd=1&hl=en&ct=clnk&gl=us&client=safari

"Detectives are waiting for results from other prongs of the investigation. Computers are being analyzed by forensic experts with the Everett Police Department. The U.S. Marshal's office is examining cellphone records and where calls were made based on pings from cellphone towers. The Washington State Patrol Crime Lab continues to analyze evidence, including the plastic bag itself and the origins of drops of blood found in her car.

---

“I know people want answers now, but it takes time,” Wilson said. “I could see it taking several months before we get all of this back. It's not the one-hour crime drama we see on TV.”"

Based on my opinion after following this case since the beginning.

 

[Treelights]

I think it was said by her son, that she had been in the culvert since that Monday. But I don't think it has been detailed, about what time/hour this happened. I'm sure there is at least a time range???

You can tell a lot from a bruise. And not all bruises hurt, or became a bruise from getting hurt. So I have no clue, what bruises look like under the skin, at the point of contact, or what they can tell was from violence. Violence comes with its own range of force. Brutal all the way to ouch. So I have no clue. Is there a bruise expert here??

I thought that was his opinion that she had been in the culvert since that Monday.

IMOO.

 

[otto]

That's not what I said, I said I remembered one recently. Maybe they had 50? I don't know, I just recalled one recently.

Or they were suicides...

The population of King County is roughly 2M, Snohomish County (where MLT is) is about 750,000.

Well that's interesting you say that, because not only do they show repeated patterns, they tend to favor the same dump sites.
One of the reasons is their desire to revisit the corpses, for necrophelia or other reasons (I guess).

But of course there is always a first time for a site. The culvert doesn't fit the "classic NW serial killer" profile, they prefer to dump them in the undergrowth somewhere. BUT there are plenty of one off killings.

One of the two most common days for suicides, according to recent stats:
http://www.sciencemag.org/news/sifter/suicide-most-common-two-days-week

page 24, 50-59 most prevalent age for FEMALE suicides in SnoCo 2014
http://wa-snohomishcounty.civicplus.com/ArchiveCenter/ViewFile/Item/4229

Of course, I wouldn't over-rely on statistics... facts are preferable.

I wouldn't count the culvert as wooded, but it is somewhat secluded.

I recently met some serial killer victims (one escaped, one was a sister of a victim). Probably a mistake on my part, easy to feel a lot of empathy for them.

Thank you for the links! Anyone who is interested suicides in the area should have a look at your linked documents:

" ... Sunday and Monday are the peak days for adults to undertake [suicide] ... more suicides are attempted at the beginning of the week because the period symbolizes a “fresh start,” but depressed individuals believe their life circumstances remain unchanged and are disappointed.

The Journal of Emergency Medicine
http://www.sciencemag.org/news/sifter/suicide-most-common-two-days-week

"Nationally, suicide deaths in older Americans are associated statistically with financial concerns, relationship issues, illness and declining health."

http://wa-snohomishcounty.civicplus.com/ArchiveCenter/ViewFile/Item/4229

I will point out that the rationale for the peak days specifies "depressed individuals", which is a form of mental illness.

 

[kammiemc]

FWIW, I too remember vividly that the verified family member said it was a non domestic animal. I remember because I was upset to think it might have been the cat she just got and was waiting for word on that piece. When i saw it, i sighed a breath of relief. It must have been removed but i remember it came out just after the blood on the floorboard was revealed.

I have no recollection of Stryker posting that. But if he did, it would seem to be in conflict with his non-missing post where he answered the question about whether they could tell what kind of animal's blood. He said "Nope, it was inconclusive." I would say ruling out domestic animals is far from inconclusive. But who knows.

Knowing what kind of animal blood would answer at least some questions, like whether she was the victim of a ruse by someone claiming to have a hurt dog or cat, etc. so hopefully we will find out soon.

 

[otto]

Regarding suicide in women over 50, a couple of years ago there was another missing person discussion that I followed where it was ultimately determined to be suicide. The woman was fully employed, had some health issues - but that was managed, her children were grown and 2/3 had moved out. She and her husband were living apart, but she lived in the family home.

She went to Church on Sunday morning late in December: Catholic. In the afternoon, she left her keys, phone, and car at home, and walked approximately 1.5 miles to a cold, rapid river. She was found downstream after the Spring thaw. Her family repeatedly looked for her in the park near the river, stating that the river was her favorite place.

Leading up to that suicide, she had packed up old clothing and household items and donated them. She essentially put her affairs in order.

Why did she commit suicide? We'll never really know, but at the time I thought the reason was that she felt like she had spent her entire life caring for her family and others (her job was to provide care to children with special needs). After her job was done and her family was grown up and independent, she was alone. The health issue was pain related to walking, yet she walked almost 2 miles that day, crossed a busy intersection, and passed many families in the park next to the river (no one saw her). She probably saw nothing in her future other than being alone, more pain, getting old, providing a service to others, and perhaps being a burden. There's probably a phd thesis waiting to be written about what happens to women after age 50 that leaves them in dispair.

 

[jennapuppy]

Thank you for the links! Anyone who is interested suicides in the area should have a look at your linked documents:

" ... Sunday and Monday are the peak days for adults to undertake [suicide] ... more suicides are attempted at the beginning of the week because the period symbolizes a “fresh start,” but depressed individuals believe their life circumstances remain unchanged and are disappointed.

The Journal of Emergency Medicine
http://www.sciencemag.org/news/sifter/suicide-most-common-two-days-week

"Nationally, suicide deaths in older Americans are associated statistically with financial concerns, relationship issues, illness and declining health."

http://wa-snohomishcounty.civicplus.com/ArchiveCenter/ViewFile/Item/4229

I will point out that the rationale for the peak days specifies "depressed individuals", which is a form of mental illness.

And Cheryl was at the age where women are at risk for developing depressive symptoms:

"For other women, though, the rapid hormone fluctuations and the physical changes that are associated with menopause can lead to mood swings, anxiety, irritability, feelings of sadness, difficulties with memory and concentration, and even depression. Women have an increased risk of developing significant depressive symptoms after they enter menopause, even if they don’t have a history of depression. Research has found that women between the ages of 45 and 64 — a period of time that coincides with menopause — have the lowest emotional well-being of any age group or gender in America."

http://www.everydayhealth.com/hs/guide-to-managing-menopause/emotional-symptoms/

I don't know if that was the case with Cheryl but I do know, from personal experience, that it's something that women don't always discuss with their spouses and families. JMO

 

[JanetElaine]

I have no recollection of Stryker posting that. But if he did, it would seem to be in conflict with his non-missing post where he answered the question about whether they could tell what kind of animal's blood. He said "Nope, it was inconclusive." I would say ruling out domestic animals is far from inconclusive. But who knows.

Knowing what kind of animal blood would answer at least some questions, like whether she was the victim of a ruse by someone claiming to have a hurt dog or cat, etc. so hopefully we will find out soon.

I remember him saying it too. It wasn't from a dog or cat but otherwise inconclusive and more tests would be ran to figure that out. If that post has been deleted he may have worded himself wrong, but I definitely remember it because people were going on and on about where Cheryl's new cat was and if it was accounted for.

 

[ANZAC]

Thank you for the links! Anyone who is interested suicides in the area should have a look at your linked documents:

" ... Sunday and Monday are the peak days for adults to undertake [suicide] ... more suicides are attempted at the beginning of the week because the period symbolizes a “fresh start,” but depressed individuals believe their life circumstances remain unchanged and are disappointed.

The Journal of Emergency Medicine
http://www.sciencemag.org/news/sifter/suicide-most-common-two-days-week

"Nationally, suicide deaths in older Americans are associated statistically with financial concerns, relationship issues, illness and declining health."

http://wa-snohomishcounty.civicplus.com/ArchiveCenter/ViewFile/Item/4229

I will point out that the rationale for the peak days specifies "depressed individuals", which is a form of mental illness.

Good information there.

Now an obvious point -- one of the most difficult things for families of people that commit suicide to come to terms with, is if they had no indications beforehand, and they feel bad (or even guilty) because they wished the person had come to them or asked for help. Regardless of the outcome I hope the family is getting adequate support. In a lot of these cases they get support in the first few days or weeks and then it tapers off.

Not knowing how or why is still very stressful. Hopefully the forensics will all be back in (I know stryker mentioned some were in) and LE will have a conclusion soon.

 

[La Louve]

I am still on the fence about who is responsible for Cheryl's death.

IMO it's a bit risky to jump from the fact that the highest rates of suicide in America are among baby boomers to concluding that because she was in her 50s Cheryl's death was a suicide.


From a 2013 Washington Post article (BBM)

It has long held true that elderly people have higher suicide rates than the overall population. But numbers released in May by the Centers for Disease Control and Prevention show a dramatic spike in suicides among middle-aged people, with the highest increases among men in their 50s, whose rate went up by nearly 50 percent to 30 per 100,000; and women in their early 60s, whose rate rose by nearly 60 percent (though it is still relatively low compared with men, at 7 in 100,000). The highest rates were among white and Native American and Alaskan men. In recent years, deaths by suicide has surpassed deaths by motor vehicle crashes

Based on the numbers from the CDC study, I think statistically it would be very unlikely that Cheryl committed suicide based on her age or gender alone.

We just don't know enough about what was going on in her life that might have led her to take her own life. We as Websleuths may never know, and I've learned to come to terms with that. But I want answers and peaceful hearts for her family, friends, & colleagues, and justice for Cheryl if she died at the hands of another.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/loca...8acc7a-c41f-11e2-8c3b-0b5e9247e8ca_story.html

 

[kammiemc]

I remember him saying it too. It wasn't from a dog or cat but otherwise inconclusive and more tests would be ran to figure that out. If that post has been deleted he may have worded himself wrong, but I definitely remember it because people were going on and on about where Cheryl's new cat was and if it was accounted for.

Hmmm. I wonder how we can be sure. I have paid close attn to all of Stryker's posts and while he did say that there was no blood in the cat carrier, he did not say that the blood wasn't cat or dog blood in his answer about the test being inconclusive and the plan to retest it. (All those posts still exist.)

Am I the only person who missed now-deleted info from Stryker that the blood was not a cat or dog (or not a domestic animal)? I admit it's possible!

 

[dizzychick]

Hmmm. I wonder how we can be sure. I have paid close attn to all of Stryker's posts and while he did say that there was no blood in the cat carrier, he did not say that the blood wasn't cat or dog blood in his answer about the test being inconclusive and the plan to retest it. (All those posts still exist.)

Am I the only person who missed now-deleted info from Stryker that the blood was not a cat or dog (or not a domestic animal)? I admit it's possible!

I thought I read " non domestic" so I was thinking what she had a bleeding squirrel in her car ?

 

[kammiemc]

I thought I read " non domestic" so I was thinking what she had a bleeding squirrel in her car ?

Here is the conversation about the animal blood after it was released on KIRO, and Stryker's responses (post #867 and #876). He makes no mention of "non domestic" or "not cat or dog" in his answers. (Though he does talk about why he doesn't think it was the cat--because there was no blood in the cat carrier.) So either he edited out that info, or an entire post was deleted, or it came up in a different line of conversation that I can't locate.

http://www.websleuths.com/forums/sh...54-Mountlake-Terrace-8-February-2016-5/page58

 

[Sun009]

Good information there.

Now an obvious point -- one of the most difficult things for families of people that commit suicide to come to terms with, is if they had no indications beforehand, and they feel bad (or even guilty) because they wished the person had come to them or asked for help. Regardless of the outcome I hope the family is getting adequate support. In a lot of these cases they get support in the first few days or weeks and then it tapers off.

Not knowing how or why is still very stressful. Hopefully the forensics will all be back in (I know stryker mentioned some were in) and LE will have a conclusion soon.

I wonder how many people have killed themselves over a severe migraine? Like a intentional/unintentional situation? Those can be very severe & the suffering lasts many hours, to the point where someone is aware of how long they've been suffering. And you are pretty much at the mercy of a hospital or Dr...to give you an injection...and that's not always so easy for most people to get there. I could see how putting a gun to your head, could be impulsive in a situation like that.

 

[otto]

I was just visiting with the neighbour and learned that a woman in the neighborhood committed suicide not too long ago because "she was only happy when she was out for a run". There were three children - all barely out of high school, an affluent lifestyle, and she had a professional career. She suffered from depression and, even though the family was aware of it, she managed to disappear by claiming that she was taking the dog for a walk, and that was the end of it.

With suicide, I suspect that once someone has made up their mind, there's very little that can be done - short of psychiatric committal - to prevent it.

 

[margarita25]

Not buying suicide. The culvert looks like the culvert where Jessica Ridgeway was found. Jmo. Call me biased. Throw tomatoes at me.

 

[PLT]

Regarding suicide in women over 50, a couple of years ago there was another missing person discussion that I followed where it was ultimately determined to be suicide. The woman was fully employed, had some health issues - but that was managed, her children were grown and 2/3 had moved out. She and her husband were living apart, but she lived in the family home.

She went to Church on Sunday morning late in December: Catholic. In the afternoon, she left her keys, phone, and car at home, and walked approximately 1.5 miles to a cold, rapid river. She was found downstream after the Spring thaw. Her family repeatedly looked for her in the park near the river, stating that the river was her favorite place.

Leading up to that suicide, she had packed up old clothing and household items and donated them. She essentially put her affairs in order.

Why did she commit suicide? We'll never really know, but at the time I thought the reason was that she felt like she had spent her entire life caring for her family and others (her job was to provide care to children with special needs). After her job was done and her family was grown up and independent, she was alone. The health issue was pain related to walking, yet she walked almost 2 miles that day, crossed a busy intersection, and passed many families in the park next to the river (no one saw her). She probably saw nothing in her future other than being alone, more pain, getting old, providing a service to others, and perhaps being a burden. There's probably a phd thesis waiting to be written about what happens to women after age 50 that leaves them in dispair.

Coincidentally, I had a conversation with a friend this weekend who married young and now is an empty nester. She is younger than 50 but is at the chapter where it is just her and her husband. Her daughter moved across country and her son will graduate in May and has accepted a job offer abroad.

I, on the other hand, was single most of my life and became a wife/mother when most of my friends had teenagers. This friend and I were very close in high school and early college. When she married we drifted apart, but still keep in touch occasionally. During this weekend's "catch up' phone call, she commented that I was lucky to have a young child and can spend most of my "older life" appreciating the closeness we share. I pointed out that there are pros/cons to both of our paths. She can enjoy the next chapter of life traveling with her husband and visiting her kids and will be around longer for both her kids/grandkids. I expected her to agree but she said - the circle of life is kind of sad and she is happy to see her kids just beginning that cycle. We moved on to other topics but it nagged at me that she was seeing herself at the end of the cycle. Coupled with conversations/comments on this thread - I decided to call her back and take the chance of over-stepping my boundaries. I wanted her to know the facts about hormones, this phase of life, but more importantly - to call someone if she ever felt her circle of life was over just because her kids were not as dependent on her. She assured me that she was fine and has already looked into activities because her husband is not a traveler ad is content to stay home all the time. She also doesn't get along with her daughter's husband and would never impose so there is little chance she will move closer any time soon.

I think this for some, this stage in life can go either way more than we realize so your post really aligned with this conversation.

I didn't see CD as someone who viewed life the same way as my friend because she and her husband seemed to have an active life together and a successful career but what would an outsider like myself know based on a few news articles and posts online. As we all know, appearances can be deceiving. I still feel like it was homocide but only because it's a strong possibility in my view and the fact that there were no signs of a struggle or violent homicide shouldn't be cause to not continue to look for evidence (missing phone, purse, camera footage)...but as time passes these items may become more difficult to locate/obtain. I think /hope LE is still reviewing all angles.

 

[otto]

Not buying suicide. The culvert looks like the culvert where Jessica Ridgeway was found. Jmo. Call me biased. Throw tomatoes at me.

That is one of the first thoughts I had as well - that the culvert is more likely a place where someone dumps a body.

 

[margarita25]

That is one of the first thoughts I had as well - that the culvert is more likely a place where someone dumps a body.

Yes. This.

 

[margarita25]

Otto, while I've got you handy, can you please do a side by side? Tia.

 

[Eileen730]

Wouldnt there be some evidence on her body if she was murdered?
A bruise a bump on the head marks on tbe throat. Scrapes torn clothes?
Something!