GUILTY WA - Nathaniel Rosa, 31, fatally shot by homeowner, Belfair, 1 April 2017

[Koshka]

Mason County Prosecutor Michael Dorcy said Tuesday that Rosa had been at a nearby friend's house Friday night and took a walk early Saturday after getting into an argument. Rosa might have mistakenly entered Fanning's building, which has an identical floor plan to the house where he had been visiting his friend, according to Dorcy.

determine whether he was hypothermic, which might have contributed to a sense of disorientation. There has to be a lot they have not released to even be pondering this. maybe he ran out in the fight in shorts and exposed for a long term to the elements moo

I think this just solved the whole thing! moo, Fight the night before- may have been in elements for some time - it the best explaination in my opinion so far - makes it all more tragic IMO

A geriatric dude could easily mistake mental confusion for being "drunk" linked a couple of posts back

moo

Agreed. Two friends argue, one goes outside to walk it off, gets mild/moderate hypothermia (confusion is a symptom of hypothermia), goes into house with identical floor plan, thinking it's the friend's house, takes shower to warm up.

 

[Caffeine]

Agreed. Two friends argue, one goes outside to walk it off, gets mild/moderate hypothermia (confusion is a symptom of hypothermia), goes into house with identical floor plan, thinking it's the friend's house, takes shower to warm up.

The onset of hypothermia I wouldn't believe to be quite that quick, we're talking about a short walk here aren't we? Same neighborhood?

Not to disparage the deceased here, but I'm more inclined to think alcohol was the main factor here, at least based on his social media posts. Still, not really any reason for the homeowner to leave and bring a pistol back unless we're missing some huge piece of the puzzle here.

 

[al66pine]

CARIIS Good points in your post.

Was his car in the driveway? Ty for map it helped. Really buzzed so he got house confused? What hangs me up there is doing damage to moms door. That is kinda intense?
If mom worked and had to be gone for periods of time it would seem mom would give him a key?
Was this the first time he had visited mom in ages ?
Was that day his first day in time in that area or had he been there visiting a couple of days? Familiar vs not familiar with area yet?
The fact that it was daylight makes it more bizarre tho huh?

If MSM said his mom's house was in the neighborhood & he was visiting mom, I missed it. Anyone find it? Link? TiA.

Esp agreeing - daylight makes it waaaaay less likely he'd confuse one house for another.

JM2cts.

 

[Cryptic]

I am always of the mindset that the intruder has the option NOT to enter someone else's property.
If I'm on the jury, and it's not proven that they did previously know each other, I'm going to let him off.
Criminals have to take responsibility for their actions. If you get yourself into a mess and you end up dying, well, you made a bad choice.

I agree with all of the above- balanced against the concept that every so often, somebody takes a valid concept too far. By leaving, arming himself, then returning, and killing the individual with out any apparent threat, the shooter became an executioner.

In short, I can give the homeowner a very large "check" involving what he can do to defend himself in his own home. I cant, however, give him a blank check. In the end, I could support at least a Manslaughter conviction in this case.

 

[gitana1]

I am always of the mindset that the intruder has the option NOT to enter someone else's property.
If I'm on the jury, and it's not proven that they did previously know each other, I'm going to let him off.
The man that waited in the basement and killed the 2 teens should not have been charged in my opinion. He was retired and had been broken into several times. He deserved to be safe in his own home. He had lost his peace of mind.
I know that my opinion is not popular, but it is how I really feel. Criminals have to take responsibility for their actions. If you get yourself into a mess and you end up dying, well, you made a bad choice.
MOO

Crime is risky business. Criminals take the chance of being killed when confronted.

But we are a nation of laws. And those laws state that:

1. We don't give the death penalty for burglary. Or for drunk people who don't be know whose house they're in.
2. We have law enforcement and a jury system. Average citizens don't get to be judge, jury and executioner unless life is being threatened and/or you're not given the luxury to figure out if they mean you harm.

You can't coldly lure people to your home and then execute them and you can't leave a building, get a weapon and return to coldly execute them.

This wasn't his home you know. It was a business.

Listen, anyone breaks into my home and I have time to access a weapon, I'm going to try to kill them and THEN call police. I'm not going to ask questions or alert them that I'm there. I don't need to be stabbed to death or raped while calmly waiting for the cops.

This is different.

 

[TheOtherChristina]

The onset of hypothermia I wouldn't believe to be quite that quick, we're talking about a short walk here aren't we? Same neighborhood?

Not to disparage the deceased here, but I'm more inclined to think alcohol was the main factor here, at least based on his social media posts. Still, not really any reason for the homeowner to leave and bring a pistol back unless we're missing some huge piece of the puzzle here.

The shooting took place around 8 am according to this article, which suggests he could have been outside for several hours. He could also have been drunk, of course, but drunkenness doesn't really explain what he would have been doing in the shower and why he might have stayed in after being confronted by Fanning. Hypothermia explains it pretty well.

 

[al66pine]

Agreed. Two friends argue, one goes outside to walk it off, gets mild/moderate hypothermia (confusion is a symptom of hypothermia), goes into house with identical floor plan, thinking it's the friend's house, takes shower to warm up.

Okay, friend's house & Fanning's Bldg-Used-As-Business-Location* have identical floor plans.

Seems imo a person, esp. approaching on foot, would have noticed differences in vehicles in driveways and/or house exteriors, that is, before getting inside.

Before shooting, Rosa was outside friend's house (IDK how long, or how far away he went), and he decided to enter a house. Presumably, walking on road, he turns to walk on driveway
As someone (forgot who, sorry, but TYVM) posted upthread, what about vehicles in driveways?
Possible/likely friend had a vehicle in driveway at own house.
Likely Rosa's vehicle (if he had one there) was not parked in Fanning's BUABL driveway.
Possible that one or more vehicles were parked in Fanning's BUABL driveway.
Why/how did Rosa not see & recognize significance of vehicles & their locations (if they were as ^)?

Ditto, differences in planting, bushes, trees, etc.
Ditto, differences in house exteriors.

Seems imo a person not noticing ^ differences in yards, exteriors, etc in daylight (~8:00 a.m.) could be -
-- very intoxicated,
-- on IDK kind of drugs,
-- waaaaay more oblivious to surroundings than the average person (or even a clueless person), or
-- confused from hypothermia. ATM <---gaining traction as a possibility imo.
Presumably BUABL's furnishings, flooring, etc were distinguishable from friend's furnishings.

Or a person w no cognitive impairment could decide w crim intent to enter (breaking door?) and take a shower. ATM w info I've seen, <--- least likely imo.

JM2cts.

 

[Elley Mae]

Dorcy said investigators have learned that Nathaniel Rosa, 31, visited some bars in Belfair on Friday with several friends, one of whom was about to be deployed to Afghanistan. Those friends reported that Rosa, an elementary school teacher, then went to one of their homes, just two doors down from the property owned by Bruce Fanning. At about 5 a.m. Saturday, Rosa left his friend’s home for some fresh air, and “according to those guys, he never came back,” Dorcy said.


http://nypost.com/2017/04/05/slain-teacher-partied-with-pals-before-breaking-into-wrong-home/

The two homes, Dorcy said, are very similar in appearance, even down to the floor plan. Rosa may have mistakenly thought he had returned to his friend’s home when he was actually at Fanning’s door.

 

[Snoopster]

I agree he seemed off his rocker on the recordings, but I feel like they drove him to that. They had broken into his house before. They took the bait again when he moved his truck which shows they had no intentions of leaving him alone. I dont know if you have ever had your house broken into, but coming from someone who has, it makes you feel unsafe in the place you are supposed to feel safe at. My husband and I were at work when it happened, and I slept with all the lights in the house on for weeks.

As for this case though, completely different. I agree, the owner should be charged with murder. He had safely left the premise, and came back with the gun. I wonder if something is being left out from the story.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SM-G935A using Tapatalk

I don't agree with your opinion on the case with the teens, but I respect your right to have it. You have your reasons. You've clearly thought them through. I just came to a different opinion.

 

[Indy Anna]

Fanning called the sheriff's office at around 7:50 a.m. local time (10:50 a.m. ET) to report that he shot and killed an intruder who was showering in his business, the sheriff's office said.

[...]

Rosa's friends said he left at around 5 a.m. to get some air and never returned, raising the possibility he mistook Fanning's building for his friend's home, Dorcy said.

<snip> http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news...der-fatal-shooting-showering-intruder-n743596

We're not sure what time NR entered BF's place of business. If he went for a "short" walk, it would've still been dark when NR entered the building, so landmarks would not have been clear. Also, it would've been dark inside the building at the time NR entered if he did so before daybreak. He may have knocked on the door a while before kicking it in, thinking his friend was angry at him and making him stay outside in the cold.

If NR had been inside the house serving as BF's place of business for some time, did he locate a sofa (in the dark) and take a nap before deciding to take a shower? Since the floor plan was similar to his friend's house, he may have easily found the bathroom as dawn broke and daylight slowly shone in. IMO

 

[Elley Mae]

I wonder if he drove there from where he lived 80 miles away, and did his friends have vehicles that would/could have been visible. Seems odd that he would kick in his friends door to get in. Jmo

 

[LaneGirl]

I wonder if he drove there from where he lived 80 miles away, and did his friends have vehicles that would/could have been visible. Seems odd that he would kick in his friends door to get in. Jmo

It does seem odd but the shooter himself said he appeared "drunk" and was incoherent. So that could explain it.

 

[neesaki]

With the police having said there is more to the story,I doubt it went down the way Fanning stated.I wonder if the two knew each other or had any contact prior? As far as the entering wrong house I can not see a sober person going all the way in and getting in shower without realizing his mistake.Could Rosa have meant to be there for some reason?

Idk, but this sounds to me like something personal was going on. As in a grudge or vengeance? I just think that there's much more to it than Fanning alleges or has been reported. JMO

 

[Pseudonymph]

With this in mind, my suspicions lead me to believe that there is a much different story at the heart of this crime. Give the LE some more time to interrogate Fanning, and I bet a whole different version of what occurred will appear. This is all only my guess.

Have you seen the musical CHICAGO by any chance? [emoji6]

 

[LaneGirl]

Not sure if its been mentioned but the charge was upgraded to 1st degree.

 

[neesaki]

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news...der-fatal-shooting-showering-intruder-n743596

Reported here that Rosa's clothing was on the floor and was wet. Temperatures were in the 30's. Wonder what he was doing to get his clothing wet, did it rain? Or maybe got in shower with them on before removing them?

Seems to have been a serious lapse in judgment on the part of Fanning, I wonder if he has any mental health issues.

 

[Hraefn]

For those interested in the laws

Statute for murder in the first degree: https://app.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9A.32.030
First degree murder has its own sentencing statute: https://app.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9A.32.040

Statute for murder in the second degree: https://app.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9A.32.050
Sentencing statute will be the one for Class A felony here: http://app.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9a.20.021

TLDR: It comes down to premeditation. IMO him leaving and coming back makes it premeditated.

 

[al66pine]

For those interested in the laws
Statute for murder in the first degree: https://app.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9A.32.030
First degree murder has its own sentencing statute: https://app.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9A.32.040
Statute for murder in the second degree: https://app.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9A.32.050
Sentencing statute will be the one for Class A felony here: http://app.leg.wa.gov/rcw/default.aspx?cite=9a.20.021
TLDR: It comes down to premeditation. IMO him leaving and coming back makes it premeditated.

Thx for ^ links.

"...leaving and coming back makes it premeditated." Yes, makes it pretty hard to argue no premed'tn.

And not calling 911/LE until after shooting, some time after. Anyone have a handle (& link) for time elapsed from (est) shooting until 911 call? Not that it bears on premed'tn, but speaks to shooter's state of min afterward - perhaps cleaning up scene, rearranging items, otherwise tampering w evd, etc.

JM2cts.

 

[Betty P]

http://www.nbcnews.com/news/us-news...der-fatal-shooting-showering-intruder-n743596

Reported here that Rosa's clothing was on the floor and was wet. Temperatures were in the 30's. Wonder what he was doing to get his clothing wet, did it rain? Or maybe got in shower with them on before removing them?

Seems to have been a serious lapse in judgment on the part of Fanning, I wonder if he has any mental health issues.

According to Rosa's friend, he left the friend's home around 5 am. Took a walk, got wet (its a rainy, misty area, even in cold weather) After finding Rosa in his spare home, the perp called 911 at 7:50 am, after having visited the home, coming back to get his gun and returning to kill Rosa, then viewing Rosa's body, looking around, etc.. Assume all of that took 45 minutes or so. That means the perp first went to the office home around 7 am. Rosa had already entered the home, looked around, undressed and got into the shower before 7 am.

https://www.wunderground.com/histor....zip=98528&reqdb.magic=1&reqdb.wmo=99999&MR=1

Sunrise for that day in nearby Bremerton, WA was 6:49 am. Given it was overcast, I'm guessing it was still mostly dark outside when Rosa mistook the killer's office house for his friend's home.

JMO, I'm satisfied the killer has been charged with premeditated murder. It was, he could have safely changed his mind at any time. Hopefully it will help others who routinely carry and use guns think more clearly about whether they're in danger or just angry before using lethal force.

 

[Koshka]

Any updates? This is one of the stranger stories I've heard in quite some time.