Was Zahra Really Homeschooled? If so, WHY?!

[Melanie]

No, I do not believe Zahra was homeschooled for a nanosecond. I believe Adam Baker is culpable, because he HAD to know Zahra wasn't going to school anymore. The same man who was visited countless times by case workers, and who even suspected that the step-bigamist-momster was abusing her.

School was her only remaining safe haven, and Adam took that away from her. How could he. I believe it was because he knew of the abuse, and agreed with the step-bigamist-momster that if he wanted to avoid charges, they better remove Zahra from school.

They are both guilty of killing Zahra Baker. Even if he didn't do the "act of killing", he is equally responsible in my eyes.

MOO

Mel

ETA: Why didn't the 60 minute interview include this horrific detail of Zahras life. I'd sure like to sit in a room with Adam and ask him a few choice questions. I wouldn't pussy-foot around it either, like so many of these media outlets do.

 

[panthera]

True, but regardless of who was to be in charge of this homeschooling, Adam Baker, as Zahra's custodial parent, had both a moral and a LEGAL obligation to ensure that his child was being properly educated. We know, per msm reports and school officials that both parents said Zahra was being homeschooled, so this doesn't appear to be (yet another) case of EB pulling the wool over poor clueless AB's eyes.

So again, I have to ask: what was the reason HE agreed to this homeschooling arrangement? And if school officials made EB aware of the laws regarding homeschooling certification, are we to believe that they didn't bother to make her legal guardian aware of this as well? I find that difficult to swallow.

I believe he agreed to the home-schooling for the same reason as I believe she was being home-schooled. I also don't believe he cared one way or the other what was going on inside the house while he was at work or he would have intervened on Zahra's behalf. What I am unclear on is at what point in time would someone in authority have checked to make sure Zahra was actually being educated? Or was that the catalyst to report her missing? :waitasec: MOO

 

[NoeticSoul]

IMO parents who homeschool in the normal manner, trying to make sure that their child receives an education, would notice that she's missing the day she disappears because they would have the habit of talking to their children.

Exactly. When hubby would come home from work, all of the childrens' work for the day and/or artwork would be on the fridge with a magnet for hubby to see. (I didn't see anything but ONE note on EB's fridge--and couldn't make out what it said, but it wasn't school work!) We talked as a family about what they learned in their lessons each day, at supper time. We quizzed them on the names and capitols of states and countries.. ect.

Surely Zahra would have been excited to show him projects, stories she wrote, SOMETHING, ANYTHING. NO. She wasn't home-schooled and I agree with the notion that it was to segregate her from public and family, because of the abuse AND due to pure laziness on their part.

Can anyone see EB (or AB for that matter) getting up at 8 am to somewhat simulate a normal schooling schedule 5 days a week at home?! And don't for get the planning and materials that go along with the lessons and projects.

NO. imo there's no way she was educated in this household.

I'd love for someone, during his next interview, to ask AB WHY Zahra was not in school in the 1st place.. Nobody's ever asked him that.

But I digress.. I feel the homeschooling issue is important in that it just adds to AB tall tales.. but Zahra's is gone and some-times it seems to me like a moot point.

The school system should have done more to verify that Zarhra was indeed being home schooled. One of the teachers already knew something wasn't right for PETE's sake! She gave Zahra her cellphone #!

*sigh*

I forget. What DID they find and take in to evidence pertaining to homeschooling records? A notebook? I remember reading something but I forget what at this point. tia

 

[bessie]

Speaking of that fridge note, I still wonder about it from time to time. It filled a full page and appeared to be quite more than a "note". Would love to know what it said.

As for homeschooling, convenience and isolation (of Zahra) are the two big attractions I see for EB, in particular. I'm still hanging on to the possibility that AB was clueless about some things that were going on in the beginning. EB might've convinced him that homeschooling was the right thing to do for Zahra, offering the same arguments that honest, conscientious parents use to make the decision to homeschool. He would've accepted her word with little challenge, I think. Dumb as a box of rocks, that one is. IMO.

ITA with TLCox's post down there, and it breaks my heart. The isolation must've been horrible for Zahra. The lack of socialization, considering that she had no siblings, and the opportunity to excel and be rewarded for her achievements by adults who were sincerely interested in her welfare...I can't imagine what harm that alone did to the poor child.

 

[Flakes]

I'm glad the home schooling issue has continued overnight into this new thread as I think it's a very important factor in this whole sequence of events. I think the answer to "WHY home school?" sits somewhere between, or in a combination of, all the explanations we have proposed. I have no idea which.

The one thing that's common through all our views is that none of us believes EB would have followed through and taken responsibility for her role as teacher, and that there's a good chance that no, or very little, teaching actually occurred in the time after August 25th when the school year commenced.

The reason I find this so significant a topic is that I feel it may have contributed to Zahra's death in a significant way. Take this vague (speculative) scenario:

Zahra is taken out of school, with the decision made by ???????, and for the following reason ???????? She is to be home schooled by EB.

This arrangement makes Zahra fully dependent upon EB, day-in day-out, for day-to-day care and also for her education. This will put a lot of pressure on EB who is expected to give Zahra a considerable amount of her time.

What kinds of emotions would EB have felt in this situation? I suspect resentment, pressure, anger and frustration. Having Zahra around the house all the time would have been a huge impediment on EB's lifestyle. She would have felt burdened; unable to come and go as she likes; unable to choose her own waking hours; unable to play on the internet or visit friends (lovers) or possibly do drugs when and if she chooses. Having to meet the education system's expectations, plus the expectations of Zahra and Adam to fulfill this role would have annoyed her. After all, Zahra would know what to expect from a teacher, as she had attended school up til this time. The fact is she was expected to be, and seen to be, the teacher. EB would undoubtedly fail to meet the expectations.

So EB becomes increasingly upset about the responsibilities and burden she is dealt. She becomes increasingly angry at Zahra, who is perceived as the cause. This builds and builds in EB's mind, and manifests in her treatment of Zahra. This resentment would occur whether she made the effort to teach any subjects to Zahra or not. And it would also occur whether EB had (or had not) been instrumental in the decision to take Zahra out of school and into the home for her education.
​

It appears that much occurred in that single month, from the date of commencement of the school year (August 25th) to the date that it's estimated Zahra died (September 24th). Even if we are to believe Adam's claims that he definitely saw Zahra alive and well in the 2 weeks after that, then this merely extends the scenario to maybe 6 weeks all together. Much in terms of potential to drive EB to act out her anger on Zahra. How that did manifest is the unknown ... and of course whether this is a viable scenario is also unknown. Inside my heart I suspect it may have played a role in things.

This home schooling decision had the (potential) outcome of putting Zahra in immediate danger IMO. An outcome that I doubt anyone anticipated, perhaps not even EB until she was actually living this way. She would possibly consider that her hand was forced (which is a sickening thought but I am sure she sees some justification and vindicating reason for her actions).

 

[Mountain_Kat]

Can WSers who have children please tell me what is required to register a child for school, or withdraw them from school? Do you not have to provide proof of legal guardianship in order to do either of these things?

 

[tlcya]

I was required to provide birth certificate, immunization records, social security card and proof of residency (mail with my name on it). I do not recall being asked to provide proof of gaurdianship, but do know that the birth certificate and social security cards were to proove citizenship and the mail to proove residency in the disctrict. I am not sure if the requirements vary in NC or from school district to district.

Perhaps a local could tell us about requirements in NC?

 

[Mountain_Kat]

I was required to provide birth certificate, immunization records, social security card and proof of residency (mail with my name on it). I do not recall being asked to provide proof of gaurdianship, but do know that the birth certificate and social security cards were to proove citizenship and the mail to proove residency in the disctrict. I am not sure if the requirements vary in NC or from school district to district.

Perhaps a local could tell us about requirements in NC?

Or better yet, a step-parent, because that is really the question I'm asking. Would EB have had the legal right to enroll or withdraw Zahra from school, based soley on the fact that she was married to Zahra's father? If she had legal guardianship, then I would think she did. If she didn't have legal quardianship, I would absolutely hope NOT.

 

[Kamille]

Or better yet, a step-parent, because that is really the question I'm asking. Would EB have had the legal right to enroll or withdraw Zahra from school, based soley on the fact that she was married to Zahra's father? If she had legal guardianship, then I would think she did. If she didn't have legal quardianship, I would absolutely hope NOT.

It was the move that made it easy for EB to claim that Zahra was being homeschooled. They had changed counties so the representative from the school that Zahra was supposed to attend just assumed that they had made the proper arrangements in the new school district for the homeschooling.
Unfortunately, they did not follow up. A decision that they will regret for the rest of their lives I'm sure.

And IMO, no...EB did not have the legal right to make that claim and withdraw Zahra from school. Just another reason why it should have been followed up immediately.

MOO

 

[westsidefox64]

MK considering the size of the place and the size of the schools I would see no problem with EB getting Zahra in school. I know several people in my area who are step parents who do most of the interactions with the school. In a bigger city it might be a different situation. In a smaller community people probley knew she was married to AB and thought nothing of her being the one to enroll her. JMO

 

[Mountain_Kat]

MK considering the size of the place and the size of the schools I would see no problem with EB getting Zahra in school. I know several people in my area who are step parents who do most of the interactions with the school. In a bigger city it might be a different situation. In a smaller community people probley knew she was married to AB and thought nothing of her being the one to enroll her. JMO

Do you think that would also have been true in the case of withdrawl from school?

 

[dar107]

Possibly when AB first enrolled Zahra in the public school system, he could have stipulated in her file that EB had his full permission to sign paperwork for Zahra, pick her up, attend teacher interviews, etc.

Once Zahra'a school from the previous year realized she was not attending, and that no other school had requested her transcript, the school would be trying to get a hold of the family to find out why she was not in school. I feel it should have raised some more flags seeing as there had been multiple DSS visits, and now suddenly Zahra was being homeschooled. If only that had been called in by the school and DSS had investigated the Home schooling aspect.

MOO is that EB was doing everything she could to keep DSS and teachers out of their business, and AB went right along with it and fully knew the reasons why.

 

[Mountain_Kat]

Maybe I should be more clear about why I'm asking this particular question.

http://www2.hickoryrecord.com/news/2010/oct/15/no-record-zahra-was-home-schooled-ar-458423/

<snipped and bbm>

Libby Brown, public information officer for Caldwell County Schools, said school personnel try to find a child who does not show for school within the first 10 days of a school year.
"We did contact the family," Brown said about Zahra's parents, Adam and Elisa.
Brown could not divulge a lot of information, but said, "a parent withdrew the child and said the family had moved to a different district."
Brown said the parent indicated Zahra would be home schooled.
That's when the Caldwell County school system's jurisdiction ended.
However, Brown said the system did review elements of home schooling with the parent.

I'm trying to determine which parent this was. If EB didn't have legal guardianship, wouldn't the school have had to contact Zahra's legal guardian, which was AB, and make him aware of this situation?

In addition to AB's legal obligations where Zahra was concerned, he also had legal rights. Being informed about any changes regarding his daughter's school enrollment or withdrawl from school, would surely fall under the description of those rights.

 

[vjlaw]

Maybe I should be more clear about why I'm asking this particular question.

http://www2.hickoryrecord.com/news/2010/oct/15/no-record-zahra-was-home-schooled-ar-458423/

<snipped and bbm>

Libby Brown, public information officer for Caldwell County Schools, said school personnel try to find a child who does not show for school within the first 10 days of a school year.
"We did contact the family," Brown said about Zahra's parents, Adam and Elisa.
Brown could not divulge a lot of information, but said, "a parent withdrew the child and said the family had moved to a different district."
Brown said the parent indicated Zahra would be home schooled.
That's when the Caldwell County school system's jurisdiction ended.
However, Brown said the system did review elements of home schooling with the parent.

I'm trying to determine which parent this was. If EB didn't have legal guardianship, wouldn't the school have had to contact Zahra's legal guardian, which was AB, and make him aware of this situation?

I know when my kids were in school I had to fill out papers every year at registration. Papers that included doctor's name, hospital preference and someone to contact if parents can't be contacted. There seem to be so many kids with step-parents or being raised by grandparents I think it is not unusual for someone that isn't the actual bio-parent to enroll the child. I would think the school would have asked where they were moving to. I thought the school had reported AB/EB for school. If that is the case, I would have thought they would be suspiscious of her saying she was homeschooling Zahra. I am not in North Carolina, but your question brings up a good point about the custodial parent. I would think since Zahra was brought here from another country, they would just make sure they had contact with the biological parent whether they are legally obligated or not. By the same token, AB brought Zahra here and he knew she was away from any family and school as she knew it in Australia. School is such a big part of a child's life, for him not to know or make an effort to know what is going on with her schooling is inexcusable. All he had to do was go by the school and make himself known. I am sorry, that doesn't give you an answer though on who should legally decide about a child's schooling.

 

[dar107]

My apologies if this article was posted here already.

http://www2.hickoryrecord.com/news/2010/oct/15/no-record-zahra-was-home-schooled-ar-458423/

Zahra was not home schooled, according to records
A parent withdrew her from Caldwell schools

Snipped:

HICKORY --
There is a hole in the statutory school attendance safety net for North Carolina's school children, and Zahra Clare Baker seems to have dropped through that hole.
There is no record that Zahra was home schooled, as her parents claimed, or that either parent applied for home school certification.
The Hickory Daily Record looked at home school registrations in Catawba, Caldwell and Burke counties and did not find any reference where Adam or Elisa Baker received certification for home schooling.
The N.C. Department of Non-Public Education, a part of the state Department of Administration, requires all home schools to be registered.

 

[NoeticSoul]

Or better yet, a step-parent, because that is really the question I'm asking. Would EB have had the legal right to enroll or withdraw Zahra from school, based soley on the fact that she was married to Zahra's father? If she had legal guardianship, then I would think she did. If she didn't have legal quardianship, I would absolutely hope NOT.

I have a step-daughter, one year younger than my daughter, who's mother passed away 5 years ago. She immediately came to live with us. Even so, here in Chicago, I was unable to enroll her in school, her father was required to, since I had not legally adopted her. I was however able to pick her up for Dr's appointments ect, while at school.

It would be interesting to learn what the NC laws are regarding enrollment.

OT: Interestingly, her maternal grandmother had more rights than I when it came to the public schools, medical issues, ect.

 

[NoeticSoul]

My apologies if this article was posted here already.

http://www2.hickoryrecord.com/news/2010/oct/15/no-record-zahra-was-home-schooled-ar-458423/

Zahra was not home schooled, according to records
A parent withdrew her from Caldwell schools

Snipped:

HICKORY --
There is a hole in the statutory school attendance safety net for North Carolina's school children, and Zahra Clare Baker seems to have dropped through that hole.
There is no record that Zahra was home schooled, as her parents claimed, or that either parent applied for home school certification.
The Hickory Daily Record looked at home school registrations in Catawba, Caldwell and Burke counties and did not find any reference where Adam or Elisa Baker received certification for home schooling.
The N.C. Department of Non-Public Education, a part of the state Department of Administration, requires all home schools to be registered.

BINGO!!!!!!!!!!

Adam Baker knew PLENTY! IMO He was helping hide the abuse. AS I see it he would have been the ONLY one able to withdraw her from that school OR enroll her in another.

Also, in order to homeschool here, the legal guardian MUST register for the Certification. Which, with my kids, was me.

 

[free2ride]

I not only live in NC but I live in Caldwell County.

My daughter withdrew her children from public school and homeschooled them for two years.

The process was very complicated. She first had to get paperwork from the public school regarding the childrens current education levels in certain subjects that are required of NC students. Then she had to fill out a very long comprehensive form regarding her education, the children's education, copies of her custodial papers (she has sole custody of her children), she had to register a name for the school, sign up for their end of grade test requirements and notify the public school of her intent.

Once all of that was competed she did not have to answer per say to anyone at the government level during the school year. The children had to take end of grade tests and pass them. If they did not pass the state education department would then have come to her home to evaluate their individual work for the past year.

Getting the children back into school was harder than taking them out. Seems the public school system in this county was concerned that the children would be behind (not considering they might have excelled) their classmates.

Since the registration process is so comprehensive I would expect had the forms been completed by EB or AB the Hickory Daily Record would have found them on file. My guess is "they" said they would be homeschooling ZB but actually never did. Or perhaps they didn't understand that there were stringent requirements in place to homeschool.

Now as to custody issues here in this county. As I said my daughter has sole custody of her children with one father involved and one father not involved in their education. In the case of the father who wanted to be involved (or rather his wife wanted to be involved - he didn't care) which was a similar situation as AB & EB's. The schools were quite open and comfortable dealing with the stepmother. She would come by and pick up my granddaughter without my daughter's knowledge. She would come by and ask for parent/teacher conferences without my daughter's knowledge. And was overstepping her bounds until my daughter went to a lawyer and had papers drawn up that said the father could be involved in her education but the stepmother was not allowed to be. That letter was placed in her school file and ONLY THEN did the schools begin to crack down on the stepmother making decisions. If AB never complained then I can see where EB got by with making a show of being interested in ZB's education.

This is a small town where people are quite trusting and naive. They are grateful to have any parent (step or otherwise) involved in a child's life. A lot of grandparents have grandchildren that they have actually enrolled in school here without having legal custody.

I can see EB being the involved parent and AB being the absent parent. And see the schools accepting her decisions regarding ZB without even a backward glance (with the exception of any teacher who might have been concerned about ZB's welfare).

I hope I helped and didn't muddy the water more. Please feel free to ask me questions about NC homeschooling and if I can't answer then I can ask my daughter.

 

[Shear22]

I started a thread about this topic, because well, the claims of her being home-schooled just don't add up!

As a homeschooling mom, IMO there's NO WAY she was home-schooled. And I don't see how AB couldn't have known that Zahra wasn't receiving an education AT ALL.

Thank you so much for asking this. This is one of the most troubling parts about this case. Well, after the dismemberment, etc.

I don't believe for a minute that she was homeschooled at all, but why oh why was she not sent to school? If a stepparent doesn't like their stepchild, for whatever reason, the last thing they usually want is to keep the child at home all day.

 

[Shear22]

True, but regardless of who was to be in charge of this homeschooling, Adam Baker, as Zahra's custodial parent, had both a moral and a LEGAL obligation to ensure that his child was being properly educated. We know, per msm reports and school officials that both parents said Zahra was being homeschooled, so this doesn't appear to be (yet another) case of EB pulling the wool over poor clueless AB's eyes.

So again, I have to ask: what was the reason HE agreed to this homeschooling arrangement? And if school officials made EB aware of the laws regarding homeschooling certification, are we to believe that they didn't bother to make her legal guardian aware of this as well? I find that difficult to swallow.

BBM. This is the question that I want to know the answer to.