What does Linda Arndt know?

DNA Solves
DNA Solves
DNA Solves

What secret does Linda Arndt know?

  • That PR is the killer.

    Votes: 21 9.6%
  • That JR is the killer.

    Votes: 38 17.4%
  • That both PR & JR are the killers.

    Votes: 11 5.0%
  • That BR is the killer.

    Votes: 7 3.2%
  • That BR is the killer and PR & JR covered for him.

    Votes: 84 38.4%
  • That someone else is the killer.

    Votes: 10 4.6%
  • She knows nothing and is lying.

    Votes: 48 21.9%

  • Total voters
    219
It's always bothered me that LA never got any support that morning despite asking for it several times. Why not? I mean even as a kidnapping, this had to have been one of the biggest events that sleepy little town had seen in quite some time, so why didn't they immediately assign a top detective to it? And wasn't this STs first murder investigation? Why not put your most experienced guy on such a high profile case? None of this makes any sense!


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It's always bothered me that LA never got any support that morning despite asking for it several times. Why not? I mean even as a kidnapping, this had to have been one of the biggest events that sleepy little town had seen in quite some time, so why didn't they immediately assign a top detective to it? And wasn't this STs first murder investigation? Why not put your most experienced guy on such a high profile case? None of this makes any sense!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

Not only that, the Chief of Police refused help from the Denver police when they offered it. Denver was a much larger city and they did have officers with homicide experience. The FBI too, was sent away. When the FBI got there very early that morning, it was still considered a kidnapping and the CASKU (Child Abduction & Serial Killer Unit) would have taken the case. However, the FBI very quickly sized up the situation at the home- the ridiculous ransom note, the behavior of the parents, the "posse" of friends cleaning the evidence away. Before they left they told police "You're going to be finding her body". They suspected what REALLY happened- that this was NO kidnapping, but the coverup of the death of a child.
 
Not only that, the Chief of Police refused help from the Denver police when they offered it. Denver was a much larger city and they did have officers with homicide experience. The FBI too, was sent away. When the FBI got there very early that morning, it was still considered a kidnapping and the CASKU (Child Abduction & Serial Killer Unit) would have taken the case. However, the FBI very quickly sized up the situation at the home- the ridiculous ransom note, the behavior of the parents, the "posse" of friends cleaning the evidence away. Before they left they told police "You're going to be finding her body". They suspected what REALLY happened- that this was NO kidnapping, but the coverup of the death of a child.

Great points Dee. It just seems so obvious that there was an attempt to sabotage this case from the very start. LA suspected the Ramseys. Off the case. ST suspected the Ramseys. Off the case. Lets bring in LS, we already know what he suspects.
 
Not only that, the Chief of Police refused help from the Denver police when they offered it. Denver was a much larger city and they did have officers with homicide experience. The FBI too, was sent away. When the FBI got there very early that morning, it was still considered a kidnapping and the CASKU (Child Abduction & Serial Killer Unit) would have taken the case. However, the FBI very quickly sized up the situation at the home- the ridiculous ransom note, the behavior of the parents, the "posse" of friends cleaning the evidence away. Before they left they told police "You're going to be finding her body". They suspected what REALLY happened- that this was NO kidnapping, but the coverup of the death of a child.

The weight of that information, alone, would be enough to convince me. Add in all of the other ridiculous crap and I honestly can hardly believe that anyone, to this day, can believe it was an intruder. I guess it was the first and last time for that lunatic then- never committed another crime similar. Yeah right.
 
I'm not sure Linda Arndt had a "secret." I think the scene she came upon was just so out of sink, and the behavior of the parents so bizarre, her antenna went up. I'm also one who gives a lot of credence to women's intuition. Not much was normal there and I think when John carried his dead, stiff daughter up and laid her on the floor, she became afraid. I sure as heck would have been. By that time Patsy was all drugged up, the house was full of strangers and there is a six year old whose body has ties and tape. BPD did not send her help and the crime scene, body and surrounding was immediately compromised. A mess from the get go.

celticthyme,
BBM: Yes ITA. She knew something was wrong ... Later she seemed to gravitate towards PR as if she recognized she was not responsible, but by default had to respond to media enquiries etc?


That is did LA come to appreciate that PR was protecting another family member and given similar circumstances LA might have responded similarly?


.
 
Arndt was trained as a rape victim specialist. She always viewed the woman as a victim. In this case, she was suspicious of JR because of his actions. Most parents in this situation would cling to each other. JR and Patsy were no where near each other in that house. In addition, neither parent seemed concerned about the supposed phone call that the "kidnappers" were supposed to make. Nor did they seem concerned that the RN said that the house was being watched, in case they talked to "even a stray dog". I never heard or saw anything about the police or friends being asked not to park by the house- and no one was worried about being seen going into the house. Bottom line- there was NO kidnapping and the RN was a fake. That left Arndt with a very short suspect list- the three people who were in the house with JB during the time she was killed. Arndt did not yet know about the autopsy results, pineapple in the stomach, etc. But she DID know that JR seemed to be hiding something. He casually looked through his mail, seemed unconcerned about his wife etc...
When she suggested JR "take another look around" (at the behest of her boss when she complained about needing backup because she was having trouble keeping track of all the people in the house) JR made a beeline for the basement, and a few moments later he "found" his "missing" daughter. His actions when she saw him carry her body up from the basement- stiff, stinking of decay and urine, like a macabre life-size doll held upright away from him- told Arndt all she needed to know. Somehow, JR was involved in this. Instead of hysterics, tears or rage, his first words to her seemed to want to throw blame on someone they knew (this was an inside job, he said) - and right there is was a giveaway that the RN was a fake. Now-think about it- who would a parent write a fake note FOR? Certainly not the housekeeper, disgruntled employee or small foreign faction. For one of THEMSELVES. I think she viewed JR as the perp, and Patsy the unwilling victim of her husband's actions against their daughter.
I wonder how that investigation would have gone if Arndt, French and their boss had acted like REAL cops and followed protocol- treat the house like an active crime scene, throw OUT all the people except the three residents of the home, keep everyone in ONE room, with your gun easily accessible. Actually, she could have managed the houseful of people the same way. Stand (or sit) by the door with that gun- and nobody leaves the room. I wonder if she regrets allowing JR to wander around the house and finding the body thereby contaminating the crime scene forever.
 
Arndt was trained as a rape victim specialist. She always viewed the woman as a victim. In this case, she was suspicious of JR because of his actions. Most parents in this situation would cling to each other. JR and Patsy were no where near each other in that house. In addition, neither parent seemed concerned about the supposed phone call that the "kidnappers" were supposed to make. Nor did they seem concerned that the RN said that the house was being watched, in case they talked to "even a stray dog". I never heard or saw anything about the police or friends being asked not to park by the house- and no one was worried about being seen going into the house. Bottom line- there was NO kidnapping and the RN was a fake. That left Arndt with a very short suspect list- the three people who were in the house with JB during the time she was killed. Arndt did not yet know about the autopsy results, pineapple in the stomach, etc. But she DID know that JR seemed to be hiding something. He casually looked through his mail, seemed unconcerned about his wife etc...
When she suggested JR "take another look around" (at the behest of her boss when she complained about needing backup because she was having trouble keeping track of all the people in the house) JR made a beeline for the basement, and a few moments later he "found" his "missing" daughter. His actions when she saw him carry her body up from the basement- stiff, stinking of decay and urine, like a macabre life-size doll held upright away from him- told Arndt all she needed to know. Somehow, JR was involved in this. Instead of hysterics, tears or rage, his first words to her seemed to want to throw blame on someone they knew (this was an inside job, he said) - and right there is was a giveaway that the RN was a fake. Now-think about it- who would a parent write a fake note FOR? Certainly not the housekeeper, disgruntled employee or small foreign faction. For one of THEMSELVES. I think she viewed JR as the perp, and Patsy the unwilling victim of her husband's actions against their daughter.
I wonder how that investigation would have gone if Arndt, French and their boss had acted like REAL cops and followed protocol- treat the house like an active crime scene, throw OUT all the people except the three residents of the home, keep everyone in ONE room, with your gun easily accessible. Actually, she could have managed the houseful of people the same way. Stand (or sit) by the door with that gun- and nobody leaves the room. I wonder if she regrets allowing JR to wander around the house and finding the body thereby contaminating the crime scene forever.

I think Arndt had regrets, and sadly she was "blackballed" by the BPD team. She also had some members of the RST or other R supporters initiating some attempts of intimidation. In reading some items on ACR recently, I read something from Arndt I didn't quite understand:

1999-09-15 (T) Linda Arndt on Good Morning America (Wed)
"Arndt: I hadn't seen savagery done to a child, or even an adult, until, uh, the doctor peeled back her scalp and, uh, saw that horrific, uh, fracture to her head. It was the length of her head.
(Voice Over) It was 8 ½ inches long.
Arndt: The doctor hadn't seen an injury like that. The doctor couldn't believe what was done to her body. Her, her head, uh, the depth of that ligature around her neck. It was so deep that twice that cord had been wrapped around her neck, and uh, and it looked like it was only one loose time around. And, um, she had trauma to her vagina, vagina.
Vargus: What kind of trauma?
Arndt: It would be trauma that would be consistent with injuries seen in sexual assault cases.
Vargus: Recently?
Arndt: What was seen was not a first-time injury."


DeeDee, I’ve never seen this comment before. Can you give your take on this? Does it sound like she is saying the cord had been wrapped twice around her neck, and the loose wrap made them initially miss the one embedded deeply in her neck? TIA
 
I think Arndt had regrets, and sadly she was "blackballed" by the BPD team. She also had some members of the RST or other R supporters initiating some attempts of intimidation. In reading some items on ACR recently, I read something from Arndt I didn't quite understand:

1999-09-15 (T) Linda Arndt on Good Morning America (Wed)
"Arndt: I hadn't seen savagery done to a child, or even an adult, until, uh, the doctor peeled back her scalp and, uh, saw that horrific, uh, fracture to her head. It was the length of her head.
(Voice Over) It was 8 ½ inches long.
Arndt: The doctor hadn't seen an injury like that. The doctor couldn't believe what was done to her body. Her, her head, uh, the depth of that ligature around her neck. It was so deep that twice that cord had been wrapped around her neck, and uh, and it looked like it was only one loose time around. And, um, she had trauma to her vagina, vagina.
Vargus: What kind of trauma?
Arndt: It would be trauma that would be consistent with injuries seen in sexual assault cases.
Vargus: Recently?
Arndt: What was seen was not a first-time injury."


DeeDee, I’ve never seen this comment before. Can you give your take on this? Does it sound like she is saying the cord had been wrapped twice around her neck, and the loose wrap made them initially miss the one embedded deeply in her neck? TIA


I had never seen that before either. Because here in back and white is a police officer who was present at the autopsy stating that there were indications of PRIOR sexual assault. How long did posters go back and forth here on WS claiming there was no prior assault. Even those who conceded that there was assault that night still refused to believe it had happened before - and all because it would have spoiled their "intruder did it" theories. No "small foreign faction" could have snuck into the home on previous occasions and molested a child undetected by her parents and unidentified by the child.
As for the cord- what I see is that she is saying that one of the two loops around her throat was very deeply imbedded and one was not digging in at all. As we know, there was ONE very faint white ligature mark. The coroner never mentioned this. Usually a white mark indicates that it was a postmortem injury, made during the early "blanching" (or non-fixed) stage. If whatever is putting pressure on the skin is left in place, the blood will not seep back in where the blood has been pushed away. This is because the heart is no longer pumping and the blood is no longer circulating. If the cord was wrapped after death and then immediately pulled away, the blood would seep back in. This would occur until it became fixed, and then all livor patterns remain. She doesn't mention the white mark; however- when we look at the autopsy photos of JB's neck, we see what seems to be one deep red ligature furrow that is completely circumferential, with no up or down movement. The coroner doesn't mention the white mark either, and it seems to be visible only at the front of her neck. Arndt's comments could mean that the cord, which was cut off right there on the autopsy table, was wound once deeply imbedded into the red, bruised deep furrow and once leaving the white mark. As I read it again, I see something different. It looks like she means that the cord was wound SO tight that although it was wound twice, the first wrap was SO deep that you couldn't even see the cord, and the second wrap, not imbedded, was hiding the first wrap, and it was laying on the surface of the skin, seemingly not digging in at all. Her wording is confusing, but when I read "twice it was wound and it looked like it was only one loose time" it makes me believe she meant the outer wind of the cord was hiding the much deeper bottom (first wind) of the cord.
Interesting that she spoke to "Good Morning America" and not to the press or any investigators. She planned to write a book- that was why she initially was not forthcoming with information. She was there - ground zero- at the crime scene with the parents and also at the autopsy- she saw and heard more than any other investigator. Yet she clammed up- and developed "ramnesia". I think it had something to do with her lawsuit. She sued the BPD and we never heard about the outcome. I would bet she had to keep quiet, and discontinue plans to write that book, as part of any settlement she received.
That lawsuit is why she was "blackballed" by the BPD. She felt she was being made a scapegoat. But she WAS responsible for much of the mishandling. It is because she did not get control of the crime scene and this allowed the PRIMARY crime scene (the body and the wine cellar) to be forever compromised. Had the parents never been allowed to touch that body, there would be NO explanation for the presence of their fibers on JB other than their handling of the body wearing the clothes they had on that day.
 
I had never seen that before either. Because here in back and white is a police officer who was present at the autopsy stating that there were indications of PRIOR sexual assault. How long did posters go back and forth here on WS claiming there was no prior assault. Even those who conceded that there was assault that night still refused to believe it had happened before - and all because it would have spoiled their "intruder did it" theories. No "small foreign faction" could have snuck into the home on previous occasions and molested a child undetected by her parents and unidentified by the child.
As for the cord- what I see is that she is saying that one of the two loops around her throat was very deeply imbedded and one was not digging in at all. As we know, there was ONE very faint white ligature mark. The coroner never mentioned this. Usually a white mark indicates that it was a postmortem injury, made during the early "blanching" (or non-fixed) stage. If whatever is putting pressure on the skin is left in place, the blood will not seep back in where the blood has been pushed away. This is because the heart is no longer pumping and the blood is no longer circulating. If the cord was wrapped after death and then immediately pulled away, the blood would seep back in. This would occur until it became fixed, and then all livor patterns remain. She doesn't mention the white mark; however- when we look at the autopsy photos of JB's neck, we see what seems to be one deep red ligature furrow that is completely circumferential, with no up or down movement. The coroner doesn't mention the white mark either, and it seems to be visible only at the front of her neck. Arndt's comments could mean that the cord, which was cut off right there on the autopsy table, was wound once deeply imbedded into the red, bruised deep furrow and once leaving the white mark. As I read it again, I see something different. It looks like she means that the cord was wound SO tight that although it was wound twice, the first wrap was SO deep that you couldn't even see the cord, and the second wrap, not imbedded, was hiding the first wrap, and it was laying on the surface of the skin, seemingly not digging in at all. Her wording is confusing, but when I read "twice it was wound and it looked like it was only one loose time" it makes me believe she meant the outer wind of the cord was hiding the much deeper bottom (first wind) of the cord.
Interesting that she spoke to "Good Morning America" and not to the press or any investigators. She planned to write a book- that was why she initially was not forthcoming with information. She was there - ground zero- at the crime scene with the parents and also at the autopsy- she saw and heard more than any other investigator. Yet she clammed up- and developed "ramnesia". I think it had something to do with her lawsuit. She sued the BPD and we never heard about the outcome. I would bet she had to keep quiet, and discontinue plans to write that book, as part of any settlement she received.
That lawsuit is why she was "blackballed" by the BPD. She felt she was being made a scapegoat. But she WAS responsible for much of the mishandling. It is because she did not get control of the crime scene and this allowed the PRIMARY crime scene (the body and the wine cellar) to be forever compromised. Had the parents never been allowed to touch that body, there would be NO explanation for the presence of their fibers on JB other than their handling of the body wearing the clothes they had on that day.

DeeDee249,
BBM: and that makes sense since the ligature would be tightened after the second looping once the knotting was complete.

You have to wonder if Coroner Meyer made more verbatim remarks than were actually reported, particulary by LA, when she cited digital penetration, Meyer must have said something else for her to know he had discovered a chronic injury?

The big Q for me, is was the acute internal injury, staging, or a valid sexual assault?

.
 
DeeDee249,

The big Q for me, is was the acute internal injury, staging, or a valid sexual assault?

.

Bingo. There are some people that will five you the impression that JB was all but torn apart by some sort of sexual sadist that night. If the injuries were part of the staging, then there was likely no assault right?
 
Bingo. There are some people that will five you the impression that JB was all but torn apart by some sort of sexual sadist that night. If the injuries were part of the staging, then there was likely no assault right?

andreww,
I know what you mean, but either way, there was an assault, some would argue however you interpret the assault it was sexual.

I'm curious if it might have been faked. Since we do know, second person, of course, but still credible that BR played doctors, so that would explain away the chronic, healed injuries.

Leaving the possibility that the acute assault was staged, which would be consistent with the rest of the wine-cellar crime-scene!

.
 
From Mark Beckner's recent interview...

Lots of reasons really. One, the ransom note was fake - there was no kidnapping and kidnappers do not write such notes. The ties around the hands were too loose to be of any use, thus it was part of the staging. The body was wrapped in a blanket and she had her favorite nightgown with her. The garroting of the neck was unnecessary since the blow to the head came first and she was unconscious and near death. Why the garrote? The tape was put on her mouth after being unconscious or dead and it was a small piece, not really enough to keep someone's mouth shut for long. The broken paintbrush used to simulate sex assault. All these were clues to staging.
 
From Mark Beckner's recent interview...

andreww,
The broken paintbrush used to simulate sex assault. All these were clues to staging.
How true is this statement. Meyer cites digital penetration, Linda Arndt never mentioned anything about the paintbrush being used.

So who is correct, or are they all? Was JonBenet assaulted acutely twice or once?

.
 
.
Hate to bring up this (sensitive) subject .... but it is not unheard of for children to "do things to themselves down there" ... our daughter started at 3 years (on her own - no abuse etc) ... doctors said it can happen , although rare . It became a bit of a problem in kindergartner and grade one ... so we (my wife) gently explained to her it should be done only in private and at home and there were no more issues after that (thankfully) .... our daughter went on to have a typical normal life so it was likely just a childhood thing..
 
.
Hate to bring up this (sensitive) subject .... but it is not unheard of for children to "do things to themselves down there" ... our daughter started at 3 years (on her own - no abuse etc) ... doctors said it can happen , although rare . It became a bit of a problem in kindergartner and grade one ... so we (my wife) gently explained to her it should be done only in private and at home and there were no more issues after that (thankfully) .... our daughter went on to have a typical normal life so it was likely just a childhood thing..

Arnie M,
I guess it could be, but in the context of such a sadistic homicide, I think its unlikely. Even if true it does not explain why JonBenet was asphyxiated.

.
 
Arnie M,
I guess it could be, but in the context of such a sadistic homicide, I think its unlikely. Even if true it does not explain why JonBenet was asphyxiated.

.

I agree completely .... I suppose my point was that trying to comprehend all the possible sources of JB's injuries we must also include self inflicted , I rather doubt it myself , but it is not impossible ,

best wishes
 
I agree completely .... I suppose my point was that trying to comprehend all the possible sources of JB's injuries we must also include self inflicted , I rather doubt it myself , but it is not impossible ,

best wishes


This disgusts me. JB did not "masturbate" her way (probably with a broken paintbrush) to an injury that caused her to bleed. Note to men- this type of violation does NOT feel good. Just so you know.
 
This disgusts me. JB did not "masturbate" her way (probably with a broken paintbrush) to an injury that caused her to bleed. Note to men- this type of violation does NOT feel good. Just so you know.

I don't think anybody meant to be offensive. We have two types of injury here, from long term abuse and from the attack that night that caused her to bleed. Although improbable, it is possible that the long term injuries may have been self inflicted and the injuries of that night may have been an attempt to stage a sexual assault in an attempt to mask the real motive of the murder.




Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk
 
And just to add, another tidbit from Mark Beckner's online Q&A...

Based on evidence of prior damage to her vagina and hymen, experts told us there was evidence of prior abuse. No way to really know if it was chronic.
 
And just to add, another tidbit from Mark Beckner's online Q&A...

Beckner is not speaking in the “medicalese” of a pathologist. He is speaking to an online group of people. The coroner listed injuries as chronic since it was medically evident that they had occurred prior to the 48 hours before her death. In everyday English usage it's generally understood that the term “chronic” means persisting for a long time or constantly recurring. The distinction between the coroner's findings and the manner in which Beckner provided an explanation is important to make, as the children's abuse experts (those that confirmed herabuse) clearly stated there is no way to tell how frequently or how long she had been sexually abused. So, a "prior abuse" explanation to an online group and "chronic injuries" in the ME's terminology are both correct.
 

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