What if another parent from Skyline abducted Kyron?

[Blue Ridge]

It would be odd for the teacher not to have noticed that he left his book bag and jacket. Kids have homework.

May be that she DID notice, but assumed that because he'd been there earlier for the science fair, he'd accidentally left it. Or, more likely IMO, perhaps everyone's bags and jackets simply hang on hooks in the back of the room out of the way, so it isn't even obvious whose is whose.

 

[Donjeta]

It would be odd for the teacher not to have noticed that he left his book bag and jacket. Kids have homework.

Maybe she did but it is not unusual for seven year olds to forget things. If his bag and jacket were hanging on the hooks on the wall with other bags and jackets I don't think they would have stood out to her until the other kids had gone with their stuff.

 

[GrainneDhu]

It would be odd for the teacher not to have noticed that he left his book bag and jacket. Kids have homework.

I saw a picture of the classroom that showed it had a row of coat hooks at kid height. A lot of coat hooks, with both jackets and backpacks hanging from them.

I strongly suspect that the kids were expected to unload their backpacks of anything they needed for class into their desks, then place them on the hooks at the back of the classroom.

Neat, tidy, less temptation for bored little fingers to find any toys, etc, that they may be carrying for recess or the bus trip to and from school.

And way too easy to miss the fact that there are, say, 25 jackets and 25 backpacks on the hooks but only 24 kids in the class.

 

[BetteDavisEyes]

Very early in the case, I considered the possibility (and may have posted about it) that a parent who felt that his/her child was somehow in competition with Kyron might have been jealous enough to want to hurt the boy. When I heard that another student had also done his science project on the tree frog like Kyron - an entry that was obviously inferior to Kyron's - I entertained the notion that this parent freaked out and targeted the Horman boy. This was one of my early thoughts about the case and why Kyron had gone missing from his school on the day of the science fair. jmo

 

[winterrose]

SBM

I think it was a very low risk move to re-open the school the following Monday and the benefits were probably huge in terms of mental health for the other kids. Even though they did not know exactly what happened to Kyron.

I am certain that the safest, most secure school in the USA 7 June 2010 was Skyline School. They had extra adults on the premises to help the children deal with Kyron's disappearance and also act as extra eyes. Every adult present and most of the older kids was primed and ready to spot any suspicious behaviour.
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I think they were more worried about appearances of not looking like it was the school's fault and having the community afraid it was a school security problem.I doubt LE could have known over the weekend it was not a stranger or school employee abduction.LE was all over the school,but that doesn't mean it was 100% non stranger abduction,at the time.And I don't see how the kids would have felt safer being in the school that day than at home with family.Plus it would have set a precedent in the parents mind there was a problem with the school,alot of money goes to the school each day for every student.LE along with the school are all part of the county or City system and the whole country was watching.

 

[Donjeta]

I think Skyline was probably the safest place in the US for children that week, being in the LE eye a lot... Any stranger would have been nuts to abduct another child from there so soon.

It is my understanding that it is usually good for children to return to school as soon as possible after a traumatic event because it keeps the routine and routine usually means feeling safe, and because it is easier to arrange for counselors to talk to a number of children who need it if they're at school. Also, if they're being kept away from school they may associate the school with danger and that's not good since they have to return eventually.

Then there is the practical consideration that if the school is closed, dozens or hundreds of parents have to stay home from work or make other arrangements to care for their children.

 

[winterrose]

Plus if it wasn't a parent abduction,the school had to contend with possible lawsuits.Not just by Kaine,but Desiree and why I think she was called when Terri and Kaine were already at the school office.They got in the school right from thier busstop and Desiree wasn't called till after 4pm,her name was on the emergency list of numbers,too.They were covering thier bases and there were people calling the shots on how to handle Monday higher up than the school or LE Dept.

I also want to say everything we've heard lately I do feel it appears Terri knows something,but I'm not dismissing the school's lack of security or it's disorganization,school's never should be lax.

 

[YellowSubmarine]

RSBM and BBM

Don't kids have assigned desks? I mean, it would be possible to not notice someone was missing if they all sat in a different seat each day all over the room, but if the kids have regular assigned seats then it would be glaringly obvious if one were missing.

Anyway, I think the teacher DID know he wasn't there for classes because IIRC she marked him absent.

I'm almost positive they had assigned desks. I remember seeing a pic of his name tag on his desk. They are the same ones my kids' school use and the kids are moved around every several weeks.

This whole subject is what angers me so much about this case. A child went missing from school during school hours and it was looked over. He was noticed missing early on. It was noticed by TWO teachers and ignored. I would be infuriated if my child attended Skyline and would have immediately pulled them out. It is absolutely unacceptable to me that this could happen. Kyron was at school, with his classmates, with his teacher and it was not questioned when he disappeared. The ball was dropped by many people that this is possible. I really wish more was being said about this!

Heck, maybe they should look more into the teacher who said he was getting a drink or in the bathroom and never gave it a second thought he never returned. IMO -- NOT trying to start rumor!!!

 

[Chewy]

What perp would return to skyline by now? That does make me think they know it's not someone in the school. But I agree it's probably the safest place in teh world right now for a kid to be.

 

[Chewy]

[double post]

 

[Chewy]

I'm almost positive they had assigned desks. I remember seeing a pic of his name tag on his desk. They are the same ones my kids' school use and the kids are moved around every several weeks.

This whole subject is what angers me so much about this case. A child went missing from school during school hours and it was looked over. He was noticed missing early on. It was noticed by TWO teachers and ignored. I would be infuriated if my child attended Skyline and would have immediately pulled them out. It is absolutely unacceptable to me that this could happen. Kyron was at school, with his classmates, with his teacher and it was not questioned when he disappeared. The ball was dropped by many people that this is possible. I really wish more was being said about this!

Heck, maybe they should look more into the teacher who said he was getting a drink or in the bathroom and never gave it a second thought he never returned. IMO -- NOT trying to start rumor!!!

I agree with this. I had my son go missing at school. Basically they lined up in the morning in the school yard and then all the kids go into school. Well my son was in Kindergarten and he walked off. He was found by a janitor 15 minutes later. Everyone had gone into the school and he was wandering around the street alone.


I had dropped my son at the school yard (they won't let parents in) and left him there. The teacher actually blamed him for not staying with the group and wandering off. She was annoyed that I suggested she was responsible. I took him right out of the school.

 

[Caligram]

Another parent, or an unknown predator, grabbing Kyron right out of the halls? I believe that is extremely risky and hard to fathom.
MOO

 

[LaceSprocket]

Thank you, thank you, thank you.

This is barely on the outskirts of Portland--not a small rural town. Believe me, there are PLENTY of interesting things to do in the area besides attend an IB exhibit at a tiny school in the area when you don't have kids that attend the school. There are over 2 million people who live in the greater Portland metro area. We need to get away from the idea that this is anything close to a "small town." Downtown Portland is only about 15-20 minutes away.

I'm not familiar with the area. So in the beginning, I was confused. Skyline school was referred to in the press and online comments/forums as a very small, little, rural school in a very, small, tiny out-of-the way community. But it's not. It's only 20 min from a major city. Near major highways, airports, etc.

No, it doesn't change anything case-related, but it helps me understand the proximity of the school and it's surrounding community. It also reminds me to not read everything online as a FACT.

 

[shefner]

At the end of the school day, if there was a student's backpack and jacket left at the desk or hanging on the wall, don't you think the teacher would notice that? Not only would she notice, but that should also trigger an automatic recall of the parent/volunteer asking about Kyron's whereabouts earlier in the day. Apparently the teacher commented that he had probably gone to get water or to use the restroom. Just to be on the safe side, I think most teachers would make a quick phone call to Kyron's parents to say, "Kyron's backpack and jacket are here...and also his science fair project. I'm double-checking to make sure he (fill in the blank)....had a doctor's appointment...left with one of you guys early today."

 

[CarmelEyesD]

I completely understand LE has to clear family first-and for some reason (guilty secret TH has) she has been unable to be cleared. However, because of her 'guilty knowledge', failed lie detector and evasive answers, LE is continuing to look and perhaps view TH as the perp. Even though I would reveal ANYTHING, KH feels she has a secret to protect. That secret may have nothing to do with Kyron-could be as simple as an affair or friend she wants no one to find out. The logical thing of course is to tell all. However, we do not know TH's mental make-up-she may have been more afraid of KH finding out she had a special friend, (or risking her marriage, income or child). She may have felt safe not telling, assuming Kyron would be found soon, or if she is innocent, feeling LE would find the perp-if she knew it wasn't her. Then of course, as things escalated, she may have either told the truth (we have no way of knowing what she has or has not said); or felt it was better to keep her secret, rather than reveal herself as a liar. My concern is, if LE concentrated so hard on TH because of her deception, did they NOT focus enough on an 'external' perp- a stranger, someone of limited acquaintance, a predator...because they were SO sure it was her? And if it isn't her, where is that perp now? Another town, another school, another child?

 

[Haeve]

Thank you, thank you, thank you.

I'm not familiar with the area. So in the beginning, I was confused. Skyline school was referred to in the press and online comments/forums as a very small, little, rural school in a very, small, tiny out-of-the way community. But it's not. It's only 20 min from a major city. Near major highways, airports, etc.

No, it doesn't change anything case-related, but it helps me understand the proximity of the school and it's surrounding community. It also reminds me to not read everything online as a FACT.

I'm repeating myself, but it bears repeating. The problem is that the area is referred to as "rural Portland" or "rural Multnomah County" and also the county sheriff is involved instead of the Portland PD. All that "rural" means in this context is that it is outside any city's urban growth boundary. But most of Multnomah County is densely populated.

On the "ask a local" thread, we decided that the closest thing to accurate was to say it was a suburban area. It's a difficult concept to explain to folks who don't know the area. I'm a visual person, and I think the simplest way to understand it is to look at one of the excellent maps created by WSers and see how close the huge densely urban area is to Skyline, Sheltered Nook, etc.

People who live near do say that there is community of sorts that is made up of people who send their kids to that school, but, as far as I can tell, for most goods, services, social and entertainment options, people would drive the 15-20 minutes into the highly populated urban area.

All it takes is one non-local reporter to jump to conclusions about the area's demographics (but geesh, didn't s/he fly into PDX--Portland International Airport??) to create the confusion that is perpetuated online.

 

[YellowSubmarine]

At the end of the school day, if there was a student's backpack and jacket left at the desk or hanging on the wall, don't you think the teacher would notice that? Not only would she notice, but that should also trigger an automatic recall of the parent/volunteer asking about Kyron's whereabouts earlier in the day. Apparently the teacher commented that he had probably gone to get water or to use the restroom. Just to be on the safe side, I think most teachers would make a quick phone call to Kyron's parents to say, "Kyron's backpack and jacket are here...and also his science fair project. I'm double-checking to make sure he (fill in the blank)....had a doctor's appointment...left with one of you guys early today."

I have no doubt the teacher did notice it. Just like she noticed he never made it back to the classroom and ignored it. This is why I'm so angry over this. It'd be different if he never showed up to school in the first place. He DID. He was there. He was in his classroom. He was with his classmates and teachers. I honestly think there should be some charges brought on the teachers and possibly the school. Think of the uproar if a parent suddenly noticed their child missing and shrugged it off with "I'm sure he's around here somewhere".

 

[human]

Maybe she did but it is not unusual for seven year olds to forget things. If his bag and jacket were hanging on the hooks on the wall with other bags and jackets I don't think they would have stood out to her until the other kids had gone with their stuff.

and even if they were still there, big deal. Kids leave stuff all of the time and it is not the teacher's responsibility to take care of kid's back packs and jackets.

If it is important, the parent will call about them and pick them up. If not, the child can bring them home the next day.

Children have to learn to become responsible instead of having their parents take care of little issues like that.

 

[cluciano63]

Remember, before we blame the teacher, we just don't know what if anything she was told about Kyron that day. And I am sure, as many teachers here have stated, that backpacks and jackets get left behind all the time, plus we do not know that this was the case with Kyron's on that day, we only heard that they were deposited in the classroom from Terri's mom, who must have been told that by Terri. No one in any official role has confirmed that, nor has Kaine, to my knowledge.

There are too many things we do not know to blame anyone, at this point, including Terri. In my opinion, one person and one person only took Kyron away from that school and that is the person to blame, but we don't know who that was, and neither do the police, as far as I am concerned. But I do think, with people stating they noticed Kyron at various points in the day, it is less likely that a total stranger went unnoticed by all present.

And we don't know if the teacher was ever really told anything by a child about Kyron being absent and if she was, what her reply was. There is only one source for that to date and it is from an 8-year old. I am sure the teacher has spoken to LE and has been told (as he was ) not to speak to media. Not saying the child made it up, but we don't know what has been verified.

I still find it strange that LE came out and stated that Terri was the last person to see Kyron on that morning. How could they possibly know that? Unless she was seen being the last person to see him, if you know what I mean? It' s confusing.

 

[human]

At the end of the school day, if there was a student's backpack and jacket left at the desk or hanging on the wall, don't you think the teacher would notice that? Not only would she notice, but that should also trigger an automatic recall of the parent/volunteer asking about Kyron's whereabouts earlier in the day. Apparently the teacher commented that he had probably gone to get water or to use the restroom. Just to be on the safe side, I think most teachers would make a quick phone call to Kyron's parents to say, "Kyron's backpack and jacket are here...and also his science fair project. I'm double-checking to make sure he (fill in the blank)....had a doctor's appointment...left with one of you guys early today."

since we have no info about the doctor's appt and what was said to the teacher, we are at quite a loss to comment on it.

However, let us say that Terri did tell the teacher she was going to an appt. Why would the teacher question that?

Sometimes doctor's appts take forever, and maybe the teacher thought that they would be going out for lunch. Or maybe she thought because of the talent show, they wouldn't be coming back at all that day.

We can look at this in hindsight, but never in a million years would a teacher think that a responsible parent wouldn't have been telling her the truth and that something like this could happen.

As a teacher, I do not worry about things left at school. And apparently, some parents do not either.

We have conferences twice a year, and I would put lost items out. I still ended up with random items.

I also had a table in front of my classroom with lost items out all year. things I felt no one else would take such as one mitten. I still ended up with items at the end of the year.

My school has a lost and found table in the cafeteria with lost items including winter jackets.

Those are placed out all year. At the end of the year, I pick through them before they are sent to Goodwill for things that I feel my students can use.