What if George really was involved?

[com n sense]

I will never believe George had any part of this murder or cover up.
What cop would plant & use duct tape that was over his precious grand daughters face?
Casey did what all murdering mothers are known to do.
She wrapper her baby in a blanket, bagged her, & threw her close to home.
She didn't have the strength to bury her, George did.
If it doesn't make sense, it isn't true.

 

[strawberry]

As if CA would never notice Caylee was missing? Let's use some common sense please.

 

[DairyGirl]

This theory was tossed around early in the case, even before Caylee was found I believe, along with other theories about CA and LA helping KC. The problem I have is the decomp in the trunk. I firmly believe that Caylee was in the trunk, which apparently, against all logic it seems, the jury did not. I do not believe that the smell, which apparently lingers to this day, came from garbage. I also believe that the reason GA didn't call the police when he smelled it is because he did what the A's seem to do best, he went into denial. He opened the trunk, saw no bodies and was relieved and didn't want to go further. He wanted it to be ok so he told himself it was garbage. I perfectly understand this because I have done the same thing when faced with something I didn't want to accept. I find an alternate explanation in my head and convince myself of it.
No, GA is no angel, but nothing can convince me that he had any prior knowledge of what happened to Caylee. He just isn't that good of an actor or his story about not having a relationship with RC would have been even somewhat believable. I think LP got it right, maybe for the first time. KC lies better then GA tells the truth.

 

[Etilema]

I will never believe George had any part of this murder or cover up.
What cop would plant & use duct tape that was over his precious grand daughters face?
Casey did what all murdering mothers are known to do.
She wrapper her baby in a blanket, bagged her, & threw her close to home.
She didn't have the strength to bury her, George did.
If it doesn't make sense, it isn't true.

Good points about the blanket and close to home. Also about the strength to dig a hole for burial.

Is the bagging actually something that murdering mothers do?

Prosecution maybe should have mentioned these common patterns? Maybe they are able to be refuted because other near relatives do similar things?

 

[darcedarce]

One scenario that I thought of requires a lot of "what if" qualifiers:
If George really were molesting Casey, many child molesters are not interested in adult women. Maybe George moved on to molest Caylee.
If George had been molesting Caylee and she died during an act of molestation or died as a result of an unrelated accident, George would, as a former police officer, know that her body would show evidence of the molestation.
If that is true, George would know how to deal with the body of Caylee so that it would decompose rapidly and evidence could not be found.
If George wanted to keep Casey from coming forward too soon, George could have known that blaming her for Caylee's death would drive Casey into a psychological state in which she would deny reality.
If George also wanted to implicate Casey, he could have put Caylee's body into Casey's car trunk.

This creates the situation: George HAD molested Casey and she was psychologically screwed up because of it. He molested Caylee, with or without Casey's knowledge. Something happened that resulted in the death of Caylee. George blamed Casey - classic "blame and shame the victim" and forced her to participate in the coverup. George puts Caylee's body in the trunk of Casey's car at some point, maybe wrapped it the same way he had wrapped dead pets over the years.

Maybe George intended to relocate the body sooner, but Casey goes into a frenzy of partying and does not return home for days when George is there. She did go back to the house on the two days after the death of Caylee, but that is too soon for the body to have been removed from the trunk and the death smell to be left in it. Or maybe one of those days is when the body was actually put IN the trunk? Whatever happened, the decomposition of the body is sped up by being left in the trunk in the Florida, but it leaves the odor as evidence.

George and Casey move the body into the woods. George washes his hands of the whole thing. Casey then is left to make excuses to Cindy about where Caylee is. She'd already created Zanny the Nanny and continues to use that story as long as possible. When Cindy is fed up with that story, Casey dredges up the name of an old classmate (can't remember his name right now) and makes up the Daytona Beach/Jacksonville tale.

George does not count on Casey abandoning the car and allowing it to be towed, or Casey could no longer stand driving the car with the stench. Casey or George or both leave the car at the Amscot parking lot, but leave fresh bags of garbage so there is some apparent source for the smell. The car is left by the dumpster so anyone walking by would blame the odor on the dumpster.

When the tow yard notice arrives, he has little choice but to go with Cindy to retrieve the car. With the tow yard operator there who recognized the decomp odor, George cannot deny it, though he probably tried to convince the guy that the garbage bags were to blame. George takes the car home and allows Cindy to clean it up, but cannot keep Cindy from tracking down Casey - Cindy with her experience knew what that smell was and was increasingly agitated. And we know what happened from that point.

This explains why an experienced former police officer would not report the smell of decomposition in the car; why he allowed Cindy to clean the car, removing evidence; why the body was removed; why Casey was so completely off kilter; why the whole family has been covering up everything. It could also factor into why Cindy and George were separated before Caylee's disappearance - Cindy could have been trying to protect her granddaughter from the things that she had not been able to protect her daughter from.

It still does not excuse Casey but it does give an explanation for some of the things that are not consistent with it just being Casey involved. It explains George's defensiveness and why he may not have told the entire truth to LE.

I thought of this plot before the verdict but discounted. Now I am wondering more and more if this may be what happened?

George molested Caylee to death????

 

[tehcloser]

Hmmmm...the thread title brings up another equally valid question, what if monkeys flew outta my butt? :maddening:

Then you too could start a media tour.......... :floorlaugh:

 

[Firefly]

This is the type thinking...the belief...the "truth" that let Casey go free. To even think for even a moment it was anyone else but her, plays to her innocence. She is not innocent but has only been proven in a court of law that she is.....in the grand scheme of things....in the world of common sense....in the totality of evidence....she is guilty.

 

[less0305]

I will never believe George Anthony threw his baby granddaughter in a swamp. I honestly, truly believe the prosecution - he would never, ever have threw his baby granddaughter in the woods for animals to savagely eat her body. No way - no how. This person had a proper burial for ALL the family pets. Nope, no way, no how. I'll never believe Casey Anthony's lie about that. Jose Bozo said it in closing "George didn't fall on the sword for Casey." No, indeed, he didn't - hence the venomous hatred Casey Anthony has for him. He made her sit in jail for 3 years without "rescuing" her by falling on the sword. Don't believe it for a minute, nor for all the money in the world.

 

[Etilema]

This theory was tossed around early in the case, even before Caylee was found I believe, along with other theories about CA and LA helping KC. The problem I have is the decomp in the trunk. I firmly believe that Caylee was in the trunk, which apparently, against all logic it seems, the jury did not. I do not believe that the smell, which apparently lingers to this day, came from garbage. I also believe that the reason GA didn't call the police when he smelled it is because he did what the A's seem to do best, he went into denial. He opened the trunk, saw no bodies and was relieved and didn't want to go further. He wanted it to be ok so he told himself it was garbage. I perfectly understand this because I have done the same thing when faced with something I didn't want to accept. I find an alternate explanation in my head and convince myself of it.
No, GA is no angel, but nothing can convince me that he had any prior knowledge of what happened to Caylee. He just isn't that good of an actor or his story about not having a relationship with RC would have been even somewhat believable. I think LP got it right, maybe for the first time. KC lies better then GA tells the truth.

BBM

This is exactly what I thought. He is already scared to death that something may have happened to his daughter and/or granddaughter. Perhaps especially concerned about Caylee, since after all Cindy had been texting and telephoning with Casey all that time, but they hadn't seen or talked to Caylee. He's not going to start stirring up things by calling the police over a smell. He's going to let Cindy figure out what's going on first.

I love that quote about KC lies better than GA tells the truth. But who is LP?

 

[Granna6]

Love you....but STOP please don't go there about George. If there was any evidence to ANYONE else that could be guilty in this case, they would have been in handcuffs at the door.

I agree with you. And I think that George had been so beaten down and emasculated by CA and ICA that he was afraid to be really honest with his wife. Cindy's defend-Casey-at-all-costs mindset was a huge roadblock. I know families similar to this one, where one parent is the realist and the other chooses not to face facts about their offspring. The realist is depicted often as being "negative," just as GA mentioned in the suicide note. And kids learn early to play parents against each other. Presenting a dual front to kids is destructive to both the kids and the marriage.

 

[Etilema]

I agree with you. And I think that George had been so beaten down and emasculated by CA and ICA that he was afraid to be really honest with his wife. Cindy's defend-Casey-at-all-costs mindset was a huge roadblock. I know families similar to this one, where one parent is the realist and the other chooses not to face facts about their offspring. The realist is depicted often as being "negative," just as GA mentioned in the suicide note. And kids learn early to play parents against each other. Presenting a dual front to kids is destructive to both the kids and the marriage.

I so completely agree with what you say here, about how GA has been beaten down, was afraid to be honest, the realist being called negative--the whole thing. unfortunately, his fear and lying only muddied the waters.

I wish he had grown a spine at any point before the trial ended.

 

[lowens1975]

I don't think GA was involved. Either in Caylee's death or the coverup. I think GA has been beat down over the years by CA that he went against his own better judgement to keep peace in the family. I think ICA felt like if GA wasn't in the household, that she could further get away with lying to CA and there would be no one around to contradict her. GA's attempts to make CA see the truth in what was going on right under nose, only got rewarded with being told by CA to 'let her handle ICA'. He can't be blamed for what she refused to believe.

 

[USARDOG]

George involved? Not a chance.

 

[Granna6]

I will add that two decades ago, a very close family member went missing. As family, we all conjured up our own scenarios. Bue we had only a few pieces of a big puzzle and foolishly thought our pieces were the most important. We were thinking abduction and adjusted our theory to that. When police presented us with evidence that the person willingly left on their own, we had to radically readjust our initial theory. I think that in the heat of everything, GA was doing this very same thing. It's easy with our 20/20 hindsight to ask, "Why didn't he do this and why didn't he do that?" IMO he was doing the best he could as each revelation came out. Bottom line is that no one had the whole picture of Casey Anthony; each friend and family member had only a partial knowledge. I think that the trial came closest to presenting a full picture of her.

 

[Camille]

I think that you are dead on in your assessment of how the jury saw George but I don't believe that he had anything to do with the murder that Casey committed at all. He would not have thrown Caylee out like garbage no matter how henpecked he was.

 

[SMK]

One scenario that I thought of requires a lot of "what if" qualifiers:
If George really were molesting Casey, many child molesters are not interested in adult women. Maybe George moved on to molest Caylee.
If George had been molesting Caylee and she died during an act of molestation or died as a result of an unrelated accident, George would, as a former police officer, know that her body would show evidence of the molestation.
If that is true, George would know how to deal with the body of Caylee so that it would decompose rapidly and evidence could not be found.
If George wanted to keep Casey from coming forward too soon, George could have known that blaming her for Caylee's death would drive Casey into a psychological state in which she would deny reality.
If George also wanted to implicate Casey, he could have put Caylee's body into Casey's car trunk.

This creates the situation: George HAD molested Casey and she was psychologically screwed up because of it. He molested Caylee, with or without Casey's knowledge. Something happened that resulted in the death of Caylee. George blamed Casey - classic "blame and shame the victim" and forced her to participate in the coverup. George puts Caylee's body in the trunk of Casey's car at some point, maybe wrapped it the same way he had wrapped dead pets over the years.

Maybe George intended to relocate the body sooner, but Casey goes into a frenzy of partying and does not return home for days when George is there. She did go back to the house on the two days after the death of Caylee, but that is too soon for the body to have been removed from the trunk and the death smell to be left in it. Or maybe one of those days is when the body was actually put IN the trunk? Whatever happened, the decomposition of the body is sped up by being left in the trunk in the Florida, but it leaves the odor as evidence.

George and Casey move the body into the woods. George washes his hands of the whole thing. Casey then is left to make excuses to Cindy about where Caylee is. She'd already created Zanny the Nanny and continues to use that story as long as possible. When Cindy is fed up with that story, Casey dredges up the name of an old classmate (can't remember his name right now) and makes up the Daytona Beach/Jacksonville tale.

George does not count on Casey abandoning the car and allowing it to be towed, or Casey could no longer stand driving the car with the stench. Casey or George or both leave the car at the Amscot parking lot, but leave fresh bags of garbage so there is some apparent source for the smell. The car is left by the dumpster so anyone walking by would blame the odor on the dumpster.

When the tow yard notice arrives, he has little choice but to go with Cindy to retrieve the car. With the tow yard operator there who recognized the decomp odor, George cannot deny it, though he probably tried to convince the guy that the garbage bags were to blame. George takes the car home and allows Cindy to clean it up, but cannot keep Cindy from tracking down Casey - Cindy with her experience knew what that smell was and was increasingly agitated. And we know what happened from that point.

This explains why an experienced former police officer would not report the smell of decomposition in the car; why he allowed Cindy to clean the car, removing evidence; why the body was removed; why Casey was so completely off kilter; why the whole family has been covering up everything. It could also factor into why Cindy and George were separated before Caylee's disappearance - Cindy could have been trying to protect her granddaughter from the things that she had not been able to protect her daughter from.

It still does not excuse Casey but it does give an explanation for some of the things that are not consistent with it just being Casey involved. It explains George's defensiveness and why he may not have told the entire truth to LE.

I thought of this plot before the verdict but discounted. Now I am wondering more and more if this may be what happened?

It is possible. Not probable, but it is not outside the realm of possibility. Thoughts like this had run through my mind as well. When a daughter is as sick as Casey is, it is usually because a very sick parent is in the background. From years of reading true crime books, I have come to the conclusion that there can be VERY bizarre incidents in families in which ALL are implicated. The Anthonys may have not only been dysfunctional but pathological and criminal as well.

 

[MustlyLurking]

George...

I never bought ANY of the drowning lies. If Caylee drowned, all they had to do was report it to the authorities, who would then verify the evidence of water in the lungs, etc. End of story. But, I think there were at least two reasons this did not happen. One, Caylee did not drown. Two, something about the condition of the body would have revealed the real cause of death. So, ICA hid the body, in order to hide the cause of death.

The bottom line for me is this. I would not trust ANY of the Ants within 100 feet of my precious two year old. Not for one minute!

 

[maur33]

I don't personally believe that george took his granddaughters body stuffed her in some garbage bags and threw her down the street, to me that just doesn't ring true. I have zero respect and even less sympathy for both george and cindy and certainly could be convinced that they would have covered up her death by any means possible but I believe that if they did actually participate in disposig of her body it wouldn't have been done so sloppily. They are perfectionists, the lawn is just so the house is immaculate, I just don't see how with what we know, that Caylee was just thrown away down the street in garbage bags and that george and cindy were the orchestrators of that disposal. No they would have done it differently, it would have been more neat.

 

[tragco]

Whether he was or wasn't, George was not on trial. He should never have had this accusation made about him in open court.

He too should be presumed innocent until proven guilty in the courtroom but the jurors didn't see it that way (Opening statements are not to be considered as evidence.. in one ear and out the other).

There was no evidence to support this. It was a red herring fallacy which is commonly used to divert attention from the facts.

 

[janine]

Gonna chime in here.

The only involvement I believe George had was AFTER this crime was committed and his agreement with Jose Baez's master plan to free KC.

I believe that while planning her defense, way back when the pretrials were going on- this clan all got together, including Lee- and devised a plan to confuse, muddy and dirty this thing so bad that there would be no way any one who was not a critical thinker *and let's face it, most of society does not follow crime, techniques, evidence, etc* would be able to follow the confusion. They live their normals lives until thrust into jury duty.

George sat up on the stand in pre-trials and declared he'd do ANYTHING to save his daughter. ANYTHING- tears and all and he meant it. It was at that time he made the decision to be the fall guy. They were all part of it. George would pretend to switch sides with to the SA after 'sparring' with them in all pretrials....... CA would razzle and dazzle with conflicting statements, non-answers, fabricated searches and beyond- Lee, well, Lee would just be a non-player. Supportive but on the sidelines. He really didn't have much involvement before this crime nor after. His dutiful girlfriend's role was to get up there and say 'what an AMAZING mother KC was- then fall apart- take a bow. KC's entire job was to show disgust and disdain for her father and mother- but mostly her father. Her anger was over the top in comparison to any communication she had with him during the visits. Terms of endearment, love and support turn to RAGE........for some unknowing reason. EXCEPT for the fact that JB had the genius idea that if he made daddy the bad guy, just ONE, if not all as in this case, would buy into it thereby creating reasonable doubt that this 'wittle girl' could pull this off.

KC, GA, CA, LE, Mallory, JB, MC, and DS were all in this. The job of the DT is to poke holes- they did that and the SA's evidence (according to the jury) did not withstand the blow. Doesn't mean she's innocent, means the SA didn't plug up all possible leaks until it was too late.

GA took a hit for the team...........he said he would and he did. Most didn't follow the pre-trials.........They don't know that was the plan. The promise was that IF this worked, everyone would be set........CA, GA, LEE, KC and the like could get out of Orlando, relocate to a less saturated place and start anew. Money in their pockets, new everything and people would soon forget about GA the accused child molester. It was all part of the plan and GA was willing to be 'accused' of raping his daughter as long as they could guarantee no prosecution. No evidence, no proof. KC set free- all go on their merry way.

My take on it only. They know she did this but know that they played a role in their screwed up daughter so were willing to 'do whatever it takes'.

No other explanation for WHY CA would stand by GA..........Hand in hand- supporting each other. She would have turned on him in a minute yet that didn't, nor will it happen.

The promise was freedom and $. They lost Caylee but were willing to recognize all their own roles in it.

Am I wrong?