What's eating you alive re this case?

[Daisy1975]

What's eating me alive at this very moment (I am FINALLY reading Perfect Murder, Perfect Town by Lawrence Schiller) is the obsession people immediately had with this case. The descent of the press on Boulder by the tabloids when there have been far worse crimes in Colorado (many against children) that got a tiny bit of news coverage. I have never fully understood this, is it the pageant angle or just that it was a wealthy family?

Also that depending on what book I read about the case, or who's post I read here on Websleuths I can completely change my viewpoint on who committed the crime, lol. I have gone from IDI to RDI, to BDI, to fence sitter more times than I can count because depending on how you perceive it, the evidence can point in so many directions. At least for me

 

[chlban]

I agree that JR would not have been OK with that RN being presented to LE. If he had coached PR to write one while he attended to other staging details, and they took the time for him to shower and PR to get herself freshened up before LE arrived, he surely would have reviewed the RN to make sure it would have been as close to the "real deal" as he thought it should be.

Too much at stake to risk having LE know immediately it was bogus, especially since they still would have to dispose of her body or later be able to claim the kidnappers had given it back to them once the ransom could have been delivered. With JR and PR working together on staging, HE would have been the one in charge, and making sure everything was just as it should be before LE were brought in. And he would have had a freak fit at how ridiculous that RN was to be considered genuine if he had reviewed it before the 911 call.

So, I have to consider:
1. The RN was not meant to be shown to LE, rather for PR to see and had to be horrific enough to scare her into doing whatever JR said they should do. Except the 911 call was made unexpectedly by PR before JR could get her stopped.
2. JR really did not see the RN at all before he suggested they call LE, which does not jive with the original reports they gave to LE. If he did not, and PR called LE before he even knew what was happening, then I see PR as doing most everything herself, and JR had nothing to do with much of anything.

But what about those Israeli shirt fibers found where they were found?????:banghead:

Don't have an answer about the fibers, but I believe that John probably did see the note, but just barely. I suspect Patsy staged the note on the stairs, screamed for John and then immediately upon his arrival dialed 911. So he had no time to stop her from calling. Besides it would take a little time for anyone, no matter how intelligent, to wake to that nightmare and assiimilate everything. I don't think she wanted him to have time to assimilate or to react.

I think the reason Patsy proceeed to call half of Boulder to come over was to prevent John from confronting her (and of course to provide her with all the attention and sympathy that she felt she deserved) because on some level she knew he would recognize her handwriting.

I just don't believe for one minute that John would have allowed that ridiculous note to be presented to the police if he was part of the staging.
That RN just screams Patsy.

 

[MyBelle]

But the PRACTICE note, found by police on the same notepad, written with the same sharpie pen and in the same handwriting, had a different salutation: It began "Mr & Mrs. R... - then the author changed her mind and re-wrote a second one. Later, Patsy's sister admitted Patsy wrote the practice note, saying it was the beginning of a party invitation..Patsy's sister never commented (and likely was never asked) about why the practice note, which she attributed to Patsy, and the ransom note had the identical handwriting.
Add this to the list of things never followed up on. And the presence of that practice note should end all further discussions about whether the note was written in the home. It was. Kidnappers don't have that kind of time- not only would a real kidnapper/intruder not have written a 3-page ransom note, but to think they'd also have written a practice note offends reason.

I think this is just another example of a family member making an excuse for Patsy's obsession with perfection. Her actions not only offend reason, they are beyond reason. It is as though they were trying to set up some kind of insanity defense in case she was arrested.

JMO

 

[UKGuy]

What's eating me alive at this very moment (I am FINALLY reading Perfect Murder, Perfect Town by Lawrence Schiller) is the obsession people immediately had with this case. The descent of the press on Boulder by the tabloids when there have been far worse crimes in Colorado (many against children) that got a tiny bit of news coverage. I have never fully understood this, is it the pageant angle or just that it was a wealthy family?

Also that depending on what book I read about the case, or who's post I read here on Websleuths I can completely change my viewpoint on who committed the crime, lol. I have gone from IDI to RDI, to BDI, to fence sitter more times than I can count because depending on how you perceive it, the evidence can point in so many directions. At least for me

Daisy1975,
I think everyone cycles through the theories. I did BDI then JDI then PDI and back to BDI as the evidence accumulated and it offered the most consistent theory. Years ago I never knew about BR's touch-dna on the pink nightgown, or that he was awake during the 911 call, so with JR moving BR out of the house ASAP that said red flag to me, since if the investigators found JonBenet, the house would be sealed and those present arrested!

It was the wealthy family angle and the pageant videos shown on the networks over the holiday period that escalated the case otherwise we might never have heard about it.

Also the Ramsey's fanned the flames deliberately with their TV appearances along with Lou Smit promoting his Intruder Theory, all of which was complete nonsense. To such an extent, I have always thought Lou Smit was in bed with the Ramsey's?

.

 

[eileenhawkeye]

What's eating me alive at this very moment (I am FINALLY reading Perfect Murder, Perfect Town by Lawrence Schiller) is the obsession people immediately had with this case. The descent of the press on Boulder by the tabloids when there have been far worse crimes in Colorado (many against children) that got a tiny bit of news coverage. I have never fully understood this, is it the pageant angle or just that it was a wealthy family?

Also that depending on what book I read about the case, or who's post I read here on Websleuths I can completely change my viewpoint on who committed the crime, lol. I have gone from IDI to RDI, to BDI, to fence sitter more times than I can count because depending on how you perceive it, the evidence can point in so many directions. At least for me

It has never been claimed that this case got so much attention because of the brutality, so the claim "There are worst cases!" doesn't really make sense. The two biggest reasons it got huge media coverage were the pageant footage and b/c the Ramseys were rich.

 

[ukrberserker23]

What bugs me the most about this case is that 2 amateurs like the Ramseys mahaged to pull it off in the first place. I think that is mainly because of the Boulder DA's office being awed by the Ramseys wealth. If it had been middle class people, both parents would have been convicted of murder.

 

[andreww]

I agree with you. I've read the police interviews with the Rs and found the interrogation to be extremely soft. Not once did they say "patsy, this doesn't add up" or "that's not what John told us". It was almost like they were just happy to have them and didn't want to risk offending them.

What really gets me about this case is why LS was ever brought in to it? Almost like they said our entire department senses the Rs did it, let's find someone who doesn't. Then LS ends up being a lifetime pal of the Rs??

What happened to cops not getting personally involved?


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[pukasonqo2]

i think everything in this case bothers me especially the detached way in which JR was expecting that they should be able to fly out of boulder leaving their dead child behind as you would a bundle of dirty laundry that others can deal with
i am of the BR did it accidentally camp but it does not explain the sexual assault, the garrotting and the staging
it bugs me that, literally, they got away with murder

 

[Global Justice Ops]

I think John Ramsey wanted the family out of Boulder for safety reasons. Somebody killed his daughter and left a threatening note behind. He probably felt targeted and watched. I would have wanted to leave also.

 

[BBB167893]

I agree with you. I've read the police interviews with the Rs and found the interrogation to be extremely soft. Not once did they say "patsy, this doesn't add up" or "that's not what John told us". It was almost like they were just happy to have them and didn't want to risk offending them.

It's not just you. Other police, prosecutors and FBI agents said the same thing.

What really gets me about this case is why LS was ever brought in to it? Almost like they said our entire department senses the Rs did it, let's find someone who doesn't. Then LS ends up being a lifetime pal of the Rs??

So your guess is that the DA's office purposely turned him against the police? I've wondered that myself.

What happened to cops not getting personally involved?

Forget personal involvement! he should have gone to jail!

 

[Mama2JML]

It's not just you. Other police, prosecutors and FBI agents said the same thing.



So your guess is that the DA's office purposely turned him against the police? I've wondered that myself.



Forget personal involvement! he should have gone to jail!

Who, Smit? Smit should have gone to jail?... :waitasec:


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[BBB167893]

Who, Smit? Smit should have gone to jail?... :waitasec:

That's right. Last I knew, it was illegal to steal evidence from an investigation, and he did.

 

[andreww]

What's eating me alive is not who did it. I'm pretty certain I know who strangled the life out of that girl, who wrote the ransom note and who's telling the truth and who's lying. What has always perplexed me is what led to the actual murder. Unfortunately ther is probably only one person that knows that and he ain't talking.


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[midwest mama]

Thanks to Cynic for the answer on another thread that Don Paugh is still alive at age 83. It eats me alive that there are family members of JBR who continually remain silent when they know LE is refusing to take any new action to look at this cold case.

I guarantee you if it was my murdered grandchild, daughter or baby sister who was in the Boulder cold case files, I would at least be seeking a "Letters To The Editor" outlet as a forum to air my outrage.

Just convinces me all the more there was and continues to be a coverup, probably involving more family members by now than we want to believe, for what really happened.

 

[questfortrue]

^^^ Yes, MWMama, I agree. But I also look at the idea that DP may not wish to cause his other grandchild BR any more distress. Of course, we don't know how DP actually feels about JR. But, iirc, PR in the last months of her life, in order to be closer to cancer treatment, moved in with her father in Roswell. I've always wondered if she shared anything with him before she passed away. moo

 

[elannia]

Apparently no one cared much in that family about seeking out the truth about JB. And we all know why(if in fact the family knew or found out the truth later on)

 

[Mama2JML]

Apparently no one cared much in that family about seeking out the truth about JB. And we all know why(if in fact the family knew or found out the truth later on)

I do not understand this sentiment. If the Ramseys weren't involved at all, and I don't believe they were, then what could they do? They have private investigators working on the case, they participate in documentaries and interviews, they've written books, filed civil suits, spoken out for victims' rights, etc. What more could they do? They have been presumed guilty from the get go. How can they possibly prove they aren't when so many refuse to accept the possibility they're innocent?


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[elannia]

I do not understand this sentiment. If the Ramseys weren't involved at all, and I don't believe they were, then what could they do? They have private investigators working on the case, they participate in documentaries and interviews, they've written books, filed civil suits, spoken out for victims' rights, etc. What more could they do? They have been presumed guilty from the get go. How can they possibly prove they aren't when so many refuse to accept the possibility they're innocent?


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Sorry... Let me clarify. If the family(NP, DP, JR's own children) knew about who really killed JB(actually I should mention Pam P too since she said she knows the truth, just not sure who actually killed her) well supposedly she said she told the DA about this so im wondering if it was looked into or not. anyways, if the R's family knew who killed her and if it was a family member then thats why they may not have come forward. But i dont think anyone in that family has tried very hard to help with this case, and I think its because a family member was involved and no one wants to come forward with that info. Took R's 4 months to give interviews and I know they knew the cops suspected them, but maybe thats because they wouldnt come forward and help with the investigation... your child was murdered and you wait 4 months to talk to LE... Sounds fishy to me. And the fact JR suddenly had a business meeting he couldnt miss right after finding JB (what happened to the big trips they had planned, flying out that morning to Charlevoix, but he has to get to that meeting). Makes no sense to me.

 

[andreww]

Never heard about a business meeting? Care to share details? I know that the Rs wouldn't talk to police on the 27th because PR was a mess. On the 28th they started to get wind of the body being held until they were interviewed. Then the lawyers took over. How did this business meeting fit in the story?


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[Mama2JML]

Never heard about a business meeting? Care to share details? I know that the Rs wouldn't talk to police on the 27th because PR was a mess. On the 28th they started to get wind of the body being held until they were interviewed. Then the lawyers took over. How did this business meeting fit in the story?


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The story has many versions, available in all the major books, but it is all hearsay.


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