Cottonstar
Case Analyst | Expert in Staged Crimes
Because the evidence doesn’t sway that way.
Who do you think is guilty? I'm relatively new here and...
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NanaNZA
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You are correct! He was. But they didn't get any useful information. Ramseys made the right choice that time once again. I am pretty old, so I don't remember being 9, but lots of people have probably kept secrets since early ages (hopefully not of this magnitude) , so I've no doubt about them being able to keep their secrets. BR definitely did something to, or knows who did do something to, JonBenet that night.-imo
He was -- which is why it wouldn't have made sense for the parents to send him off with neighbors, by himself, if he had committed the crime himself. Good post.
NanaNZA
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Userid, you have the right to your opinion, of course, but I see it differently. That house was full of law enforcement officers that morning who could have asked BR questions at any time. PR and JR needed him out of there. I think that they knew their son and they were pretty confident that he would not share what he knew about what happened. How were they to know that police would send someone over there to interview him? And even if he did say something incriminating, he was only 9 and was being questioned without his parents present, so.....
Children are unpredictable. They could never have been sure that he wouldn't crack under police questioning, by himself -- after all, he's only nine. Even with police present, the parents also would have been present, and would have been able to intervene in any line of questioning offered to their child. I find it ironic that PR had all of this supposed foresight during the crime, but she wouldn't have had the common sense to know that police would question her son the first instance they got.
Userid,
Foresight what foresight? Patsy's amateur role in the wine-cellar staging suggests she is not staging herself out killing JonBenet somewhere else in the house, e.g. the longjohns, size-12's gap-top, hair-ties, etc.
Yet the one thing the Ramsey's knew was that everyone in the house would be interviewed by the police, that is unavoidable !
That apart, the Ramsey's were uncertain as to how their crime-scene staging would play out, once they made the 911 call maybe they would be arrested and booked immediately, they did not know?
Steve Thomas says Fleet White returned home about 8:00 AM with the Fernie kids and Burke.
At about 13:40 PM or four hours forty minutes later and after finding JonBenet, JR calls his pilot.
Assuming Patsy would have accompanied JR as he fled interstate by private plane, this meant leaving JonBenet behind.
You do not need to be Columbo to recognize that JR has done some forward planning, e.g. remove BR, schedule a flight, then bailout?
So if JR is prepared to abandon JonBenet what about BR, maybe he might have been sacrificed also?
Unless JR motored over to the White's and told Burke to get in as we are leaving town son, what would Fleet White have thought, would he have notified the authorities?
From this angle the case looks more JDI than BDI, particularly if you add in the possibility that JR tweaked the basement crime-scene, e.g. actually putting JonBenet into the wine-cellar, meaning Fleet White never missed her, i.e. she was never there !
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UKGuy, my post went over your head...
I'm not the one who suggested PR had great foresight -- it was suggested by others. I find it ironic that those same people, who believe she had such great foresight as to wear the same sweater from the night before (knowing her fibers would be found), had such foresight but didn't have enough common sense to realize police would question BR the first chance they got. That's all.
I'm not the one who suggested PR had great foresight -- it was suggested by others. I find it ironic that those same people, who believe she had such great foresight as to wear the same sweater from the night before (knowing her fibers would be found), had such foresight but didn't have enough common sense to realize police would question BR the first chance they got. That's all.
Userid,
Might be naive but it's a valid interpretation, else why bother moving Burke?
Unless of course the case definitely is JDI and he does not want Burke to see JonBenet being carried upstairs, deceased?
Point being whatever anyones position is that the parents patently had a motive for moving BR, else why bother?
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Its still flying ...
Sure, so she did think it was a possibility so JR moved BR out to Fleet White's house thinking there might be less chance of an interview there, i.e. no police moving about?
Might be naive but it's a valid interpretation, else why bother moving Burke?
Unless of course the case definitely is JDI and he does not want Burke to see JonBenet being carried upstairs, deceased?
Point being whatever anyones position is that the parents patently had a motive for moving BR, else why bother?
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NanaNZA
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PR kept it together to do whatever she had to do that night to protect what was left of her future. but by the time she had populated her house with an army of people, she allowed herself to become hysterical and sick with anguish and JR had taken the lead and was making the decisions now, so he made the decision to get BR out of Dodge. We do not know their family dynamic! I have seen BR in his interviews, and I saw a sneaky, secretive and deceptive person. No doubt they knew their son well enough to know that it just wasn't in his nature to 'crack.' After all, he is the son of two of parents who have shown themselves to be very selfish and deceptive people...all my opinion only.
Cottonstar
Case Analyst | Expert in Staged Crimes
Huh?
Cottonstar
Case Analyst | Expert in Staged Crimes
John and Patsy both had the foresight that cops would be looking to question Burke. This is why they removed him from the house!
Cottonstar
Case Analyst | Expert in Staged Crimes
From 5:52am to 2:17pm, no one questioned brother Burke about where JBR might be, or what he knew or saw that night. Maybe he saw an intruder? The fact that he goes unquestioned for over 8 hours while his sister is missing was by design.
It actually proves there was no intruder. In an innocent scenario both the parents and LE would be all over Burke asking desperately when is the last time he saw her etc...
It actually proves there was no intruder. In an innocent scenario both the parents and LE would be all over Burke asking desperately when is the last time he saw her etc...
Cottonstar,
Burke was questioned by a searching officer, he with the flashlight, who was told Keep searching she is in the house, i.e. not kidnapped, really how so?
Consider the Ramsey actions:
1. John sanctions Burke's transfer to the White's house.
2. John finds JonBenet.
3. John phones his pilot.
Is it not obvious all three are premeditated and a response to domestic events?
I also reckon JR tweaked the beasement crime-scene prior to finding JonBenet, would that not make forensic sense, oh here she is, a place I never looked before, but unknown to John, Fleet White had and observed no JonBenet, later with the same scene, no lights, John immediately recognizes JonBenet beneath a blanket, whut !
John has orchestrated events 1. to 3. So if the case is BDI why does John need to flee interstate, abandoning both JonBenet and Burke?
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Cottonstar
Case Analyst | Expert in Staged Crimes
Burke wasn’t questioned by anyone, including law enforcement until after 2:17pm, when Patterson questioned him briefly at the Whites.
At 7:00am, Officer French attempted to speak to Burke as he was being ushered out the door by John. However, John stepped-in and told French that Burke was asleep the whole time and didn’t know anything. Then off Burke went.
kaykay543
Well-Known Member
I think PR's despair and hysterics were real. I think she never changed her clothes because she never went to bed. She spent the night in a panic and probably never even thought about her clothes. JR did though as he took a shower and got re dressed.
I don't think the Ramseys would have left BR there. They would have gone and picked him up from the White's had they left town. I still cannot believe they left JBR there alone until the coroner took her away. So cold and heartless.
Obviously there was no fear of a "kidnapper" or intruder murderer. A reasonable (not guilty) parent would have never left BR up in a bedroom alone had there been a real intruder. That is just not at all a normal reaction.
I don't think the Ramseys would have left BR there. They would have gone and picked him up from the White's had they left town. I still cannot believe they left JBR there alone until the coroner took her away. So cold and heartless.
Obviously there was no fear of a "kidnapper" or intruder murderer. A reasonable (not guilty) parent would have never left BR up in a bedroom alone had there been a real intruder. That is just not at all a normal reaction.
To get him out of the way while the other two figure out their next move. They obviously couldn't discuss what happened with BR by their side.
If we don't know their family dynamic, how can you know it was JR that had made the decision to get BR out of dodge?
You are not a qualified professional and you're simply going off of feeling instead of education. Just because you saw one TV interview, doesn't qualify you.
He was nine!
I find it ironic that PR had all of this supposed foresight during the crime, but she wouldn't have had the common sense to know that police would question her son the first instance they got.
This is illogical. They could have simply kept refusing to allow him to be questioned, as long as he was in their presence. They were well within their right to do so!
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Agreed. People like to think that every single thing about this case was masterfully planned, down to every little detail. It wasn't. PR kept the same clothes on because she simply didn't have enough time to change and make the police call before their scheduled flight the next morning. That's it. These aren't long-time criminal masterminds here.