Who molested/abused Jonbenet?

[scruffydog]

I'm sorry if this is repetitive..(I haven't seen it asked), but didn't BR say that PR ran into his room looking for JBR that "NIGHT"??? Not morning...

 

[singularity]

I'm sorry if this is repetitive..(I haven't seen it asked), but didn't BR say that PR ran into his room looking for JBR that "NIGHT"??? Not morning...

Yes he did. Early morning is still dark so its possible he meant morning, not night.

When I was a kid in the mid 80s, I'd wake up Saturday mornings at 5 am to watch NWA wrestling. I considered it night since it was still dark outside.

 

[BOESP]

<snip>

Lou Smit's incompetence is not breaking news. I'm well aware of the "bugaboo" statement.....same level of awareness that he also ignored the other contents in her system as he couldn't fit it into his theory either.

THis is exactly what I'm talking about.....any other day you'd be laughing at Smit......now you're using him to defend a piece of fruit now that some more evidence is trickling in that isn't sitting well with some.

He gets no gold star from me for latching on to one piece of fruit in her digestive system when he knew there was actually three(at least). Its just more proof that he never should have been within a light year of this case much less be a key figure in the downward spiral the investigation went.

BBM - I don't really care if you give him a gold star or not but I don't believe you found me saying any such things about Lou Smit.

What is it you are indicating by saying three pieces of fruit was found. Iirc, green matter was found below the pineapple that was in JonBenet's digestive tract and that knowledge has been available for years. I don't see any relevance of one piece versus three pieces. A lie about whether or not JonBenet was awake after returning home is the problem. She was awake. The Ramseys said she wasn't. That is the bugaboo.

 

[Tadpole12]

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/6a/ea/11/6aea119f28e4387f42ed1bf5840a1958.jpg

 

[DeDee]

Or stuffed it into the Samsonite which might have been in JAR's room, waiting to be used for packing the Disney Trip clothes? If someone tried to put JB into that suitcase, only to remove her after discovering it would be too tight a fit, and/or the Samsonite wouldn't fit through the basement window, that might explain the fibers from the duvet on her shirt. But I am questioning my memory too, thinking I may have read somewhere quite a while back that when JB fussed about wearing the red turtleneck to the Whites, she instead retrieved the star shirt that PR was intending to pack for the Disney trip. PR said she bought the black velvet outfit with the shirt as a new set from the Gap, and decided to break out the velvet togs for the party, and wanted to take the shirt along on the cruise. If the shirt was in JR's room waiting to be packed, maybe it picked up fibers from the duvet there somehow?

RSBM :cow:

The blue duvet and sham bedding of JARs was recently brought into the Rs home when JAR was on Christmas Holiday from college. I always assumed he brought it home, to the Rs, as is, with the intention of the contents inside being washed and taken back to college in January. JAR left the blue suitcase where JR said he got it near the washer/dryer area on the 2nd floor and took the blue suitcase downstairs to the basement in prep for the Dec 23rd party.

IOW, the blue duvet was never on the bed at the Rs home. It belonged at college with JAR.

How the Dr Seuss book came to be placed inside the suitcase is a different banana. I do believe that it is part of the crime but have never learned of possible fingerprint analysis on the book. If it was not part of the actual crime, then it is staging to point a finger at JAR and away from the real killer.


ST: And what this something that John Andrew let [sic] at the 15th Street home while he went to school at CU?
PR: Yeah, yeah, that’s to my recollection. Yeah, he moved out here with a bunch of stuff and then he left a lot of stuff t [sic] our house that he didn’t want to take to the dorm.

With LS:
7 JOHN RAMSEY: Well it was -- I mean, it
8 looks like it. It looks a little darker but I
9 think it's cause the room is darker. It was like a
10 hard case, a Samsonite suitcase that I think, I
11 think, John Andrew when he came to college, he
12 brought all his stuff out and left it at our
13 house.


12 TOM HANEY: Can you tell us anything about
13 that?
14 PATSY RAMSEY: Well, that wasn't one of the
15 suitcases that I normally use. We use the roller ones.
16 I think that is one that John Andrew had brought over
17 from his college stuff, you know, like unpacked and
18 brought the suitcase over to our house, but I didn't
19 think it was in there. I thought it was back in --
20 back there toward the cellar room more, back in the
21 (inaudible).
http://www.acandyrose.com/s-evidence-window-grate.htm

 

[otg]

I'd say two vital pieces of info that was buried for 20 years is pretty significant.......yet you deem it rhetoric. If facts don't aid "my case", nothing will.

I love new facts coming in. Waited years for info to surface. I'm not going to ignore any of it......whether it aids my case or not. I'm hoping this case is on the verge of being solved or if not technically solved, something resembling closure.

I never claimed she was asleep. Obviously she wasn't asleep. Even if someone were to ignore Burke's statement that she was awake(I believe him), Patsy and JOhn dance around the car ride so much in the interviews that its obvious she never slept on the journey from the Whites, the gift drop, and home. IMO a domestic dispute may have broke out in the car and I doubt a six year old child would sleep through that and if she was asleep, certainly woke up before arriving home.

A shortened timeline would mean she was murdered(or bludgeoned anyways) shortly after arriving home. I'm sure this will be debated even more after we've watched these various shows but its obvious quite a few are going to have issues with any change in the timeline. The shorter it gets, the more theories get shot down and/or morph to fit all the new details.

LIke I said, we're already getting a taste of that now.

Obviously many people here disagree with that statement.




Lou Smit's incompetence is not breaking news. I'm well aware of the "bugaboo" statement.....same level of awareness that he also ignored the other contents in her system as he couldn't fit it into his theory either.

THis is exactly what I'm talking about.....any other day you'd be laughing at Smit......now you're using him to defend a piece of fruit now that some more evidence is trickling in that isn't sitting well with some.

He gets no gold star from me for latching on to one piece of fruit in her digestive system when he knew there was actually three(at least). Its just more proof that he never should have been within a light year of this case much less be a key figure in the downward spiral the investigation went.

Please, singularity, don't take this personally, but could I ask you to use the multiple quote option when you quote more than one poster, or indicate somehow when you are quoting someone else who that poster is. I couldn't figure out why BOESP took one of your statements personally when your post only shows UKGuy's name as the originator of the quotes.

 

[Tadpole12]

https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/236x/6a/ea/11/6aea119f28e4387f42ed1bf5840a1958.jpg

So are those grapes? on the table.

 

[CorallaroC]

big question Tad! my eyesight is bad, but it sure looks like a clump of grapes to me, plus a bunch of other things I cant identify except the Maglite, and what appears to be bagels. Which we salready know that the houseguests called to the R home that morning brought bagels. So, hell, does that mean the whole contents of the kitchen counter are to be considered irrelevant? No. Something is very wrong, especially if we get more info about autopsy stomach contents include grapes. Are we expected to believe that the houseguests called upon after the 911 call brought food that was ultimately found in JBR's deceased body? Oh please! just when I thought this case could not get more complicated by misinformation. What to do? What to think? Common sense tells me that if there are grapes on the counter, and we already know about the pineapple bowl, and know about the published autopsy findingings - then it only makes sense that there were grapes in the kitchen long before the 911 call, and if found in her digestive tract, has to mean that JBR ate them prior to her death.

 

[Tadpole12]

CC, issues with visual acuity
maybe invert color version easier....

 

[DeDee]

So are those grapes? on the table.

This photo was snapped by the Police whose assignment was to document the Scene. The Victim's Advocacy volunteers brought over the food items to the 15th Street address. That is what is seen in the image. In addition to the food items, is the positioning of the flashlight.

It was ST who said, the photos are almost unreliable b/c things changed. Items were moved. Countertops were cleaned by the VA folks. Bags of clothing were placed inside closets by friends. Beds were made by friends. I'm shocked no one bothered to move the bowl of pineapple and empty glass w/ a tea bag from the table.

Did PR and JR sit at the kitchen table together at one point that morning? It was likely the closest they were to one another that day. STs statement about unreliability includes the basement photos. The body was moved. The tape was removed. The suitcase was moved. Glass shards were moved.

Upstairs the body was moved; not once but twice. Then, covered with her mother's body then by a blanket. RIP Sweet JonBenet

 

[Tadpole12]

This photo was snapped by the Police whose assignment was to document the Scene. The Victim's Advocacy volunteers brought over the food items to the 15th Street address. That is what is seen in the image. In addition to the food items, is the positioning of the flashlight.

Ty DeDee, for the background info.
My friend and I were having a closer look,
looks like a doughnut resting atop a mug?

It was ST who said, the photos are almost unreliable b/c things changed. Items were moved. Countertops were cleaned by the VA folks. Bags of clothing were placed inside closets by friends. Beds were made by friends. I'm shocked no one bothered to move the bowl of pineapple and empty glass w/ a tea bag from the table.

yes, I can appreciate the caveat.
I can see bringing doughnuts and coffee for an emergency situation, but not grapes.

 

[madeleine]

the blanket in the basement really bothers me.don't think they wasted time to go upstairs and bring it down only to comfort her after the staging was done.
so imo it's either she was killed upstairs and carried downstairs in it OR the blanket was used to sexually abuse jonbenet in the basement.

you would definitely wanna use the most hidden place in the house if doing that.you would definitely use a blanket since there are no beds down there

 

[BBB167893]

the blanket in the basement really bothers me.don't think they wasted time to go upstairs and bring it down only to comfort her after the staging was done.
so imo it's either she was killed upstairs and carried downstairs in it OR the blanket was used to sexually abuse jonbenet in the basement.

you would definitely wanna use the most hidden place in the house if doing that.you would definitely use a blanket since there are no beds down there

I think she was carried downstairs in it.

 

[FrankieB]

So BDI isn't including cherries and grapes into the snack now? Why am I not surprised? Also not including Burke's crying that morning and just like the other fruit, was buried in BPD reports. If BDI members are going to ignore all unknown evidence(until now) in this case, what's the point of even watching any of these shows or reading any new books? Your mind has already been made up and nothing is going to change that clearly.

I tried to approach this topic at the chat tonight, half the people out there don't know about it and the rest disregarded it as a red herring. People can now instantly disqualify books they haven't read yet. Someone even felt the need to make a sarcastic remark about statement analysis, something I think we discuss here frequently and is quite valid.

 

[MsJosie]

I think she was carried downstairs in it.

SuperDave and madeline....just maybe she was carried downstairs in the blanket and then molested while on top of it, in the basement room.

 

[BBB167893]

SuperDave and madeline....just maybe she was carried downstairs in the blanket and then molested while on top of it, in the basement room.

Go on, MsJosie. Please.

 

[BBB167893]

I tried to approach this topic at the chat tonight, half the people out there don't know about it and the rest disregarded it as a red herring. People can now instantly disqualify books they haven't read yet.
Someone even felt the need to make a sarcastic remark about statement analysis, something I think we discuss here frequently and is quite valid.

I have a feeling who that might be. Like I said, sorry I missed it.

 

[Mountain_Kat]

I have suspicions, but no solid evidence to back those suspicions up. I'm stuck with having to say that I have no idea who molested that child.

 

[madeleine]

I have suspicions, but no solid evidence to back those suspicions up. I'm stuck with having to say that I have no idea who molested that child.

could it be that BOTH kids were abused?would make sense why they needed to cover for BR if he did it?

 

[Mountain_Kat]

could it be that BOTH kids were abused?would make sense why they needed to cover for BR if he did it?

No idea. I've never seen any evidence that would suggest that Burke had been sexually abused. Odd behavior, yes. But any number of things might have contributed to that behavior. In the absence of evidence, I don't think it's helpful to speculate. For me personally, I mean. I'm one of those people who doesn't function well in a mind filled with chaos.