Why did Lee flip-flop?

[OneLostGrl]

I think Lee is "chameleon-like", just like his sister! He changes himself to fit the person/situation.

ITA.. as do the rest of them.

 

[natsound]

I think Lee is "chameleon-like", just like his sister! He changes himself to fit the person/situation.

I think you're right. Early on, in his first jail phone convo with KC, he's sick of her lies, what she's doing to mom and dad, etc. Then he decides to play her game and coddle her, trying to ease some information out of her. Somewhere before or after that, he's telling Annie D. not to lie for her, she's done lots of bad things. Fast forward to surveillance in the car with TonE. He's drank too much of the Kool-Aid, wondering why LE is suspecting KC did something with Caylee. Making excuses for his sister's lies. Fast forward to depo... the same story here, except he's got a chip on his shoulder. I call that flip-flipping and flop-flopping.

 

[songline]

I think Lee is "chameleon-like", just like his sister! He changes himself to fit the person/situation.

I do not think that LA knows what to do with this situation after all it is not simple for the professionals either.
But he is part of "Family First".
I think his B***s would get cut off if he went in any other direction. I think his parents would do that.

He has a pregnant girl friend and was made to come stay at home with the "A"s due to the situation.
Maybe because that is where they are more protected, and he does not want his girlfriend implicated, who knows
I hope at the very end he will not put his Azz on the line, he has a baby coming.
I am not going on the Bash LA line; He is a product of the "A"s and I hope his NEW family will change his world.

 

[natsound]

Are we sure Mallory is pregnant? I thought that was a rumor that had been dispelled.

 

[Jay D]

I voted "other", but I don't think I can explain my vote very well. I'll try.

Lee (and George) remind me of the personality type of those that easily become addicted. Like the novice recreational casino player that one day hits the jackpot at the nickel slots. After that, despite the poor odds, the novice becomes addicted and life begins to revolve around winning again.

In the very beginning, Lee (and George) "hit the jackpot" with the incoming donations received by soliticiting through the Myspace and Help find Caylee sites that Lee set up. I think the paypal receipts to Lee may have been much greater than many could imagine.

I think Lee (and George) became intoxicated with the power that their solicitations in Caylee's name had given them. Their sense of power evolved quickly as shown in this early August addition to the HFC site:

Personal Assistant to Lee Anthony
24 hours On-Call DAILY
Locations: TBD, willing to travel within greater Orlando area with the potential for out of state travel.
Purpose: Run errands, schedule meetings, answer emails, update Myspace and HelpFindCaylee.com websites, etc.
Skills/Resources Required: Must own or have regular access to a personal computer, cell phone, and reliable transporation. Must have a valid drivers license. Ability to take and execute direction given by Lee Anthony. Great organizational skills, ability to multi-task, and work with little to no supervision. Knowledge of how to maintain a myspace page, basic html/website design, and other internet based resources such as search engines and news media sites is a must. This is a jack-of-all-trades position that may be cross utilized in all aspects of the search for Caylee as well as any personal need of the Anthony family, as directed by Lee Anthony. There is no compensation for this position.
Whom to Contact: Lee Anthony - 407-808-XXXX cell - LeeAAnthony@XXXXX.com

Lee soon came to the obvious conclusion that an "innocent KC" was in direct correlation with donation amounts.
I believe that this is the current mindset of Lee (and the rest of the cast of players).

I realize that Lee continues to work, but I am convinced that he is geared toward being an important person in the New Caylee Trust. He doesn't want to risk being left out of that "jackpot", so he cater's the the Anthony's line of spin. He willingly does this even though he may know in his heart that using the name of his murdered niece for personal profit is wrong.

Anyway, that's why I voted "other".

 

[abbra]

Cindy!

 

[seagull65]

I think Lee A. is probably a completely innocent, grief-stricken young man who is grieving the loss of his little niece and the heart-breaking knowledge that she was cruelly murdered by someone and that little to nothing is known about where, how, or by whom she was murdered (not ruling out Casey's involvement in something of course, the family have repeatedly said they don't know if she could have been involved in some kind of criminal activity, though they firmly believe she would never physically harm or abuse Caylee.) Lee has been vilified, maligned, and defamed to a shocking degree, as has the whole Anthony family. I was amazed at the good faith that Lee extended to people like TL and others, treating them with the assumption that they were friends who were equally concerned about Caylee's welfare rather than suspects, and the callous treatment returned to him by those same people. I do not believe that Lee was involved in any crime against Caylee or in a cover up of a crime against Caylee, nor do I think that he or Cindy conspired with each other or Casey or anyone else to deceive police. My two cents anyway.

 

[seagull65]

LA then portrays himself loyal to KC but in the sting video with TL he berates KC.
.

?? LA didn't berate KC, TL did a bit. In the sting video LA clearly assumed KC was innocent of any crime against Caylee, and assumed that TL also was innocent and was just as worried about Caylee's welfare and about her being found as he was. LA was naturally desperate for any information TL could provide. He was very concerned about TL's comments about his and his friends' drug dealer in the complex and TL's claim that Casey had said she had x amount of money saved up, Lee seemed to be concerned about the possibility that Casey could have stolen money from the drug dealer, crossed a dangerous person.
Other than the comments about his drug dealer, all TL had to say as usual throughout the conversation was a few derogatory comments about Casey, i.e. how p.o.'d he'd been about Casey needing to be picked up at the Amscot (p.o.'d about that? kind of a weird, and why make a point in the conversation that you were p.o.'d and in a hurry to be somewhere else when you picked her up there?), and then after the interview was over to say to LE "you're right, that guy never shuts up." That's what he had to say about this poor young guy who is scared to death about his niece and wanting to find her. In my opinion TL showed the same lack of compassion or concern in the sting conversation with Lee that he and his friends show in their little snide remarks and jokes in their interviews. But I guess all this is a topic for another thread, so I will stop there on the subject
Lee always admitted that KC had a problem with compulsive fibbing and minor thefts, he speaks about it when he says to her friends "we all know Casey's done bad things", even laughs about it, because he and the friends never considered it a serious thing before. He always made it clear that he didn't believe Casey would ever harm Caylee, though. (Her close friends said the same.) He's always told her friends just to tell the truth and wished them luck. I never saw flip-flopping or deception on his part.

 

[seagull65]

Lee is also a nutcase. I'm thinking charges against the whole family are coming down the pike. Obstruction of Justice if nothing else.

CMA. Casey Marie Anthony..... no one else. He didn't care about anyone, including Caylee, except his little sister. He certainly doesn't care about Justice for his own niece.

Could you provide a link to any facts to support these claims? Thanks

(a) that Lee A suffers from any kind of mental illness or that Cindy A does?*

(b) that anyone in the Anthony family is about to be charged with obstruction of justice or that they obstructed justice.

(c) that Lee didn't care about Caylee.

(d) that Lee doesn't want justice to be done for Caylee and the perpetrator of her murder convicted?

*As far as dysfunction or disorder among the family members (responding generally here to several posts Dunlurken, not your post) the only disorder I've seen with any possible substantiation might be GA's supposed online gambling addiction at one time, (I don't know if it's a fact, seems like it's been mentioned by a few family members and maybe mentioned by GA? I'm not absolutely sure on that. Maybe even that isn't true, I'm not sure.) I've never seen any facts to support the rest of the popular, very developed and intricate theories regarding CA's controlling narcissism and the dysfunction in this family. (I won't get into the possible ego-gratification derived by some members of the public in their speculation on this topic. It's been almost gleeful, like some kind of free-for-all, basically. Again, I don't mean you have done that Dunlurken, just speaking generally.)

Since this is a discussion website about the crime and entire case, I think questions will come up regarding any and all people in the case and that's normal, but it's one thing for someone to carefully raise a theory about someone in the case, without stating the theory as a fact, it's another for the speculation to be stated as if it is fact, and to be repeated over and over as fact. MOO

 

[whiteangora]

I just voted, 'covering his own tracks'. Since he went and hired a lawyer I would think he has some problems. He just acts very odd,
creepy actually, he reminds me of a young Mr Chester (the molester)

 

[songline]

I think Lee A. is probably a completely innocent, grief-stricken young man who is grieving the loss of his little niece and the heart-breaking knowledge that she was cruelly murdered by someone and that little to nothing is known about where, how, or by whom she was murdered (not ruling out Casey's involvement in something of course, the family have repeatedly said they don't know if she could have been involved in some kind of criminal activity, though they firmly believe she would never physically harm or abuse Caylee.) Lee has been vilified, maligned, and defamed to a shocking degree, as has the whole Anthony family. I was amazed at the good faith that Lee extended to people like TL and others, treating them with the assumption that they were friends who were equally concerned about Caylee's welfare rather than suspects, and the callous treatment returned to him by those same people. I do not believe that Lee was involved in any crime against Caylee or in a cover up of a crime against Caylee, nor do I think that he or Cindy conspired with each other or Casey or anyone else to deceive police. My two cents anyway.

:clap::clap::clap:I do not like the way Lee has been treated either, he sure did not come into that family with an operating manual, and their insane behavior may be all that he is familiar with. I think this is going to work against him sadly enough for a life time and he is a very young man.
All he did was born into a train wreck and have to be part of an investigation that will 4 ever be etched in his life and heart. I think he is an innocent victim.
I do not expect him to be a saint coming out of that household.

 

[songline]

Could you provide a link to any facts to support these claims? Thanks

(a) that Lee A suffers from any kind of mental illness or that Cindy A does?*

(b) that anyone in the Anthony family is about to be charged with obstruction of justice or that they obstructed justice.

(c) that Lee didn't care about Caylee.

(d) that Lee doesn't want justice to be done for Caylee and the perpetrator of her murder convicted?

*As far as dysfunction or disorder among the family members (responding generally here to several posts Dunlurken, not your post) the only disorder I've seen with any possible substantiation might be GA's supposed online gambling addiction at one time, (I don't know if it's a fact, seems like it's been mentioned by a few family members and maybe mentioned by GA? I'm not absolutely sure on that. Maybe even that isn't true, I'm not sure.) I've never seen any facts to support the rest of the popular, very developed and intricate theories regarding CA's controlling narcissism and the dysfunction in this family. (I won't get into the possible ego-gratification derived by some members of the public in their speculation on this topic. It's been almost gleeful, like some kind of free-for-all, basically. Again, I don't mean you have done that Dunlurken, just speaking generally.)

Since this is a discussion website about the crime and entire case, I think questions will come up regarding any and all people in the case and that's normal, but it's one thing for someone to carefully raise a theory about someone in the case, without stating the theory as a fact, it's another for the speculation to be stated as if it is fact, and to be repeated over and over as fact. MOO

It is my view that the entire family is dysfunctional. (NO LINK).
that 31 day wait to make that 911 call was a family affair in my opinion.
GA was a detective and it is totally mind boggling what a botch job he made of it all, I will never believe that it took them 31 days to come to a conclusion to dial 911, ?I do believe that they had to make that call at some point.
I do suspect that the delay had one purpose.
Not to find a body till there was no flesh on it. No body, no flesh = no additional evidence to bury Casey.
But I do not think that LA should get the brunt of any of this.

 

[natsound]

I think Lee A. is probably a completely innocent, grief-stricken young man who is grieving the loss of his little niece and the heart-breaking knowledge that she was cruelly murdered by someone and that little to nothing is known about where, how, or by whom she was murdered (not ruling out Casey's involvement in something of course, the family have repeatedly said they don't know if she could have been involved in some kind of criminal activity, though they firmly believe she would never physically harm or abuse Caylee.) Lee has been vilified, maligned, and defamed to a shocking degree, as has the whole Anthony family. I was amazed at the good faith that Lee extended to people like TL and others, treating them with the assumption that they were friends who were equally concerned about Caylee's welfare rather than suspects, and the callous treatment returned to him by those same people. I do not believe that Lee was involved in any crime against Caylee or in a cover up of a crime against Caylee, nor do I think that he or Cindy conspired with each other or Casey or anyone else to deceive police. My two cents anyway.

I agree that Lee was not involved in any crime against Caylee, and probably not involved in any cover up.

However, you say the A's firmly believe KC would never harm or abuse Caylee. This is false... the A's say that publicly, but they don't believe it. Go all the way back to the initial police report, when they first responded to the A's house. GA met the officers outside and expressed worry that KC wasn't telling them everything. CA's 911 call. CA's initial conversation with KC in jail. Everything that's happened since then. They know KC is responsible, they're just not admitting it because they don't want to see their daughter convicted of murder.

 

[marla]

Could you provide a link to any facts to support these claims? Thanks

(a) that Lee A suffers from any kind of mental illness or that Cindy A does?*

(b) that anyone in the Anthony family is about to be charged with obstruction of justice or that they obstructed justice.

(c) that Lee didn't care about Caylee.

(d) that Lee doesn't want justice to be done for Caylee and the perpetrator of her murder convicted?

*As far as dysfunction or disorder among the family members (responding generally here to several posts Dunlurken, not your post) the only disorder I've seen with any possible substantiation might be GA's supposed online gambling addiction at one time, (I don't know if it's a fact, seems like it's been mentioned by a few family members and maybe mentioned by GA? I'm not absolutely sure on that. Maybe even that isn't true, I'm not sure.) I've never seen any facts to support the rest of the popular, very developed and intricate theories regarding CA's controlling narcissism and the dysfunction in this family. (I won't get into the possible ego-gratification derived by some members of the public in their speculation on this topic. It's been almost gleeful, like some kind of free-for-all, basically. Again, I don't mean you have done that Dunlurken, just speaking generally.)

Since this is a discussion website about the crime and entire case, I think questions will come up regarding any and all people in the case and that's normal, but it's one thing for someone to carefully raise a theory about someone in the case, without stating the theory as a fact, it's another for the speculation to be stated as if it is fact, and to be repeated over and over as fact. MOO

No links but ..

a) It's as obvious as the nose on Casey's face ..

b) BC said so himself in the deposition ..

c) Lee sure didn't try too hard to find Caylee, let's put it that way ..

d) Cuz he's a proven liar, just read his conflicting stories ..

 

[Leila]

I agree that Lee was not involved in any crime against Caylee, and probably not involved in any cover up.

However, you say the A's firmly believe KC would never harm or abuse Caylee. This is false... the A's say that publicly, but they don't believe it. Go all the way back to the initial police report, when they first responded to the A's house. GA met the officers outside and expressed worry that KC wasn't telling them everything. CA's 911 call. CA's initial conversation with KC in jail. Everything that's happened since then. They know KC is responsible, they're just not admitting it because they don't want to see their daughter convicted of murder.

Also, Cindy's July 3rd MySpace message clearly spells out all of Cindy's concerns about Casey's behavior and her worries about Caylee, and begins with "My Caylee is Missing." Cindy's voice mail message to John Allen on July 23 is very telling. Cindy states that Casey "had to have had help" alluding to someone helping Casey in the disposal of Caylee.

 

[nyvictoria]

http://cfnews13.com/uploadedfiles/audio/TipCallAndLeeAnthonyCall.wma

http://cfnews13.com/News/Sidebar/20...gs_released_by_law_enforcement.html?refresh=1
in the list of audio files

This is an audio recording I've never heard before. YM recorded two vm's he received. The first is from an anonymous caller who states Casey and Caylee were at "the home of the grandmother" on Friday, June 13th, between 7pm and 9pm, which contradicts the date of June 9th as the date Caylee went missing.

The second message is from Lee calling to give YM a "heads up" about the bond hearing. Lee is on his way to the hearing and apparently is alone in his car. Lee tells YM he and his parents spent the morning being "prepped" by JB regarding their testimony at the bond hearing. Lee wants YM to know that he expects the questions asked by JB will produce answers (from the Anthony family) that will show if Casey is released, she will provide information about Caylee's whereabouts. Lee tells Yuri he appreciates Yuri's help in finding Caylee and that he will tell the truth, even if it goes against the family line.

It sounds to me like Lee, at this time, did not necessarily believe that it would be best for Casey to be released on bond but his parents surely did. I find it very interesting that Lee went out of his way to tip off YM about their "prepared" testimony. I've only seen snippets of Lee's testimony at the hearing and I'm not really sure if his testimony went the way he told Yuri it would. I'd like to know what others think of this call from Lee.

 

[Devon]

I agree that Lee was not involved in any crime against Caylee, and probably not involved in any cover up.

However, you say the A's firmly believe KC would never harm or abuse Caylee. This is false... the A's say that publicly, but they don't believe it. Go all the way back to the initial police report, when they first responded to the A's house. GA met the officers outside and expressed worry that KC wasn't telling them everything. CA's 911 call. CA's initial conversation with KC in jail. Everything that's happened since then. They know KC is responsible, they're just not admitting it because they don't want to see their daughter convicted of murder.

Just because it's likely that the A's may now have a private understanding/acceptance that KC is involved in some way with Caylee's death, how does that mean that they cannot still firmly believe that she would never have deliberately harmed or abused Caylee?

Is it really so unreasonable that someone's parents, having raised her from a child to a woman, and knowing her better than anyone else, would believe that she is not capable of deliberate harm or abuse towards her own baby? They clearly know that their daughter lies and steals and have admitted as much - even though they like to minimise/gloss over her misdemeanors in public. But that doesn't mean that they must also know that she is capable of cruelty or murder. We don't know yet how or why Caylee died, or whether it was murder or not, so how can we say that their professed belief is false?

 

[seagull65]

Also, Cindy's July 3rd MySpace message clearly spells out all of Cindy's concerns about Casey's behavior and her worries about Caylee, and begins with "My Caylee is Missing." Cindy's voice mail message to John Allen on July 23 is very telling. Cindy states that Casey "had to have had help" alluding to someone helping Casey in the disposal of Caylee.

Well, I always assumed the "My Caylee is Missing" entry was about KC having taken Caylee from them when she left due to their falling out. That's what it seems to be about.

I think the other statement by Cindy you mention seems to mean Cindy thought at that time if Casey is pulling some scam or hiding Caylee with friends somewhere or gave Caylee to someone, someone had to have helped, she couldn't be hiding her on her own, someone has her. This was very early in the case. At this stage they thought and hoped that some friend or associate or babysitter of Casey's probably had her, or at the very wildest that maybe she had given her up for adoption or something.

The family did always say they didn't know what Casey might have gotten herself involved in or what her degree of involvement in Caylee's disappearance was. At this early date, I don't think they were letting themselves think about the possibility that someone could have murdered Caylee, except for maybe George, though I think he was very much trying to keep hope alive, too. I don't think Cindy was talking about murder in the July 23 statement...

 

[seagull65]

Just because it's likely that the A's may now have a private understanding/acceptance that KC is involved in some way with Caylee's death, how does that mean that they cannot still firmly believe that she would never have deliberately harmed or abused Caylee?

Is it really so unreasonable that someone's parents, having raised her from a child to a woman, and knowing her better than anyone else, would believe that she is not capable of deliberate harm or abuse towards her own baby? They clearly know that their daughter lies and steals and have admitted as much - even though they like to minimise/gloss over her misdemeanors in public. But that doesn't mean that they must also know that she is capable of cruelty or murder. We don't know yet how or why Caylee died, or whether it was murder or not, so how can we say that their professed belief is false?

Well said, Devon.

In the almost 3 years they had never seen any sign (nor had any of her friends) of violence or anything but loving, protective behavior on KC's part toward Caylee. Suddenly she and Caylee have some new people around them in just the past few months, and Caylee disappears. They may or may not know that some of the friends (and possibly Casey) may be into some scams. They do know about her history of thefts and fibbing. What would parents in this situation think? Naturally at heart they must have been very frightened that Caylee could be in danger, very scared wondering who she was with, or at worst what if some accident had happened. But would they jump to the conclusion that Casey would have murdered her? They had no reason. Even about the smell in the car, I think only George consciously considered the possibility that it was from a body. I think Cindy and Lee convinced themselves it was from the pizza box. At worst, if they did ever allow themselves to think of it, and I imagine GA also considered this, they might have thought, well if it was the smell of a body, what did someone do to someone, is Casey in the middle of some gang thing or what, did someone use her car for some bad purpose, or what? I don't think they would leap to, "did Casey murder Caylee?" Knowing Casey as a nonviolent person, who loved and was protective toward the child, I would expect GA and CA and Lee to suspect, not Casey, but most likely some new person she'd come into contact with, of any violent crime.

 

[seagull65]

I agree that Lee was not involved in any crime against Caylee, and probably not involved in any cover up.

However, you say the A's firmly believe KC would never harm or abuse Caylee. This is false... the A's say that publicly, but they don't believe it. Go all the way back to the initial police report, when they first responded to the A's house. GA met the officers outside and expressed worry that KC wasn't telling them everything. CA's 911 call. CA's initial conversation with KC in jail. Everything that's happened since then. They know KC is responsible, they're just not admitting it because they don't want to see their daughter convicted of murder.

Great post natsound.

The only thing I disagree with is about them necessarily thinking Casey herself had harmed Caylee, or even that they believed in the beginning that Caylee was dead. I think they were terrified because, like they said, Casey didn't have Caylee with her, they didn't know exactly what was going on, and she wasn't telling them everything.