Why not put Casey in the general population while in jail...??

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I bet they are pi$$ed off. Remember not only did she use ZFG it has also came to light that one of KC closest friends said she was not allowed in the home when cindy was home because she was hispanic. Which is probably a reason casey dates hispanics. She hates her mother! cindy is a racist!
i think cindy is so stuck into believing her daughter so she may obtain the relationship she always wanted with her but could never get!

In all fairness, we ONLY know this because Casey said so.

And, if true, we don't know if Cindy simply didn't like this one girl for some reason.... bad influence, drugs... whatever.

In any event, the point here was how Hispanic prisoners will PERCEIVE Casey when she arrives. No wonder she's learning Spanish.... she probably wants to be able to understand what they're plotting because she's sacred to death! lol
 
Look, morally, I would hope that I would have the courage to forgive KCA for her crimes against society. I live by the philosophy that "there but for the grace of God go I" - my life isn't over yet and I don't know what will befall me or my children in the future. I would hope that if I did something wrong or my children did, that people would forgive me or my children. As human beings we are here to further our evolution and to promote the human condition for all people, whether we "like" them or "approve" of them or not. This kind of thinking that people who do these sorts of crimes are "monsters" is to lessen their humanity and to excuse us as human beings from recognizing that all human beings have to ability to hurt other human beings. They're not "monsters", they're not less than human, they are just like us and we're all capable of the most horrendous behavior. People who are broken human beings, who have personality disorders, mental illnesses (and anyone who commits crimes is on some level mentally ill, because the evolutionary inclination is cooperation and interdependence) need to be treated compassionately and with empathy. That is why we no longer lock up the mentally ill in dungeons or towers or burn them at the stake - we've learned that all behavior is subject to our combination of nurture/nature and we are the product of our environments and genetic codes.

Unfortunately, we live in a society that chooses not to treat the mentally ill, we choose for many reasons to warehouse them and to isolate them from society. In some cases people are so broken that they simply cannot be restored to human society and must live apart from it. That is the choice we made as a society and as a member of that society I am as obliged as the next person to accept the will of the majority. That doesn't mean however, that I give up my humanity or compassion for those broken people. Since we have chosen to warehouse them, then the least we can do is treat them humanely, to afford them the right to appeal to society for judgement and to be safe while in the warehouses of our society. We are morally obligated to do so.

I don't want anyone tortured, beaten, or in anyway to have their dignity destroyed by society - and we are society - no one ever learns from that and if we think they are mentally ill, then they no doubt won't learn from it. I don't take pleasure from others getting their just desserts or being hurt because they might have hurt someone. To wish for that imo, makes us as sick and mentally ill as the people whom we've warehoused and proves my point that we're all capable of cruelty and the infliction of misery upon each other.

Bev,

With all due respect and not that I disagree with your views (there should be more people that think this way :) ) Not only is it a crime against society it was her daughter. The little girl whom she gave birth to. KC has no morals. Maybe we would be more compassionate towards her if she was honest. I can see forgiving but not forgetting if she would have done this by calling LE right when whatever happened. I just can't find it in my heart to pity her whether morally or not.
 
In all fairness, we ONLY know this because Casey said so.

And, if true, we don't know if Cindy simply didn't like this one girl for some reason.... bad influence, drugs... whatever.

In any event, the point here was how Hispanic prisoners will PERCEIVE Casey when she arrives. No wonder she's learning Spanish.... she probably wants to be able to understand what they're plotting because she's sacred to death! lol


No KC didn't say this, Kiomaire did. IIRC.

Maybe she is learning it in case she gets out so she can finally go to PR and look for Caylee :crazy:
 
KC had not been adjudicated guilty yet. She is in protective custody. There is the chance that she will be aquitted. The State must protect her while she is in PC.

I am not bothered that she is eating pop tarts (yuck), shampooing her hair, wearing a new sports bra, learning Spanish and reading books. Good grief she is in a cell smaller than the oriental rugs in my living room. It ain't no disco.

I know nothing about women in prison, but should KC end up in a penitentiary, I am sure she will fit in just fine, baby killer or not. She plans, adapts, and manipulates. I dare say that the other inmates will look at her as a star and will believe that Caylee was kidnapped once KC tells them all the story. Prison is not filled with inteliigent, logical people - they will fall for her, like everyone else on the outside did for so long.
 
KC had not been adjudicated guilty yet. She is in protective custody. There is the chance that she will be aquitted. The State must protect her while she is in PC.

I am not bothered that she is eating pop tarts (yuck), shampooing her hair, wearing a new sports bra, learning Spanish and reading books. Good grief she is in a cell smaller than the oriental rugs in my living room. It ain't no disco.

I know nothing about women in prison, but should KC end up in a penitentiary, I am sure she will fit in just fine, baby killer or not. She plans, adapts, and manipulates. I dare say that the other inmates will look at her as a star and will believe that Caylee was kidnapped once KC tells them all the story. Prison is not filled with inteliigent, logical people - they will fall for her, like everyone else on the outside did for so long.

Bold by me:

I totally disagree with this. There are some of the brightest people and logical people in prisons/jail. I know some. They just made bad decisions.
 
Well, Coley, as you said on another thread, you made a horrible transgression against societal rules - did you want people to find it in their hearts to forgive you? I'm not picking on you personally, but what if others had judged you without knowing you and thrown you in prison without any kind of forgiveness or allowance of compassion? If people hadn't given you a break and helped you, how do you know you wouldn't be in prison today? Do you see what I'm getting at?
 
Look, morally, I would hope that I would have the courage to forgive KCA for her crimes against society. I live by the philosophy that "there but for the grace of God go I" - my life isn't over yet and I don't know what will befall me or my children in the future. I would hope that if I did something wrong or my children did, that people would forgive me or my children. As human beings we are here to further our evolution and to promote the human condition for all people, whether we "like" them or "approve" of them or not. This kind of thinking that people who do these sorts of crimes are "monsters" is to lessen their humanity and to excuse us as human beings from recognizing that all human beings have to ability to hurt other human beings. They're not "monsters", they're not less than human, they are just like us and we're all capable of the most horrendous behavior. People who are broken human beings, who have personality disorders, mental illnesses (and anyone who commits crimes is on some level mentally ill, because the evolutionary inclination is cooperation and interdependence) need to be treated compassionately and with empathy. That is why we no longer lock up the mentally ill in dungeons or towers or burn them at the stake - we've learned that all behavior is subject to our combination of nurture/nature and we are the product of our environments and genetic codes.

Unfortunately, we live in a society that chooses not to treat the mentally ill, we choose for many reasons to warehouse them and to isolate them from society. In some cases people are so broken that they simply cannot be restored to human society and must live apart from it. That is the choice we made as a society and as a member of that society I am as obliged as the next person to accept the will of the majority. That doesn't mean however, that I give up my humanity or compassion for those broken people. Since we have chosen to warehouse them, then the least we can do is treat them humanely, to afford them the right to appeal to society for judgement and to be safe while in the warehouses of our society. We are morally obligated to do so.

I don't want anyone tortured, beaten, or in anyway to have their dignity destroyed by society - and we are society - no one ever learns from that and if we think they are mentally ill, then they no doubt won't learn from it. I don't take pleasure from others getting their just desserts or being hurt because they might have hurt someone. To wish for that imo, makes us as sick and mentally ill as the people whom we've warehoused and proves my point that we're all capable of cruelty and the infliction of misery upon each other.

I don't think any of us really want to see KC beaten or killed. We are just venting, because this is such a tiring case.
 
Well, Coley, as you said on another thread, you made a horrible transgression against societal rules - did you want people to find it in their hearts to forgive you? I'm not picking on you personally, but what if others had judged you without knowing you and thrown you in prison without any kind of forgiveness or allowance of compassion? If people hadn't given you a break and helped you, how do you know you wouldn't be in prison today? Do you see what I'm getting at?

I do see where you are getting at. I was judged. I lost friends b/c of what happened and I loss respect from some of the oldest people I knew. It took time and some people are still trying to forgive me for being stupid. I could have been in prison but thank god I had a lawyer that was awesome and I was able to use my youthful offender card since I had no prior criminal charges. If it weren't for me going to rehab I would have been in prison. The 7 days I stayed in jail was the worst thing I ever experienced. But, it was the best life lesson I have learned yet. I do not regret it at all because it has made me stronger and wiser :)
 
I want her to live to hear the word GUILTY!!! I think she thinks she is sooo much smarter than everyone else! She makes me sick!!!
 
Look, morally, I would hope that I would have the courage to forgive KCA for her crimes against society. I live by the philosophy that "there but for the grace of God go I" - my life isn't over yet and I don't know what will befall me or my children in the future. I would hope that if I did something wrong or my children did, that people would forgive me or my children. As human beings we are here to further our evolution and to promote the human condition for all people, whether we "like" them or "approve" of them or not. This kind of thinking that people who do these sorts of crimes are "monsters" is to lessen their humanity and to excuse us as human beings from recognizing that all human beings have to ability to hurt other human beings. They're not "monsters", they're not less than human, they are just like us and we're all capable of the most horrendous behavior. People who are broken human beings, who have personality disorders, mental illnesses (and anyone who commits crimes is on some level mentally ill, because the evolutionary inclination is cooperation and interdependence) need to be treated compassionately and with empathy. That is why we no longer lock up the mentally ill in dungeons or towers or burn them at the stake - we've learned that all behavior is subject to our combination of nurture/nature and we are the product of our environments and genetic codes.

Unfortunately, we live in a society that chooses not to treat the mentally ill, we choose for many reasons to warehouse them and to isolate them from society. In some cases people are so broken that they simply cannot be restored to human society and must live apart from it. That is the choice we made as a society and as a member of that society I am as obliged as the next person to accept the will of the majority. That doesn't mean however, that I give up my humanity or compassion for those broken people. Since we have chosen to warehouse them, then the least we can do is treat them humanely, to afford them the right to appeal to society for judgement and to be safe while in the warehouses of our society. We are morally obligated to do so.

I don't want anyone tortured, beaten, or in anyway to have their dignity destroyed by society - and we are society - no one ever learns from that and if we think they are mentally ill, then they no doubt won't learn from it. I don't take pleasure from others getting their just desserts or being hurt because they might have hurt someone. To wish for that imo, makes us as sick and mentally ill as the people whom we've warehoused and proves my point that we're all capable of cruelty and the infliction of misery upon each other.

I could forgive her if she would just be honest...
If she said "Hey a horrible accident happened and I panicked, so this happened... Caylee is here..."
But the fact that she won't even talk, she doesn't even have the morals to do right after her wrong, thats the part that cannot be forgiven at this point.

...I think the "beaten" thing was taken a little too literally/personally
 
Thanks, Coley, that's what I'm getting at - if you want forgiveness, you yourself have to forgive. Frankly, I don't think she purposely murdered this child, I believe she administered some kind of sedative and the child died as a result of her action. What is really ironic is that if she had called 911 immediately and tried to get help, she probably would be on her way to serving a plea of 5 to 10 years - because she didn't she'll no doubt get a 25 to life, even if death wasn't intentioned.
 
Thanks, Coley, that's what I'm getting at - if you want forgiveness, you yourself have to forgive. Frankly, I don't think she purposely murdered this child, I believe she administered some kind of sedative and the child died as a result of her action. What is really ironic is that if she had called 911 immediately and tried to get help, she probably would be on her way to serving a plea of 5 to 10 years - because she didn't she'll no doubt get a 25 to life, even if death wasn't intentioned.

I'm on the fence on this one. I want to believe that this was all a horrible accident, but in my opinion her actions after the fact proves otherwise. It takes an emotionless person to carry her dead child in the back of her trunk for days or maybe even weeks and then dispose of the body already decomposed. Not to mention, there is a chance she may have moved the body several times. No way on God's green earth can a "normal" human being carry out such a horrendous task!!
 
No KC didn't say this, Kiomaire did. IIRC.

Maybe she is learning it in case she gets out so she can finally go to PR and look for Caylee :crazy:

But WHO told Kiomarie she was not welcome there 'because she was Hispanic'... Cindy told her herself OR did Casey say 'that's what my mother said?'
 
But WHO told Kiomarie she was not welcome there 'because she was Hispanic'... Cindy told her herself OR did Casey say 'that's what my mother said?'


Not sure. I have always wondered that myself. I can so see CA telling someone they aren't welcomed at her house b/c of something silly.
 
I could forgive her if she would just be honest...
If she said "Hey a horrible accident happened and I panicked, so this happened... Caylee is here..."
But the fact that she won't even talk, she doesn't even have the morals to do right after her wrong, thats the part that cannot be forgiven at this point.

...I think the "beaten" thing was taken a little too literally/personally

And instead of even doing that... she chooses to further torture her whole family..... as well as a large number of totally innocent people who she is willingly dragging into her sick game.

No, she can never expect any forgiveness until she shows that she is ready to change.
 
Bev,

With all due respect, I still do not see what your solution would or should be in the event that Casey is adjudged guilty at her upcoming trial.

What type of punishment do you deem would be appropriate for having murdered that precious baby? Do you even think that she should be punished? Should we simply forgive her and send her on her merry way to potentially commit this same type of behavior down the road again?

Allowing for forgiveness is one thing--certainly anyone can be forgiven for their actions--however, in our society someone who commits a crime is also subject to receiving just punishment.

Forgiveness for crimes such as rape and murder does nothing if punishment is not also meted out--it simply says, "It's okay whatever heinous act you committed. We forgive you. There will be no punishment, so you are now free to go out and commit this type of horrendous crime, or worse, again. Peace be with you."

As a daughter, sister and granddaughter of mentally ill family members, I have a lot of compassion for those who are so afflicted. My father was a paranoid schizophrenic who brutally attacked my step-mother, cutting her face so severely with the bottom of a broken beer mug that she required almost 3500 stitches to her face. She endured 17 surgeries to put her face back together again. For this act, my father was hospitalized in a mental institution for many years, and when he was finally released back into society, he committed suicide.

My grandfather was a paranoid schizophrenic who traumatized the entire family with his abuses and rage. He drank himself to death at an early age.

My sister was a paranoid schizophrenic with anti-social personality disorder. She lied her way through life, stealing from anyone and everyone, and could weave stories more complex and detailed than those we have seen from Casey. Talk about scary. She committed suicide in September, rather than face the music for having deceived her husband of 18 years, and her children who are now 28 and 26 years old. Her entire life story, in their view and now in retrospect, was a complete falsehood. Nothing about her past, as she had related to them, was the truth. They are still struggling to come to terms with the deception, nevermind her last selfish act of taking her own life.

Throughout my life, I have watched these family members commit crimes, and even after I spoke with law enforcement in hopes that they would be charged with crimes and jailed (thinking that it MIGHT change their behavior), nothing was done.

When I found out that my father had exposed himself to a woman in a parking lot and subsequently arrested, I was outraged and when he went to court, I asked that he please be put in jail. He was given a very light sentence of 6 months probation and put back on the streets. It was his first offense.

When my sister stole DOZENS of identities and bought cars, furniture, clothing and jewelry, sold drugs on the street, and spread her AIDS around like it was a gift, I begged law enforcement to PLEASE incarcerate her. These felonious acts were never even dealt with, not in court, not in a mental institution, not in any manner. Putting either of them in a mental hospital would have been nothing more than a little vacation away from home. It certainly is not punishment for the crimes they committed.

Just because someone is mentally ill does NOT mean that they do not know right from wrong. Yes, granted, there are many who cannot grasp this concept because they are so ill, but what about those who DO understand the distinction? My sister and father both fully understood that what they were doing was wrong, yet they never had to be responsible for their actions.

I fully understand what you are saying; don't get me wrong. But I see nothing in what you wrote that indicates how you feel this type of behavior should be dealt with so that we, as a society, can feel and see some sort of retribution, not to mention safety from people such as those who commit murder.

What you stated is that anyone who commits a crime must be mentally ill, and as such should be given some sort of leniency, and most especially forgiveness. You also state that we, as a society, simply are warehousing mentally ill people, so I can only assume that you are inferring that all of the prisons are full of mentally ill people who deserve our forgiveness, but not our punishment.

Where do we draw the line as to what is acceptable behavior, and when the behavior is deemed unacceptable, what are the repercussions?

(I want to state here that I did not share the stories of my family history for any type of sympathy. I simply shared them so it would be apparent that I have experience from that side of the issues. No matter what my family did, if they committed a crime they should have been punished, especially given the fact that they were well aware of the potential consequences of their actions. It is beyond me how they ever escaped being incarcerated.)
 
One of the things I hope to get the opportunity to ask God about one day is why 's like KC are able to spit out kids with no effort and either abuse or kill them without batting an eye, while there are good, loving people (like my sis-in-law and so many others) on this forum who have struggled with infertility or lost babies that they wanted so bad. It just is so unfair.

Not to try to turn this into a religious thread or anything but after watching my dad suffer until death years ago in the hospital, I wrestled with the same questions. I came to my own conclusion with the help of a pastor that Jesus was the best of the best and suffered more than anyone ever has or ever will.

If he can do it, we can do it and the "good" have to feel some of this painful suffering in our lives to truly appreciate what he went through. Once we appreciate it, we are raised closer to that level and thus closer and into Heaven.

The "bad" never seem to suffer or care. That's OK, because in the very end, they will not know the love, eternal peace and happiness that we will with God, they will be in ETERNAL suffering. They pay the price in the end.

Sorry if this offends anyone, this is only my personal opinion and feelings. Nice to feel comfortable enough to share it with you guys though! :)
 
The biggest thing I notice here on this thread is the misconceptions about life in prison and who hates who on the inside. While there are obviously exceptions, for the most part womens prisons are reasonably safe and women are not as quick to judge one another as men in prison are. There is some violence of course but it's been my experience that it is usually sexual or material issues that bring it on.

Many womens prisons are dorm-like or 3 or more people to one cell and the women are typically helpful and considerate to one another. Often there is a "mom" like figure who's been in a long time and offers comfort. Units are treated as and punished as teams.. so everyone learns pretty quickly to get along and do what is supposed to be done otherwise everyone suffers.

People keep talking about how horrible prison is but Prison is a relief from jail in a sense. There is more freedom, the food is better, you can work and take classes. People can get drugs, sex, pretty much anything they want. If you keep your mouth shut and your eyes down you are fine. Really everyone kind of has a "We are in this together" attitude. The staff and administration are the only ones that really give anyone a hard time and as with the inmates, if you keep your mouth shut and behave the staff is usually OK too.

This is not to say that prison is a wonderful place, it is not. It is loud and scary and violent.. you are not allowed to have a mind of your own, you follow the rules or you get in trouble, you mess with someone you better be prepared to fight or you will get your a$$ kicked. People are raped by other inmates and by staff. Medical attention sucks, mental health care sucks even worse (though not in Florida, JBean gave us a great link awhile back with info on that).

To be honest, I didn't find prison to be any harder than basic training for the military and I found being hospitalized against my will in a locked psych ward much worse than prison.

Anyway, these are just my thoughts & observations based on my own experiences.
 
KC had not been adjudicated guilty yet. She is in protective custody. There is the chance that she will be aquitted. The State must protect her while she is in PC.

I am not bothered that she is eating pop tarts (yuck), shampooing her hair, wearing a new sports bra, learning Spanish and reading books. Good grief she is in a cell smaller than the oriental rugs in my living room. It ain't no disco.

I know nothing about women in prison, but should KC end up in a penitentiary, I am sure she will fit in just fine, baby killer or not. She plans, adapts, and manipulates. I dare say that the other inmates will look at her as a star and will believe that Caylee was kidnapped once KC tells them all the story. Prison is not filled with inteliigent, logical people - they will fall for her, like everyone else on the outside did for so long.

While I disagree that smart, logical people cannot be found in prison, I agree that Casey will not have a difficult time in prison. I don't think people are going to believe her story but it's prison, they will over-look her crime it's what we do in prison. She is a con-woman, she will be very successful in prison... We will hear of affairs with guards and other inmates (if she is in gen.pop) and milking money out of "pen pals" who want to marry her.
 
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