Found Alive WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *Arrest* #36

[Seattle1]

I think there might be a possibility, since Jayme's a "ward of the state" until formal proceedings have concluded, she would be instantly eligible for CHIP

I also believe JC is entitled to receive social security survivor benefits from both her parents, until age 19. Benefits likely come with health insurance but not sure if/how changed after the affordable health care act. MOO

 

[Lillymac]

BBM
Good observation.

I was under the impression that it was a hired nanny ?
It'd be interesting to hear from this caretaker, sitter, or whatever.
She has been silent about what she may have observed about the family dynamics, in the days leading up to the incident.
Sometimes caretakers know quite a bit about the child under their care, and the family as well.

She is the family. Her aunt and she's been posting all over FB since all this horror. Denise is her sister.

 

[Lillymac]

Aunt and Jayme.

 

[Rubiconbob]

I find Fitzgerald a straight shooter.

He knows this to be the truth or he wouldn't have ever mentioned it. He is not going to say anything he knows he cant backup.

There are different ways he could know all of this including knowing this suspect also carefully planned all of this out.

I imagine it's his most reliable witness of all and is Jayme herself.

When Joe Duncan held Shasta and Dylan kidnapped for almost 2 months he discussed in great detail with Shasta how he entered their home and how he murdered her family with a hammer one by one showing her the murder weapon. He even told her how he had chosen her family and picked them to kidnap. He told her everything.

Jmo

Don’t u think know that they have him and his cars .... they might have him on security tape or camera at some location where he’s trying to look different...clothes or facial hair different than what it normally is..

 

[vlpate]

Elizabeth Smart testified EIGHT YEARS after she was kidnapped. She was an adult by then.

This has nothing to do with "putting the stigma of rape on the survivor".

For me it has to do with trauma. Period.

But I also think it sort of has to do with an excited public's determination to hear details of abuse that a survivor may not want the public to hear. Sometimes people make excuses for why those details should be public and sometimes one of those excuses is that those of us who wish to afford a survivor privacy, are fostering the stigma of sexual assault.

She's a kid who can be retraumatized by reliving what happened to her and by the knowledge that a public desperate for details is hearing every bit of what occurred.

Elizabeth Smart didn't actually have therapy and she wasn't quizzed on the details by family when she escaped. Instead, she was surrounded by healthy family relationships and allowed to get back to a normal life as soon as possible. She went back to school. Her community treated her normally. She finished high school, went to college and became a missionary before she ever had to testify as to details.

She became a wife and mother before she spoke voluntarily on a tv program about what happened to her, in an effort to help other victims of abuse.

I hope JC can be equally protected and allowed to try to resume a normal life. I hope the creep pleads guilty so that JC can have some agency and the dignity and power of deciding if and when she speaks about the details of what she survived.

I followed the ES case closely at the time. Elizabeth Smart dealt with her ordeal quickly. She did a Katie Couric interview within a week or so of her return. She was amazingly strong and, according to her, empowered by her faith. ES is now part of the MeToo movement that encourages survivors to tell their stories.

Amanda Berry and Gina DeJesus also told their stories (sans sexual assault "details), within 2 years.

I pray by some miracle JC was spared sexual assault.

I don't think the general public wants to hear details of anyone's rape, especially that of a child. I think people just want to know if rape was involved.

 

[Zephyranth]

There’s pic of him as freshman in highschool... curly hair... says around senior year started shaving head and possibly going into marines ...? Then states no army or marines... and basically not much know in 3 yrs other than 1 day at jenni o...

That’s crazy to have 3 yrs and work 1 day.. how is he paying for 2 cars, buying weapons? There has to be something he’s done in 3 yrs prior to incident that’s traceable or known... even remote computer work or drug sales ... people would pop up and say something...bizarre...

Thanks for this, Rubiconbob - do you remember where you saw the info about his senior year and possible military plans? Thanks so much!

I mentioned on another thread that between the ages of 18 and 21, he has zero record (not even speeding tickets). That's a pretty amazing record for a northern Wisconsin boy Out in the country you have to drive literally everywhere on isolated roads--everyone speeds mightily--and nearly every boy gets speeding tickets, lol. So I feel it's worth exploring whether he was away with the military for a 2-year enlistment--which would mean the Army (the only one with an regularly-offered 2 year enlistment option).

The 2 year commitment doesn't begin until you're done with basic training and tech school(s), so the overall span of time always ends up being something like 2 years+some months.

 

[human]

I still can't help but feel that something is missing in all this. Where did this guy have visual access to Jayme on a regular basis ? You don't just see a kid once, decide you have to have her, and that the best way to get her is to blast your way into her home, mowing down 2 other people in the process. I'm just not buying that, sorry.

He could have seen her twice a day. In the AM and the PM when she got on and off the school bus.

She lives on a highway. The bus would stop at her driveway and pick her up. Only her.

When the school bus stop arm is exteneded , all cars in either direction must stop until the arm is retracted and the red lights stop flashing. This takes quite a while.

In the AM she would be waiting alone, I assume, until the bus picked her up.

6000 some cars pass that way everyday so getting her alone would be difficult.

He could have first accidentally seen her while driving and then the plan was hatched.

I think he is an incel. I think he wanted a gf but could not get one.

 

[WiseOwl]

There’s pic of him as freshman in highschool... curly hair... says around senior year started shaving head and possibly going into marines ...? Then states no army or marines... and basically not much know in 3 yrs other than 1 day at jenni o...

That’s crazy to have 3 yrs and work 1 day.. how is he paying for 2 cars, buying weapons? There has to be something he’s done in 3 yrs prior to incident that’s traceable or known... even remote computer work or drug sales ... people would pop up and say something...bizarre...

At a guess i would say that his parents have been funding him. They left the house to him and his brother and they could well pay him an allowance every month, maybe even send him cash? This would allow him to live his very easy lifestyle quite comfortably i would think.

 

[BlinkOfAnI]

I find Fitzgerald a straight shooter.

He knows this to be the truth or he wouldn't have ever mentioned it. He is not going to say anything he knows he cant backup.

There are different ways he could know all of this including knowing this suspect also carefully planned all of this out.

I imagine it's his most reliable witness of all and is Jayme herself.

When Joe Duncan held Shasta and Dylan kidnapped for almost 2 months he discussed in great detail with Shasta how he entered their home and how he murdered her family with a hammer one by one showing her the murder weapon. He even told her how he had chosen her family and picked them to kidnap. He told her everything.

Jmo

I completely agree about Fitzgerald. I find him honest, committed, and as you said, "a straight shooter". I haven't doubted anything he has said and have trusted in his decisions of what not to say. We have all seen grandstanders, arrogance, self-promoters. He is not one of them. The pressure of speaking at a press conference is immense. Especially when the consequences of a misstep can affect the outcome of a case. Not to mention most of the world is watching and analyzing every word he says. I have great respect for his handling of this case.

 

[human]

I'm thinking about how he got money. If he was selling pot he wouldn't have made enough money to survive. Could he have been on SSDI or getting help from his parents? Maybe that's why they let him live there? They knew he wouldn't be able to support himself?

 

[mickey2942]

I don't think that we know enough about the perpetrator to speculate anything at this point.

Nor do we know anything about Jayme's experience to speculate, that story belongs to her.

What we do know, is that Wisconsin doesn't have the Death Penalty. If any case merits the DP, this one does.

I don't think that the DP even is a deterrent to crime, but at least it would motivate a criminal to plead out, rather than go to trial.

 

[BeeGirl]

She probably has the option to go on either homebound instruction or home schooling. If homebound is provided (which in NJ is legally required for less serious circumstance than this case) they could also provide tutoring to catch her up to the level she would be on now had this not happened. I would think the school district would provide options to Jayme.

ETA Returning to school could be difficult for her, not only due to the emotional side of it, but also due to the lag of instruction - need to fill in gaps and catch her up so to speak.

This is a good point. Also, I imagine that she will probably be able to catch up pretty quickly when she does feel strong enough to try because the three months she was gone are the least busy time of an instructional year with the holiday breaks, weather outages and whatnot.

 

[human]

I'm thinking about how he got money. If he was selling pot he wouldn't have made enough money to survive. Could he have been on SSDI or getting help from his parents? Maybe that's why they let him live there? They knew he wouldn't be able to support himself?

I don’t think he got SSDI because no classmate that has been interviewed said that he had special education.

The supt said he had great friends whereas classmates said he was a loner. I go with the clasmates.

It is difficult to get SSDI.

What was he using for money to eat, heat the house, pay electricity, pay for gas?

Even though you cannot be shut off for heat in the winter, in order to get assistance for the year, you have to catch up on past bills . So over the summer he could have been shut down. Furnaces use electricty to run.

That is a big house and it appears that there may be a fireplace. Keeping a house warm in Wisconsin in the winter would take a lot of wood. If he did not cut wood himself, buying it is expensive.

If you cut it yourself, you have to do it months in advance because you cannot burn green wood. It would be impossible to keep the house warm enough to keep pipes from freezing. He looked clean but Jayme was not. An article did say there was electrcity and water.

 

[Stunned]

I’m surprised he didn’t change her appearance

 

[MassGuy]

Thanks for this, Rubiconbob - do you remember where you saw the info about his senior year and possible military plans? Thanks so much!

I mentioned on another thread that between the ages of 18 and 21, he has zero record (not even speeding tickets). That's a pretty amazing record for a northern Wisconsin boy Out in the country you have to drive literally everywhere on isolated roads--everyone speeds mightily--and nearly every boy gets speeding tickets, lol. So I feel it's worth exploring whether he was away with the military for a 2-year enlistment--which would mean the Army (the only one with an regularly-offered 2 year enlistment option).

The 2 year commitment doesn't begin until you're done with basic training and tech school(s), so the overall span of time always ends up being something like 2 years+some months.

Yesterday, I speculated about him potentially enlisting because of a comment on that Facebook photo of him, his mom, and sister.

He may have enlisted and never shipped off to boot camp. If he had actually served, we would probably know by now.

Jake Thomas Patterson: Jayme Closs suspect was quiet student who hoped to join Marines

 

[Rubiconbob]

Thanks for this, Rubiconbob - do you remember where you saw the info about his senior year and possible military plans? Thanks so much!

I mentioned on another thread that between the ages of 18 and 21, he has zero record (not even speeding tickets). That's a pretty amazing record for a northern Wisconsin boy Out in the country you have to drive literally everywhere on isolated roads--everyone speeds mightily--and nearly every boy gets speeding tickets, lol. So I feel it's worth exploring whether he was away with the military for a 2-year enlistment--which would mean the Army (the only one with an regularly-offered 2 year enlistment option).

The 2 year commitment doesn't begin until you're done with basic training and tech school(s), so the overall span of time always ends up being something like 2 years+some months.

Here I think is where I originally read.. looks like junior year is when head shaving started... other pic looks like standard computer nerd... some good info.. still don’t know how u disappear for 3 yrs...

Jake Thomas Patterson: Jayme Closs suspect was quiet student who hoped to join Marines

 

[vlpate]

I also believe JC is entitled to receive social security survivor benefits from both her parents, until age 19. Benefits likely come with health insurance but not sure if/how changed after the affordable health care act. MOO

I know for a fact in Texas those benefits start fairly quickly. My daughter was 12 when she lost her father - she received his SSB within a couple of months, then monthly until 18. There was no health insurance though, I had her on mine at work.

<modsnip: discussion is not allowed>

 

[Parks]

The neighbor comment about people being in and out of the house could’ve been dated. Not when she said it but the time period she was speaking of. Kind of like the siphoning of gas being mentioned but happening years before this incident. The brother has past drug convictions, so the coming in and out could've Referred to when EP was still living there.

 

[CDmom]

She probably has the option to go on either homebound instruction or home schooling. If homebound is provided (which in NJ is legally required for less serious circumstance than this case) they could also provide tutoring to catch her up to the level she would be on now had this not happened. I would think the school district would provide options to Jayme.

ETA Returning to school could be difficult for her, not only due to the emotional side of it, but also due to the lag of instruction - need to fill in gaps and catch her up so to speak.

 

[gitana1]

Who would determine the need for her to testify or not? Would she have any say in that? I guess the reason I ask is pondering the idea that she may actually want to testify.

The DA would determine that. Her wishes would be considered as much as they could be. If she didn't testify and her testimony was pivotal to a conviction as to specific charges, that could lead to an inability to obtain a conviction on certain charges.