Found Alive WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *Arrest* #36

[Cardinal47]

This makes no sense at all! What people came over while he was gone? And nobody opened their mouthNot even for reward money but common decency? What story were they told? Nothing is making sense!

Might I suggest a rush to print and mistakes by reports in the 'what happened' were made. We see that so much while following these stories. 'gone and home' are close on the keyboard. sigh

 

[katydid23]

No officer stayed back to help guard?? How scary for that family as well!

Rescuers, law enforcement recount finding Closs alive

"Douglas County Sheriff’s Office deputies arrived within 20 minutes of Kristin’s 911 call. A pair of deputies identified Closs and took her into protective custody. A deputy stayed behind with Nutter and the Kasinskas family.

“They identified her, stood her up, got her in the car and got her out of there instantly,” said Kasinskas, who works at Louisiana Pacific in Hayward.

"It was a great day," Douglas County Sheriff Tom Dalbec said.

He credited Nutter and the others for keeping Closs safe and calling 911 right away."

 

[scapa]

This makes no sense at all! What people came over while he was gone? And nobody opened their mouth? Not even for reward money but common decency? What story were they told? Nothing is making sense!

My sense from reading these snippets is that people may have come over when he was gone -- but she was hidden from them, hence the turned-up radio. If true, he may have deceived some pleasure or satisfaction in their ignorance of his "secret." All IMO, of course.

 

[vlpate]

Wisconsin kidnapping, killing suspect lived under the radar
JTP grew up in Gordon, a sprawling township of 645 people tucked into the snowy evergreen forests about 35 miles (55 kilometers) south of Lake Superior. It's wild country; roadside signs admonish motorists to share the pavement with ATVs.

The few neighbors who know Patterson's family say he grew up in a cabin in a remote development that's a mix of seasonal and year-round homes about 10 miles (16 kilometers) outside Gordon proper. Patterson's high school teachers barely remember the now 21-year-old man who graduated only three years ago, and say they didn't realize he still lived in the area.

The suspect has no apparent online presence. It appears he has been living in the family cabin; property records indicate his father still owned the place in October. But he has kept a low profile. KK told The Star Tribune that she didn't even realize he was her neighbor.

Despite EP's criminal record, few across the township seem to have heard of his family. JK, the township's lone constable, said he knows almost everyone in the area but has never encountered the Pattersons.

One of the businesses closest to the development is J&K's Halfway House Bar and Grille. Owner KB said she's run the place for 22 years and had never heard of the family before JP was arrested.

"I have no clue who they are," she said.

(names changed to initials by me)

That is really wild - 650 population and they had never heard of someone that has lived there for years? Are we sure this is where they lived or was this a vacation home?

Excuse my ignorance, I don't know the distance from high school to the cabin.

 

[Rubiconbob]

She may mean the doorbell rang when he was out...

Was there two buildings... she kept in garage..

I don’t know how he pulled this off with many guests... disregard the garage coughing... I don’t see how a friend woundnt narc... I could see an accomplice... JP doesn’t seem like poker night type guy.

 

[katydid23]

This is the most detailed account I have raised so far:

Rescuers, law enforcement recount finding Closs alive


“She looked at me and said, ‘I’m Jayme Closs,’ and I knew who she was immediately from the pictures of her,” Nutter told the News Tribune on Friday via phone from her cabin — less than 24 hours after the missing Closs had been recovered. “I knew immediately I needed to get her to a safe place. And I knew it wasn’t my place.”

The Nutter cabin is an A-frame facing away from the road and shut off from the rest of the circuitous community along South Eau Claire Acres Circle, where two doors to the west of the Nutters lived Jake Patterson, Closs’ suspected 21-year-old abductor.

“I’ve walked by it every time I come up for four years,” Nutter said of Patterson’s place. “I don’t believe I’ve ever seen him.”

Telling herself it wasn’t her job to ask questions of Closs, Nutter and her dog, HenryStandingBear, kept it simple and calm. They gathered Closs and retreated east along the icy and slippery roadway, away from Patterson’s residence and the Nutter cabin and toward homes where Nutter knew there would be more people and greater security.

“She needed to get away — to be someplace where she was not close (to where she was coming from) and where there were other people,” Nutter said. “I had two missions: to get her someplace warm and someplace safe.”

 

[SeekingJana]

Elizabeth Smart gave no interviews or testimony about the details of what she went through until eight years later. She did not undergo any therapy either. So no details were discussed even with a counselor.

Those are facts. Amanda and Gina were full grown adults when they talked. Not 13 year old girls.

I do think the public wants details. One post here stated "I can't wait to see inside" where she was held. A subsequent post clarified that that apparent excitement was due to morbid curiosity.

Don't get me wrong, it's pretty obvious why she was taken, we all know she was likely assaulted (unless we're naive) and it's clear further charges as to that are probably coming soon. I don't think it's wrong to talk about that.

This conversation was about the desire to have her testify because it somehow is "healing" and to suggest otherwise is to shame and stigmatize sexual assault victims. That's what I'm discussing and I disagree with that point.

I'd like this child to be protected as much as is practicable and I disagree that it is healing for a child to testify about trauma she just endured.

I hope he pleads guilty so she can choose or at the least, trial won't happen for a long time so she can have time to recover.

That's just my opinion.

JMO, but I think it's extremely likely that Elizabeth Smart had private comforting and healing talks with members of her huge extended family female members who may have experience in counseling. Also, I believe her mother was a great help to her because of her education, faith, and years of living life in this world.

The Smart family adults are all college graduates in varied fields of study according to what I have read in the past. I'm sure it was easier to talk to her mom and maybe an aunt than to someone outside their marvelous close family. They are so very special in all the best ways!

 

[Queencitylaydee]

Wonder if the perp watched his parents mimic abnormal behaviors...??

 

[human]

Here you go. Sheriff: Closs ‘targeted’ by 21-year-old suspect with no... Jayme told Nutter that Patterson was gone in his red car and was expected to be back around midnight, though she wasn’t certain when he would return. The call log states that Jayme told the woman Patterson didn’t work, used to be in the military and “turns the radio up and sometimes has people come over while he is gone.”

People come over while he’s gone.

What?

And where did he go?

Burglary's?

 

[ArizonaNative]

Weird, it’s not letting me include quote.

Does this link above include something about JP?

Sorry all, I was referring to the article that was linked with the post that said something about a friend of JP saying he dropped out of boot camp or something to that affect.

I don’t see the post or the article now. So carry on...maybe just a rumor, not sure...

 

[Seattle1]

How often was she left alone? He was coming back at midnight? Why communicate that to your hostage?

We obviously don't know the details of how often JP left JC alone. JC may have observed a pattern in his length of absence, and reported that he might be back at midnight based on her experience. Nothing to confirm PT communicated this to JC.

 

[gitana1]

I certainly see your point and respect it greatly. Even if true none of us aware of any detail that may have transpired.

While shielding victims is a wonderful gesture every victim is not the same.

I feel Jayme is much stronger than we may think. She reminds of Elizabeth Smart in many ways. Elizabeth always knew she had nothing to be ashamed of for what happened to her was none of her fault. She didnt cower at all when testifying about every graphic detail of what they did to her. She told the police everything.

It empowered her knowing in the end her goodness would overcome evil resulting in her receiving the justice she knew she deserved. She knew no one else could tell what she had gone through. Telling her story on the stand only made her stronger....not more fragile. Shasta too wanted to testify to everything Duncan had done.

I think Jayme will also show the same courage and will tell the investigators every tiny detail without hesitation.

If there is a trial she will step up to the witness stand...raise her right hand..sit down and will go through everything no matter how difficult it may be.

She knows she is the only one who can testify against this monster and expose all that he has done.

She wants justice for what she had to endure and will also go into great detail about what happened when he killed the two people she loved more than anyone.

I saw a trial one time years ago where a 5 year old girl testified. All you could see was her feet which she swung back and forth. But she sat up there and told how her mother had been raped and then murdered when the suspect cut her mom's throat but he also raped her and cut her throat too leaving her to die but miraculously she lived. I have never forgotten her courage. Her voice although soft was strong. She came there to get justice for her mom and for what he had also done to her and she did.

Children are more courageous and resilient than we may think. Being able to speak about it often can be healing for some abused victims.

Imo

I agree with a lot of what you wrote. This child is particularly strong. And I'm sure she will compel herself to testify to get justice.

However, I disagree that she will march right up there and easily testify. In most cases where child victims of trauma testify they need a lot of psychological help, victim assistance and safeguards to be anywhere close to a position to be able to testify.

Also, I 100% disagree that children are resilient. I think that's something we adults say to comfort ourselves. Children are particularly vulnerable to the effects of trauma.

Almost every mental illness has roots in childhood trauma even when there are genetic components. Anxiety disorder. Panic disorder. Depression. Bipolar disorder. Narcissistic personality disorder. Histrionic personality disorder. Antisocial personality disorder. Borderline personality disorder. Obsessive compulsive disorder. Alcohol and drug dependency. Etc.

All can stem from childhood trauma.

Children are horrifically destroyed by trauma. They lack the emotional reserves, the cognitive abilities and the maturity and life experience that enables them to cope with such events.

Interestingly, the child you reference was one of psychiatrist Bruce Perry's patients. He wrote the primer (IMO) on childhood trauma.

That kid had extensive therapy in order to be able to get up there and testify, from what I recall, which mostly consisted of her repeatedly positioning the doctor on the floor and simulating hog tying him and slitting his throat, until eventually she gained some semblance of agency and power over the memories of what had been done to her.

 

[Sjm_qc]

Do we know if he had a gun with him in the car? I don’t recall any mention of a gun, other than the couple that LE found in the house.

We do not yet know where, or how many, guns were recovered (house or vehicle) other than the fact (stated by LE in the press conferences yesterday) that guns were found.

 

[katydid23]

Rescuers, law enforcement recount finding Closs alive
continued:
Nutter’s thoughts were swirling, but she stayed in the moment. She’d known the Closs parents had been murdered, and Closs was likely kidnapped and in danger. She knew somebody with bad intentions could be pursuing Closs and, in one of her few inquiries to Closs, Nutter found out about Patterson’s red car.

Nutter was on the lookout for the vehicle while the three of them made their way to safety. Nutter said she was prepared to dive for cover if need be. It took eight minutes, Nutter said, to get to the Kasinskas residence not far away. Nutter knew they would be protected there.



Peter Kasinskas said he was cleaning fish in the kitchen when his dogs “started going crazy.”

His wife, Kristin, and children, ages 7 and 9, were getting home.

“And then the neighbor lady was pounding on our door in the kitchen,” Peter Kasinskas said. “She opened the door, her dog ran in, and then she helped this girl into the kitchen. She said: ‘It’s Jayme Closs. Call 911.’

“My jaw hit the floor.”


Kristin Kasinskas immediately called 911.

“Jayme was able to give us the person’s name and the color of the car that he drove (red), so when we called the police they could know who they were looking for,” Peter Kasinskas said. “She was probably in shock. She was pretty quiet. She didn’t say a lot.”

 

[human]

Grandfather says Jayme Closs has no link to suspected kidnapper – Twin Cities
“He didn’t know Jayme, he didn’t know Denise or Jim,” Naiberg said. “(Jayme) don’t know him from Adam. (But) he knew what he was doing. We don’t know if he was stalking her or what. Did he see her somewhere?”

Attorneys for Patterson called the affair “a very tragic situation” and said they were relying on the court system to treat him fairly. Charles Glynn and Richard Jones said in a statement that they await Patterson’s initial court appearance and the filing of charges against him on Monday.

Treat him fairly. I am sure lots of us have ideas what would be fair

 

[mcrazingwill]

Somehow providing a source has gone out the window...I thought it was a rule that you had to backup a statement you make. jmo

I haven't read that people were "coming and going" but the neighbor did state in her CNN interview that JP "hid her when others were near......"

What we know about the suspect in the kidnapping of Jayme Closs

 

[stephlovescheese]

Rescuers, law enforcement recount finding Closs alive

"Douglas County Sheriff’s Office deputies arrived within 20 minutes of Kristin’s 911 call. A pair of deputies identified Closs and took her into protective custody. A deputy stayed behind with Nutter and the Kasinskas family.

“They identified her, stood her up, got her in the car and got her out of there instantly,” said Kasinskas, who works at Louisiana Pacific in Hayward.

"It was a great day," Douglas County Sheriff Tom Dalbec said.

He credited Nutter and the others for keeping Closs safe and calling 911 right away."

Longest 20 mins ever! Can you imagine? How scary. I get that it’s rural, but i naively imagine very quick response time when 911 is called.

 

[TCIntriguedIN30]

A poster here said 'I wouldn't be surprised if he was on the spectrum' . Personally, being the parent of a child on the spectrum I know a little about it and I would be very surprised if he was.

I would be very shocked as well if he were.. way too brazen. Those i have had contact with that are on the spectrum do not like chaos or changes or over stimulation.

 

[oceanblueeyes]

Nope. You can sign the paperwork and change your mind, or they can cancel your contract at any point prior to you signing the final paperwork on the day you ship out.

Once you reach boot camp, there is a period of time during processing, in which you can confess to any lies you told when you enlisted.

At this point, you are likely to be sent home, depending on the seriousness of your lies.

Once boot camp officially starts, you can be kicked out for any number of reasons, from medical issues (especially previously unreported ones), and for “failure to adapt.”

I think he may have enlisted, but never shipped out. Or when he shipped out, he didn’t last long.

I don’t think he served.

I think some think anyone who goes to boot camp passes muster when in truth there will always be quite a few who don't even make it out of boot camp.

Like you have said there are a myriad of reasons why they don't make it to graduation.

Some don't even last but a couple or three weeks or even less much less lasting for 13 grueling weeks at Marine Corps boot camp. Some get a rude awakening about the realities of becoming a Marine.

I'd be surprised if he ever served a day no matter the branch of service.

Imo

 

[MassGuy]

I think some think anyone who goes to boot camp passes muster when in truth there will always be quite a few who don't even make it out of boot camp.

Like you have said there are a myriad of reasons why they don't make it to graduation.

Some don't even last but a couple or three weeks much less lasting for 13 grueling weeks at Marine Corps boot camp. Some get a rude awakening about the realities of becoming a Marine.

I'd be surprised if he ever served a day no matter the branch of service.

Imo

Yeah, this guy doesn’t have a solid employment record, unless 1 day counts.

That tells me that he doesn’t play well with others, and probably can’t handle authority.

I agree, he doesn’t seem the type.

 

[vlpate]

There's info in that article that is new to me. The red car, his claim about being in the military, the part about coming back at midnight, and people coming over when he's not there. What people? Interesting.

"Fitzgerald said investigators have established that Patterson was not home when Jayme approached Nutter for help. He said they believe Patterson may have been out searching for her at the time of his arrest."
<snip>
"The first Douglas County deputy arrived on scene to locate Jayme at 4:43 p.m. Exactly 10 minutes later, according to the call log, deputies stopped Patterson’s car. He was detained at 4:54 p.m."

JC told Nutter that JP would not be back until midnight - so how did he know she had escaped? Was he watching her? Was someone else?

Source Sheriff: Closs ‘targeted’ by 21-year-old suspect with no...