AMBER ALERT WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron, missing after parents found shot, 15 Oct 2018 *endangered* #11

[bizzle2]

I think those phone records take some time to get. Trying to remember from a previous case I followed. Maybe it was MT. They took maybe 10 days.

Getting the phone numbers she communicated with, call durations, etc. is really quick for LE. That info is already tracked on a the monthly bill so there is no legwork to do, just a question of whether or not access is necessary. Plus, her bill was likely in her parent's name if she had a cell phone. Getting the phone bill of a homicide victim would be really fast. It could take less than a day.

 

[jcoast]

We have shots around 12:30. Probably the door being kicked open, too. Then it goes over 20 minutes before the 911 call. We gather there’s arguing at that point and I doubt the preceeding 20 minutes were much different. The intruder had to know the shots could have been heard and reported. The intruder had a gun so what went on for 20 minutes? What was up for discussion rather than just being taken?

The discussion could be can the girl ID them and if so what do they do with her...and who does it

 

[PommyMommy]

I just returned from doing some much needed errands and way overdue grocery shopping! Both were put off because I’ve been glued to WS practically 24/7 for past week.

Anyway, is there a link to a live streaming of today’s search?

TIA

There are many of them as well as tweets, photos, etc. in the media thread: WI - WI - Jayme Closs, 13, Barron,Media, Maps and Timelines *NO DISCUSSION*

 

[BeeGirl]

Wooooo! Okay - I am very excited about the Rambler's Rest tip. I hate the fact it's a hotel (for dozens of reasons I won't let my mind explore) and hope it bears fruit, as its OP said she saw the investigation.

Thanks, @Tricia.

The tip seems to be a good one. Black Ford Escape spotted in the parking lot of Barron's First Ramblers Rest, a motel about 5 minutes east of the Closs family home on Hwy 8.

Barron County Sheriff's Department

The woman who posted the tip called it in, and it seems LE came out pretty quickly to look at the vehicle and run the plates.

She also claims in her comments that the car has been parked there for about a week, hasn't moved, and she hasn't seen anybody near it. It's "suspicious" (her words) and has tinted windows.

I also wanted to give you a shoutout for directing everyone to this tip in thread #10 @ludakristen but I couldn't find your post or recall your name until I just saw it again and I don't know how to link to the previous thread. Good eye!

 

[Confusion]

Okay I know some of you may not care for Mark Furhman at times including myself but the thread was closed at the time he was being interviewed on Fox.

Since he spoke I can't get out of my mind what he said because it ALL made so much common sense and none of it I had ever even considered.

Anyway for those who may be interested I will try to post it in my own words for you.

He said he believes the evidence shows that Denise was the intended target. Here is the clear reason he gave. If James had been the intended target the mission would have been over right at the front door with no need to enter the home. They would have shot James and quickly left probably before Denise could have even seen who it was.

But he said they purposefully went inside to murder Denise. He also said the crime scene can reveal who may be the intended target. Such as if one victim suffered more gunshot wounds than another victim. Or if one victim had other type of injuries done by the killer beyond the gunshots themselves.

He said he does believe that Jayme has been killed and thinks the police know that too and know they are in recovery mode now.

He also said this which makes sense to me. He said the experts on the ground have the ability in less than a day's time to know if there are any vehicles in this county of 45000 that matches the 2 vehicles in question.

So he thinks the police already know the vehicles aren't from the county this happened in. He said they will go county by county searching the DMV data base looking for possible matches and interviewing anyone who may own the same type of vehicles crossing them off one by one.

So what do all of you think about this? I found all of it so facisinating. Jmo though

It actually makes sense to me that she was the target. If Jayme was the original target, there would have been much easier ways to go about getting her, if James was the target, the person could probably have left immediately without ever being seen by either of the females in the house (since they apparently ran and hid). I still think it's possible that Jayme was only taken in case he needed a hostage because he knew LE was probably on the way. MOO

 

[SuziQ]

Keeping with my thought of someone being angry with the parents...I also feel the perps action was sudden and impulsive. Grudges can last decades. Time usually does heal all wounds. For some though, the passage of time causes emotional wounds to fester. The decision to take action can come on suddenly.

So here we possibly have a perp who couldn't stand it one more minute. He kicks in the doors, shoots and kills mom and dad. Now maybe he has an oh cr*p moment. In his haste to act on his feelings, the perp hadn't though of Jayme. She might know this guy and can ID him. LE is on their way. He takes Jayme with him, and will deal with her later.

Jmo IMO moo.

 

[gg1]

Searchers were divided into 14 separate groups, each with about 150 volunteers, and each group was assigned to a separate mapped out area in a several mile circumference around the residence

2,000 Volunteers Comb Fields, Forests In Search For Jayme Closs

link to barron county gis:
Barron County, WI » WG Xtreme

To the immediate north of the property is a wisconsin central railroad track

Also note that the search instructions were that all open buildings could be searched, closed buildings could not be searched. Logistically I'm sure it took some time to secure permission to search all of these areas as well.

The railroad tracks are 900 feet north of the home, visible from the Barron County gis site. The Canadian National (owning Wisconsin Central) line connects Escanaba MI and Minneapolis.

 

[MassGuy]

I also wanted to give you a shoutout for directing everyone to this tip in thread #10 @ludakristen but I couldn't find your post or recall your name until I just saw it again and I don't know how to link to the previous thread. Good eye!

Thanks for quoting those, as I missed them.

These are the kinds of tips that LE needs.

This is so much better than people calling in and saying “I think you should look at all sex offenders in the area....”

Those are not tips, they are pointless distractions.

 

[Jethro4WS]

Please someone correct me if I am mistaken: I do not believe it has confirmed whether Jayme has her own cell phone or not.

She probably does, IMO, since she appears to have an Instagram account. Or perhaps she did at one point, but her parents had to take it away from her temporarily (I am mentioning this only because I once had to do that with my then 13-year-old).

Someone (I am so sorry I cannot remember at the moment) suggested earlier that maybe LE believes Jayme was still there when the 911 call (which LE has determined came from Denise’s phone) was made because they did not find the phone at the crime scene and thorized Jayme took it with her. This scenario makes a lot of sense to me, and if true, they may be looking for Denise’s phone.

If Jayme does have her own phone, I would bet LE has done everything in their power to obtain records as quickly as possible; in fact, they probably have been analyzing data for several days now, IMO. Since she is a minor, and due the seriousnes of the situation, I would think the rules are quite different than the ones that apply when an adult goes missing.

Here is a link to the more recent photos of Jayme released by the Sheriff's Office (24 hours after they put out photos of her when she was a year or two younger) on the Sheriff's FB page.

Barron County Sheriff's Department

In the two photos of her in the denim jacket a cell phone can be seen on the table right next to her.

Also, law enforcement said that they are in possession of the cell phone the 911 call came from. The 911 call log indicates that the cell phone that made the 911 call was Denise's.

I am of the strong opinion that law enforcement has not recovered Jayme's cell phone.

 

[ludakristen]

I also wanted to give you a shoutout for directing everyone to this tip in thread #10 @ludakristen but I couldn't find your post or recall your name until I just saw it again and I don't know how to link to the previous thread. Good eye!

Thanks! I'm new-ish to sleuthing but find the most valuable information to be posted in social media comments in respond to LE or MSM posts. For example, the Ashley Johnson-Barr case -- there were some comments on local news station FB pages about who took her far before the suspect was ID'd.

 

[Lady Justice21]

I reapectfully beg to differ that it's not the norm.

For what it's worth (probably not much). I put little stock in what we can see of Jayme's social media. We can't see what she posted on instagram or snapchat (if she had a snapchat). My teen would tell us fb is for old people. She doesn't have nor want fb. She and her friends use insta and snap. If you had access to my teens insta you'd see a whopping 2 or 3 posts. Every now and then she deletes posts and starts over. She and her friends also primarily use it for messaging. The only page she has that's more active is a pet page. Wonder if Jayme had a page for her pup?

My long winded point is her social media that the public could see wouldn't tell you whether or not she had a phone.......

All my own opinion.

 

[Mandie K]

I've thought that, too. I know, though, that Facebook requires its users to be at least 13, so it wouldn't surprise me if she was relatively new to the world of social media and hadn't had much time to make a larger digital footprint. On your same vein of thinking, though, I have noted the lack of selfies on her account, which does make me wonder if she has her own phone.

Source: Self - have many teenage relatives and selfies seem to be a cornerstone of SM if they have a phone.

To chime in on this post i have 2 girls similar in age and are completely different. My oldest was a young 13 yr old, naive and didn’t pay much attention to friends, SM, and those sort of things. My youngest now 13 is the complete opposite. IMO i feel like JC is a “young” 13yo as my daughter was when she was 13.

 

[ludakristen]

OK, thought this was interesting as well. Here is a map of three locations: far left is the Closs home, center pin is the Jennie-O turkey store, far right pin is the Ramblers Rest motel.

North on 25 about 5ish miles is where the search took place today.

No idea how or if this is relevant, but it helps me figure stuff out when I can see it visually like this.

Google Maps

 

[BRRI]

Is there a way to know for sure if she left the house alive or dead? I assume dogs could sniff out certain smells? If she was shot, that would be obvious, but what about strangulation?

 

[medea13]

agree- and I add- finsta accts

yes finsta and rinsta - fake instagram (private - only your friends know and can see) and real instagram - what you want the world and your parents to see

 

[bizzle2]

Wasn't there a huge case recently where the phone records would have provided (possibly) great information but the cell phone company was being very resistant, perhaps to prove a point of security, and it dragged on for weeks? I think it even may have been Apple resisting? Surely someone here remembers as I only peripherally glanced at headlines then. Given that Jayme is a minor and her life is at stake, I would love to think that the cell phone company has to turn over all texts and such even if her phone is missing. Anyone here who can provide some expert input on this?

ETA: Found the case I was recalling vaguely. Apple putting their foot down when perhaps they should have just - well - no matter now - personal privacy vs fighting crime. Tis an issue I know, but gee whiz. Anyway - here's the case I was recalling earlier - Apple Fights Order to Unlock San Bernardino Gunman’s iPhone

That is to unlock the phone. Which is different than phone records. Phone records -- phone numbers communicated with, call durations, etc. -- are easily obtained.

 

[gg1]

OK, thought this was interesting as well. Here is a map of three locations: far left is the Closs home, center pin is the Jennie-O turkey store, far right pin is the Ramblers Rest motel.

North on 25 about 5ish miles is where the search took place today.

No idea how or if this is relevant, but it helps me figure stuff out when I can see it visually like this.

Google Maps

The search took place in many locations, the spot you refer to is the staging areas for the volunteers.

 

[MassGuy]

Is there a way to know for sure if she left the house alive or dead? I assume dogs could sniff out certain smells? If she was shot, that would be obvious, but what about strangulation?

They had limited time to escape after the 911 call was made. What’s the point of killing her and then taking her with you?

I don’t think the perpetrator(s) had time to commit sexual assault or anything (one possibility as to why they would take a dead body).

Absent any clear evidence to the contrary, and using common sense, I think she almost certainly left that house alive.

 

[thesnowflakesparkles]

Where is Rambler's Rest in comparison to the house?

Can any locals give us some insight on the hotel?

jmo

I have a map, I will update it and post the link in a second. I don't know much about it except that it is kind of dumpy.

Edit: Google Maps

 

[Jethro4WS]

Thanks. I found the locations of the towers, but don't know how to post it.
Gotten study that one. But I do see there are towers very close.

content://media/external/file/18911

Some of the others are located at the hospital and where the Sheriff's office is located. There are towers further north and one south, but I don't know how many miles from the home the search is and whether any of those would be within the search zone today.