GUILTY WI - LAKE GENEVA SUITCASE MURDERS, Laura Simonson & Jenny Gamez - #2

[Rallygrrl]

Can't. Fact is you have no idea.

 

[bessie]

Can't. Fact is you have no idea.

Excuse me?

 

[FBEye]

When all is said and done, I think this could become a story of sex trafficking, not just him meeting these women on his own without any help of any other third party actors. Hard to say for sure, though, but it's likely all of his electronic communications will be subpoenaed and that includes text messages, emails, stuff on the websites he was involved in, etc.

Will be interesting to see the full indictment come July 17 when he has his arraignment hearing.

You're not kidding. It'll be interesting to hear what they find in his car and on his computer and phone records, as well as banking records in the way of hotels, flights, gas receipts & locations, memberships, etc. Plus all that evidence they hauled out of his apartment in the brown paper bags with the warrants. I hope they also check for storage units, any rentals, titles for boats or other vehicles, and lockers at work and health clubs.

 

[ClaireNC]

on another note . . . I'm rereading an article: http://www.farmingtonindependent.com/content/missing-farmington-woman-found-dead-wisconsin


Questions, questions, questions. And do read again how the Farmington Sgt / Detective was tipped in January '14 that Laura Simonson was w/SZ. It was that tip that led him to locate the online chats that occurred between Laura and SZ (evidently SZ was logging into his account from two locations - wondering what the second location was - assuming the first was his apartment).

I think the article is trying to say that they found two email accounts, not that he was logging in from two locations. It is very oddly worded. We know about the steve53227@yahoo.com email account, do we know any other email addresses that he was using?

Here is the quote from the article:

In early January, Hollatz received another tip that Simonson was with a Wisconsin man named Steven Zelich. With that name and information he found through accessing her online chats, Hollatz located an email account registered to Zelich in two separate locations, both of which were connected to online chats with Simonson.

 

[Sos]

When all is said and done, I think this could become a story of sex trafficking, not just him meeting these women on his own without any help of any other third party actors. Hard to say for sure, though, but it's likely all of his electronic communications will be subpoenaed and that includes text messages, emails, stuff on the websites he was involved in, etc.

Will be interesting to see the full indictment come July 17 when he has his arraignment hearing.

I will not be surprised if we find out that he had many more user names and email addresses than we are aware of at this time

 

[Sos]

Good questions. Just because he left alone doesn't mean he was. Did he roll out a suitcase? Yes, she could've been alive in it. Just because he says they died when they did doesn't mean squat. He knows enough that if he says he kept them as a slave he'd be charged with more.

Did LE or news/media ever state that they were the only two people in that room that evening ?

 

[tatertot]

Zelich's attorney: "He was likely hoping the suitcases would be found."

http://www.jsonline.com/news/crime/...-suitcase-killings-b99304298z1-265686411.html

"If it's a reckless act involving two people, which one is being reckless?" Schwantes said. "If two people are involved in a reckless act, can one be charged for accidental death by reckless behavior?"

:notgood: Which one is being reckless? Er, maybe the one who killed another woman previously during a "reckless act" and was hiding her body at the time?

I know this attorney has his work cut out for him, but that statement is disturbing. It implies that all would have been hunky-dorey if Zelich had continued to kill during "reckless acts" so long as it was accidental.

 

[Sos]

Zelich's attorney: "He was likely hoping the suitcases would be found."

http://www.jsonline.com/news/crime/...-suitcase-killings-b99304298z1-265686411.html



:notgood: Which one is being reckless? Er, maybe the one who killed another woman previously during a "reckless act" and was hiding her body at the time?

I know this attorney has his work cut out for him, but that statement is disturbing. It implies that all would have been hunky-dorey if Zelich had continued to kill during "reckless acts" so long as it was accidental.

Laura used her name when she checked in to the Motel, SZ did not use his real name.
Two thoughts on that; first he probably had a false identity and I believe that it proves he had ill intent when he checked in, why else would he not have used his real name?
If he did not intend to break the law or do harm by kidnapping Laura or killing her at the motel then there is no reason not to check in as SZ!

 

[OhThatVictoria]

of course I could be completely wrong about this theory . . . in lieu of "evidence", all we have are theories . . .

. . . therefore, further traveling down the worm hole, this site -- http://slaveexchange.blog.com/transfer-guidelines-wip/ -- provides a primer on the buying/selling of BDSM slaves. Valuation of slaves, definitions and transfer guidelines are spelled out, quite clearly. These buyers/sellers in no way feel they are trafficking. I'm wondering if Laura was sold to SZ. We don't know why she left her van at her Mother's, who drove her back to Farmington from St. Paul and from Farmington to Rochester. (Note that you may have to click on site links a couple times to connect, it's hinky)

For the safety of all parties, the exchange should take place in a public but out of the way of others. If things go smoothly, nobody should notice.
To prevent the possibility of the slave running off as soon as their former master is paid, new owners will often require a slave to take a sufficient dose of sleeping pills to knock them out quickly and will usually not execute the transaction until the slave is sufficiently incapacitated that they cannot just run off. This detail is often agreed to in advance so that a scammer would not dare pose as the owner of a slave because they would know they would lose their slave in the process, regardless.

 

[OhThatVictoria]

If he did not intend to break the law or do harm by kidnapping Laura or killing her at the motel then there is no reason not to check in as SZ!

Agree. And he certainly was not protecting his identity when he published pics of himself on BDSM sites and his email address on the yahoo list serve in early 2012.

 

[OhThatVictoria]

If Laura had a tendency of disappearing (which the family used as an excuse for not reporting her missing for 20 days), could she not have been a slave to someone in the area, perhaps? I'm hopeful that the MN authorities are seeking a more "local" dominant who might be in the trade.

 

[tatertot]

Laura and Zelich did have a preexisting online relationship before they met; it doesn't sound as if she was passed off to him by anyone else:

http://fox6now.com/2014/06/26/roche...es-to-involvement-in-death-of-laura-simonson/

“Laura and Mr. Zelich were not strangers. They had a previous relationship through the internet. This was not something random where he picked her up off the street and kidnapped her and held her against her will,” Rochester Police Captain of Investigations John Sherwin said.

 

[OhThatVictoria]

Laura and Zelich did have a preexisting online relationship before they met; it doesn't sound as if she was passed off to him by anyone else:

Good catch. I'd still like to fill in the blanks of why she left her van behind in St Paul on November 1st etc... and it's interesting to note that those in the trade recommend the use sleeping pills. I'd like to learn if SZ had an Rx for them. Still working off the idea that she left that hotel alive (unless of course the "evidence" proves otherwise).

 

[ClaireNC]

Laura used her name when she checked in to the Motel, SZ did not use his real name.
Two thoughts on that; first he probably had a false identity and I believe that it proves he had ill intent when he checked in, why else would he not have used his real name?
If he did not intend to break the law or do harm by kidnapping Laura or killing her at the motel then there is no reason not to check in as SZ!

If Laura registered under her name to get the hotel room, why would SZ need to check in? Generally only one person has to register and just say the number of people that will be using the room. Was it reported that he used a fake name at the hotel? Or was it just that they couldn't find his name in the register, but they did find Laura's?

From this article it sounds like they checked in together. http://www.farmingtonindependent.com/content/missing-farmington-woman-found-dead-wisconsin

The management provided Hollatz with video of Simonson and a man checking into the hotel on Nov. 2, and of the man checking out Nov. 3.

Of course, he could have had her do the checking in to avoid giving his name, but it is not as direct/devious/deceitful as it would have been if he had used a fake name and gave a fake ID. Might make a difference trying to prove premeditation.

 

[ClaireNC]

Good catch. I'd still like to fill in the blanks of why she left her van behind in St Paul on November 1st etc... and it's interesting to note that those in the trade recommend the use sleeping pills. I'd like to learn if SZ had an Rx for them. Still working off the idea that she left that hotel alive (unless of course the "evidence" proves otherwise).

It sounds like she left her van at her mother's house in Farmington, not St. Paul.

Simonson was last seen by family members on Nov. 1, 2013. She had residences in both Farmington and St. Paul, so family members were not initially concerned when they had not seen her for several days. On Nov. 2, she left her van parked at her mother’s Farmington home.

http://www.farmingtonindependent.com/content/missing-farmington-woman-found-dead-wisconsin

Still doesn't answer how she got to the hotel in Rochester.

 

[kodi]

<snipped>

For the safety of all parties, the exchange should take place in a public but out of the way of others. If things go smoothly, nobody should notice.
To prevent the possibility of the slave running off as soon as their former master is paid, new owners will often require a slave to take a sufficient dose of sleeping pills to knock them out quickly and will usually not execute the transaction until the slave is sufficiently incapacitated that they cannot just run off. This detail is often agreed to in advance so that a scammer would not dare pose as the owner of a slave because they would know they would lose their slave in the process, regardless.

RSBM and BBM

I've decided to jump on in here with your post OTV.

I have spent the better part of the last week catching up on this case. My interest grew tremendously once Jenny was identified as the second victim, especially since I hadn't remembered ever hearing she went missing. Of course the reasons behind that have unfolded and it is a heartbreaking set of circumstances that led to her falling off the grid. Of course, Laura's disappearance and death is just as heartbreaking. Sending prayers of strength and love to those that love both of these women.

I have so many things I want to say that my brain feels like it's in a blender and I can't even slow down to pull out one idea to make sense of. :doh: The foundations of BDSM is a safe, sane and consensual dynamic. However, each dynamic is as unique as a snowflake in such a way that no two are exactly the same; very similar perhaps, but not identical. Consent can mean different things to different individuals. When I read OTV's post regarding the exchange my blood boiled; clearly you wouldn't have to drug someone to near incapcitation to do something they consented to. Screams nonconsent to me. Yet, I know that there are slaves who seek complete captivity and once she consents to this she knows she has given up her free will, essentially her existence. It can be extremely difficult to wrap ones mind around.

I think these buyers and sellers don't feel like they are doing wrong because they feel they're fulfilling the slave's (those that have consented to enslavement) desire.
There are those that wish to be in this kind of dynamic but I fear there are far many more that are not there by choice.

All JMO

 

[OhThatVictoria]

It sounds like she left her van at her mother's house in Farmington, not St. Paul.
Simonson was last seen by family members on Nov. 1, 2013. She had residences in both Farmington and St. Paul, so family members were not initially concerned when they had not seen her for several days. On Nov. 2, she left her van parked at her mother&#8217;s Farmington home.
http://www.farmingtonindependent.com...dead-wisconsin

Still doesn't answer how she got to the hotel in Rochester.

oops, transposed the cities. (too vain to wear glasses <cough>)

Yes, it doesn't explain how she got to the hotel in Rochester. Was she seen being picked up at a bus stop, by a vehicle? (BTW ~ hate how that article was written)

I haven't found anything about Laura's residence in St Paul. Why two residences, (is one her Mom's - Farmington) and St Paul is (her Father ???). Her Father does have a different last name. BTW, you may wish to google his name. This story is going from bad to worse.

http://www.jsonline.com/news/corrections-and-clarifications-b99299891z1-264860801.html

 

[OhThatVictoria]

There are those that wish to be in this kind of dynamic but I fear there are far many more that are not there by choice.

kodi ~ thanks for commenting. I admit that only through this case have I done any serious reading / research on the lifestyle of BDSM and come to learn how sex trafficking enters the picture. as the commercial tag reads, "I could have had a V-8".

what I'm finding is that the majority of BDSM hobbyists (if that term is OK to use) are in it for exploration and excitement, ie harmless fun. by no means am I judging people who wish to partake and if my posts seem that way, it's probably because I'm rather incredulous at what I'm learning on the downside of the lifestyle.

there are people who are in this lifestyle to profit, exploit and hurt others (true sadists at heart). was that the case w/SZ? we don't know but I sure hope we find out. the fact that people can die accidentally is part of dancing on the edge, isn't it? I would think that having it happen once would have been enough for him. and, in that instance, I don't understand why he would remove a body from a death scene. being an ex-cop, he knew better. yeah, then it happens twice . . . this case is infuriating.

 

[Sos]

If Laura registered under her name to get the hotel room, why would SZ need to check in? Generally only one person has to register and just say the number of people that will be using the room. Was it reported that he used a fake name at the hotel? Or was it just that they couldn't find his name in the register, but they did find Laura's?

From this article it sounds like they checked in together. http://www.farmingtonindependent.com/content/missing-farmington-woman-found-dead-wisconsin



Of course, he could have had her do the checking in to avoid giving his name, but it is not as direct/devious/deceitful as it would have been if he had used a fake name and gave a fake ID. Might make a difference trying to prove premeditation.

Yeah I just reread several news articles and found contradictions - so I am unsure at the moment if they arrived together - LE references evidence to tie him to the room but does not reveal what that evidence is (that I can find and provide a source for)
Still think its strange how quick this topic went silent..... as mentioned by others, no follow up stories or any further details about SZ..... very strange

 

[kodi]

kodi ~ thanks for commenting. I admit that only through this case have I done any serious reading / research on the lifestyle of BDSM and come to learn how sex trafficking enters the picture. as the commercial tag reads, "I could have had a V-8".

what I'm finding is that the majority of BDSM hobbyists (if that term is OK to use) are in it for exploration and excitement, ie harmless fun. by no means am I judging people who wish to partake and if my posts seem that way, it's probably because I'm rather incredulous at what I'm learning on the downside of the lifestyle.

there are people who are in this lifestyle to profit, exploit and hurt others (true sadists at heart). was that the case w/SZ? we don't know but I sure hope we find out. the fact that people can die accidentally is part of dancing on the edge, isn't it? I would think that having it happen once would have been enough for him. and, in that instance, I don't understand why he would remove a body from a death scene. being an ex-cop, he knew better. yeah, then it happens twice . . . this case is infuriating.

I didn't feel you came off as judging in any way. *smiles*

The BDSM community is extremely diverse and can certainly have somewhat of a shock value for those who know little or nothing about it. There are those that dabble from time to time and those that choose to live 24/7 and everything in between. As with any community, there are those that will exploit others and have sinister motives, but I don't feel there's any more in the BDSM community vs another. Just as the towns of these ladies (geographic community) are affected by this tragedy, the BDSM community (nongeographic community) is affected. We are all just as disturbed as those who don't partake in the lifestyle at this crime. I feel media and television highlight mostly only the exploitations and dark side of the lifestyle because that's what sells.


I agree there certainly couldn't have been two accidents and don't think either were. I've wondered if he left the suitcases where he did anticipating they would be removed and disposed of when mowed and not discovered before making there way to the landfill. I feel his electronic trail will be very telling and I would venture to guess he spent a lot of time online if he didn't have any friends. He was talking to somebody.

All JMO