WV - Sodder Family - 5 children, Christmas eve 1945 - #3

[bambi_sue]

Also, in response to a question of visibility that evening, according to the Farmer's Almanac online, the moon was at 66% visibile on Christmas Eve 1945 in Fayetteville.

Without weather spotter information on cloud conditions, I'm not sure that's helpful. It's possible the local historical society might have weather spotter journals or something of the sort on file with more info.

Source: http://www.almanac.com/moon/calendar/WV/Fayetteville/1945-12

 

[wv171]

Glad some of you keeping this case alive..

Fayette County allway's had a large Italian's POP..

Oak Hill I would say be nearest town to Fayetteville, Then Beckley, Summersville, Charleston..

I still think this case make a wonderfull movie..

 

[Laura_Bean]

I have not been here for a loooong time. I was doing thinking, thinking I believe, is one of the best ways to solve these cases.

I have come to several ideas.

1. I believe the children did die that night. I don't yet know if it was in the fire or in some other way, but I think they died that night. I think, if they were alive, someone would have showed up eventually back in this town, asking questions, visiting a grave, something. With no contact whatsoever, (that we can prove or even was claiming to be one of the children), I just don't think they lived past that night. I think it is possible, after having spoken to the fire dept, that there is a possibility the children's bodies were incinerated, and I think George Sodder made one mistake, bulldozing the area. Bones get scattered by wind, floods, animals, etc.

2. Even if the children did die in the fire that night, I think it was murder and arson. I think this is where the real case is. Who set the house on fire, and if the children were killed or died that night due to some other cause, (I have considered them getting locked outside and wandering into the woods accidentally, as it was dark outside, and if that is the case they would have died not due to murder, but due to exposure to the cold and elements the night had to offer), what happened to them.

3. I now believe there are only three main suspects in this case, and some people may be upset by one of them. The first is the man who had the arguement with Mr. Sodder, the man who told Mr. Sodder, your house will burn and your kids will pay. Mr. Sodder would not buy his insurance, the man yells these things, and the next thing we know is the house is burned to the ground and five young children are unaccounted for. That sounds suspicious to me. Although, this could just be a very odd coincidence, it still warrants looking in to.

4. The second possible suspect, would be the oldest brother or someone who did not like the oldest brother. The reason is this, and this just came to me today, the youngest child was playing in the yard, and she found a "Military Pineapple", that had mostly been melted. This shows that whoever did this either knew someone who had military acess or was someone with military access. If the brother was angry at his parents for some reason, or maybe he was sending money to help the family and did not want to do so any longer, (after all if everyone dies in a big fire he would not have to help any longer, if he was helping), or if someone was very angry with the oldest brother and would have taken it out on his family, that would explain the "Military Acess" part of things. Sorry if this offends everyone, but part of a thorough investigation means looking into every possibility. And oftentimes, when someone is killed, police look at family first. This would also offer an explanation of why no one heard the children screaming. Think of this. If the brother showed up, and his five siblings caught him off guard, perhaps they were outside doing their chores, if they saw their own brother, they would be overjoyed to see him. No screaming, MOM A STRANGER, just hugs all around, and maybe the oldest brother says, Don't wake them up let them sleep, and it is late go up to bed, you can spend time with me in the morning. And they would listen, without hesitation. If it was someone who was angry with the brother, but someone who used to be a good friend of the brother, that would warrant the same thing. Perhaps the children would recognize him and listen to what he told them to do.

5. The next suspect would be the man who stole from the family that night. It seems very odd that he was there at all. He didn't report seeing anything strange, yet the police said the phone lines were cut right before or even DURING the fire. This may be in conjunction with suspect number one. Perhaps he was helping the other man, the one who fought with Mr. Sodder and used the robbery as a coverup.

 

[Laura_Bean]

The question here, is which one? Which one would you drag out of the house? How would you decide?

I will say this, if I was trying to escape a fire, and ran into my siblings room and shook them to wake them, and I knew I could not carry more then one of them at most probably, I am not sure if I would grab the nearest child, or if I would panic for a few or more precious seconds and then run out because I no longer had the time to carry someone down. The thing is, what if the five children were laying in the beds, none of them were waking up, and you could only carry 1 of 5 down those stairs... Would you grab the baby? Would you grab the youngest boy? Would you hesitate in a real emergency? What if you were just a teenager yourself?

 

[Laura_Bean]

And I think it is MUCH more likely, if the children were kidnapped, it was by someone they TRUSTED. How else do you keep FIVE children quiet? How else do you ensure they don't start screaming? A family member or a friend of the family or someone they were USED to seeing around had to be the culprit, IF you are saying they were abducted. I think it is HIGHLY more likely these children either died in the fire or were killed sometime during or after the fire. Such as perhaps they ran into the woods nearby, because someone was after them, and they got lost and died due to exposure. Or perhaps, the house gets set on fire, and the kids try and take a shortcut to the nearest house for help, and the kids get lost in the dark and cold and confusion, and die again due to cold and the elements. If not perhaps someone followed the kids into the woods and killed them there. The thing is this, it would be impossible, in my opinion, to keep FIVE children from EVER going back to their home. They would come back eventually. To visit graves or to see where their old house once stood or something. One of them at least, would GO BACK. But it never happened. This tells me the kids were dead.

And if Mr. Sodder bulldozed the area and only put about three feet of dirt over some bones and stuff he didn't notice, animals could have taken the bones away, the wind could take them away, any number of things could scatter the remains.

 

[T-Rex]

Just finished reading all three threads, and links. Whew! Some things that struck me:

The children who went missing are the same ones no one saw go to bed.
Would five excited children have put themselves to bed?
When the mother woke for the phone call, and the lights were on, was the radio they had been listening to still on?
Did Maurice & Louis do their chores (feeding the cow, and closing the chicken coop)?
You'd think, on Christmas Eve, they'd be especially "good" for Santa.
Why would the burglar in the barn cut the electicity (his intention) to the house?
What good would that do him?
It must have been after the phone call (12:30ish), because what he actually cut was the phone line, and that's when the call was received.
If he had cut the phone line earlier, the phone call wouldn't have been received.
If he had really cut the electricity, there would be no electrical fire.

 

[wvhandyman]

Is there a chance anyone has copies/scans of the origional newspaper articles related to the fire from 1946-46. I'm helping my daughter do a school project on this. These would be very helpful.

Thanks

 

[Teresa Larson]

Is there a chance anyone has copies/scans of the origional newspaper articles related to the fire from 1946-46. I'm helping my daughter do a school project on this. These would be very helpful.

Thanks

Have you tried contacting the library there? They should have a copy Maybe they could email a copy to you.

 

[DIRK SCHILLER]

hello, this is my first post here except for my thread about my missing son.
Ive just read a website about the Sodder´s, and it is very inetresting what it says,:
"On Christmas Eve in 1945, Betty and four of her siblings, Maurice, Martha, Louis and Jennie, asked to be allowed to stay up and play with their Christmas toys after the rest of the family went to bed. They promised they would do their chores before they went to sleep, so their parents agreed to let them stay up."... and then it says:

"Shortly after midnight, the children's mother, Jenny Sodder, was awakened by the ringing phone. When she answered, the female caller on the other end asked to speak to someone Jenny did not know, then laughed and hung up. Jenny believed this was a prank call. Before she went back to sleep, she noticed that her home's lights were on, the shades were up and the doors were unlocked. "......then it says:

"Jenny was woken up again that night by a noise on the roof. At 1:30 a.m., she realized the house was on fire. She called for her husband and children to get out. Two of the Sodders' sons and their daughter, who was carrying the baby, made it outside, but Jenny and her husband, George, realized Maurice, Martha, Louise, Jennie and Betty were missing."

does it really happenned like this?
because the mother after the phone call and realizing about the lights,shades and UNLOCKED DOORS , did she check on the children? were all the 5 laying in bed? because it is suspicious to me the 5 children that did get missing were the same children still up playing and the doors were unlocked?!?
What if they disappeared before the fire while the parents were sleeping?!? How did the parents new for sure all children were in bed as the house did burn? Maybe someone did get into the house and took the children away?!?

please..sorry if posted before,,,,it seems odd to me too the parents did not go to the childrens rooms right after the fire started to save the children before they went downstairs, that´d have been my first reaction, but I do not know for sure how things happenned, I wasn´t there




here is the link:
http://webcache.googleusercontent.c...7.html+sodder+family&cd=8&hl=de&ct=clnk&gl=de

 

[RMIC]

Hello! I know the youngest Sodder child's daughter has been a great source of help on the forum, but I wonder if any other members of the family have been contacted? I did a White Pages search for "Sodder," and there are many still living in the West Virginia/Fayetteville area, including listings for George Sodder Jr, Louise Sodder (Fayetteville) and Margaret Sodder (Fayetteville).

 

[DIRK SCHILLER]

I guess the Sodder family has given up on the 5 children,too bad..
poor kids!

 

[Ravenclaw]

I'm guessing that Mrs. Sodder simply thought that the kids had been irresponsible in their Christmas excitement. Not to mention she was half-asleep.

Also, I don't think that they really ever gave up as much as they realized they had to let it go or else it would drive them nuts. I know this case haunts me [especially since i live in the area] and I'm not even family.

I've wondered before if any of the family still living here would be willing to talk about what they know, but I do not want to bother them or offend them.

 

[Eva]

I was born in Fayetteville, West Virginia in early 1936 and moved to Florida when I was 6 years old. I would return to W.Va with my family for a few months of each year--and was in Fayetteville when the sign went up about the Sodder Children. I was the same age as one of the missing girls. And the sign horrified me.

I don't recall knowing the children in school, but I probably did.

What is strange is that I woke last night ( December 28,2010) and the story of the Sodder family came to me. I had not thought of them in more than 55 years--and I usually don't lay awake during the night.

It was as if I was compelled by some force (crazy, eh?) to delve into the matter.

I went on the computer this morning and found the WebSleuths posts.

Now I must do more research.

The name Janutolo contected in some way to this mystery amazed me. Frienzo and Cliente Janutolo were friends with both my grandfathers--Goddard who owned and edited THE FAYETTE TRIBUNE, and Smith who was superintendent of Erskine Coal Company. I never heard anything negative about the Janutolo family.

Has something new arisen in regards to this mystery? My own mystery is why I was suddenly made aware of it after so many years.

I have had many other "odd" experiences of "knowing" things before they happen or as they happen. I am a retired school teacher--not thought of as a quack.

 

[wfgodot]

Welcome to WebSleuths, Eva. Indeed this is one of the country's great mysteries. Your input will be much appreciated here.

 

[Eva]

good to see that you are from "Avalon"--

Are you a professor of literature?

I have a degree in English literature USF--1970--

 

[wfgodot]

good to see that you are from "Avalon"--

Are you a professor of literature?

I have a degree in English literature USF--1970--

Nice catch, you're the first one to comment on my location. I've an MA English, and taught in a small college for ten years.

 

[cindyc]

I happened on this thread on Sunday and spent most of the day reading it because it is so intriguing.

After reading it all, I firmly believe the children did not die in the fire and it was not "Mafia" related. I don't think the children were even in the house when the phone call woke Mrs. Sodder up. I think the fire was started as a distraction to cover up the fact someone removed the children.

I don't doubt the presence of Mafia in West Virginia during this time; I just believe that if it was a Mafia related issue they would have taken credit for it somehow and they would have gone after either Mr. Sodder of one of his older sons who was working for him.

This was a time that was very unlike now. Communication was much more difficult and people tended to be more trusting. How easy would it be to lure children out of the house- especially on Christmas Eve? I believe there is a very realistic possibilty that the children were sold to an "adoption" agency or orphanage and were told and believed that their family perished in the fire. People did not talk about adoption like they do now- it was not a thing that was openly discussed. Times were very different and people were very careful about keeping their personal "business" to themselves. Family secrets tended to be just that- SECRET!

 

[PaulR]

Satch - it was documented that the fire started on the roof, supporting what Mrs. Sodder said about hearing a "rubber ball" type of sound on the roof just before the fire, and also supporting what an eyewitness said about seeing "balls of fire being thrown" onto the roof or toward the house.

Hmmm...

"balls of fire" = ball lightning?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ball_lightning

 

[Sparky]

I was born in Fayetteville, West Virginia in early 1936 and moved to Florida when I was 6 years old. I would return to W.Va with my family for a few months of each year--and was in Fayetteville when the sign went up about the Sodder Children. I was the same age as one of the missing girls. And the sign horrified me.

I don't recall knowing the children in school, but I probably did.

What is strange is that I woke last night ( December 28,2010) and the story of the Sodder family came to me. I had not thought of them in more than 55 years--and I usually don't lay awake during the night.

It was as if I was compelled by some force (crazy, eh?) to delve into the matter.

I went on the computer this morning and found the WebSleuths posts.

Now I must do more research.

The name Janutolo contected in some way to this mystery amazed me. Frienzo and Cliente Janutolo were friends with both my grandfathers--Goddard who owned and edited THE FAYETTE TRIBUNE, and Smith who was superintendent of Erskine Coal Company. I never heard anything negative about the Janutolo family.

Has something new arisen in regards to this mystery? My own mystery is why I was suddenly made aware of it after so many years.

I have had many other "odd" experiences of "knowing" things before they happen or as they happen. I am a retired school teacher--not thought of as a quack.

Hello Eva,

My Father is also from Fayetteville and my Mother from Smiters. They both remember this case very vividly. My mother and I were just discussing it not long ago and she does not believe the children were murdered. She has said many times she believes they were kidnapped.

I also remember seeing the sign when my parents took me to visit. I remember how scared I was back then when I saw the children's faces.

Mother says back then Smithers was known as Little Italy and was very rough. She also said people came from everywhere to mine coal. She compared it to the Gold Rush.

 

[miss_sherlock]

Hi I am a newbie here so hope I am not putting my foot in my mouth posting this.

I know this is probably a daft idea, but has anyone put any of the photos on FB to make a page for this case? Maybe the pic that is possibly Louis would get recognized. I have seen so many pages of this type on FB and they all seem to get alot of people signing up.
I have not been able to see a lot of the links and the myspace is quite limited. The "sodders" website is no longer working as far as I can make out.