WY WY - David Vernon Lovely, 19, Fort Bridger, 5 Aug 1985
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kevmob77
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This is a case that always bothered me. Something didn't seem right about it. If I recall correctly, David's sister did point out a few original errors in his case-file. One thing that never made too much sense to me was that the family (on a cross-country trip moving), said that they would stop every 30 miles to check on him, yet, they were driving behind him. If I'm correct here, and if David was riding in his motorcycle, wouldn't he be the one who said to pull over to take a break? All he had to do was slow down, give a hand gesture saying it's time to take a break. One factor that needs clarification is this: whether accurate or not, multiple websites state that it took the family 9 days to report his missing. If this is true, why wait so long? I have 3 siblings, and if either one of them went missing under bizarre circumstances such as this, I would be worried as hell that they may have crashed. Was this avenue pursed. I understand that his motorcycle was found "in running condition" but between the time that happened, it still does not fill the gap of whatever happened to him. Obviously, there were no cell phones then, but something about this case is not fully being told. Again, it is not my interest to hurt anyone here. A clarification on a lot of things would probably clear things up a bit more.
Angels_Not_Forgotten
Anxiously Awaiting a WINNING NFL Season!
In a previous post (sorry mobile can't locate with this app I use I don't think...?) The sister said he was reported missing earlier than 9 days but it took a while to locate the bike.
I wonder, too, about the follow and call situation. Seems like on a trip, to stop and call every 30 minutes would drag the trip on for what seems like forever.
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kevmob77
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On a basically 1,500 mile trip, I agree, that would seem a bit ridiculous. If the motorcycle was jacked up (not in the best running condition), I could maybe understand every 100 miles. But nothing was ever mentioned of that. But every 30 miles?
kevmob77
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KurtieB,
He was reported missing prior to 9 days but it took that time before his bike was found. There was heavy rain in that area so unfirtunately the bike couldn't be fingerprintedAt least thats what my mother was told.
We don't believe he went there alone. It was way too isolated and he wasn't familiar with the area at all.
(Davids sister)
Just read this part. If you do not mind me asking, what are your theories on what happened to your brother? I understand if you wish not to do so.
SheWhoMustNotBeNamed
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Bumping for David. Missing for 28 years today.
Lundberg99
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We've always felt that someone killed him...Could have been accidental even with the medical issues he had. If someone even hit him slightly he could have instantly died.
The detective that found the bike said that the area where his bike was found was full of ravines. They searched but they said it wasn't a safe area.
We pray every day that one day we will have an answer..Someone out there must know something
The detective that found the bike said that the area where his bike was found was full of ravines. They searched but they said it wasn't a safe area.
We pray every day that one day we will have an answer..Someone out there must know something
scriptgirl
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If he had such serious medical issues, was it safe for him to even have that bike? Also, that bike could have just been placed there. I think that weird man was involved.
OkieGranny
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That article is a great find OkieGranny. Thanks so much for posting that. I do think about this case from time to time. I drove from Colorado to California in 1989 in a car when I was 19 - and even though I was a fairly experienced driver, I was confused. There's a big difference between driving around town and driving cross country where everything is new. Add to that - We only had maps back then and also he was on a motorcycle. It's very easy he go lost. Now, according to google maps, he could have easily taken a wrong turn and gone south very far without realizing he was no longer on the freeway. Looking at the map - instead of going east through Ft Bridge, suppose he ended up going south on 430 and finally pulled off on South Baxter road completely lost.
I don't think the Harley Davidson guy would have rolled or hurt David. The kind of guy - a Harley type guy - who would be tough wouldn't bother a kid like that, and he surely wouldn't fix his bike and follow him. What because Harley guys want Yamaha parts? They don't and the bike was intact. I don't see that. I just see that biker as a guy who helped out a kid. He was probably gruff - all the ones I knew as a kid (from the 1970s) were very gruff, but mean to the defenseless - never.
The sister also mentioned a rain storm between the time he went missing and when his bike was found. A big storm.
I think he got lost/hurt/fell out there.
Could have been buried in the mud.
Too bad the exact location of the bike isn't known. I would like to examine it with Google maps, but we don't know.
scriptgirl
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I suspect foul play. What is a draw? I believe David was scared of that guy he told his aunt about.
dogperson
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I think most likely LE could have found his body out there in the general area of where the motorcycle was found. If the person seen riding out of there on a motorcycle was involved, then they evidently did not take David with them. Tracking/cadaver dogs could have been used. I don't know whether I think he met with an accident or foul play, but I do believe he is not far from his motorcycle.
scriptgirl
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Wyoming has a lot of remote parts. David could be buried anywhere in that general area.
HelpingHeart
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Bumping for David. This case stuck out to me, I feel for the family. I couldn't imagine.
How far was the place where his bike was found to where he was last supposed to meet up with his family? I know his sisters are on here at times, so I ask - did you all go back up and down the highway for awhile searching for him, or just stayed at the rest stop for hours waiting for him to show (like the articles say)? I like getting facts because articles always are flawed it seems. And, if he went on ahead, but slept on the side of the highway, wouldn't you have came across him on that stretch of the highway?
I suspect foul play, because why wouldn't he be in the vicinity of the rest areas? His bike was fixed, he could have driven up and down the rest areas until he found his family or called at another gas station (collect if needed). Then the area where his bike was found seems to be remote. Why would he drive to that area, when he doesn't know it? Something happened to him, not sure what, then his bike was just placed there is my guess.
How far was the place where his bike was found to where he was last supposed to meet up with his family? I know his sisters are on here at times, so I ask - did you all go back up and down the highway for awhile searching for him, or just stayed at the rest stop for hours waiting for him to show (like the articles say)? I like getting facts because articles always are flawed it seems. And, if he went on ahead, but slept on the side of the highway, wouldn't you have came across him on that stretch of the highway?
I suspect foul play, because why wouldn't he be in the vicinity of the rest areas? His bike was fixed, he could have driven up and down the rest areas until he found his family or called at another gas station (collect if needed). Then the area where his bike was found seems to be remote. Why would he drive to that area, when he doesn't know it? Something happened to him, not sure what, then his bike was just placed there is my guess.
scriptgirl
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Were the people at the Bingo Truck Stop questioned thoroughly?
snowleopard
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Hi Lundberg. I'm sorry about David. I hope you still watch this board. I wondering if you can elaborate on David's medical issues? It sounds as if he was quite physically fragile(?), which makes me think of perhaps a small accident or incident that may have proved fatal. Sorry to be so plain, but I see a 'biker type' with an accidentally deceased young man on his hands freaking out and putting him somewhere. It sounds like the bike was neatly place along with the backpack, almost with some care ? Also, did the detective mean hazardous geographically, or frequented by bad folks?We've always felt that someone killed him...Could have been accidental even with the medical issues he had. If someone even hit him slightly he could have instantly died.
The detective that found the bike said that the area where his bike was found was full of ravines. They searched but they said it wasn't a safe area.
We pray every day that one day we will have an answer..Someone out there must know something
scriptgirl
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Was he a hemophiliac?
spamelope
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It said that he had kidney surgery. That area (Rock Springs) is Meth Central and it's pretty tough. A lot of men were there from all over the country doing roughneck work. You also have a ton of truck drivers from all over, and so many of them have turned out to be serial killers. So tragic he hasn't been found. WY is beautiful, but it can be harsh and unforgiving. Both the people and the terrain.
****30 YEARS AGO TODAY****
Dave Lovely was last heard from by his family on August 5, 1985. He was 19.
.
.
.
To his family: your lost Dave is a terrible blow, but I know you're thankful for the short time you had him with you. Won't you interact with us some more?....because I think you have some important knowledge you may not consider relevant.
I have a little bit of insight to the area around Rock Springs and a bit more contacts with Biker Culture, which to me seems pivotal in this case, I offer what I have concluded below:
The biker world is the KEY to this mystery.
Rock Springs was featured on the likes of 60 Minutes and A&E for it’s terrible crime and corruption. Drugs and organized crime ruled the town and Sweetwater County, supported by corrupt police. Of course no one moving coast-to-coast would really be expected to know this about such a small town in a bleak Wyoming desert, but having a breakdown in the area is similar to getting stranded in the Bronx or hitchhiking in Bedford-Stuy. Trouble is about a 50/50 chance for strangers here, and the place attracted all types of criminals, but it especially attracted the mobile type who hid in plain sight roaming the interstates – bad bikers and bad truckers.
I trust Dave’s first impression. We all know within a minute or so of meeting someone whether they are a friend or enemy, whether they are here to help or hurt. When Dave tells his aunt he's afraid of the guy who fixes his bike, this obviously is the beginning of the tragedy. There is a reason to be afraid of the man who fixes his bike, who is apparently another biker himself. I wish Dave would have trusted his first impression because I think things might have turned out a lot differently. Very often a kind personality is too easy in thinking others are also kind. When the couple camping around Baxter Road sees a long-haired rider on a big fancy chrome bike coming from the area where they would shortly find Dave’s Yamaha, it’s clear this whole case starts and ends with the motorcycles and bikers.
Somehow, a man on a motorcycle convinced Dave to ride way way the heck out of his way, well off the interstate - to a draw off Baxter Road. It seems this person is either the man who fixes Dave’s bike or a “colleague.” I know many bikers, my brother is a hardcore biker. There are two basic types who ride the big bikes: dentists who like to act bad on the weekends on the one hand and hard-core criminals living off the grid and under the radar on the other hand. The bad kind is always on the move, but they usually have something of a home base. In the 1980s, Rock Springs is the home base for many bikers all over the mountain west who are making a living off crime because the policing is bought off. I feel certain Dave drove himself out to the Baxter Road area. Why? Because the camping couple saw only a SINGLE biker leave and absent a truck (with helpers) the only way Dave’s bike gets out to Baxter Road is if he rides it himself.
What makes Dave go out there in the middle of nowhere? The offer of money, a free place to stay, a fixed motorcycle or some other reward might work. Alternatively, perhaps the bad biker used a variation of “help me look for my lost puppy” and played on Dave’s sense of gratitude for getting a repaired bike. In other words maybe the criminal said, “Since I helped you, would you mind helping me with this one little thing, its back here a ways….”
If I currently lived in Rock Springs, the place where Dave’s bike is found would probably be noticeable to me as popular biker route. But I can’t say for sure. Bikers very often establish long, hilly, curving remote routes where they can cruise, speed and stop off to do things without attracting attention…and these routes are widely known in every local biker community. I am confident where Dave’s bike was found is on or near a regular bike route. The road where the Yamaha is found and where the campers are is not a random place a random drive-by biker from far away accidentally discovers. Dave is brought to this place by someone local, or at least with local knowledge, and this person very much knows the countryside.
It doesn’t matter much to finding the criminal how things ended up this way, but once he got Dave to the remote location, something happened which left Dave dead - I'm certain. I feel it was a deliberate set up. $140 is worth $300 today and if Dave was carrying that much, this alone might be worth killing for. Bikers are not generally the type to fit the common characteristics of child sexual molesters, but since David is really a young adult it is also possible sexual violence is at play here. I kind of doubt it, though. It is also possible, this was in some ways an accident and that Dave was “only” a robbery victim, but a victim who died unintentionally through accident or the infliction of force not intended to be deadly. Finally, it is possible that it was a total accident – in this case Dave voluntarily goes out to the desert, perhaps to camp for the night with a true Good Samaritan, and then injures himself beyond recovery. If this is about money, it takes a very bad mindset to kill someone, when you can just mug them. But killing them leaves no witnesses – except for the campers who saw the man on the big fancy bike leave the area. Bikers are not the type to stay around and expain things to the cops, even if they are legitimately innocent of all wrongdoing.
I really think that besides the overall biker world here, the other big point is to understand everything the two campers can say. Can we get in touch with them?
Really, in every scenario here, there is some level of deception and foul play. At minimum someone let Dave die without helping him or alerting others. I'm confident Dave's final resting place is close to his bike. He drove his bike there, then died there. The man who took him there, and was seen driving back out is the man with the answers. He is probably the one who fixed the bike. I don’t think there is any way Dave goes off the interstate so far, unless he was led there. The person who led him there, almost certainly the long haired gent on the big bike, holds the big answer we’re looking for.
…The key to this is bikers. The chrome bike, long haired guy. Alternatively, the greater biker community is plausibly aware of Dave’s story and at least further details. Rumors may still be flying around that have some basis in truth. If there is a scary biker bar in Rock Springs, that's were to start.
I plan to visit both the truck stop and Baxter Road area when I’m next in Rock Springs. I’ll try to post here what I discover.
777
Dave Lovely was last heard from by his family on August 5, 1985. He was 19.
.
.
.
To his family: your lost Dave is a terrible blow, but I know you're thankful for the short time you had him with you. Won't you interact with us some more?....because I think you have some important knowledge you may not consider relevant.
I have a little bit of insight to the area around Rock Springs and a bit more contacts with Biker Culture, which to me seems pivotal in this case, I offer what I have concluded below:
The biker world is the KEY to this mystery.
Rock Springs was featured on the likes of 60 Minutes and A&E for it’s terrible crime and corruption. Drugs and organized crime ruled the town and Sweetwater County, supported by corrupt police. Of course no one moving coast-to-coast would really be expected to know this about such a small town in a bleak Wyoming desert, but having a breakdown in the area is similar to getting stranded in the Bronx or hitchhiking in Bedford-Stuy. Trouble is about a 50/50 chance for strangers here, and the place attracted all types of criminals, but it especially attracted the mobile type who hid in plain sight roaming the interstates – bad bikers and bad truckers.
I trust Dave’s first impression. We all know within a minute or so of meeting someone whether they are a friend or enemy, whether they are here to help or hurt. When Dave tells his aunt he's afraid of the guy who fixes his bike, this obviously is the beginning of the tragedy. There is a reason to be afraid of the man who fixes his bike, who is apparently another biker himself. I wish Dave would have trusted his first impression because I think things might have turned out a lot differently. Very often a kind personality is too easy in thinking others are also kind. When the couple camping around Baxter Road sees a long-haired rider on a big fancy chrome bike coming from the area where they would shortly find Dave’s Yamaha, it’s clear this whole case starts and ends with the motorcycles and bikers.
Somehow, a man on a motorcycle convinced Dave to ride way way the heck out of his way, well off the interstate - to a draw off Baxter Road. It seems this person is either the man who fixes Dave’s bike or a “colleague.” I know many bikers, my brother is a hardcore biker. There are two basic types who ride the big bikes: dentists who like to act bad on the weekends on the one hand and hard-core criminals living off the grid and under the radar on the other hand. The bad kind is always on the move, but they usually have something of a home base. In the 1980s, Rock Springs is the home base for many bikers all over the mountain west who are making a living off crime because the policing is bought off. I feel certain Dave drove himself out to the Baxter Road area. Why? Because the camping couple saw only a SINGLE biker leave and absent a truck (with helpers) the only way Dave’s bike gets out to Baxter Road is if he rides it himself.
What makes Dave go out there in the middle of nowhere? The offer of money, a free place to stay, a fixed motorcycle or some other reward might work. Alternatively, perhaps the bad biker used a variation of “help me look for my lost puppy” and played on Dave’s sense of gratitude for getting a repaired bike. In other words maybe the criminal said, “Since I helped you, would you mind helping me with this one little thing, its back here a ways….”
If I currently lived in Rock Springs, the place where Dave’s bike is found would probably be noticeable to me as popular biker route. But I can’t say for sure. Bikers very often establish long, hilly, curving remote routes where they can cruise, speed and stop off to do things without attracting attention…and these routes are widely known in every local biker community. I am confident where Dave’s bike was found is on or near a regular bike route. The road where the Yamaha is found and where the campers are is not a random place a random drive-by biker from far away accidentally discovers. Dave is brought to this place by someone local, or at least with local knowledge, and this person very much knows the countryside.
It doesn’t matter much to finding the criminal how things ended up this way, but once he got Dave to the remote location, something happened which left Dave dead - I'm certain. I feel it was a deliberate set up. $140 is worth $300 today and if Dave was carrying that much, this alone might be worth killing for. Bikers are not generally the type to fit the common characteristics of child sexual molesters, but since David is really a young adult it is also possible sexual violence is at play here. I kind of doubt it, though. It is also possible, this was in some ways an accident and that Dave was “only” a robbery victim, but a victim who died unintentionally through accident or the infliction of force not intended to be deadly. Finally, it is possible that it was a total accident – in this case Dave voluntarily goes out to the desert, perhaps to camp for the night with a true Good Samaritan, and then injures himself beyond recovery. If this is about money, it takes a very bad mindset to kill someone, when you can just mug them. But killing them leaves no witnesses – except for the campers who saw the man on the big fancy bike leave the area. Bikers are not the type to stay around and expain things to the cops, even if they are legitimately innocent of all wrongdoing.
I really think that besides the overall biker world here, the other big point is to understand everything the two campers can say. Can we get in touch with them?
Really, in every scenario here, there is some level of deception and foul play. At minimum someone let Dave die without helping him or alerting others. I'm confident Dave's final resting place is close to his bike. He drove his bike there, then died there. The man who took him there, and was seen driving back out is the man with the answers. He is probably the one who fixed the bike. I don’t think there is any way Dave goes off the interstate so far, unless he was led there. The person who led him there, almost certainly the long haired gent on the big bike, holds the big answer we’re looking for.
…The key to this is bikers. The chrome bike, long haired guy. Alternatively, the greater biker community is plausibly aware of Dave’s story and at least further details. Rumors may still be flying around that have some basis in truth. If there is a scary biker bar in Rock Springs, that's were to start.
I plan to visit both the truck stop and Baxter Road area when I’m next in Rock Springs. I’ll try to post here what I discover.
777
A draw is kind of like the little notch or "mini-valley" between two hills. If the two humps of the letter "m" were two hills, it would be the dip between the two humps..