17 y/o Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #20

[Horace Finklestein]

FWIW, my son attends High School in our mildly affluent part of town. He told us that out of several dozen students he has heard voice an opinion, not one of them thinks Trayvon was an innocent victim, and almost 75% think Zimmerman was attacked and in fear for his life. None of those have any reason other than that is what he said.

Personally I think both he and Zimmerman possibly stereotyped one another. No way do I think Zimmerman is blameless and no way do I believe his account in full. I think it's sad that young people are apparently buying into the prejudices of their elders. But then what can you expect..

So if kids believe GZ's side of this it means they are prejudiced? Just honestly curious, not trying to be sarcastic.

 

[vlpate]

I have included links to the Burglery reports (none of which occurred on Feb 2, 2012, the date Taffe said the burlary of his home occurred and to the 911 calls Zimmerman made, one of which was on 2/2/2012-it's on page 45 of 47. It seems Taffe has told a few versions of what happened-there are more quotes from him "out there"...

Thank you for the links. He didn't say a burglary occurred at his home, he said an attempted burglary. He said the same kid was arrested later for burglarizing a home. I'm assuming that would be the 2/6 burglary where the black male, who originally gave a false name, is pointed out as the same black male seen on in the area of the burglary the day before?. So am I still missing the Taffe's lie? Three young black males and one white male - all of which were being hand-cuffed because the stolen items were found on them, and one took off running. I think I would have been suspicious of tall Asian males casing houses if tall Asian males were robbing them all month - anyone would that cared about their property. JMO

http://www.documentcloud.org/documents/329597-sanford-burglary-reports.html

https://s3.amazonaws.com/s3.documentcloud.org/documents/327330/george-zimmerrman-911-call-history.pdf
[/QUOTE]
<respectfully snipped>

 

[songline]

Most of the guys my husband hangs out with have their concealed permits and I would guess most are carrying 80% of the time. Myself and most of the other wives got their permits just to avoid something happening like swapping vehicles with my spouse and not realizing I have a concealed weapon in the vehicle.

WOW and how about the kids...
they can get their hands in a glove compartment and be curious...
I am a city girl&#8230;. Don&#8217;t mind me.
I always say if you don&#8217;t carry, you won&#8217;t have to use it.

 

[jaded cat]

If TM wanted to evade GZ he easily could have done so imo. That's why I think he wasn't worried about a gun. In fact I think TM was outraged that GZ was following him and that's why he attacked him.

How does someone who doesn't live there easily evade someone following them? There are millions of complexes like that all over this country and sometimes people who live in them can get lost. I was house sitting for a friend when I lived in Texas and she gave me the keys to her condo. One night, not paying attention, I went to the wrong block of condos and tried to unlock the door. The home owner was unamused but very understanding when all the facts came out. I KNEW where she lived, the block and house number and I still made a mistake. Thank heavens I wasn't shot, as well I could have been in that situation. Most states allow a home owner to blast the crap out of anybody breaking into their home.

I'm a little confused about how TM can be held up to a higher standard of behaviour than an man 11 years his senior, who lived in the complex and had the rules about NW explained to him.

:moo: I'll say it again!

 

[csziggy]

Personally I think both he and Zimmerman possibly stereotyped one another.

I'm curious - how do you think TM stereotyped GZ? I'd really like to know. :waitasec:

 

[Boytwnmom]

which were made clear to HOA members at the presntation that was made to them by Wendy Dorval, the volunteer coordinator for the Sanford police. This is also why the HOA is at great peril in a lawsuit especially if they knew or should have known that GZ routinely patrolled, carried a guy and/or confronted people he deemed suspicious.

In every presentation, “I go through what the rules and responsibilities are,” she said Thursday. The volunteers’ role, she said, is “being the eyes and ears” for the police, “not the vigilante.” Members of a neighborhood watch “are not supposed to confront anyone,” she said. “We get paid to get into harm’s way. You don’t do that. You just call them from the safety of your home or your vehicle.”

Using a gun in the neighborhood watch role would be out of the question, she said in an interview.

Mr. Zimmerman was there, she recalled, and the local group appointed him their coordinator.

http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/23/us/trayvon-martin-death-spotlights-neighborhood-watch-groups.html?_r=1

Everyone who has spoken for NW and other law enforcement volunteer groups clearly state that no weapons are allowed.

Law-enforcement authorities instruct neighborhood watches, and even sanctioned volunteer programs such as Citizens on Patrol (COP), to never approach or pursue someone, but rather to call 911 - and to never use a weapon.
The sheriff's office has more than 3,000 COP volunteers. Many wear uniforms and drive marked sheriff's cruisers. But they do not carry weapons and are instructed not to confront people but to be their "eyes and ears," spokeswoman Teri Barbera said.
Said Officer Ellen Lovejoy, spokeswoman for Palm Beach Gardens police: "We always tell people not to confront. Not just neighborhood watch groups. Everyone. To call the police department."
"There should have been no confrontation whatsoever. Make your phone call. Stand aside," Chris Tutko, director of Neighborhood Watch for the National Sheriff's Association, said from Alexandria, Va.....

When the Retreat at Twin Lakes community told Sanford police it wanted to start a neighborhood watch, city volunteer program coordinator Wendy Dorival spoke to them in September 2011.
Her PowerPoint presentation, and a neighborhood watch manual the city makes available, both make clear: Don't confront.
"The philosophy is, 'No weapons. Don't confront. Call the police,' " Dorival said Wednesday.

DO NOT CONFRONT!
Excerpts from Neighborhood Watch manuals:
"What you will not do is get physically involved with any activity you report or apprehension of any suspicious persons. This is the job of the law enforcement agency." -- City of Sanford (where Trayvon Martin slaying occurred)
"Neighborhood Watch is an observe and report type of program. Neighborhood Watch members are encouraged not to stop and question people, but to observe and report their observations to the Sheriff's Office and a trained officer will respond and investigate the incident." -- Palm Beach County Sheriff's Office
"It should be emphasized to members that they do not possess police powers and they shall not carry weapons or pursue vehicles. They should also be cautioned to alert police or deputies when encountering strange activity. Members should never confront suspicious persons who could be armed and dangerous." -- National Sheriff's Association


Read more: http://www.wptv.com/dpp/news/region...-warn-neighborhood-watch-groups#ixzz1rbHystHS

Where did that information come from? It's not against Home Owner Assn rules to carry a gun, I don't think. I don't even think it's againt Crime Watch rules - surely a LOT of crime watch captains have CWPs. I would think a great number of them.

 

[grammieto5]

So GZ is asking the public to help with his living expenses? Why can't he work?

 

[vlpate]

So if kids believe GZ's side of this it means they are prejudiced? Just honestly curious, not trying to be sarcastic.

IMO, they don't watch the news.

 

[vlpate]

So GZ is asking the public to help with his living expenses? Why can't he work?

Death threats? Why can't TM's parents work? They have gotten tens of thousands for their expenses. Crump took their case pro-bono.

 

[impatientredhead]

WOW and how about the kids...
they can get their hands in a glove compartment and be curious...
I am a city girl…. Don’t mind me.
I always say if you don’t carry, you won’t have to use it.

I don't have kids but I don't know anyone that keeps their gun in their glove box either. They are usually holstered or there is a lockable compartment under the drivers seat type of a thing. A license to carry still requires you to maintain safe control of your weapon.

 

[TonyGatto]

If they were attacked by the person they followed, it was self defense.

You're right -- that's the law. Which is why carrying a concealed weapon should not even be permitted.

 

[impatientredhead]

which were made clear to HOA members at the presntation that was made to them by Wendy Dorval, the volunteer coordinator for the Sanford police. This is also why the HOA is at great peril in a lawsuit especially if they knew or should have known that GZ routinely patrolled, carried a guy and/or confronted people he deemed suspicious.



http://www.nytimes.com/2012/03/23/us/trayvon-martin-death-spotlights-neighborhood-watch-groups.html?_r=1

Everyone who has spoken for NW and other law enforcement volunteer groups clearly state that no weapons are allowed.

Whether you can carry while on watch is determined by each county. He was legally carrying in this case.

 

[TonyGatto]

I believe we are going to have an arrest soon. Real soon. Like tomorrow.

 

[atthelake]

I am coming on this thread (well, a previous one!) and trying to scan through the posts to address the SA pulling the grand jury. I"m not seeing it with scanning though. Have subthreads been created yet? TIA. I do understand that there are not enough mods on this website for discussions..........jeez, I really wish to stay here vs. wandering to another URL.

WOO and other mods that I know from another Florida case - is the downstairs chat room busy with folks that you can link to.........as this thread is just too busy/long for me and I'm now searching elsewhere to keep up. Y'all are FABULOUS!!!!!!!! but I need to talk on items of interest and no threads being taken out (I DO UNDERSTAND y'all are overwhelmed, but want to DISCUSS yet cannot on this thread which moves so fast and doesn't keep on a topic)

TIA..........

..........lurking in chat for those who were there for the FCA case.........Paninini...........wake up!

 

[mercuriod]

NWP is watch only but they are told no guns. The Civil Patrol cannot carry weapons when patroling only radios. The HOA does not have security so there is no need to tell someone to not carry a gun. They have a gate and a camera. I'll bet you someone is burning the midnight oil tonight rewriting those rules and including about walking within the common areas carrying a concealed weapon. I wonder if GZ wore his gun to the pool????? jmo

BBM: Oh, dear lord I don't even want to think about where he concealed it if he did wear it to the pool. :sick: :hills:

 

[ynotdivein]

Bumping this post... :seeya:

Anyone wishing to discuss the demonstrations, political, religious or racial aspects of the Trayvon Martin case, please check out our new forum in the Private Area of Websleuths, called SOUND OFF.

Warning: Be sure to read the Required Reading thread.

Trayvon Martin Sound Off

 

[LambChop]

Death threats? Why can't TM's parents work? They have gotten tens of thousands for their expenses. Crump took their case pro-bono.

I must have missed that bulletin. Do you have a link for the money???? jmo

 

[jaded cat]

Death threats? Why can't TM's parents work? They have gotten tens of thousands for their expenses. Crump took their case pro-bono.

Please let's not head into that territory. That way lies danger for all of us. It would be normal for any employer to give an employee time off for the death of family member, especially a child. Both TM's parents do work, I can only imagine they're are leave.

Crump took the case pro bono for the ability to make a name for himself with another high profile case. I doubt TM's parents have a lot of money. Why shouldn't they avail themselves of a high profile attorney who might be able to get them some semblance of justice in the death of their son?

:moo:

 

[LambChop]

BBM: Oh, dear lord I don't even want to think about where he concealed it if he did wear it to the pool. :sick: :hills:

I was thinking "zip-lock" bag???? jmo

 

[kimpage]

I cant believe the bashing of TM's parents it is sad...They have shown nothing but class...:moo::moo::moo::moo: