17 y/o Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #20

[vlpate]

You can't trick me into another political thread in the basement.

Last time I was in one of those, vlpate was bashin my head on the floor and JeannaT had me in a figure 4 leg lock!:floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

:floorlaugh::truce::razz:
That's hilarious. Thank you for not shooting me!!

 

[flourish]

Before I posted something I'd be sorry for, I went to find the rules and guidelines we received from the PD when we became involved in our NW group. It was 7 years ago so I had to dig around a little.

We are specifically told NOT to arm ourselves and pursue the suspect. We can be charged with a felony if we do so and someone is injured due to our actions. Oregon is also a SYG state. You don't get to go and and play Rootin' Tootin' Ranger cuz somebody is wandering around your neighborhood and you don't know them.

I've stated before I live in a boring neighborhood, on a boring street and nothing exciting has ever happened here. My husband owns 2 pistols and 1 shotgun. None of those weapons has been moved since we got here 13 years ago. Most people aren't carrying weapons with the expectation of using them and a NW person most certainly should not. However much they want to, this case proves why that's a bad idea. I sure don't want the elderly couple living behind us, who call about the kids playing and the noisy garbage trucks!, having a gun and threatening to use it.

RBBM
Rootin' tootin' ranger :floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

Oh lovely...I did not know I lived in a SYG state. I don't even understand why this law even exists in the first place, because I would think self-defense would cover it...I dunno...

anyway, I love Oregon and its generally liberal stance on things :rocker:

Do you happen to know when the SYG law was passed here, jaded cat, or anyone? I suppose I can just google it...okay, so it looks like it's not technically a SYG law but a Castle one...perhaps a special, enhanced Castle version? Hm. http://kezi.com/news/local/242695

Although Oregon does not have a so-called "Stand Your Ground" law, criminal defense attorney John Henry Hingson says what is on our books is very similar.

Moving on...

I've been lurking lately and not posting...partly to keep myself in check...and partly because the threads move so dang fast it seems pointless to respond to something on page 1 when by the time I get home from work we're up to page 30, ya know?

But here are my general thoughts as of this moment:

• I stand by an earlier statement I made, which is that IMHO GZ should have stayed in the car--no one was in mortal danger from the situation until he stepped out of his car.
• I'm pleased at the lack of violent rioting and mayhem thus far. Yes, yes a Wag's was trashed by some kids, but as far as I know, everything has generally altogether been pretty peaceful, yeah?
• That road sign is just abhorrent, and the culprit behind it is, IMHO, a shameless bigoted coward...probably goes without saying, but I'm saying it anyway...
• I hope we get news this week! Regardless of what the news is, I know I'm ready to hear it! How 'bout you all? I will admittedly be upset if there is no arrest and no reasonable explanation made...I don't know what explanation I would deem "reasonable" enough for me...I suppose it's one of those "have to see it to know it" kinda things? Anyway, here's hoping for this week! [crossing fingers]
• Oh yeah, and I am too curious for my own good, so I did attempt to view GZ's alleged new site, but it timed out. Shucks. :giggle:
• Oh one more thing, I'm really happy the stuff about Shaken Baby Syndrome dissipated quickly, because my baby boy, who should be 17 like Trayvon, was shaken by his father, and died as a result. This case is difficult enough as it is, but if it continued down that route, I was gonna have to go take a literal chill pill and be done with the case. I really hope it doesn't come up again. lease:

On that note, back to trying to catch up.

 

[songline]

I don't have kids but I don't know anyone that keeps their gun in their glove box either. They are usually holstered or there is a lockable compartment under the drivers seat type of a thing. A license to carry still requires you to maintain safe control of your weapon.

:floorlaugh:I guess I watched to many gangsta movies..LOL

 

[atthelake]

RBBM
Rootin' tootin' ranger :floorlaugh::floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

Oh lovely...I did not know I lived in a SYG state. I don't even understand why this law even exists in the first place, because I would think self-defense would cover it...I dunno...

anyway, I love Oregon and its generally liberal stance on things :rocker:

Do you happen to know when the SYG law was passed here, jaded cat, or anyone? I suppose I can just google it...okay, so it looks like it's not technically a SYG law but a Castle one...perhaps a special, enhanced Castle version? Hm. http://kezi.com/news/local/242695
Moving on...

I've been lurking lately and not posting...partly to keep myself in check...and partly because the threads move so dang fast it seems pointless to respond to something on page 1 when by the time I get home from work we're up to page 30, ya know?

But here are my general thoughts as of this moment:

• I stand by an earlier statement I made, which is that IMHO GZ should have stayed in the car--no one was in mortal danger from the situation until he stepped out of his car.
• I'm pleased at the lack of violent rioting and mayhem thus far. Yes, yes a Wag's was trashed by some kids, but as far as I know, everything has generally altogether been pretty peaceful, yeah?
• That road sign is just abhorrent, and the culprit behind it is, IMHO, a shameless bigoted coward...probably goes without saying, but I'm saying it anyway...
• I hope we get news this week! Regardless of what the news is, I know I'm ready to hear it! How 'bout you all? I will admittedly be upset if there is no arrest and no reasonable explanation made...I don't know what explanation I would deem "reasonable" enough for me...I suppose it's one of those "have to see it to know it" kinda things? Anyway, here's hoping for this week! [crossing fingers]
• Oh yeah, and I am too curious for my own good, so I did attempt to view GZ's alleged new site, but it timed out. Shucks. :giggle:
• Oh one more thing, I'm really happy the stuff about Shaken Baby Syndrome dissipated quickly, because my baby boy, who should be 17 like Trayvon, was shaken by his father, and died as a result. This case is difficult enough as it is, but if it continued down that route, I was gonna have to go take a literal chill pill and be done with the case. I really hope it doesn't come up again. lease:

On that note, back to trying to catch up.

I'm now caught up with skipping though....and don't see a discussion of the SA dropping the Grand Jury........... :waitasec: .....to comment on.

 

[kimpage]

I hope that this never happens to me, but I feel that both families have lost something here. The Martins have lost their son forever and the Zimmermans have lost the function of the family. Neither one will ever be the same again, and that is sad.

Respectfully Yes but TM's parents did not ask for this to happen..GZ has no one to blame but himself,he should of stayed in the car.....IMHO JMHO and all that

 

[Chris_Texas]

So if kids believe GZ's side of this it means they are prejudiced? Just honestly curious, not trying to be sarcastic.

It's certainly a possibility. In my opinion, an unbiased and objective evaluation of this case might leave open the possibility that it was actually self defense rather than murder, and result in a desire to withold judgement until more information is available, but that is a far cry from assuming that this possibility is a reality.

In other words, there is a difference between A. having doubts about Zimmerman's guilt; B. Concluding that Trayvin is the guilty party. Let's look deeper.

There is ZERO evidence at this time that Zimmerman suffered injuries that would result in a reasonable and rational person deciding that killing the other guy was the only choice. There is ONLY Zimmerman's claim, and that is meaningless at this time.

On the other side of the coin we have at least the following:

1. Zimmerman's lack of known significant injuries
2. Zimmerman's aggressive and racist comments
3. Zimmerman's scripted (and implausible) description of the subject
3. Zimmerman's pursuit of the victim
4. Zimmerman's refusal to follow the advice of LE
5. Zimmerman's deliberate deception of LE
6. Zimmerman's apparent choice to cut-off TM's route of escape.
7. Zimmerman's own statement that TM was attempting to flee the confrontation
8. Two expert witnesses identifying the pleading voice as belonging to the victim
9. TM's mother identifying the voice as belonging to her son
10. Zimmerman's conduct after the shooting
11. Zimmerman's history of violence, including assault on a police officer
12. Statements from Zimmerman's NW partner, describing in glowing terms Zimmerman's aggressive crime-fighter attitude
13. Statement's from Zimmerman's friends and family that do not match known facts in the case.

I could go on, but no need.

 

[kimpage]

Trayvon and his parents are victims.No doubt about that.So accusing them of getting money (with no link provided,which has been asked for,but that gets ignored) and basically not caring about their son is abhorent...And i for one have never bashed GZ which i could but i wont stoop to that level...:moo::moo::moo: So with that i am heading to bed before i post something i shouldnt... Nite all see you tomorrow!:seeya:

 

[legalmania]

Respectfully Yes but TM's parents did not ask for this to happen..GZ has no one to blame but himself,he should of stayed in the car.....IMHO JMHO and all that

This is just one of the facts the Special Prosecutor will have to decide. It will be interesting to see how she rules. The Martin family seems to be happy that it is being handled this way.

 

[vlpate]

You really think the media wouldn't carry sensational stories like this because they care about the welfare of society -- not promoting vigilantism? They'll report anything as long as it gets ratings -- they're not that restrained. The fact is that these types of self-defense shootings just don't happen that often. Women don't shoot their rapists -- they barely report the rapes. These self-defense shootings are usually done by gun enthusiasts, just itchin to set up a situation where they can use their firearm -- such as the case of GZ.

I know that used to be the case (self-defense, home invasions, etc). The examples I mentioned happen all the time, much more often that I hear about but read online or see on youtube. I won't debate the point because it's been years since I had this conversation with someone who would know, however, suicides are still pretty much taboo unless the story is unusual in nature.

I can't even begin to address the rest of this post. Thanks for your opinion though

 

[Isabelle]

I was watching the nightly news and saw she even took the time, and invited the Martin family inside to explain what this meant and I would guess to answer any questions they may have.

I am glad the Martin family is being treated with respect. Certainly at this time in their life it means a lot to them!

 

[legalmania]

I am glad the Martin family is being treated with respect. Certainly at this time in their life it means a lot to them!

Yes I've heard Mr. Martin talk and he seems like a nice guy and has said several times there are no winners here. The Special Prosecutor is definitely showing compassion toward the Martin family and I'm sure she will do the same with the Zimmermans.

 

[Isabelle]

So GZ is asking the public to help with his living expenses? Why can't he work?

Skeered!?

 

[Isabelle]

Well, this part sure clears it up...not:

The unlawful killing of a human being, when perpetrated by any act imminently dangerous to another and evincing a depraved mind regardless of human life, although without any premeditated design to effect the death of any particular individual, is murder in the second degree and constitutes a felony of the first degree,

:waitasec:

I got dizzy just reading that!

 

[jaded cat]

This is just one of the facts the Special Prosecutor will have to decide. It will be interesting to see how she rules. The Martin family seems to be happy that it is being handled this way.

And in the end, that's more important than anything else about this case. If there is no arrest, I hope the SProsecutor will be able to explain that in a way that gives them peace. If there is an arrest, I hope TM's parents will urge restraint from their supporters. I think a lot of ordinary people, the media and maybe LE itself will look to them for their reaction and their statements after the decision is handed down. Frankly, as painful as it would be for his mother or father, I hope they will say something instead of their lawyer.

I doubt they'll read this but - :angel:

Taken too soon
Not soon forgotten
The Lord hath brought them home
Find peace in the arms of the Lord

 

[legalmania]

Skeered!?

He has to have a lot on his mind and can't be of sound mind to work right now. He doesn't know his future, will he be under arrest next week? If he is found in the right, he will probably have to move to another state and start over.

 

[Isabelle]

Death threats? Why can't TM's parents work? They have gotten tens of thousands for their expenses. Crump took their case pro-bono.

Where did you get the info that the Martin's got tens of thousands for expenses?

 

[Isabelle]

You're right -- that's the law. Which is why carrying a concealed weapon should not even be permitted.

I agree. When the Baton Rouge Serial Killer was on the loose, I wanted to carry my gun freely visible in a holster - kind of like Annie Oakley! For a while I carried a can of Aqua Net Hair Spray as a weapon, since pepper spray was not in stock anywhere.

 

[legalmania]

Where did you get the info that the Martin's got tens of thousands for expenses?

That question has been asked a couple of times with no response, so for now we have to either believe it or not.

 

[Isabelle]

Grief? Shock?

It's way too difficult to describe to one that hasn't experienced the loss of a child. It's difficult, if not impossible to concentrate on minor things, much less a job, for longer than a few minutes. Difficulty eating, sleeping. taking care of everyday duties. Physical illness. The list is endless. May I suggest reading up on the subject? A good place to start with be with the works of Elizabeth Kubler-Ross. I pray you never have to experience it firsthand.

To know, is to be.

 

[Isabelle]

in speedo's................:what:

Passion the visual is just about all I can handle right now!