17-yo Teen Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #6

[SuziQ]

God, I would hate for you all to see my 17-year-old nieces mean-muggin' faces on her facebook page? I'm glad that classifies her as a bad kid? I'll have to call her mother.

ITA. I love his grills.

 

[Donjeta]

He had every reason to fear for his life according to the witness and police reports. He was beaten and at one point Trayvon was on top of him during the fight. Plus, if TM wanted to escape, couldn't he outrun the husky GZ? I believe TM jumped GZ as he and the police have claimed. It makes the most sense.

It's a little more difficult to outrun a bullet from a husky man's gun.

 

[Inabsentia]

i just don't understand why the media is only distributing pictures of trayvon at 12yrs old. The picture's i've seen, show tats, gold teeth, and completely different image than what is being fed to us thru the media.
:

Zimmerman "had tats" too. So what? Now tattoos (which were covered by clothing on both parties) and dental work mean something sinister?
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/os-trayvon-martin-george-zimmerman-job-20120323,0,7163107.story

 

[gxm]

Because when he seen the gun his reaction was the pushing and struggling she heard? Do you think he had time to tell his girlfriend... Yo, he's got a gun? No, he reacted! Like every normal person would when confronted by a man with a gun who had been following them.

I would never confront anyone with a gun. My reaction would be to duck, or start running, or pee myself. One of three or all three and not necessarily in that order. But confront, push, or struggle for it? Nope.

 

[m00c0w]

Zimmerman "had tats" too. So what? Now tattoos (which were covered by clothing on both parties) and dental work mean something sinister?
http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/os-trayvon-martin-george-zimmerman-job-20120323,0,7163107.story

It all goes to pointing towards that individual being a player in a certain lifestyle choice, yes. Whether it's relevant or not is unclear.

 

[LolaMoon08]

No, I didn't mean to his girlfriend. I mean to Zimmerman. "Hey, man, WTF?!" "Dude, WTF?!" "Don't shoot!" "Why do you have a gun?!" "WTF?!"

I know I wouldn't say nothing when surprised by something with that magnitude.

So Trayvon has to react how you, an experienced gun owner, would react? Why can't he just have done what his instincts told him to do? Try to get the gun away from a mad man?

 

[mikeysmommom]

:goodpost:

Bless you, this is how I feel as well. I feel this so easily could have ended without a dead teen and a national furor with racial overtones. Except there was a gun there and a law which seems to allow for too much latitude.

Thank you.

ETA I believe this is why the Official neighborhood watch program instructs their members NOT to follow and NOT to engage. I am pretty sure they discourage watchers from carrying weapons as well. Why? IMO so that situations exactly like this one can be avoided at all costs.

GZ was going to the grocery store he was aware of crime so he was carrying his gun.When he saw TM and got suspicious so IMO he was not in his role as neighborhood watch.It would seem IMO he was a citizen who has a permit to carry and was exercising his right to have his gun on him.He was going on an errand to the store not patrolling on his watch.

 

[m00c0w]

So Trayvon has to react how you, an experienced gun owner, would react? Why can't he just have done what his instincts told him to do? Try to get the gun away from a mad man?

Being a gun owner has little to do with being surprised by a man with a gun.

 

[OrdinaryLife]

But if that person is viciously attacking you, you can, under the law, defend yourself whether you like how they look or not.

Sadly, Trayvon may have believed *he* was a victim (given the circumstances of being followed by a total stranger in a car and backed up by Zimmerman's own cell phone call to 911) of and attacked Zimmerman in self defense.

Where is his voice to be heard? Zimmerman provoked Trayvon. Was this the outcome Zimmerman ever thought was possible? No, I doubt that sincerely. However, Zimmerman made a very conscience decision to track Trayvon. He is completely responsible for how it ended.

imvho

 

[LolaMoon08]

I would never confront anyone with a gun. My reaction would be to duck, or start running, or pee myself. One of three or all three and not necessarily in that order. But confront, push, or struggle for it? Nope.

Have you ever been in that situation? Do you think Trayvon should have run again? He had already run away once? He should take the chance to get shot in the back? You don't think Zimmerman would have chased after him anyways? If Trayvon would have peed himself, Zimmerman would have called 911 for Trayvon urinating in public.

 

[mikeysmommom]

So Trayvon has to react how you, an experienced gun owner, would react? Why can't he just have done what his instincts told him to do? Try to get the gun away from a mad man?

Trying to take away an armed mans gun IMO is never a smart idea.Dooley vs James where a black man brought his gun to a park and killed a white man supposedly happened when Mr.James saw the mans gun and jumped him.He was killed one shot to the heart.

 

[tlcya]

FWIW, I believe that GZ may well have had the injuries as described in police reports. My concern is with how he portrays he received them. I will never believe TM jumped GZ from behind. I just don't see it based on anything I have seen or heard thus far.

I believe that any injuries that GZ suffered ocurred in a scuffle that was initiated when GZ tried to physicall restrain TM.

GZ followed TM. TM was aware and concerned about being followed by this unkown adult male. TM says "why are you following me?" or "whats your problem" or whatever he says. All perfectly logical and not unexpected behavior IMO.

GZ, already convinced this [insert A word used in conversation with dispatcher] was up to no good and going to get away like always, attempts to restrain TM til LE (already on the way) arrives.

TM is now being physically threatened by GZ (in TM's perception) and twists, pulling away. Scuffle ensues. At some point, both GZ and TM are convinced this is now a fight for their lives.

Turns out GZ could not have been more wrong. TM was DEAD right.

Tragic.

 

[rossva]

Link? Fact or your opinion?

Lots and lots of drunk people call 911.

 

[ohiogirl]

The weapon was recovered with an empty chamber and a fully loaded magazine. This implies that the weapon's slide did not fully blow back, most likely because something retarded its movement. The slide went back far enough to eject the casing, but not to actually catch the next round from the magazine and load it into the chamber.

That would lead me to believe that the gun went off during a struggle.
The reason that GZ had the gun and was following this person with his gun, is what has most people upset, imo.
He should have left the gun in the vehicle, he should have stayed in the vehicle, these actions, to me, show that GZ was looking for an altercation and he got it. That makes it his fault, imo.

 

[Dr.Fessel]

The weapon was recovered with an empty chamber and a fully loaded magazine. This implies that the weapon's slide did not fully blow back, most likely because something retarded its movement. The slide went back far enough to eject the casing, but not to actually catch the next round from the magazine and load it into the chamber.

I wonder if it could have been Zimmerman's nose that obstructed it from going back all the way?

 

[Horace Finklestein]

But once GZ stated on the 911 call Trayvon was black, shortly thereafter GZ exited his vehicle and went after Trayvon. IMO in a court of law this is going to work against GZ, and rightly so.

The law does not allow a citizen to chase down another citizen and then shoot them dead because you don't like the way they look.

jmo

Yeah...and that's not what happened here, at all. Not even close. GZ was defending himself after TM punched him and smashed his head against a sidewalk. I don't think the police had any reason to lie or cover for GZ. Witnesses corroborate this in several stories.

 

[SuziQ]

Is there anything to back up the allegations of racism other than one event that occurred several years ago, that I believe was under a different administration? I'm curious as to where this keeps coming from.

Below is one article stating the problem has been going on ten years. There are others in the MSM that state that Chief Lee was hired to clean up a problematic and racist dept.

http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/03/23/2709222/history-of-racial-tension-for.html

(snip)
The furor over the failure to charge a neighborhood watch captain for shooting Trayvon Martin to death is the latest episode to inflame racial tensions that have simmered between police and blacks in this Orlando suburb for years. And on Thursday, the department's chief temporarily stepped aside.
Stanford City Manager Norton Bonaparte Jr. acknowledged the problems on Friday.
"The issues that have been brought to my attention regarding the black community and the Sanford police department go back 10 years," he said. "There's a lot of work that needs to be done there."
Bonaparte noted Police Chief Bill Lee Jr. took over the department less than a year ago and said he had made improvements but added, "Certainly that has changed as of right now in terms of the relationship between the black community and the Sanford police department."
Turner Clayton Jr., president of the Seminole County's NAACP, agreed.
"There is no trust," he said. "There is no confidence."

Read more here: http://www.miamiherald.com/2012/03/23/2709222/history-of-racial-tension-for.html#storylink=cpy​

 

[LolaMoon08]

Call 911 did Trayvon do this?

Do you honestly believe that Zimmerman was going to allow Trayvon to reach in his pocket (I think he had earbuds in his ears?) and call 911? Do you honestly believe at that moment that Zimmerman was going to allow Trayvon to do anything? He had the gun! He had the power!

 

[Kimster]

Link? Fact or your opinion?

This wasn't necessary. Let's have a more constructive discussion please.

 

[mikeysmommom]

Sadly, Trayvon may have believed *he* was a victim (given the circumstances of being followed by a total stranger in a car and backed up by Zimmerman's own cell phone call to 911) of and attacked Zimmerman in self defense.

Where is his voice to be heard? Zimmerman provoked Trayvon. Was this the outcome Zimmerman ever thought was possible? No, I doubt that sincerely. However, Zimmerman made a very conscience decision to track Trayvon. He is completely responsible for how it ended.

imvho

IMO If TM felt he was in danger from GZ following him,why didn't he hang up with his girlfriend and call 911?