17-yo Teen Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #7

[vlpate]

Zimmerman gets out of his car aproximately 2 minutes into the call. you can hear the ding ding ding and the door slam. Then approximately 13 seconds after 911 says stop following then he immediately says okay. It should only take 14 seconds to get back to vehicle and the call goes on to 4:05. he also nixes the mailbox car meeting place and says the cops will have to find out his new location, call him back, because he doesn't know where it will be yet.

Zimmerman said it was a cut-through street and he didn't know the name of it. This is what makes me believe he might have been looking for a street sign so that when LE called him back, he would know what to tell them.

 

[Emeralgem]

Goodness gracious... I'm seriously dizzy from all the spin...JMHO

 

[LambChop]

I just turned it on to see - first thing, one story she heard was Zimmerman was dragged out of his car.

*click*

Sorry, just can't watch.

I know. She's really pretty bad. I can't watch her anymore she makes me crazed. lol

 

[csziggy]

I hadnt read this before, about going a back way to 711. Do you have a link? Tia

If you use Google Street view for 1960 Oregon Avenue, Sanford, FL you can see where the brick wall ends and a row of mutilated crape myrtles screens that side of the subdivision from the main street.
[ame="http://maps.google.com/maps?q=1960+Oregon+Avenue,+Sanford,+FL&oe=utf-8&client=firefox-a&hnear=1960+Oregon+Ave,+Sanford,+Florida+32771&gl=us&t=m&z=16"]1960 Oregon Avenue, Sanford, FL - Google Maps[/ame]

It really would not be a shortcut though, it would just let someone walk less distance along the main road and be able to walk along the presumably quieter subdivision streets.

Because of the lakes behind the various subdivisions, there is really no shortcut from where Trayvon was staying and the 7-Eleven.

 

[Wise Old Owl]

The two lady witnesses who were on tv said when they looked out Zimmerman was knelt down on the body with his knees on each side of the body and his hands on Martin's back. They said they yelled at him several times and he just looked at them then said call he cops.



What was he doing?

IDK - checking pockets? :waitasec:

I don't know what to think of those two and that account. Wonder if they saw the gun? It had just happened - did GZ have time to re-holster it by then? Or was he still holding it?


ETA: I wanted to add that IF this account is accurate and GZ was on top of Trayvon - that maybe he (GZ) was checking to see if Trayvon actually had a weapon. Or maybe he was thinking about trying to plant the weapon on Trayvon - which would NOT have worked - IDK. I do believe that GZ checked Trayvon's pockets after he shot him though.

JMHO

 

[m00c0w]

As far as I understand it, self-defense is normally an affirmative defense (such as the person accused has to prove they are acting in self-defense) but "stand your ground" laws shift burden of proof onto the prosecution.

The burden of proof is on the prosecution to prove that the defendant committed a crime, just as it always is, and self defense is still an affirmative defense. The difference is that before, the use of force itself could be used as probable cause to arrest and charge the individual. Now, the use of force has to be accompanied by probable cause to believe the use of force was unlawful. The police aren't kept from conducting an investigation as they normally would.

 

[jjenny]

IDK - checking pockets? :waitasec:

I don't know what to think of those two and that account. Wonder if they saw the gun? It had just happened - did GZ have time to re-holster it by then? Or was he still holding it?


JMHO

As I recall in her first interview Mary C said she did not see a gun. I didn't see any of her later interviews.

 

[m00c0w]

The two lady witnesses who were on tv said when they looked out Zimmerman was knelt down on the body with his knees on each side of the body and his hands on Martin's back. They said they yelled at him several times and he just looked at them then said call he cops.



What was he doing?

They've said he was both standing and kneeling in various reports. Their story is really bizarre.

 

[Sensei]

The two lady witnesses who were on tv said when they looked out Zimmerman was knelt down on the body with his knees on each side of the body and his hands on Martin's back. They said they yelled at him several times and he just looked at them then said call he cops.



What was he doing?

I have no idea what he WAS doing, but he wasn't attempting to render first aid. Maybe he was searching for a weapon, or even attempting to subdue him somehow (sounds stupid even when I type it) but that is really all I can think of that he might be doing.

 

[LambChop]

If you use Google Street view for 1960 Oregon Avenue, Sanford, FL you can see where the brick wall ends and a row of mutilated crape myrtles screens that side of the subdivision from the main street.
1960 Oregon Avenue, Sanford, FL - Google Maps

It really would not be a shortcut though, it would just let someone walk less distance along the main road and be able to walk along the presumably quieter subdivision streets.

Because of the lakes behind the various subdivisions, there is really no shortcut from where Trayvon was staying and the 7-Eleven.

Plus if you zoom in near the ponds/lake it looks pretty swampy back there. Not a good place to be going at 7pm at night..

 

[rotterdam]

I really don't know. He could have had his jacket off before the fight ever started and put it on after the shooting.

But a hoodie isn't a shirt, it's not something that would be that confusing.

I'm curious what he was wearing under his jacket.


JMHO

The police report mentioned red jacket and wet on back with grass. Artificial lights, especially if they had the yellow ones can really distort colors though

 

[Sensei]

They've said he was both standing and kneeling in various reports. Their story is really bizarre.

maybe I was injecting things, but I thought that she said that at first he was kneeling astraddle TM's body with his hands on his back and then stood up and began pacing while putting his hands over the back of his head in the "What the Heck have I done" type position and she said she had to speak to him 3 times before he said," call 911" so I did not find that bizarre, perhaps I just presumed movement ....

 

[Storm]

Zimmerman gets out of his car aproximately 2 minutes into the call. you can hear the ding ding ding and the door slam. Then approximately 13 seconds after 911 says stop following then he immediately says okay. It should only take 14 seconds to get back to vehicle and the call goes on to 4:05. he also nixes the mailbox car meeting place and says the cops will have to find out his new location, call him back, because he doesn't know where it will be yet.

I am not understanding what all the discussion is about..it's simple..a 28 yr old armed man got out of his truck...as a consequence, a teen was killed with that weapon. Simple..the adult had the weapon and was the aggressor.
I challenge anyone to take a walk and not look around as you walk...it's a normal thing to do..what was he supposed to do..keep his eyes straight ahead the entire time? Of course he's looking around.it's a boring long walk. They never insinuated he was looking in windows etc...this is nuts..an adult chose to leave his vehicle and find the "suspicious" teen. What do you think GZ had on his mind when he made that choice? Stop the teen?
Why stop him? He's just walking! Wake up folks...it's simple..if GZ had stayed in is car and let the teen walk to his home..nothing happens...^i^

 

[LambChop]

As I recall in her first interview Mary C said she did not see a gun. I didn't see any of her later interviews.

They said both hands were on TM back so he must have holstered his gun because it was in the holster when LE arrived. jmo

 

[iluvmua]

I have no idea what he WAS doing, but he wasn't attempting to render first aid. Maybe he was searching for a weapon, or even attempting to subdue him somehow (sounds stupid even when I type it) but that is really all I can think of that he might be doing.

Maybe he was in shock that he just shot and killed a person, just speculation.

 

[mikeysmommom]

GZ was told by the police department spokeswoman at the NWP they were only to observe, not to follow and not to carry a gun. Everything except the gun is in that manual he received. I don't have a problem understanding what LE wanted GZ to do. GZ seems to be the one who wants to control the situation. Had the dispatcher known he had a gun he would have been ordered to wait for LE to arrive. That is not speculation this is LE's worst nightmare as is quite evident since GZ decided to take the matter into his own hands. jmo

It does not matter what they told him at NWP because that was when he was on his watch.When he went to go out he was just like anyone else he had a right to have his gun in his holster.

 

[francie]

Zimmerman did not have on a white t-shirt. Police described him wearing red jacket.

I hadn't seen anything about GZ in a red jacket, do you have a link? Thanks.

But I believe the witness on 911, apparently police took no crime scene photos, didn’t look for blood/skin/tissue on sidewalk where his head was supposedly banged, didn’t take shooter’s clothes, didn’t test shooter for drugs/booze, immediately accepted GZ's version of events despite unarmed dead victim, etc, jmo. If they did complete these investigative tasks I think they'd release the findings to show GZ wasn't at fault as they claim. jmo.

 

[m00c0w]

Two women who live nearby have said they heard someone in distress, and then a gunshot. Mary Cutcher and her roommate, Selma Mora Lamilla, said Monday they ran to about 10 feet from where Martin's body lay.
"(Zimmerman) was standing over the body, basically straddling the body with his hand on Trayvon's back," Cutcher said, adding that they called three times to him before he finally asked them to call police. "It didn't seem to me that he was trying to help him in any way."

http://www.cnn.com/2012/03/27/justice/florida-teen-shooting/index.html
BBM

“So you saw Mr. Zimmerman on top of Trayvon Martin?” Cooper questioned.

“Trayvon, exactly,” Lamilla said.

“When you say on top of, how so?” the CNN anchor pressed.

“Straddling him,” Cutcher replied.

“His legs were straddling him?” Cooper followed up.

“One on each side, on his knees, with his hands on his back. I immediately thought, okay, obviously if it’s the shooter, he would have ran,” Cutcher detailed. “I thought he’s holding the wound, helping the guy taking a pulse, making sure he’s okay. When she called to him three times, everything okay, what’s going on? Each time he looked back, didn’t say anything and then the third time he finally said, ‘just call the police.’”

http://www.mediaite.com/tv/anderson-cooper-interviews-witnesses-to-trayvon-martin-shooting/

BBM

 

[LambChop]

maybe I was injecting things, but I thought that she said that at first he was kneeling astraddle TM's body with his hands on his back and then stood up and began pacing while putting his hands over the back of his head in the "What the Heck have I done" type position and she said she had to speak to him 3 times before he said," call 911" so I did not find that bizarre, perhaps I just presumed movement ....

That is what I heard, too. jmo

 

[m00c0w]

maybe I was injecting things, but I thought that she said that at first he was kneeling astraddle TM's body with his hands on his back and then stood up and began pacing while putting his hands over the back of his head in the "What the Heck have I done" type position and she said she had to speak to him 3 times before he said," call 911" so I did not find that bizarre, perhaps I just presumed movement ....

No, I just posted what I was talking about. It's fairly clear.