17 yo Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #17

[Gin]

We are in 100% agreement here. I have always said that he should have been arrested that very night for manslaughter, while the case was further investigated.

What bothers me is the people trying to make this out to be a case like Emmet Till--or to say he was 'hunted down like a rabid dog.' It is wrong for the activists to try and create a huge racial divide here, imo.

IMO, GZ should have been arrested that night. Trayvon didn't stand a chance, and his screams do cause folks to feel indignation, sorrow, and anger. His last minutes on earth were full of terror. I am glad there are folks who are speaking out, asking where is justice?? That isn't a racial divide, that's human empathy for someone who was needlessly shot dead.
Trayvon cannot speak for himself.

 

[mercuriod]

:floorlaugh: Not a bit...just wondering if those who disagreed with him about TM being the one screaming were ready to accept that it was.

Yea, that question does have to go both ways doesn't it? :floorlaugh: :floorlaugh: :floorlaugh:

 

[frenchvixen]

CNN posted transcripts of all the 911 calls (not GZ's non-911 call, but that transcript had been posted before): http://news.blogs.cnn.com/2012/03/20/911-calls-paint-picture-of-chaos-after-florida-teen-is-shot

The call (Call 3 on the Sanford web site, the second call on the CNN transcript) that has the screaming and the shot is listed as beginning at 7:16. The gunshot is at 44 seconds into that recording according to the measurements I made with my audio software. The screaming is going on from the moment the call connects until the shot then ends instantly.

The police officers logs show that they arrived at 7:17. GZ was already standing, TM on the ground facedown with his hands under his body. The officers attempted CPR but never got a response and the EMTs (whose arrival time we don't have) declared TM dead at 7:30.

According to this timeline, 44 seconds after Trayvon's girlfriend's call was disconnected, Trayvon was dead.

IMO, JMO, etc.

How in the world will GZ explain himself when confronted with the truth? How did this so call physical attack on him happen in 44 seconds?

 

[LambChop]

I believe you are correct, frenchvixen. If we are going to believe that the experts are correct when they say it is NOT GZ screaming, then we must also believe them when they say there was no racial slur. I listened earlier to the enhanced audio from CNN and it definately sounds like he could be saying "cold" instead of the slur. I do not know how these audio clean-ups work, but I am willing to accept it as "cold". Somewhere on here, I read that on another CNN clip they are saying it is "punks". I didn't hear that clip, but have trouble buying that since there is clearly a "kuh" sound at the start of the word. I feel better believing that he said it was "cold" instead of the other word. It takes some of the ugliness of the situation away and leaves us with a tragedy that didn't have to happen. jmo

How many people say "f***in cold", instead of "it's f***in cold". I heard the kuh sound to but I thought it was coming from the f word as he was drawing it out. jmo

 

[tehcloser]

Yea, that question does have to go both ways doesn't it? :floorlaugh: :floorlaugh: :floorlaugh:

You know it really isn't funny but it is......we get so dug in around here with our thoughts that sometimes all of us get slapped out of the blue by something like that. :what: I can't very well say oh he's right about one but not the other...and peeps that thought he was the devil can't say oh he's right about this but not the screaming. He got us all.......:floorlaugh:

 

[Allusonz]

The Media is not our friend. jmo

Thank you for this!!!!

JMO IMO

 

[frenchvixen]

I agree with you except that I don't think they'll ever be able to "prove" who was screaming on the tape. IMO, every one was probably screaming (or yelling), perhaps even the witness who ran inside. IMO, all h*** was breaking loose and it was a short, ugly, and loud confrontation.

What I want to know, and I fear we'll never know, is what happened to put the gun in play. I agree that GZ should have never left his car, but I don't believe he left his car with the intention of shooting anyone. What in the world happened in those brief final moments that turned such everyday events (a teenager walking to the store, GZ keeping an eye on his neighborhood) into such a terrible tragedy.

JMO, OMO, and :moo:

GXM, those screams come from someone who is facing death. Take a guess who that was. They are gut wrenching and they are not coming from a by-stander.

 

[mikeysmommom]

http://www.freep.com/article/C4/201...led-with-conflicting-reports?odyssey=nav|head

It was the third time Trayvon Martin had been disciplined at school, so this time his parents sent him to a quiet, racially mixed gated community in Sanford, Fla., with his dad to get his priorities straight.

A T-Mobile phone log provided by the family's attorney shows Trayvon's girlfriend called him again at 7:12 p.m., just moments after they had hung up. "I think this dude is following me," Trayvon told her, according to her account.

The girl said she offered Trayvon advice: "Run!"

Trayvon did just that.

The girlfriend said she heard the two exchange questions: "Why are you following me?" and "What are you doing here?"

"While SFD was attending to Zimmerman, I overheard him state, 'I was yelling for someone to help me, but no one would help me,' " Smith wrote.

In an interview two weeks after the incident, Chief Lee, who has since stepped down from his post, said witness statements and physical evidence backed up Zimmerman's version of events. He suggested that based on the timing of the call, he believed that Trayvon went out of his way to approach the person tailing him and mouth off.

IMO That has to be addressed if GZ background is out there so should TM , getting to the truth of the matter is very important.

http://www.clickorlando.com/news/Ge...er/-/1637132/10180938/-/12bc53nz/-/index.html

Understand those people are now under incredible social pressure, they're being told there's going to be riots in the street if 'you don't give
us the justice with the conclusion we want,'" Uhrig said.

I totally agree! IMO Justice should not be tempered with,or be bullied by a mob mentality IMO GZ.IMO This is not a Racial Issue, no matter how the press and either family want to spin it.JMO

 

[vlpate]

Hold onnnnnnnnnnnnn.
If we are going to believe this expert on "punks" are we also gonna believe him on this:

While Zimmerman's lawyers may welcome Owen's analysis of their client's 911 call, they disagree with his conclusions about what is heard on another 911 recording.


Owen and another audio expert, Ed Primeau, analyzed the recording for the Sentinel using different techniques, and they said they don't believe it is Zimmerman who is heard yelling in the background of one 911 call.

http://www.cnn.com/2012/04/05/justice/florida-teen-shooting/index.html


quite the quandry.............innit?

IMO, everyone trying this case in the media has an agenda, and not one of them cares about the two people whose lives were changed forever that night. One is trying to get ratings, the other publicity for himself and his product. There is really no other reason for either to opine while FBI are doing their tests. JMO

 

[Elley Mae]

http://www.usatoday.com/news/nation/story/2012-04-05/trayvon-martin-poll/54047512/1

Blacks were more likely to think Zimmerman is guilty of a crime; 51% say he was definitely guilty and 21% say he was probably guilty. Whites were more inclined to reserve judgment; 58% say his guilt was unclear based on information currently available.


http://www.lsa.umich.edu/polisci/people/ci.hutchingsvincent_ci.detail

 

[LambChop]

How in the world will GZ explain himself when confronted with the truth? How did this so call physical attack on him happen in 44 seconds?

And if TM had gone after GZ and jumped him at the cut through path wouldn't John or Austin w/the dog have seen that because they were both walking towards that area to get to their condos? And if GZ's car was on Twin Trees the front of the homes are right there. Why would GZ have to take the cut through path to get over the Retreat View to look at a house number when the homes where his car was parked are facing the street? The house numbers would be right there. That makes no sense unless this was the only explanation he could come up with to explain how GZ ended up where he did when LE asked him to stay with the car. jmo

 

[joypath]

:banghead::banghead::banghead:


Just a thought BUT...........There should be some OTHER pieces of "official" information available to the public when/if an arrest warrant is issued.

The EMS run sheet/call log/"chart" notes and lease:lease:lease:for the sake of the SFD, the SIGNED (by ALL parties) AMA waiver.

lease:lease:lease: Let there be a well done, including photographs &/or measurements, ME's office investigator's report in addition to or data referred to, included in the autopsy report.

AND some CSI-type reports with data points included: ie. distance to/from sidewalk, witnesses, vehicle, participant's points of origin, etc. and again many photographs!

BUT more significantly, PLEASE tell me that the special prosecutor has/will have and is REVIEWING ALL available materials and is REQUESTING ALL information that could/would/should shore up EITHER individual's right to the SYG law &/or its permutations as applicable!

 

[Gin]

How in the world will GZ explain himself when confronted with the truth? How did this so call physical attack on him happen in 44 seconds?

Indeed! Yet, according to friends and attorneys of GZ, he was badly beaten, head into the concrete, bloody, wrestling in the fight for his life...The situation was so dire that his only option was to use his 9mm.
And yet, less than hour after after GZ shot to kill, the miracle of Sanford must have happened. Because I saw the tape of him walking with ease, absolutely no problems through the police station. I know he got looked over by the EMT's, but they didn't even give him so much as a SpongeBob Bandaid.

I don't buy the "physical attack" defense, either.

 

[Dr.Fessel]

The words “Long Live Zimmerman” were spray-painted on the side of Ohio State’s Hale Hall sometime between Wednesday night and Thursday morning.

George Zimmerman is a neighborhood watch leader who allegedly killed Trayvon Martin in self-defense Feb. 26 in Florida.

The Frank W. Hale Jr. Black Cultural Center is housed in Hale Hall and is part of the Office of Diversity and Inclusion.

http://www.thelantern.com/campus/lo...-black-cultural-center-1.2840151#.T33pZ3po9OW

 

[Horace Finklestein]

CNN just reporting that GZ lawyers are setting up a website: ZimmermanDefense.com supposedly that will have a pay pal for donations!!!! Oh.....and information that supports their side of the story!!

Good. He has every right to do so and I expect there will be plenty of donations. Others are certainly making money on this, the least GZ is entitled to is a defense fund imo.

 

[vlpate]

How in the world will GZ explain himself when confronted with the truth? How did this so call physical attack on him happen in 44 seconds?

The attack was likely going on for more than 44 seconds, the 911 caller contacted 911 when Trayvon was on top of GZ. The confrontation and punch in the nose had already happened.

I have a question that I think about every time I read someone's belief that it was Trayvon screaming on that call - what was he screaming about for over 45 seconds? If he is on top of Zimmerman, why is he screaming "help, help me, help..." over and over. I can't make sense of the person doing the beating yelling for help.

 

[gxm]

How in the world will GZ explain himself when confronted with the truth? How did this so call physical attack on him happen in 44 seconds?

But the screams didn't begin with the 911 call(s). If so, that would be an incredible coincidence especially considering that some sort of urgent commotion must have been occurring to spur the caller(s) to dial 911. But TM's gf doesn't mention any of that. Which is why I think the timestamps on the various devices are not synced up. Otherwise, IMO, it calls her testimony into question.

JMO, OMO, and :moo:

 

[raeann]

And if TM had gone after GZ and jumped him at the cut through path wouldn't John or Austin w/the dog have seen that because they were both walking towards that area to get to their condos? And if GZ's car was on Twin Trees the front of the homes are right there. Why would GZ have to take the cut through path to get over the Retreat View to look at a house number when the homes where his car was parked are facing the street? The house numbers would be right there. That makes no sense unless this was the only explanation he could come up with to explain how GZ ended up where he did when LE asked him to stay with the car. jmo

I am still waiting for their explanation of how GZ never left the cut through sidewalk as he returned to his car, yet ended up more than 10 yards further down the OTHER sidewalk toward the townhouse that TM was trying to get to......


jmo

 

[rotterdam]

I don't see the SYG law and the CC permit as one in the same. When a state grants a permit for cc a person then has the right to do just that (carry the weapon concealed). Then the same state has a SYG law in place that means you are justified to defend yourself in your home. The issue is not the gun the issue is whether GZ killed TM in self defense. He could have had a knife. jmo

I have mixed feelings about that. I used to live in FL and it was so easy to get a gun permit for a concealed weapon. When I applied for it in PA, it could not be concealed but must be clearly visible on the body. Not inside a waistband or covered up by a jacket. Ditto if you have the gun in a car, must be clearly visible, not hidden in glove compartment. Of course in your own house, it did not have to be visible. Just in public places.
Face it, even uniformed cops do not carry their gun concealed either. I just wonder that if GZ's gun would have been clearly visible to Tray, the outcome could have been different.
Now coupled with the Fl SYG, which IMO is a badly written piece of legislation, and not the same as SYG in other states, it makes it a toxic combination.
But you are right. It is two separate issues.

 

[gxm]

The attack was likely going on for more than 44 seconds, the 911 caller contacted 911 when Trayvon was on top of GZ. The confrontation and punch in the nose had already happened.

I have a question that I think about every time I read someone's belief that it was Trayvon screaming on that call - what was he screaming about for over 45 seconds? If he is on top of Zimmerman, why is he screaming "help, help me, help..." over and over. I can't make sense of the person doing the beating yelling for help.

Pure speculation. The only thing that would make sense is that TM saw the gun and that is why he was yelling for help as he beat GZ. TM must have seen GZ as a threat which is why he screamed for help while he struggled to keep GZ away from his gun.

JMO, OMO, and :moo: