17 yo Trayvon Martin Shot to Death by Neighborhood Watch Captain #23

[frenchvixen]

Page 2 "Trayvon's mother has reviewed the 911 calls and identified the voice crying for help as Trayvon Martin's voice."

Wouldn't a thurough investigation also ask a GZ family member (perhaps his wife) if the voice was GZ's voice? Just to be fair?

Page 2 "When the police dispatcher realized Zimmerman was pursuing Martin, he instructed Zimmerman not to do that"

That is not true. He said "we don't need you to do that"

I see a few more inconsistencies and I feel that this affidavit is sloppy. JMHO

Man, if only she had said, "don't do that" to GZ, TM would have been alive now.

 

[Cher352]

Page 2 "Trayvon's mother has reviewed the 911 calls and identified the voice crying for help as Trayvon Martin's voice."

Wouldn't a thorough investigation also ask a GZ family member (perhaps his wife) if the voice was GZ's voice? Just to be fair?

Page 2 "When the police dispatcher realized Zimmerman was pursuing Martin, he instructed Zimmerman not to do that"

That is not true. He said "we don't need you to do that"

I see a few more inconsistencies and I feel that this affidavit is sloppy. JMHO

Thought it was kind of sloppy too for all the time they said they took on it.

The big one that glared out to me was the mis-statement on what the dispatcher said....made he think they took their info from some of the media coverage instead of actually reviewing the 911 calls.

Also surprised too that AC said yesterday they never interview GZ. I wonder now if that the reason GZ called AC's office Monday was because he had been told the charges were finalized and he knew they had not talked to him yet.

 

[elementary]

Perhaps he wanted someone to help him because he didn't want to pull the trigger.

Yeah, the devil made him do it.

 

[katydid23]

Thanks TL. I think they have sooo much more information that we have no clue about at all. I think it's going to end up being an open and shut case.



~jmo~

In my experience, anytime something is called an 'Open and Shut' case, it ends up being the opposite.

 

[Isabelle]

Where is the Autopsy!

 

[tlcya]

Page 2 "Trayvon's mother has reviewed the 911 calls and identified the voice crying for help as Trayvon Martin's voice."

Wouldn't a thurough investigation also ask a GZ family member (perhaps his wife) if the voice was GZ's voice? Just to be fair?

Page 2 "When the police dispatcher realized Zimmerman was pursuing Martin, he instructed Zimmerman not to do that"

That is not true. He said "we don't need you to do that"

I see a few more inconsistencies and I feel that this affidavit is sloppy. JMHO

GZ's brother has not spoken to him in years (per GZ former attys). He simply jumped int the camera due to the notoriety of his brother and the incident. I doubt his voice recognition was given the same weight as a woman who speaks to and with her son probably daily.

as to Page 2 - It is my opinion that the investigators more than likely have extensively interviewed the actual dispatcher as to the calls that night and what took place during them.

It is also my opinion that the dispatcher told the investigators that he told Mr. Zimmerman not to follow Trayvon. Hence the investigator used a quote not from the actual 911 tape but from the actual person interviewed who had that conversation and it appears that person told investigators that they instructed GZ not to follow. Whether the semantics are the same or not, I feel this item in the Affidavit is not sloppy, but rather an accurate depiction of what investigators were told literally from the horses mouth. I also believe it gives us clear insight into what the dispatcher meant with the words "we don't need you to do that". IMO it is now very clear from this affidavit that dispatcher meant by those words "do not do that or STOP doing that"

Not a suggestion, a directive. One that was not followed.

All the usual :moo: and :cow: s apply

 

[Cher352]

I disagree. It's not the same.

The way it was stated was not an order, it was a suggestion.

Dispatcher never said the words "don't do it" or "stop doing it".

He said we don't NEED you to do that.

Not an order.

I am with you it is not the same thing in my mind either

Can you imagine if we cannot agree on the meaning of that dispatcher's statement the members of the jury probably won't be able to either.

 

[LolaMoon08]

I disagree. It's not the same.

The way it was stated was not an order, it was a suggestion.

Dispatcher never said the words "don't do it" or "stop doing it".

He said we don't NEED you to do that.

Not an order.

The keyword, IMO, is "need." Wanting someone to do something and needing someone to do something is completely different. I think any reasonable person knows what the dispatcher meant when she told GZ "we don't need you to be doing that." It was a direct, IMO, request for Zimmerman to not follow Trayvon. Maybe not an order, but he was told not to follow Trayvon. George chose to ignore it.

MOO

 

[Dr.Fessel]

For all we know this could have been a decoy on the video due to the death threats. The GZ I saw in today's hearing looked no where that big to me in either height or girth...IMO.

He has a bullet proof vest on under that big old checkered shirt I believe. IMO

 

[Isabelle]

I am most disappointed to hear that parents of TM were told there was going to be no arrest because of SYG. to me that is clearly case closed. Then yesterday the SA said the investigation had been ongoing from the get go. I'm not at all comfortable with this and I am sure TM's parents heard that too. That to me is a major trust issue.

 

[Isabelle]

GZ's brother has not spoken to him in years (per GZ former attys). He simply jumped int the camera due to the notoriety of his brother and the incident. I doubt his voice recognition was given the same weight as a woman who speaks to and with her son probably daily.

as to Page 2 - It is my opinion that the investigators more than likely have extensively interviewed the actual dispatcher as to the calls that night and what took place during them.

It is also my opinion that the dispatcher told the investigators that he told Mr. Zimmerman not to follow Trayvon. Hence the investigator used a quote not from the actual 911 tape but from the actual person interviewed who had that conversation and it appears that person told investigators that they instructed GZ not to follow. Whether the semantics are the same or not, I feel this item in the Affidavit is not sloppy, but rather an accurate depiction of what investigators were told literally from the horses mouth. I also believe it gives us clear insight into what the dispatcher meant with the words "we don't need you to do that". IMO it is now very clear from this affidavit that dispatcher meant by those words "do not do that or STOP doing that"

Not a suggestion, a directive. One that was not followed.

All the usual :moo: and :cow: s apply

Agree. I would interpret the comment as don't do that. It was said in a way to be polite. (common sense)

 

[princesspjs]

For all we know this could have been a decoy on the video due to the death threats. The GZ I saw in today's hearing looked no where that big to me in either height or girth...IMO.

The GZ that you saw in today's hearing was wearing a huge gray shirt which hid any sign of his body underneath it.

Perhaps he was wearing a girdle to hide his husky curves even more. We can go back and forth with "perhaps this" and "for all we know that". In my opinion, that isn't productive at all.

 

[elementary]

I disagree. It's not the same.

The way it was stated was not an order, it was a suggestion.

Dispatcher never said the words "don't do it" or "stop doing it".

He said we don't NEED you to do that.

Not an order.

Oh, please. IMO, that is just spuriously splitting hairs. I think dispatch carries way more weight than simply 'suggesting' anything. Besides, the situation was not a light hearted romp. It was grave, as we saw in the end.

 

[Isabelle]

If I am in the process of doing something and my DH or someone else comes along to help and I say, I don't need you to do that, they better back off, cause I am being nice!

 

[elementary]

Agree. I would interpret the comment as don't do that. It was said in a way to be polite. (common sense)

Absolutely common sense. If society does not share a common coinage there would be no effective way to communicate.

I am wondering why GZ did not mention his gun to the dispatcher, then, as in, "oh, I'm okay, I have a gun, so I'm not worried about following him".

 

[joypath]

GZ's brother has not spoken to him in years (per GZ former attys). He simply jumped int the camera due to the notoriety of his brother and the incident. I doubt his voice recognition was given the same weight as a woman who speaks to and with her son probably daily.

as to Page 2 - It is my opinion that the investigators more than likely have extensively interviewed the actual dispatcher as to the calls that night and what took place during them.

It is also my opinion that the dispatcher told the investigators that he told Mr. Zimmerman not to follow Trayvon. Hence the investigator used a quote not from the actual 911 tape but from the actual person interviewed who had that conversation and it appears that person told investigators that they instructed GZ not to follow. Whether the semantics are the same or not, I feel this item in the Affidavit is not sloppy, but rather an accurate depiction of what investigators were told literally from the horses mouth. I also believe it gives us clear insight into what the dispatcher meant with the words "we don't need you to do that". IMO it is now very clear from this affidavit that dispatcher meant by those words "do not do that or STOP doing that"

Not a suggestion, a directive. One that was not followed.

All the usual :moo: and :cow: s apply

lease: ITA!.....and the comment of "we don't need you to do that" is similar to the standardized comment one MAY/might receive from a 911 dispatcher of "stay on the line" OR "start chest compressions by doing......" IMVHO, one calls 911 for HELP and ASSISTANCE, one would anticipate/expect/believe that the CALLER will follow the given ADVICE/HELP as offered. :moo:

 

[Aedrys]

Oh, please. IMO, that is just spuriously splitting hairs. I think dispatch carries way more weight than simply 'suggesting' anything. Besides, the situation was not a light hearted romp. It was grave, as we saw in the end.

Exactly. It's a common sense kind of thing. If I'm on the phone with dispatch, and they tell me to do something or not do something, I'm going to listen to them because they know what to do in emergency situations better than I do. I give them that respect because I called them and they are supposed to be helping me. It doesn't mean they're always perfect, but if they told me not follow someone, I would sure as heck not go against that and follow the person anyway. It may not be something I legally have to do or not do, but I respect authority enough that if they tell me not to do something, I won't do it. However, GZ thought he knew better than the dispatcher, unfortunately, and is now paying the price for not listening.

 

[uvamerica]

I am most disappointed to hear that parents of TM were told there was going to be no arrest because of SYG. to me that is clearly case closed. Then yesterday the SA said the investigation had been ongoing from the get go. I'm not at all comfortable with this and I am sure TM's parents heard that too. That to me is a major trust issue.

Yep, it is disappointing, AC also praised Wolfinger and the SPD. It gave me a awful feeling in my stomach when she said this. Unless the FBI comes up with charges on the shoddy investigation or has answers for it, I think what happened will be swept under the rug. :maddening:

 

[Cher352]

He has a bullet proof vest on under that big old checkered shirt I believe. IMO

Now that makes sense...Thanks!

 

[tlcya]

Thought it was kind of sloppy too for all the time they said they took on it.

The big one that glared out to me was the mis-statement on what the dispatcher said....made he think they took their info from some of the media coverage instead of actually reviewing the 911 calls.

Also surprised too that AC said yesterday they never interview GZ. I wonder now if that the reason GZ called AC's office Monday was because he had been told the charges were finalized and he knew they had not talked to him yet.

BBM do you have reason to believe that investigators simply review tapes and do not interview the actual participants? Aside from GZ who Spec Pros Corey says was not interviewed I am acting under the belief that witnesses were actually spoken to.

I think GZ would have been spoken to had he not flaked out and gone incommunicado even to his attorneys. From their presser yesterday they spoke of trying to set up the meeting or interview with Ms. Corey and GZ was MIA

Until I hear differently, I am going to believe that investigators actually investigated and spoke to people/witnesses