2007 Church Yearbook Ranks Largest Denominations

[LovelyPigeon]

Free will means we are allowed to choose to commit murder, steal, commit adultery, rape, lie, cheat, use His name in vain, and so forth. It does NOT mean there aren't consequences for making those choices

Sure thing about those consequences! Just ask those victims of the murder, the theft, the adultery, the rape, the lying, the cheating, etc about the consequences of someone else's free will.

 

[PaperDoll]

Free will means we are allowed to choose to commit murder, steal, commit adultery, rape, lie, cheat, use His name in vain, and so forth. It does NOT mean there aren't consequences for making those choices, including Hell if we do not repent. That's why the "why give us free will and then punish us for using it" logic is wrong. We could rationalize anything we do then, which is why some people lean on that logic so heavily. It really is as simple as that, folks.

Well put DK..

 

[PaperDoll]

Sure thing about those consequences! Just ask those victims of the murder, the theft, the adultery, the rape, the lying, the cheating, etc about the consequences of someone else's free will.

Well put LP

 

[Maral]

Hehe (and hehe on your last post too)

God is amazingly clever- that's why there is more than one way home- God doesnt expect us to all arrive the same way

Narla, now don't faint, but I agree with you.

 

[narlacat]

Free will means we are allowed to choose to commit murder, steal, commit adultery, rape, lie, cheat, use His name in vain, and so forth. It does NOT mean there aren't consequences for making those choices, including Hell if we do not repent. That's why the "why give us free will and then punish us for using it" logic is wrong. We could rationalize anything we do then, which is why some people lean on that logic so heavily. It really is as simple as that, folks.

I do not go out and kill someone because God tells me not to, I decide not to kill someone because I have already leant that lesson- if I kill someone else, ultimately I am killing myself.

There is no way God gave us free will, not expecting us to use it.
I understand all about rationalisation- it's really scary how well I rationalise stuff- but I know right from wrong and I dont need guidelines to tell me how to live
eg I could rationalise having an affair with my best friends husband but I wouldnt- why> because I've already learnt the lesson- don't touch what's not yours :hand:

Why do you need God to tell you what's cool and what's not- at your age you should know the difference between right and wrong without a book with guidelines telling you

 

[narlacat]

Narla, now don't faith, but I agree with you.

lol

Just glad you're still talking to me Maral :blowkiss:

Love and light everyone and thank you all for forgiving me so readily for being such a jerk.

 

[southcitymom]

lol

Just glad you're still talking to me Maral :blowkiss:

Love and light everyone and thank you all for forgiving me so readily for being such a jerk.

Truly, narla, you're hard not to love!

 

[Dark Knight]

I do not go out and kill someone because God tells me not to, I decide not to kill someone becauseI have already leant that lesson- if I kill someone else, ultimately I am killing myself.

There is no way God gave us free will, not expecting us to use it.
I understand all about rationalisation- it's really scary how well I rationalise stuff- but I know right from wrong and I dont need guidlines to tell me how to live
eg I could rationalise having an affair with my best friends husband but I wouldnt- why> because I've already learnt the lesson- don't touch what's not yours :hand:

Why do you need God to tell you what's cool and what's not- at your age you should know the difference between right and wrong without a book with guidelines telling you

God created the life, so God creates the rules for it. If I was an athiest, I would be far more immoral than I am now. Why wouldn't I be? I wouldn't answer to anyone, so long as it wasn't against the law. I believe we we are born we all have that spark of belief in God, and those who don't extinguish that spark entirely have a basic moral compass that they follow, but if they are not believers, they think they did it all by themselves.

 

[PaperDoll]

God created the life, so God creates the rules for it. If I was an athiest, I would be far more immoral than I am now. Why wouldn't I be? I wouldn't answer to anyone, so long as it wasn't against the law. I believe we we are born we all have that spark of belief in God, and those who don't extinguish that spark entirely have a basic moral compass that they follow, but if they are not believers, they think they did it all by themselves.

Well put DK ... ok I'm going to stop saying that now.. hehe

 

[IrishMist]

God created the life, so God creates the rules for it. If I was an athiest, I would be far more immoral than I am now. Why wouldn't I be? I wouldn't answer to anyone, so long as it wasn't against the law. I believe we we are born we all have that spark of belief in God, and those who don't extinguish that spark entirely have a basic moral compass that they follow, but if they are not believers, they think they did it all by themselves.

That's a common misconception about Atheists. They aren't any more immoral than anyone else. (And I could tell tales of where they are MORE moral than many of the "christians" I know.)

Maybe fear of punishment when you die keeps you in line. Others do right just because it is right the right thing to do.

ETA: God may have created life. But MAN made the rules for it, IMO.

 

[narlacat]

Well put DK ... ok I'm going to stop saying that now.. hehe

Please do- he doesn't need any encouragement :hand:

 

[PaperDoll]

Please do- he doesn't need any encouragement :hand:

Well put Narla

 

[narlacat]

That's a common misconception about Atheists. They aren't any more immoral than anyone else. (And I could tell tales of where they are MORE moral than many of the "christians" I know.)

Maybe fear of punishment when you die keeps you in line. Others do right just because it is right the right thing to do.

ETA: God may have created life. But MAN made the rules for it, IMO.

That is true.

Still, I feel a bit bit sad for Athiests- how very unimaginative of them lol

And who wouldn't want to believe in life after death

 

[IrishMist]

That is true.

Still, I feel a bit bit sad for Athiests- how very unimaginative of them lol

And who wouldn't want to believe in life after death

It will just have to be a pleasant surprise for them!

 

[narlacat]

It will just have to be a pleasant surprise for them!

Yes lol, that's what I think too- are they sure in for a shock! (a pleasant one)

 

[narlacat]

Well put Narla

*chuckles

 

[Dark Knight]

That's a common misconception about Atheists. They aren't any more immoral than anyone else. (And I could tell tales of where they are MORE moral than many of the "christians" I know.)

Maybe fear of punishment when you die keeps you in line. Others do right just because it is right the right thing to do.

ETA: God may have created life. But MAN made the rules for it, IMO.

Right? Wrong? Those are pretty abstract ideas by themselves. They didn't just fall out of the sky, so to speak. But as long as YOU think you can figure out right from wrong all by yourself, then good for you I guess.

 

[Nova]

Free will means we are allowed to choose to commit murder, steal, commit adultery, rape, lie, cheat, use His name in vain, and so forth. It does NOT mean there aren't consequences for making those choices, including Hell if we do not repent. That's why the "why give us free will and then punish us for using it" logic is wrong. We could rationalize anything we do then, which is why some people lean on that logic so heavily. It really is as simple as that, folks.

You're just repeating yourself now, DK, not responding to anyone's arguments against this overly simplified concept of freeedom.

This ain't catechism, my friend, it's WS!

 

[IrishMist]

Right? Wrong? Those are pretty abstract ideas by themselves. They didn't just fall out of the sky, so to speak. But as long as YOU think you can figure out right from wrong all by yourself, then good for you I guess.

Concepts of right and wrong didn't just come from your book and your religion, DK. And those are not the only places to find them.

 

[LovelyPigeon]

If Free Will is simply a matter of slavish obedience to arbitrary rules, then it isn't very free, is it? On the other hand, if Free Will demands that we engage with our own morality and establish criteria for right conduct, then Free Will might be worth something.

Then there's the teachings of free will, predestination, and dispensationalism...