2009.04.13 State To Seek Death Penalty For Casey Anthony #3 POLL ADDED

[fortytwo]

I searched but did not find another thread on this particular topic to bump.

While I realize we have not seen all the evidence LE has, we HAVE seen the tox reports on the head of hair (negative), and Dr. G report that there did not appear to be any trauma to the bones to suggest a COD. The SA office did say that they were bringing the DP back to the table in light of "new" evidence discovered either with or on the skeletal remains. The only thing I can think of based on what we have seen, is the duct tape--wrapped completely around the head so tightly that it never floated away. I agree this is significant, but I'm having doubts as to whether or not this is enough without a COD to garner a sentence of death--should KC be convicted. I hate it too, because I believe 110% that she is guilty of a premeditated, particularly heinous murder of her own 2 year old child.

I'd convinced myself that KC drugged Caylee with xanax and then murdered her, but no drugs in the hair were found. So, perhaps KC duct taped Caylee so she couldn't scream/cry out or fight with her, and drowned her in the pool with very little force. Now that there was no human tissue to test, and she wouldn't have had to strangle her, breaking the hyoid bone, we may never find out the true COD. IDK....I wonder if the SA office isn't reaching a bit.

Thoughts, anyone?

(bold above by me)

I like the idea for the thread, at least in general. But I have to ask.

How do we know that this is true?

From above...

the duct tape--wrapped completely around the head so tightly that it never floated away.

 

[shgrbkr]

(bold above by me)

I like the idea for the thread, at least in general. But I have to ask.

How do we know that this is true?

From above...

I'll have to search for the link. Post it when located. I will say IIRC that when the body was found, it was widely reported that the duct tape was wrapped all the way around the head that if someone was going to try and take it off, they would have had to cut her hair. This is one reason why the hair was still there too.
Right now I'm at work, so cannot guarantee a link tonight.

 

[Valhall]

I'll have to search for the link. Post it when located. I will say IIRC that when the body was found, it was widely reported that the duct tape was wrapped all the way around the head that if someone was going to try and take it off, they would have had to cut her hair. This is one reason why the hair was still there too.
Right now I'm at work, so cannot guarantee a link tonight.

I think, maybe, you might be confusing the statement in the report that the mandible (lower jaw) of the skull did not fall away and/or float away due to the duct tape preventing it. This doesn't necessarily mean the duct tape was tight or adhered very long after placement. If the tape was completely around the skull (and I'm not even sure we have that confirmed yet), then it creates a circle that, even after it became loose (unstuck) as the skin decayed away, could have acted as almost a harness preventing movement of the lower jawbone. Kind of like when you wear a shorter necklace and you're fiddling with it, you can slip it up onto your chin and it will become taut and stay there and you actually have to dip your chin down and in to get it back off. The circle of tape could have acted just as that.

The other explanation would be yours, which I'm not arguing at all, that it was placed on severely tight from the beginning.

Either scenario could very well have happened.

 

[2goldfish]

They brought the DP back because they have "overwhelming evidence" that KC murdered Caylee (I havent a link, hopefully someone with better organization can add the link)

additionally I think they would prefer the death qualified jury because of the CSI effect all over the place - even on this forum with all you brilliant people there are still people who feel "circumstantial" evidence isn't much.

I would like to add yet again that nearly every case is a "circumstantial" case. very rarely is there video of crimes or direct witnesses that got away which is direct evidence. It is the preponderance of all circumstantial evidence given which leads us or the jurors to decide beyond a reasonable doubt.

Another poster, whom I forget at the moment (sorry) likes to say that if you wake up and there is snow on the ground, it is reasonable to assume it snowed - based on circumstantial evidence of snow being on the ground. no video or direct witness testimony required!

 

[Patty G]

bumping up

 

[shgrbkr]

I think, maybe, you might be confusing the statement in the report that the mandible (lower jaw) of the skull did not fall away and/or float away due to the duct tape preventing it. This doesn't necessarily mean the duct tape was tight or adhered very long after placement. If the tape was completely around the skull (and I'm not even sure we have that confirmed yet), then it creates a circle that, even after it became loose (unstuck) as the skin decayed away, could have acted as almost a harness preventing movement of the lower jawbone. Kind of like when you wear a shorter necklace and you're fiddling with it, you can slip it up onto your chin and it will become taut and stay there and you actually have to dip your chin down and in to get it back off. The circle of tape could have acted just as that.

The other explanation would be yours, which I'm not arguing at all, that it was placed on severely tight from the beginning.

Either scenario could very well have happened.

Yes, Valhall, you are probably correct that I am confusing one thing with another. THe only "link" I could find was where this was supposedly leaked to the media who then reported it--nothing official as of yet. I see what you are saying about the tape and the jaw. Makes sense.
In general,
I would like to add that the only reason I was thinking about the SA bringing the DP back is because it was reported they did so because of something found either on or with the body, and this was after most of the circumstantial evidence was in, as far as I can tell. The only thing I could think of is mainly the duct tape. I was not suggesting that I disagree with the DP as a possible sentence.
I am only thinking about there not being a definitive COD, it might be difficult for a jury to render a sentence of death. Please do not misinterpret this to mean that I am out of touch with the evidence or that I do not believe the DP is appropriate here. I certainly may not be as in tune with this case as some, and I'm not as particular about links and so on as others, but I have followed the case. I just wondered what others thought might be "the thing" that made the SA do a 180 on this issue. Obviously, it's not something they have officially stated at this time, so pure speculation on my part.

 

[eddeva]

Yes, Valhall, you are probably correct that I am confusing one thing with another. THe only "link" I could find was where this was supposedly leaked to the media who then reported it--nothing official as of yet. I see what you are saying about the tape and the jaw. Makes sense.

i remember something about the tape being 'wrapped' around caylee's head too. i think it came from one of the last two doc-dumps but i can't say where. i was surprised to see that being stated after all the arguing here about it just being over the mouth and again surprised that nobody brought it up.

 

[shgrbkr]

i remember something about the tape being 'wrapped' around caylee's head too. i think it came from one of the last two doc-dumps but i can't say where. i was surprised to see that being stated after all the arguing here about it just being over the mouth and again surprised that nobody brought it up.

IDK, I think it would be difficult to tape a mouth that tightly and NOT go all the way around the head...IMO.

 

[2goldfish]

Yes, Valhall, you are probably correct that I am confusing one thing with another. THe only "link" I could find was where this was supposedly leaked to the media who then reported it--nothing official as of yet. I see what you are saying about the tape and the jaw. Makes sense.
In general,
I would like to add that the only reason I was thinking about the SA bringing the DP back is because it was reported they did so because of something found either on or with the body, and this was after most of the circumstantial evidence was in, as far as I can tell. The only thing I could think of is mainly the duct tape. I was not suggesting that I disagree with the DP as a possible sentence.
I am only thinking about there not being a definitive COD, it might be difficult for a jury to render a sentence of death. Please do not misinterpret this to mean that I am out of touch with the evidence or that I do not believe the DP is appropriate here. I certainly may not be as in tune with this case as some, and I'm not as particular about links and so on as others, but I have followed the case. I just wondered what others thought might be "the thing" that made the SA do a 180 on this issue. Obviously, it's not something they have officially stated at this time, so pure speculation on my part.

I see what you are getting at now..that wording struck me also the other day. They did specifically say something about evidence discovered after the remains were found. I assume it is the duct tape as well - I dont think even KC was dumb ennough to leave a goodbye note or anything. but there could be other prints or something worse than duct tape with a heart sticker on it cause we sure werent expecting that...I think til that info I secretly held out hope it was an accident just so caylee didnt have to suffer although duct tape certainly ...well, I just cant say it

I wonder if COD really matters so much, I dont recall if it was in reference to this case or some other I read a prosecuter saying "I dont have to prove motivation OR a COD, I only have to prove it happened and that so and so did it"


...because at the end of the day, there were only bones cause momma wouldnt "crack" and confess, so let her baby rot under water for 6 months - which is plenty bad enough.

But although I doubt that gatorade bottle was related to this murder, I keep holding out hope that there comes to be something it in including prints, that would get the DP back on the table IMO (so long as it wasnt just gatorade in the bottle)

 

[cyn0matic]

This week's National Enquirer has a report from an inmate who was in the same block as KC. This now-released inmate said that on the day the SA put the death penalty back on the table, KC was supposedly taken to visit her lawyer and was informed of this big change.

Upon KCs return to her cell a couple of hours later, she was hollering (I'm pissed! I'm pissed!) and thrashing for a couple of hours, until the guards took her to a special restraint cell, and tied her down for several more hours. (Standard procedure when inmates won't calm down, the article says).

What do you think of this?

 

[NSS]

*respectfully snipped*

But although I doubt that gatorade bottle was related to this murder, I keep holding out hope that there comes to be something it in including prints, that would get the DP back on the table IMO (so long as it wasnt just gatorade in the bottle)

Even if there were only Gatorade in the bottle, if it can be linked to KC by prints or similar, it would be proof that KC was in the area of the dumped body.

So.
Last person to be seen with Caylee. (attempt to pass THAT buck to ZFG failed).
Avoids contact with her family.
When contact is made - so are excuses as to Caylees absence.
31 days pass before a report is made - and it's NOT at KC's instigation.
Car is abandoned.
Car smells of death.
Dogs and air samples indicate death.
Body discovery proves death.

Something at that death scene (or possibly multiple tenuous links) leads right back to KC or the Anthony home.

The DP is warranted because it is the murder of a child.
Had it been an accident - we'd have heard the 'defense details' by now.

 

[NSS]

This week's National Enquirer has a report from an inmate who was in the same block as KC. This now-released inmate said that on the day the SA put the death penalty back on the table, KC was supposedly taken to visit her lawyer and was informed of this big change.

Upon KCs return to her cell a couple of hours later, she was hollering (I'm pissed! I'm pissed!) and thrashing for a couple of hours, until the guards took her to a special restraint cell, and tied her down for several more hours. (Standard procedure when inmates won't calm down, the article says).

What do you think of this?

It was denied by the jail, they said KC has been a model inmate and has never required restraining.

Since KC is kept in isolation from other inmates, I doubt the 'short stay' inmates come into contact with her.

On my POT scale (Probability Of Truth), I'll give this just a 1.

 

[mountaintime]

This seems as though it might be appropriate for this forum
It is a video interview with a former prisoner who saw KC's reaction to the death penalty being re-instated.


http://www.radaronline.com/exclusiv...ormer-inmate-reveals-day-casey-anthony-had-be

 

[cyn0matic]

This seems as though it might be appropriate for this forum
It is a video interview with a former prisoner who saw KC's reaction to the death penalty being re-instated.


http://www.radaronline.com/exclusiv...ormer-inmate-reveals-day-casey-anthony-had-be

That is the same person whose statements are featured in the Enquirer article. In my experience the Enquirer checks facts.

This witness peered out her cell window to see KCs fit. So even if KC is "separated" from other inmates, they can see her and hear her sometimes. It's not like she's in her own special soundproof room.

 

[Kat]

That interview with the former prisoner was very interesting.

 

[Kentjbkent]

It was denied by the jail, they said KC has been a model inmate and has never required restraining.

Since KC is kept in isolation from other inmates, I doubt the 'short stay' inmates come into contact with her.

On my POT scale (Probability Of Truth), I'll give this just a 1.

After just watching the video, I am with you on this one.

A few things caught my attention..

1. At the beginning of the video, she states that she was viewing KC at a table in the commons area (gives detailed description of table) and then said that when KC was ascending the stairs back to her that was directly above the cell of this inmate..etc... Then how was she able to continue viewing KC if she was directly overhead?

2. She also gave a description of a large posterboard "perhaps put together with several legal pads" that had many pictures of KC and Caylee, as well as pictures from magazines......where is KC getting all this stuff? I recall she ordered a drawing pad from the commissary, but how is she getting all the magazines to cut up, as well as stuff to make a shrine??

3. And the paper mache' handmade roses that were black????

This woman certainly speaks very eloquently and sounds very articulate, but sure seemed to give precise details without any prompting at all?


I don't know....Guess I would give it a bit more value if it had been an interview with the WESH or the Sentinel, etc instead of a "pay big money for your story" media source. How much is Radaronline paying Octomom again??

 

[nobull]

This seems as though it might be appropriate for this forum
It is a video interview with a former prisoner who saw KC's reaction to the death penalty being re-instated.


http://www.radaronline.com/exclusiv...ormer-inmate-reveals-day-casey-anthony-had-be

Very very interesting. The "thousand mile stare" as psych professionals call it. I've seen it numerous times. And almost all those times I was staring in the eyes of a psychopath or sociopath. Chilling.

 

[Searchfortruth]

I just don't know about this inmates story, she see's an awful lot of stuff in Casey's cell. Is one side of the cell plexiglass ?

 

[texaslb218]

As the poster pointed out, the plexi glass would have to be the floor/ceiling of the two inmates if CA were above her. She sounds so intelligent that it is hard to believe that it is all BS. No telling ... except the "above me...looked in her cell" part.

 

[nobull]

After just watching the video, I am with you on this one.

A few things caught my attention..

1. At the beginning of the video, she states that she was viewing KC at a table in the commons area (gives detailed description of table) and then said that when KC was ascending the stairs back to her that was directly above the cell of this inmate..etc... Then how was she able to continue viewing KC if she was directly overhead?

2. She also gave a description of a large posterboard "perhaps put together with several legal pads" that had many pictures of KC and Caylee, as well as pictures from magazines......where is KC getting all this stuff? I recall she ordered a drawing pad from the commissary, but how is she getting all the magazines to cut up, as well as stuff to make a shrine??

3. And the paper mache' handmade roses that were black????

This woman certainly speaks very eloquently and sounds very articulate, but sure seemed to give precise details without any prompting at all?


I don't know....Guess I would give it a bit more value if it had been an interview with the WESH or the Sentinel, etc instead of a "pay big money for your story" media source. How much is Radaronline paying Octomom again??

The former inmate stated that Casey's regular cell was above her (unknown as to which side or if there even was another side of the unit or if the cells are in one row), and that she had "peeked" into it and it was considerably smaller than her own cell. I can imagine that from time to time the inmates would need to move around the unit to use showers/go to medical/go outside, etc. This seems plausible to me.

The "time out" room/table was obviously not in Casey's room, since it was a concave-type table. It could very easily be located somewhere else within the unit. These types of mattresses are commonly used to reduce injury in psych time-out areas: http://www.medicalsearch.com.au/Products/Concave_Mattress-24918.

As far as the former inmate conveying precise details, maybe it was because she was there and witnessed the entire thing?

The NE is very particular about fact-checking especially with witness accounts of this type. It's why you so seldom have seen them successfully sued, considering they specializing in printing fringe stories.

Just my 2 cents.