2010.08.05 Document Release

[ExpectingUnicorns]

maybe she meant the way YM kept telling witnesses that Casey was a big liar and must be responsible for Caylee's disappearance, etc? I did think the witnesses were influenced by what they were hearing from the investigators IMO (also from the media of course). (I wouldn't use the word "tampering" but maybe that was the only word Cindy could think of to describe the influencing aspect.)

If I'd been the family I think I also would have been very distressed that the investigation seemed to have tunnel vision on Casey. IMO Seems like any family would obviously want all angles investigated and everyone who'd potentially been around the missing child.

I need to go catch up on the docs! I was actually driving back from Orlando on the 5th, didn't know there had been a doc dump! Thank you guys

Seagull, I believe that Casey is a liar. Because of that it probably wouldn't have been something that "stood out" to me when YM might have mentioned it. But I don't recall any incidents when he did and I am curious concerning the context. Would you mind giving me the links where he kept doing this? tia!

 

[sleutherontheside]

maybe she meant the way YM kept telling witnesses that Casey was a big liar and must be responsible for Caylee's disappearance, etc? I did think the witnesses were influenced by what they were hearing from the investigators IMO (also from the media of course). (I wouldn't use the word "tampering" but maybe that was the only word Cindy could think of to describe the influencing aspect.)

If I'd been the family I think I also would have been very distressed that the investigation seemed to have tunnel vision on Casey. IMO Seems like any family would obviously want all angles investigated and everyone who'd potentially been around the missing child.

I need to go catch up on the docs! I was actually driving back from Orlando on the 5th, didn't know there had been a doc dump! Thank you guys

Respectfully......After reading the LE interviews and depos that have been released.......I can not recall proof that YM or anyone else for that matter told anyone that KC lied.

There was certainly discussion about having heard from others that KC lied and asking if that was their impression as well. I also recall LE asking for examples.

Stating that it appears that someone has a propensity for lying does not equate to calling them a liar. Now.....we have seen EVIDENCE of lies. Addresses that were not what KC said they were.....a job that she did not have.....phantom parties that could not be located....the list goes on.

I just can't agree with the theory that LE had tunnel vision. When you have an investigation....and one that is time sensitive....you MUST prioritize your efforts. KC is NOT the first POI / suspect/ to mislead, withhold, or fabricate information.

LE is smart enough to know where to expend energy FIRST. Does that mean that they only investigated KC???? Not at all. From the doc dump I have read....I see a massive LE effort with participation from several states and jurisdictions investigating "tips", family versions of events, witness statements, and random parties.

I don't think that the family can claim that other angles were not investigated......we have seen proof that they were....and that's only out of what has been released.

This family refused to give Tim Miller of TES an item of Caylee's for the search dogs....yet sent items to a psychic. Their argument has merit...but only based upon their own end goal.

JMO

 

[seagull65]

OK I was trying to get a feel for when this new to-be-released CA interview took place. WFTV says it's from 7/31/08. It looks like her FBI interview happened on7/30/08 (George's happened 7/31/08, the same day the new video was taken), and the interview where she met to do a timeline happened on August 1. This is the one where YM held her hands and told her she can't be changing her story.

snipped by me/bolded by me

it wasn't a supportive kind of hand holding though IMO, and I don't think he was telling her not to change her story, was he? I was shocked at the time when I saw it, if I'd been Cindy I think I would have cried. I thought the other officer seemed really nice and understanding about taking down everything she knew, though. I mean, they'd asked her to provide the information she knew for the timeline, that was why she was there, and she was trying to do that. She clearly thought they really wanted to know and that somehow this would help lead them to Caylee.

Can you imagine if your grandchild was missing, you were completely exhausted and obviously very worried, and you were trying desperately to help with the timeline, racking your brain for everything you could remember, and then one of the detectives came in and suddenly got all impatient and grabbed you by the arms like that, getting in your face and telling you if it was from Casey it was all lies so basically why even note any of it for the timeline? What a shock it must have been for her. If YM didn't want to know, why ask, or why be in the room? MOO Not faulting him in general, but I was shocked at that.

This sounds interesting about the newly released "in between" interview. OK, off to catch up.

 

[CuriousTwo]

maybe she meant the way YM kept telling witnesses that Casey was a big liar and must be responsible for Caylee's disappearance, etc? I did think the witnesses were influenced by what they were hearing from the investigators IMO (also from the media of course). (I wouldn't use the word "tampering" but maybe that was the only word Cindy could think of to describe the influencing aspect.)

If I'd been the family I think I also would have been very distressed that the investigation seemed to have tunnel vision on Casey. IMO Seems like any family would obviously want all angles investigated and everyone who'd potentially been around the missing child.

I need to go catch up on the docs! I was actually driving back from Orlando on the 5th, didn't know there had been a doc dump! Thank you guys

p.s. IMO I'm not so sure what Casey was doing was lying, it seems like crazy incoherent statements that don't make any sense, mixing up 2006 with current activities, maybe in her mind she was back in 2006. Her statements were as crazy as "Zenaida used to live on the 2nd floor of that building with her roommate who lived on the 3rd floor." (How are people on two different floors of a building roommates?) And this is referring to a building across the street from JP's Glenwood townhome where she had stayed with AH and other roommates (and with Caylee), JP's place does look like it has 3 floors...Crazy jumbled up nonsense. Obviously no point in taking the police to a job she no longer had. What for? Just to embarrass herself? Maybe she didn't remember until she got there that she no longer worked there. One of the officers noticed how little sense she was making and asked her if she'd ever been committed at the mental hospital before. I think he might have been on the right track.
As little sense as Casey was making, I always wished they'd been able to let her ramble on a bit more rather than interrupting her the whole time. Just in case she had been able to come out with anything useful. Or if she'd been able to ramble on, it might have become clear how addled she was. But they were obviously in a time urgent situation at the time and were expecting the mother to be able to provide logical information. They couldn't hang around.[/

I really don't think LE can afford to devote endless amounts of time to listening to a family member ramble on and on, mostly off-topic, hoping that LE might be able to decipher or glean a slight shred of truth, when LE's main focus is to help and find the VICTIM as quickly as possible.

While the family members are all focusing on themselves, LE is focusing on finding CAYLEE. What a novel idea, huh? It's just plain sad to me that those who had never even met Caylee were giving more of themselves and devoting more time and attention, lack of sleep, and loss of time with their own families, than the flesh-and-blood family members were willing to give. Very, very sad.

 

[Trapshooter]

maybe she meant the way YM kept telling witnesses that Casey was a big liar and must be responsible for Caylee's disappearance, etc? I did think the witnesses were influenced by what they were hearing from the investigators IMO (also from the media of course). (I wouldn't use the word "tampering" but maybe that was the only word Cindy could think of to describe the influencing aspect.)

If I'd been the family I think I also would have been very distressed that the investigation seemed to have tunnel vision on Casey. IMO Seems like any family would obviously want all angles investigated and everyone who'd potentially been around the missing child.

I need to go catch up on the docs! I was actually driving back from Orlando on the 5th, didn't know there had been a doc dump! Thank you guys

p.s. IMO I'm not so sure what Casey was doing was lying, it seems like crazy incoherent statements that don't make any sense, mixing up 2006 with current activities, maybe in her mind she was back in 2006. Her statements were as crazy as "Zenaida used to live on the 2nd floor of that building with her roommate who lived on the 3rd floor." (How are people on two different floors of a building roommates?) And this is referring to a building across the street from JP's Glenwood townhome where she had stayed with AH and other roommates (and with Caylee), JP's place does look like it has 3 floors...Crazy jumbled up nonsense. Obviously no point in taking the police to a job she no longer had. What for? Just to embarrass herself? Maybe she didn't remember until she got there that she no longer worked there. One of the officers noticed how little sense she was making and asked her if she'd ever been committed at the mental hospital before. I think he might have been on the right track.
As little sense as Casey was making, I always wished they'd been able to let her ramble on a bit more rather than interrupting her the whole time. Just in case she had been able to come out with anything useful. Or if she'd been able to ramble on, it might have become clear how addled she was. But they were obviously in a time urgent situation at the time and were expecting the mother to be able to provide logical information. They couldn't hang around.

BBM: I'm curious Seagull where that information came from about the officer asking KC if she had been in a mental hospital? Could you point me to a link for that information? Thanks!

 

[kaRN]

Why is it that I can't get a cool guy like Coma the Mortician to write me poetry?

He's spammming her with the same lousy prose lol!!

 

[kaRN]

Well, ya know how sometimes those unauthorised cell phones fall in to the jails from the sky----right thru the celings too!!!!! Amazing huh??

How is it nobody told KC her parents home phone number had been disconnected a year and a half earlier?? :crazy:

 

[kaRN]

Just a thought...do you have the latest Adobe reader? IIRC, isn't that what is used to read pdfs?:waitasec:

Edited to add: Just read your post...yup, I have IE too!

Fire F is working well with the downloads.

 

[kaRN]

Oh, Cindy is perfectly fine. The crazed ramblings are for the benefit of the public.imo

I don't deny her loss of Caylee, but what she is doing now is game playing.imo, to save the princess.

The game is the outward manifestation of the inner illness IMO.

 

[wildchild1961]

You know RR-- I have said that this is the first case I have ever followed online. While it is just a curiosity, past-time thing with me, these people (the psychics and PIs) seem to make a living from inserting themselves into active criminal investigations. And they scour the internet forums to gain most of their info. It is amazing to me.

Armchair Private Investigators... welcome to the cyber age

wild

 

[wildchild1961]

maybe she meant the way YM kept telling witnesses that Casey was a big liar and must be responsible for Caylee's disappearance, etc? I did think the witnesses were influenced by what they were hearing from the investigators IMO (also from the media of course). (I wouldn't use the word "tampering" but maybe that was the only word Cindy could think of to describe the influencing aspect.)

If I'd been the family I think I also would have been very distressed that the investigation seemed to have tunnel vision on Casey. IMO Seems like any family would obviously want all angles investigated and everyone who'd potentially been around the missing child.

I need to go catch up on the docs! I was actually driving back from Orlando on the 5th, didn't know there had been a doc dump! Thank you guys

p.s. IMO I'm not so sure what Casey was doing was lying, it seems like crazy incoherent statements that don't make any sense, mixing up 2006 with current activities, maybe in her mind she was back in 2006. Her statements were as crazy as "Zenaida used to live on the 2nd floor of that building with her roommate who lived on the 3rd floor." (How are people on two different floors of a building roommates?) And this is referring to a building across the street from JP's Glenwood townhome where she had stayed with AH and other roommates (and with Caylee), JP's place does look like it has 3 floors...Crazy jumbled up nonsense. Obviously no point in taking the police to a job she no longer had. What for? Just to embarrass herself? Maybe she didn't remember until she got there that she no longer worked there. One of the officers noticed how little sense she was making and asked her if she'd ever been committed at the mental hospital before. I think he might have been on the right track.
As little sense as Casey was making, I always wished they'd been able to let her ramble on a bit more rather than interrupting her the whole time. Just in case she had been able to come out with anything useful. Or if she'd been able to ramble on, it might have become clear how addled she was. But they were obviously in a time urgent situation at the time and were expecting the mother to be able to provide logical information. They couldn't hang around.

With all due respect Seagull, I think its time that we all do something for KC that her parents never did. Let her take responsibility for what she DID say.. rather than figuring out what or why she was trying to say. She lied. Bottom line is.. she lied and lied and lied and continues to lie. If a court finds her to have mental issues.. then fine her sentencing will reflect those findings. But even if that is found to be accurate.. she has LIED and needs to be held accountable for that. Even if it is just by a group of folks here at WS.

wild




wild

 

[Leila]

maybe she meant the way YM kept telling witnesses that Casey was a big liar and must be responsible for Caylee's disappearance, etc? I did think the witnesses were influenced by what they were hearing from the investigators IMO (also from the media of course). (I wouldn't use the word "tampering" but maybe that was the only word Cindy could think of to describe the influencing aspect.)

If I'd been the family I think I also would have been very distressed that the investigation seemed to have tunnel vision on Casey. IMO Seems like any family would obviously want all angles investigated and everyone who'd potentially been around the missing child.

I need to go catch up on the docs! I was actually driving back from Orlando on the 5th, didn't know there had been a doc dump! Thank you guys

p.s. IMO I'm not so sure what Casey was doing was lying, it seems like crazy incoherent statements that don't make any sense, mixing up 2006 with current activities, maybe in her mind she was back in 2006. Her statements were as crazy as "Zenaida used to live on the 2nd floor of that building with her roommate who lived on the 3rd floor." (How are people on two different floors of a building roommates?) And this is referring to a building across the street from JP's Glenwood townhome where she had stayed with AH and other roommates (and with Caylee), JP's place does look like it has 3 floors...Crazy jumbled up nonsense. Obviously no point in taking the police to a job she no longer had. What for? Just to embarrass herself? Maybe she didn't remember until she got there that she no longer worked there. One of the officers noticed how little sense she was making and asked her if she'd ever been committed at the mental hospital before. I think he might have been on the right track.
As little sense as Casey was making, I always wished they'd been able to let her ramble on a bit more rather than interrupting her the whole time. Just in case she had been able to come out with anything useful. Or if she'd been able to ramble on, it might have become clear how addled she was. But they were obviously in a time urgent situation at the time and were expecting the mother to be able to provide logical information. They couldn't hang around.

This is what liars do.............they're making it up as they go along and it doesn't make sense. Had she told the truth, it would have made sense. I've listened to the audio numerous times and there's no evidence of confusion on Casey's part. There's been no evidence that Casey is in any way impaired or addled. She was defiantly lying to the police.

Had Casey told the police the truth, this case would have been over two years ago. Caylee's remains would have been found within 24 hours of Cindy's last 911 call.

The police were very thorough and professional in this case. There's no doubt that everyone involved was investigated. Through the process of clearing and eliminating people, it became very clear that there was only one suspect...........Casey.

I don't see the police or media influencing witnesses. The media was doing their job of reporting what was happening, and George and Cindy's behavior is what kept the story in the headlines.

 

[Leila]

I immediately thought of the bat phones when I heard that!

I did too!

 

[RR0004]

I really don't think LE can afford to devote endless amounts of time to listening to a family member ramble on and on, mostly off-topic, hoping that LE might be able to decipher or glean a slight shred of truth, when LE's main focus is to help and find the VICTIM as quickly as possible.

While the family members are all focusing on themselves, LE is focusing on finding CAYLEE. What a novel idea, huh? It's just plain sad to me that those who had never even met Caylee were giving more of themselves and devoting more time and attention, lack of sleep, and loss of time with their own families, than the flesh-and-blood family members were willing to give. Very, very sad.

IMHO Yuri Melich had the patience of a saint.

 

[RR0004]

snipped by me/bolded by me

it wasn't a supportive kind of hand holding though IMO, and I don't think he was telling her not to change her story, was he? I was shocked at the time when I saw it, if I'd been Cindy I think I would have cried. I thought the other officer seemed really nice and understanding about taking down everything she knew, though. I mean, they'd asked her to provide the information she knew for the timeline, that was why she was there, and she was trying to do that. She clearly thought they really wanted to know and that somehow this would help lead them to Caylee.

Can you imagine if your grandchild was missing, you were completely exhausted and obviously very worried, and you were trying desperately to help with the timeline, racking your brain for everything you could remember, and then one of the detectives came in and suddenly got all impatient and grabbed you by the arms like that, getting in your face and telling you if it was from Casey it was all lies so basically why even note any of it for the timeline? What a shock it must have been for her. If YM didn't want to know, why ask, or why be in the room? MOO Not faulting him in general, but I was shocked at that.

This sounds interesting about the newly released "in between" interview. OK, off to catch up.

A shock? Ya mean like being called out on your own BS when your granddaughter is missing?

 

[claudicici]

...just read Cindy's letters and just wanted to say her passive agressiveness is amazing....calling kC her BFF ,still insisting that they are all one,forever and ever....imagine how KC feels,she KILLED her baby to get away from all this,to show her mother that she is not part of CMA anymore and yet she still could not win,the CA/KC war rages on....JMO

 

[LiveLaughLuv]

...just read Cindy's letters and just wanted to say her passive agressiveness is amazing....calling kC her BFF ,still insisting that they are all one,forever and ever....imagine how KC feels,she KILLED her baby to get away from all this,to show her mother that she is not part of CMA anymore and yet she still could not win,the CA/KC war rages on....JMO

I can imagine ICA becoming more enraged at that. She may just change her plea and give Cindy that last jab in the heart. The hatred runs deep and IMO, ICA will do whatever she has to to finally destroy everyone who loved Caylee more than they loved HER...dispicable creature, evil at heart with the blackest soul one could have. She will take great pleasure to finally be the one who breaks Cindy down, all the way down.. JMHO

Justice for Caylee

 

[faefrost]

Yep, they probably disconnected the home phone for the batphones. How funny it took them two years to tell Casey *snort* *laugh*

Unfortunately, batphones have come up in another case, Kyron Horman. Apparently friends of the stepmother bought her multiple batphones and just testified in front of the Grand Jury about it.

The only thing worse than the craziness of this case is someone taking cues from the craziness of this case. KH's case seems more and more like Casey's by the moment...I am just thankful there aren't sunshine laws in Oregon. I can't handle craziness in two cases right now. Casey's is more than enough, lol.

And man you guys were so right about the emails. Just wow and whoa!

This brings up something that I was thinking on this morning. Why exactly does the SA and the Sheriff and the Bar and most importantly the judge, let some of this nonsense keep continuing, and pass without action or judgement? The overwhelming obstruction of justice, the downright complicity after the fact, the lies to authorities, the cheating and skirting the rules as an expected privilege? It is setting up a road map for the next high profile case, such as the Kyron Hormon one to do it further and do it worse. Slap it down now and make an example of them all. This sort of behavior is NOT tolerated in our system of justice. We have rules, we have decorum. They must be followed or you may face that system yourself

 

[whiteangora]

snipped by me/bolded by me

it wasn't a supportive kind of hand holding though IMO, and I don't think he was telling her not to change her story, was he?Yes, that is exactly what he was trying to tell her! She would not stop talking long enough for him to get in a word edgewise. Yuri was trying to get her off the crazy train and let her know none of the people she was discussing even existed! He was trying to bring her back to reality. Also, she was going on TV saying she knew who had Caylee and she was disrupting the investigation. I was shocked at the time when I saw it, if I'd been Cindy I think I would have cried. I thought the other officer seemed really nice and understanding about taking down everything she knew, though. I mean, they'd asked her to provide the information she knew for the timeline, that was why she was there, and she was trying to do that. She clearly thought they really wanted to know and that somehow this would help lead them to Caylee.

Can you imagine if your grandchild was missing, you were completely exhausted and obviously very worried, and you were trying desperately to help with the timeline, racking your brain for everything you could remember, and then one of the detectives came in and suddenly got all impatient and grabbed you by the arms like that, Yuri did not grab her by the arm, he held her hand, she even put her own hand on top of his hand initially and he did not barge in the room and grab her as you suggest. He was there trying to speak to her for quite a long while before her held her hand. Even then she would not hush up and let him speak, that was when he held her other hand trying desperately to get her attention.

getting in your face and telling you if it was from Casey it was all lies so basically why even note any of it for the timeline? What a shock it must have been for her. Perhaps there is more than one version of this video floating around? The one that I have watched several times does not resemble your description whatsoever. Why would Cindy be shocked to hear that her daughter had lied? You mean to say that Casey had never lied to anyone before? If YM didn't want to know, why ask, or why be in the room? MOO Not faulting him in general, but I was shocked at that. The only shocking part of that video to me was that the detectives used such restraint and patience with an impossible and uncooperative woman.

This sounds interesting about the newly released "in between" interview. OK, off to catch up.

Red Bold= me

 

[RR0004]

[/B]

Armchair Private Investigators... welcome to the cyber age

wild

DC needs to learn "IMO"!!!!!!!!!!