2011.06.06 Sidebar (Trial Day Eleven)

[Mountain_Kat]

The stinky squirrel was striking at midnight on Clickorlando.com. BUt nothing exciting came out of it.

Sounds like spy lingo. "The stinky squirrel strikes at midnight."

 

[Chili Fries]

i thought this was interesting
http://www.forensicdna.com/Timeline020702.pdf

New York v. Castro: first case in which DNA admissibility challenged. This set in motion standardization and quality control guidelines for DNA labs and the general forensic community.

I guess i think you gotta start somewhere, or else never go forward with new technology

But you have to judge each individual technique on it's own merits. That is based on the research and protocols which buttress any relatively new technique.

If I were a juror I would find Casey's own words to be the main reason I would be strongly leaning toward guilt at this point. I just haven't heard anything that definitively says there was a dead body in the trunk (although I believe there was as merely a trial watcher who does not have the weight of deciding justice on my shoulders). I would discount the tow yard worker's testimony because his credentials were vague. I would question George's testimony because he didn't immediately call 911 for whatever reason. And, as I have posted today, I would have reservations about Vass' testimony. I believe there was also a forensic technician of some sort who also testified about decomposition but I can't judge his testimony because I wasn't able to pay attention to it.

 

[catnron]

What about when Baez asked DR. Vass if he Knew of a Dr. Vass and DR. Vass replied to Baez " I am DR. Vass" I laughed so hard my ribs hurt!

 

[Intermezzo]

During Dr. Vass's testimony, IIRC, he said the chloroform had a high evaporation rate and that the high levels achieved "over time". That said, to me, this was used over and over and over. To add to that, I believe he said at some point over the course of 8 hours of testimony, he referred to it as not only chloroform, but "manufactured chloroform". Anyone else catch it?

yes..he said something about in the manufacturing of the product or chloroform..something along those lines

 

[darnudes]

I think Baez not letting Sims up there goes back to the Frye hearings - Jeff Ashton was able to rattle her so badly that it was actually a tie between her and Baez about which one was actually worse. Baez was slightly ahead on those hearings. Sims really was a joke at them but I couldn't see how she would have done any worse today than Baez. Now Baez has lost credibility with the jury and why wouldn't they be thinking like us - the spelling, the objections, the sustaineds, the objecting to his own question, running back and forth to Sims, it was an absolute farce!

And ICA is perfectly happy with that display today as she gave Baez a big tap and a good job.

 

[Darla]

My niece would like to know who the African American is that sits in the front row, second seat on viewers left. Is he a journalist? He sits in the same seat every day.

 

[Emeralgem]

What about when Baez ask DR. Vass if he knew DR. Vass and DR. Vass replied " I am Dr. Vass.. I laughed so hard my ribs was hurting!

I missed that..

 

[ami]

Was there any explanation for those? I find that very strange.

(cur | prev) 17:55, 6 June 2011 97.104.160.149 (talk) (6,402 bytes) (undo)
Country: United States
State/Region: Florida
City: Deltona
"Arpad A. Vass, Ph.D., is a research chemist scientist, a bichemist [sic] and forensic anthropologist based at the Life Sciences Division of Oak Ridge National Laboratory (ORNL), in Oak Ridge, Tennessee."

(cur | prev) 17:55, 6 June 2011 97.104.160.149 (talk) (6,403 bytes) (undo)
Country: United States
State/Region: Florida
City: Deltona
Arpad A. Vass, Ph.D., is a research chemist scientist, a biochemist and forensic anthropologist based at the Life Sciences Division of Oak Ridge National Laboratory (ORNL), in Oak Ridge, Tennessee.

(cur | prev) 17:56, 6 June 2011 96.57.103.174 (talk) (6,381 bytes) (undo)
Hostname: vpn.jlshapiro.com
ISP: Optimum Online
Country: United States
State/Region: New Jersey
City: Rahway
Arpad A. Vass, Ph.D., is a research scientist and forensic anthropologist based at the Life Sciences Division of Oak Ridge National Laboratory (ORNL), in Oak Ridge, Tennessee.


(cur | prev) 17:57, 6 June 2011 97.104.160.149 (talk) (6,393 bytes) (undo)
Country: United States
State/Region: Florida
City: Deltona
Arpad A. Vass, Ph.D., is a biochemist, research scientist and forensic anthropologist based at the Life Sciences Division of Oak Ridge National Laboratory (ORNL), in Oak Ridge, Tennessee.

(cur | prev) 17:58, 6 June 2011 64.79.101.174 (talk) (6,377 bytes) (undo)
Country: United Kingdom
State/Region: London, City of
City: London
Arpad A. Vass, Ph.D., is research scientist and forensic anthropologist based at the Life Sciences Division of Oak Ridge National Laboratory (ORNL), in Oak Ridge, Tennessee.

 

[Themis]

:floorlaugh:In keeping with the "Websleuthmyster's montra"..I am going to take a wee break..and wish to congratulate DT/namely JB for assisting the Courts of Justice to bring Decomp ability proof to the table!!..I always try and look at the "Bright Side" of the issues..just as I watched the introduction of DNA to the Courts..I have been so Blessed to witness this :blushing::tyou::websleuther::fireworks:

With that,salute for awhile:seeya:

You watched the introduction of DNA to the Courts! :woohoo::goodpost::cheer:

THIS WAS A HUGE DAY FOR THE LAW!!!! :toastred:

 

[Intermezzo]

Dr Vass "I get paid to think outside the box, I don't even know what the box is"

Beautiful!

DH and I just loved :great: when Dr Vass said that

 

[marspiter]

I'm wondering if the JB solo show is what seems to have pushed HHJP to decide that "school is over!" I think the judge may have been expecting a more varied parade of lawyers from the defense team to be on display. The fact that the inexperienced and grossly unqualified JB is seeking to single handedly defend a capital case has got to be alarming to the judge?

Which kind of leads me to a legal question. Doesn't CM being the only DP qualified attorney on the DT mean he has to be 1st chair? So why isn't CM more involved during the trial?

That or can JB try the case as 1st chair with CM "coaching" him?

 

[darnudes]

The one that made me really really laugh today was the poster here who said something about "Mr Snugglephgus" and Sesame St after Baez tried 2/3 times to pronounce the Greek gentleman's name. That comment killed me.

 

[RR0004]

Were the As in court today?

 

[The Eunice Burns]

But you have to judge each individual technique on it's own merits. That is based on the research and protocols which buttress any relatively new technique.

If I were a juror I would find Casey's own words to be the main reason I would be strongly leaning toward guilt at this point. I just haven't heard anything that definitively says there was a dead body in the trunk (although I believe there was as merely a trial watcher who does not have the weight of deciding justice on my shoulders). I would discount the tow yard worker's testimony because his credentials were vague. I would question George's testimony because he didn't immediately call 911 for whatever reason. And, as I have posted today, I would have reservations about Vass' testimony. I believe there was also a forensic technician of some sort who also testified about decomposition but I can't judge his testimony because I wasn't able to pay attention to it.

I disagree, but for the sake of brevity and not rehashing what others have said before......I'll keep it to this.......

Simon Birch was an excellent witness, IMO. He was well spoken, very clear and concise on procedures, and offered testimony based on his experience at the tow company and as an employee of a waste management company. I don't think the jury would/will discount his testimony. MO

 

[Girlrilla]

Mt. Kat - kc hired JB after he came highly recommended from other inmates @ booking.

And at the time it wasn't a death penalty case. Once it became that she should've taken a public defender.

 

[WholeLottaRosie]

What is remarkable about this morning is, no matter how technical things became, everyone, with the exception of the DT, enjoyed listening to Dr Vass. Not only this, but I am sure the jury want to hear more just to hear him speak, he is one of the most fun and interesting witnesses thus far. He exudes personality and super intelligence, I am in awe of the man, Baez can only look foolish trying to discredit him.

I am not too concerned about Baez interrupting, we just got to see Dr.Vass for longer.

I will be forever grateful to Dr. Vass as my 13 year old was riveted to his testimony, making notes and is just a fire with a renewed interest in science. We are going to have a fun summer, I am going to be reading here and then off to find some things for her to do.

 

[momtective]

I've been thinking: We're ten days away from when dear Caylee was taken from this world. I will be glued to the computer on June 16th. It won't slip the jurors minds to pay close attention to ICA on this anniversary as well.

Although I'm sure the DT will come and read here and prep their client to behave in the appropriate "mourning" manner...One week from Thursday will be a day when the world will be closely focused on ICA...my guess is she will cry a river that day...and that day only. At her attorneys urging, I strongly suspect she will have a complete breakdown in front of the jury. Yes indeed this is sure to be a red letter day for the defense. :banghead:

 

[cecybeans]

I'm wondering if pool supplies were purchased on one of those two dates. IIRC, in the emails collected from Cindy's mom, there was mention of the pool being put into use the first weekend of June. In other words, while Cindy has tried to make everyone believe that they religiously put the ladder on and off the pool, those emails make it appear that the pool may have only first been used for the season, beginning the first weekend in June.

For one thing, I doubt ICA would be buying pool chemicals with her stolen money (the way nobody believes she needed a shovel to suddenly dig up bamboo roots), and I'm assuming that all pertinent videos in discovery relate only to the defendant.

Secondly, the swimming season in FL starts long before June. A lot of snowbirds swim during the Christmas holidays if the weather is decent (even though it makes the residents nuts).

Discovery in a Sunshine Law state is kind of a double-edged sword. Some things are not released into discovery if they are part of an on-going investigation or if they are too inculpatory/inflammatory. Which means things we have not yet seen could either be completely immaterial or incredibly significant. The videos of ICA shopping with stolen money would not have the same impact of a video showing her purchasing a mask and chemicals to make chloroform. So it could either be nothing at all or something really significant. I'm also wondering as to why they were released relatively late in the discovery process (4-11) but it could be the same reason.

For some reason (and I'm hoping it's just not complete incompetence), JB was anxious to have Dr. Vass linger all day on the stand answering idiotic questions and belaboring points in a way that only a fool of an attorney wouldn't realize was alienating a jury and ruining his credibility. Maybe he was simply trying to delay the inevitable. But this is also the second day the dog handler people have had to wait outside to testify and go home without being in court, so I'm assuming the state had planned on getting through the lab stuff and the dog stuff by tomorrow. Maybe whatever is coming after that is of huge concern to the DT.

 

[sorrell skye]

I was going to put all of Dr. Vass' awesome quotes in my siggy, but then I realized that it'd take up a page or two.

Which ones were your favorites?

Ashton: "Remember when your deposition was taken by Mr. Baez?"

Dr. Vass: "The inquisition you mean?"


If anyone can resist the torture of the Comfy Chair, it's my man Dr. Vass.

 

[Nali87]

I can't wait to see how the state will do in cross-examinating the defense witnesses.