A rather "personal" question about female part

[southcitymom]

inserting a finger into your own vagina is definitely possible, past the entrance where the hymen is, correct?

but if you vigorously scratch the area, what could happen to the hymen?

Some females could bust their hymen with a vigorous scratch.

 

[voynich]

I didn't see a post about a hymen being near the cervix, but in real life it is nowhere near the cervix!

deedee deleted her post as I was responding to it but this is an excerpt

I'd say she knew about douching because people who knew Patsy said she did it to JB after she soiled herself.
But to suggest that JB eroded her own hymen through masturbation is particularly vile, as well as being impossible. Her fingers would not reach her hymen.
I've said this before, but you choose to ignore it. The hymen is NOT near the opening of the vagina and no where near the clitoris, where pleasure is most felt.


But I don't think that a 6-year old would reach it with her fingers.


.

Deedee told this me before in an earlier post but I didn't believe it.

The nosle of a douche could expand the diameter of the hymen. JB might self-douche as well.

 

[redeemed]

N.B (My husband will probably throw a fit if he saw where this conversation is going (LOL)...but I'm doing it for JB's sake...so here we go )

Yes-it is possible to go past the hymen...but then in a child of that age, how likely is it???

From what I know-there are different types of hymens....also, it is a FACT that some females are born without them...
some types are more fragile than others (the hymens that is-not the females...we are all tough!!)
http://www.livestrong.com/article/12495-the-vagina/

Please look at the diagram at the above site...
You will realise that the cervix is waaaaaaay above the vaginal opening...

The average length of vagina in a woman who hasnt had any children is around 3 inches..
if she's had kids this could stretch to around 4 inches...
(BY LENGTH I MEAN FROM THE EXTERNAL OPENING TO THE CERVIX)..
were Jonbenet's fingers 3 inches long? or even 2 inches long? I dont think so...

 

[Sophie]

I gather that little girls' arms are short and hands small in relation to their size so self-penetration isn't that easy and, furthermore, as we have discussed on here ad nauseam, there is a difference between clitoral masturbation and vaginal masturbation. The latter would be painful for a little girl as she doesn't have the hormones that make that pleasurable and would have a hymen to negotiate. The vagina itself isn't that sensitive even for grown women. This, in part, is presumably is why the experts (see ST's book) concluded that self-manipulation was unlikely to have caused the erosion to JBR's vagina. I guess it's possible but it's not the most likely cause of the erosion by any stretch of the imagination.

All sorts of things can damage the hymen, but, in the 72 hours before Christmas, we are not aware of JBR engaging in any activity that would damage her hymen, and if she had been horse-riding or somesuch, we'd have heard about it. In fact, it would have been shouted from the rooftops.

JBR's parents wouldn't entertain the mere notion that she had been abused. We know she would ask anyone to wipe her after using the loo. She was found crying about not feeling pretty just days before Christmas.

Patsy had had menopause and anecdote suggests that she was a prude in many ways so it's unlikely that she would have had occasion to discuss menstruation with JBR or that JBR would have had occasion to experiment with her mother's 'supplies.' I guess older girls might have discussed this stuff in her presence but she wouldn't have access to these supplies at home.

Douching and cleaning by digital penetration are other matters entirely.

 

[Sophie]

Voynich, could you not have just added this to your other threads about female masturbation?

 

[voynich]

Redeemed, Sophie,

what's more likely, secondary DNA transfer in 3 incriminating location, or primary transfer?

What's more likely, JR somehow abusing JBR by inserting his huge fingers into her 6/0 vagina, eroding but not actually breaking her hymen, or her hymen diameter being naturally larger than average, or it is the result of masturbation, douching, vaginal itching, rough activities, dance, or another child exploration, experimenting with tampon insertion, etc.

As adult women, do you think you could insert your finger into a 6 y/o girl vagina, who might be squirming or moving or kicking or whatever, without actually rupturing it?

Was JB perfectly motionless and still when JR allegedly inserted his finger into JB vagina? If so how did he pull that off? Could PR's douching nozzle expand the diameter of her hymen? Maybe the R's did murder JB, but some unknown third party was playing with JB sexually.

JB had a another girlfriened Megan


"Barbara Kostanick was the mother of a playmate of JBR's. She asserted: "The day before Christmas, JonBenet was at our house playing with Megan. The kids were talking about Santa, getting all excited. I asked JonBenet if she had visited Santa Claus yet. She said, “Oh, Santa was at our Christmas party the other night.” Megan had seen Santa at the Pearl Street Mall, so we talked about that. Then JonBenet said, “Santa Claus promised that he would make a secret visit after Christmas.” I thought she was confused. “Christmas is tonight,” I told her. “And Santa will be coming tonight.” “No, no” JonBenet insisted. “He said this would be after Christmas. And it’s a secret” (Schiller 1999:38-39).

I'm not saying Megan did it but JB obviously had other same-age female friends.


Maybe another girl and JB explored one another's vaginas. Another girl's much smaller 6 y/o female fingers would be more likely to not break it.

How old do girls start exploring other girls bodies?

Maybe JB played tickle games with same age-mate peers.

Since JB is a bedwetter and had issues with soiling, that could be a source of irritation there.

 

[Sophie]

Don't I know it, Sophie. At this point, I don't think there's enough soap in the world to get me clean again. But if it could lead to a final resolution, then damn the torpedoes.

ITA.

It's just that we have had loads of this stuff recently, culminating, IRC, in someone suggesting that we make a model vagina to test various ideas.

Sometimes it feels like we are violating JBR all over again with this discussion of her personal habits and I'll admit to worrying that we are doing JBR a disservice since the hymeneal erosion isn't going to solve this case either way.

Anyway, I'll depart the thread with the point that, whatever caused the damage to JBR's vagina, had she turned up in an ER with the damage, it would have been investigated so presumably the medical profession doesn't view masturbation as being the most likely cause of this sort of damage in little girls.

ETA: Hope you had a happy holiday, Davexxx

 

[redeemed]

ANYTHING IS POSSIBLE VOYNICH...SERIOUSLY ANYTHING...
lets not forget the "erosion" of the hymen... even if her hymen was naturally larger than normal, where did the erosion come from then??? something must have caused it...

 

[Sophie]

And as a postscript, the erosion of JBR's hymen is not especially RDI. It could point to a 'friendly' intruder who had close, unsupervised contact with JBR. Which is why the IDI insistence on trying to prove that the erosion was innocent is completely risible.

 

[voynich]

ANYTHING IS POSSIBLE VOYNICH...SERIOUSLY ANYTHING...
lets not forget the "erosion" of the hymen... even if her hymen was naturally larger than normal, where did the erosion come from then??? something must have caused it...

Maybe from douching. Maybe from some sort of cleaning after urination and/or soiling.

What would have been the diameter of her hymen had no "sexual abuse by JR" occurred? How many mm of erosion do we need to account for?

IMO the suspiciously similar handwriting of PR and RN is the only evidence that links R's to the crime

 

[voynich]

And as a postscript, the erosion of JBR's hymen is not especially RDI. It could point to a 'friendly' intruder who had close, unsupervised contact with JBR. Which is why the IDI insistence on trying to prove that the erosion was innocent is completely risible.

And hence, the fugitive and the secret visit of Santa. IDI is one thing I'm a JIDI. I'm not ruling out that possibility. I even said R's could have murdered their own daughter not knowing about previous injury from perhaps an unknown friendly intruder.

 

[voynich]

Sophie, Redeemed,

do you agree with your fellow Dark Lord of the Spin Darth Deedee

But to suggest that JB eroded her own hymen through masturbation is particularly vile, as well as being impossible. Her fingers would not reach her hymen.
I've said this before, but you choose to ignore it. The hymen is NOT near the opening of the vagina and no where near the clitoris, where pleasure is most felt. But I don't think that a 6-year old would reach it with her fingers.

Do you agree with this Spin? You may consult medical references on vaginas and hymens. Is this true or is this an RDI spin and campaign of misinformation and counter-intelligence and tactics?

 

[redeemed]

I just looked it up " The median hymenal diamter of a virginal woman is 25mm"...
But ofcourse there are anatomical variations...

 

[redeemed]

Sophie, Redeemed,

do you agree with your fellow Dark Lord of the Spin Darth Deedee



Do you agree with this Spin? You may consult medical references on vaginas and hymens. Is this true or is this an RDI spin and campaign of misinformation and counter-intelligence and tactics?

I agree with the Spin :woohoo::woohoo::woohoo:

 

[redeemed]

[ame]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zse71uC0XuU&feature=related[/ame]

 

[redeemed]

I havent given up on you- Voynich..We'll get you on our side...sooner or later..
Ive given up on HOTYH , though...

 

[voynich]

I havent given up on you- Voynich..We'll get you on our side...sooner or later..
Ive given up on HOTYH , though...

LOL

is this Redemption or is this Seduced by the Dark Spin of the Forensics?

 

[southcitymom]

deedee deleted her post as I was responding to it but this is an excerpt



Deedee told this me before in an earlier post but I didn't believe it.

The nosle of a douche could expand the diameter of the hymen. JB might self-douche as well.

I see. Yes, IMHO, the hymen could be reached with a six-year-old's hand. Katrinka's post on the hymen's location spells it out well - the pictures are also helpful.

 

[voynich]

I see. Yes, IMHO, the hymen could be reached with a six-year-old's hand. Katrinka's post on the hymen's location spells it out well - the pictures are also helpful.

Makes you wonder what other untrue spins the Spin hold. :waitasec:

As Deedee states, she made the same claims in other posts (that the hymen is near the cervix and cannot be reached by a 6 y/o) and other RDI Spin Lords did not contest her claim (they accepted it without argument) given they are mostly women, it makes me wonder how this is something they could be believed.

Twised, by the Dark Spin, RDI is.

It takes a JIDI to fight the Spin.

 

[southcitymom]

Makes you wonder what other untrue spins the Spin hold. :waitasec:

As Deedee states, she made the same claims in other posts (that the hymen is near the cervix and cannot be reached by a 6 y/o) and other RDI Spin Lords did not contest her claim (they accepted it without argument) given they are mostly women, it makes me wonder how this is something they could be believed.

Twised, by the Dark Spin, RDI is.

It takes a JIDI to fight the Spin.

I am a bondafide "who the hell knows."