a view from the inside: observations from our own court observers #4

[Paintr]

The Alexander family side consists of their family/friends and media.
The ja side consists of her mother, aunt, and one or two others. The rest of the seats are the public. That's the side I always sit on. We are also told where to sit, we can't go in and sit where we like. It's pretty controlled. I've not talked to anyone who is a supporter of ja. I suspect one person who was there a few days may have, but she never revealed it. It was just a gut feeling.

TYK Pasa. I wondered who all those people sitting on the defense side were. :floorlaugh: I just couldn't believe they chose to sit there to show support for her.

 

[PASA]

I'm going to share a piece of why I sit in the courtroom with the family offering support. For those who haven't seen it, this is a Victim Impact Statement I wrote in 2009 after one of my sister's killers was released from Death Row on a mental retardation claim. So it makes more sense, this hearing for this MR issue (for both of them, not just the one who got it, it was argued for BOTH) lasted 7 years and I'm told cost taxpayers around 10 million dollars. It was decided by ONE Judge who was retiring right after this hearing..actually stayed on just to complete it. She was a known DP opponent and imo, just wanted to go out with letting one person off death row which she did. We tried to get her thrown off due to her multiple expressions of obvious bias thru the AZ Supreme Court but it didn't happen. There's so much more to it but this one part that you will see edited in, speaks to why I do what I do for the Alexander family.

Respectfully snipped...

I'm so sorry you had to go to Florence alone. I wish I'd known you then. I would have gone with you for support.
I wonder how these so called champions for R.A. would feel if he started conning them, or their daughter. I hope to God he never gets paroled. If I'm in any way able to go with you and you want me to, I certainly will be there for you.
:hug::hug:

 

[PASA]

Julie made comment Dr Drew that the folder under as JD says "her hiney" had something to do with financial gain... maybe she smuggles her "art" out so it's not folded to take away from its value?? :floorlaugh::floorlaugh:


That Julie so-called-friend-of-Travis is so bogus and annoying.

MOO

I met her for the first time after the Dr. Drew show. She out of the blue told me a couple of things about myself that she would have no way of knowing. It isn't anything she could have read anywhere or been told by another. Is she legit? I dunno, just passing along my experience with her.
I do have to say she is stunning in person, and very nice.

 

[Kaddy Wonders]

Thank you for making this clear explanation! :tyou:

Does borderline mean bordering on sociopathy (psychopathy)? Or on the border between two "-pathies"? :doh:

KCL sent a great link defining BPD, which led to ask Mr. Google, "Why is it called 'borderline'?" I'm going to paste what I found and feel free to ignore this bunny trail.

The term "borderline" was first used by early psychiatrists to describe people who were thought to be on the "border" between diagnoses. At the time, the system for diagnosing mental illness was far less sophisticated than it is today, and "borderline" referred to individuals who did not fit neatly into the two broad categories of mental disorder: psychosis or neurosis.

Today, far more is known about BPD, and it is no longer thought of as being related to psychotic disorders (and the term "neurosis" is no longer used in our diagnostic system). Instead, BPD is recognized as a disorder characterized by intense emotional experiences and instability in relationships and behavior.

Many experts are now calling for BPD to be renamed, because the term "borderline" is outdated and because, unfortunately, the name has been used in a stigmatizing way in the past. Suggestions for the new name have included: "Emotion Dysregulation Disorder," Unstable Personality Disorder," and "Complex Posttraumatic Stress Disorder."


BBM Quoted from About.com

 

[Renee110]

Hi Katie:seeya:

Borderline makes sense but so does pathological narcissism - love to know which subtype you and others think could be applicable to Jodi Arias - personally I'm leaning between amorous and unprincipled.:what:

Other theorists have identified two types of narcissism: Those narcissists who have been diagnosed with narcissistic grandiosity express behavior "through interpersonally exploitative acts, lack of empathy, intense envy, aggression, and exhibitionism."

While on the stand under cross exam Jodi Arias was defiant and her supreme distain for Juan Martinez unmistakable e.g. the smirking - mocking of questions, etc.

IMO the killing was all about Jodi's rage filled hatred of Travis for calling her out on her LIES, MANIPULATION, SCAMMING, SKANKY-NESS, etc.

Narcissistic personality disorder - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Yes!!!! I do believe that word hatred perfectly describes it. She does not in any way show emotion when she hears his voice (sex tape) or sees his picture. My mother passed away 4 years ago and I feel like someone kicked me in my gut when I smell her clothes, or hear her voice in a tape or something. I've seen nothing from JA but contempt. And this was someone she "loved". And I keep seeing "something" that she sometimes shows that seems like she is GLAD and HAPPY he's gone. She does not miss him one bit. Almost proud. I train horses and have all kinds of animals and I've never seen animals act this way. It's weird.

 

[PASA]

Because he sold himself for money. Because instead of giving an IMPARTIAL evaluation as he was supposed to, he decided that she would have PTSD and fit everything she said or did in her life around this bogus diagnosis. It's not about how much money he got, it's about being a shill instead of a professional for a little fame and fortune once his book flew off the shelves as the guy that treated Jodi Arias. Whatevs.

That is the problem I have with him too.

 

[deedee21]

Would someone be interested in starting a new thread. What will Jodis reaction be when she hears GUILTY? Im not able to.

 

[katiecoolady]

Respectfully snipped...

I'm so sorry you had to go to Florence alone. I wish I'd known you then. I would gone with you for support.
I wonder how these so called champions for R.A. would feel if he started conning them, or their daughter. I hope to God he never gets paroled. If I'm in any way able to go with you and you want me to, I certainly will be there for you.
:hug::hug:

Thank you Sweetie...I really had no time to ask anyone to go with me as I literally decided to go at midnight the night before. I printed out my statement and read it over the phone to my friend as I drove down there. He won't get paroled ever as once he completes this 25 year min. sentence he starts the next 25 consecutive one. Now had she ruled concurrent he could have been up for parole for real...terrifying.

Thanks for the <3

 

[PASA]

I think the cart then the horse, in that order, crossed over that borderline back in NJ and went on a cross country pioneering expedition all the way to AZ with that wagon full o' unethics.

And a mouthful of new dental work. :floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

 

[katiecoolady]

KCL sent a great link defining BPD, which led to ask Mr. Google, "Why is it called 'borderline'?" I'm going to paste what I found and feel free to ignore this bunny trail.

The term "borderline" was first used by early psychiatrists to describe people who were thought to be on the "border" between diagnoses. At the time, the system for diagnosing mental illness was far less sophisticated than it is today, and "borderline" referred to individuals who did not fit neatly into the two broad categories of mental disorder: psychosis or neurosis.

Today, far more is known about BPD, and it is no longer thought of as being related to psychotic disorders (and the term "neurosis" is no longer used in our diagnostic system). Instead, BPD is recognized as a disorder characterized by intense emotional experiences and instability in relationships and behavior.

Many experts are now calling for BPD to be renamed, because the term "borderline" is outdated and because, unfortunately, the name has been used in a stigmatizing way in the past. Suggestions for the new name have included: "Emotion Dysregulation Disorder," Unstable Personality Disorder," and "Complex Posttraumatic Stress Disorder."


BBM Quoted from About.com

As a former Psych RN, I'd call it "wreak as much havoc on everyone around you disorder" and the treatment "get as far as possible from this person". I know that sounds completely uncompassionate and I guess it is. It is a very destructive diagnosis and I'm talking for the world around them.

Think Alex in Fatal Attraction. And I don't think that character was as evil as Jodi Arias.

 

[Renee110]

She could easily be both anyway but there's been recent research into a new type of psychopathy typically found in females that closely mimics the aspects of borderline too. FWIW

Samuels didn't do any of the forensic psychological assessments for psychopathy (PCL-R and PPI-R) and the current DSM doesn't consider it a psychological diagnosis so the MCMI wouldn't show it as even a possibility either. But we agree again, small surprise!, she's very likely afflicted with comorbid Cluster B (in addition to psychopathy, imo).

(My ex is dx'd as aspd/npd but I believe him to be psychopathic too. Lotsa peeps think aspd is the same thing but they're really not - just very closely related. The new version of the DSM due out in May is likely to throw all this out too as the definitions for psychopathy and antisocial are being combined.) Dr. Robert Hare, famous for his extensive research into psychopathy, hypothesizes up to 80% of all criminals could be diagnosed with aspd but of those, only 20% are also psychopathic.

The scariest statistic comes next...those 20% are responsible for 50% of the most serious crimes.

GREAT post! Thank you!

 

[deedee21]

Yes!!!! I do believe that word hatred perfectly describes it. She does not in any way show emotion when she hears his voice (sex tape) or sees his picture. My mother passed away 4 years ago and I feel like someone kicked me in my gut when I smell her clothes, or hear her voice in a tape or something. I've seen nothing from JA but contempt. And this was someone she "loved". And I keep seeing "something" that she sometimes shows that seems like she is GLAD and HAPPY he's gone. She does not miss him one bit. Almost proud. I train horses and have all kinds of animals and I've never seen animals act this way. It's weird.

The only time I saw anything in her eyes is when she looked at JM from the witness stand. She hates him. She hates how smart he is.

 

[katiecoolady]

And a mouthful of new dental work. :floorlaugh::floorlaugh:

hahahahah!!!!

 

[katiecoolady]

Thank you, and my apologies in advance for my other, semi-snarky post about no one answering me, ha ha. Sorrrryyyyy!

So then people KNOW that a cameraman is all up in their space?? That would feel very awkward I'd think.

The cameras are so far away , you really don't even think about them. Unless you are a malignant Narcissist and I'm sure then you're all in to them.

 

[Sleuth13]

I found a news piece about Juan Martinez & his huge popularity. It shows him posing for pictures outside the court building & walking back to his office.

He's so nice!

http://bcove.me/u34jwenl

Thanks for sharing this!!!!

(I loved the part about his office getting so many calls/messages from people volunteering to work with him!! LOL!!)

 

[Renee110]

RBBM

I think you totally nailed it. There's a theory out there I've honestly mostly ignored until seeing the Doc testify. Theory goes disordered personalities tend to gravitate towards other disordereds. Sometimes too disordered personalities are actually attracted to career fields in psychology and psychiatry in a subconscious attempt to self-medicate.

I personally think Dr. Samuels motivation for testifying goes beyond dollar signs. I believe he probably is afflicted with NPD and saw a chance to live his moment in the limelight, on the national stage, touting his 'vast expertise' and 'superior intellect'.

It explains, for me, why he had a hypothesis before any assessment and sought only to prove his theory correct. Without a very defensive defense it's unlikely he would have been called to testify and he would've missed out on the spotlight.

Like most narcissistic personalities he couldn't possibly see he'd instead be made into a laughingstock of epic proportion. Likely instead he feels he's done amazingly well on the stand, all things considered, like the mean, mad Martinez questioning him with such veracity.

I agree. I don't think the money is the motive here. He is too motivated. He's getting paid regardless of effectiveness of his testimony. Something else is driving him, and I think you hit it out of the park with like attracts like and his moment in the spotlight. This is probably the highest profile case he's consulted on and there are cameras in the courtroom and yes, <modsnip>

 

[katiecoolady]

Sorry to quote myself, but can SOMEONE answer this for me??

TIA.

The cameras are back in the far left up in the corner. Left of the jury and right of the witness stand up by the ceiling. But there is a whole separate audio visual room as you enter the courtroom to the left where there are cameramen who operate those cameras. Also at times there is a tripod with a still photographer to the left of the family/media section of the courtroom. Now THAT one I am aware of as it's often right next to me and you can hear the soft click click clicks when something happens.

 

[katiecoolady]

I agree. I don't think the money is the motive here. He is too motivated. He's getting paid regardless of effectiveness of his testimony. Something else is driving him, and I think you hit it out of the park with like attracts like and his moment in the spotlight. This is probably the highest profile case he's consulted on and there are cameras in the courtroom and yes, I think there is some (gag) attraction to the ugly a$$ heifer.

How about his "no more memory problems than you do" not once but TWICE to Martinez. Whiny snippy for a professional psychologist. Wah.

 

[katiecoolady]

Discounting the entire defense psychological theory, one step at a time. It's great!

http://kristinarandle.com/blog/jodi-arias-essays/

This was a great find...I read all of the articles this afternoon...thanks to the finder!

 

[Sleuth13]

She'll file a restraining order against the needle.

Baaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaahahhahahaaaa!!!!!!!!!!!!!! :floorlaugh: :floorlaugh:

And if that doesn't work she'll try to seduce it!!