Actress Natasha Richardson UPDATE has passed away after skiing accident

[southcitymom]

I knew Canada was going to feel some heat from this story, but I find it misguided. Canada has a terrific healthcare system. Nothing we know indicates that any negligence took place on the part of anyone - ski resort employees OR health care workers.

This was by all accounts a tragic, bizarre accident. Plenty of folks have checked in on this thread to tell of other closed head injuries that have seemed very minor at first but wound up causing a person's death. Several years ago a good friend of mine had a seizure in a movie theatre bathroom and struck his head on the floor when he fell. There wasn't a mark on his head and yet he went into a coma that lasted 3 weeks. Contrarily, my youngest son once hit his head hard enough on a fireplace hearth to bleed like a spouting geyser, require staples, raise a massive goose egg and bruise terribly - but he never lost conscience or even felt dizzy.

As for Natasha not wearing a ski helmet and not wanting help - I'm sure if I were taking lessons on a bunny slope, I wouldn't think a ski helmet necessary and if I felt fine following a spill, I wouldn't want medical help either.

Maybe we will here more about how she hit her head. My continued prayers to the family.

 

[Penelope]

I am an American living in Canada in a rural area about an hour outside of Winnipeg. We have a hospital about 7 miles from our home, but it is only equipped with the basics -- X-ray machine, blood/urine lab, ekg. They recently opened a Cancer Care department where patients can go for Chemo. Anything more serious than that, a patient must be transported by ambulance into Winnipeg-- a drive than can take about an hour to an hour and a half, depending upon the hospital one is being transported to. Once when my husband went into respiratory distress, they had to drive him to Winnipeg accompanied by a doctor because they did not have the equipment to put him on a respirator. Emergency in these small hospitals can mean very basic emergency treatment-- no surgeons, etc. If you live up in Northern Manitoba in a really remote area, you have to be Medi-Vaceed by airplane to the hospital in Winnipeg for anything beyond basic treatment.

The point of what I am saying is that, according to reports in today's NY Times, once Natasha Richardson experienced a severe headache and vomiting, tshe was taken by ambulance to a "small hospital" in St. Agethe, Quebec. She was then "stabilized" and "sent by ambulance to a major medical center 50 miles away in Montreal."

By then, it was probably already too late. Dr. David J. Langer, the director of cerebrovascular neurosurgery at St. Luke's-Roosevelt Hospital in NY city, is quoted in the article as stating "Epidural hematomas do show up in CT scans, and surgery is needed quickly -- ideally within the hour -- to relieve the pressure, remove the clot, and stop the bleeding." Unfortunately, I would doubt the small hospital had a CT scan and by the time they got her to Montreal, it was probably more than 2 hours after the fall had occured.

It's just the way the Canadian system works. I am sure if she had fallen in Vail, Colorado, she would have been taken to Denver for treatment. Vail may have a helicopter to transport her -- in Canada, the medical system does not have funding to offer emergency helicopter transport in small rural areas -- there are just too many smal towns, clinics and hospitals.

My prayers go to her and her husband, sons and family.

 

[fran]

Broadway dims lights for Natasha Richardson

NEW YORK – Broadway theaters dimmed their lights in tribute to Natasha Richardson, the Tony-winning actress who died from bleeding in the skull caused by the fall she took on a ski slope.

<<<<<<<<<<<<<full article at link>>>>>>>>>>

http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20090320/ap_en_mo/natasha_richardson

 

[JBean]

I knew Canada was going to feel some heat from this story, but I find it misguided. Canada has a terrific healthcare system. Nothing we know indicates that any negligence took place on the part of anyone - ski resort employees OR health care workers.

This was by all accounts a tragic, bizarre accident. Plenty of folks have checked in on this thread to tell of other closed head injuries that have seemed very minor at first but wound up causing a person's death. Several years ago a good friend of mine had a seizure in a movie theatre bathroom and struck his head on the floor when he fell. There wasn't a mark on his head and yet he went into a coma that last 3 weeks. Contrarily, my youngest son once hit his head hard enough on a fireplace hearth to bleed like a spouting geyser, require staples, raise a massive goose egg and bruise terribly - but he never lost conscience or even felt dizzy.

As for Natasha not wearing a ski helmet and not wanting help - I'm sure if I were taking lessons on a bunny slope, I wouldn't think a ski helmet necessary and if I felt fine following a spill, I wouldn't want medical help either.

Maybe we will here more about how she hit her head. My continued prayers to the family.

I live near one of the finest trauma centers around, but it had no bearing on the fact that my gf's son died of the exact same thing. He hit his head on a hard surface, but there was just no outward sign that it was anything at all or that it was a sigificant injury, let alone life threatening. Cripes I have done more endos on my own mountain bike and slammed my head while snowboarding and have never considered medical treatment.

This is one of those awful tragedies where hindsight is 20/20

 

[hannahsnana]

It seems that any time there is a death considered by the public 'untimely', that many people immediately start in with the the 'woulda, coulda, shoulda'. Human beings don't like to think that they cannot stave off death by taking extraordinary steps to prevent it. In other words, if this happened to her, it could happen to me. Yes, you could have worn a helmet, gone to a different hospital, and the next day get hit by a car while crossing the street. We as humans do not always have control over death, our own and others'. This is what many appear unwilling to accept.

 

[OrdinaryLife]

This tragic accident and death is just that. Tragic accident. I think many times, especially when it is a celebrity, people try to place an understanding and subsequent responsibility on others. I don't think anyone should be held accountable, but a lesson should be taken in. No matter how "innocent" a head injury is, get it checked out. It may cost some time at an ER, but it is your health that matters. And, as in this case, your life. I can honestly say that if this had happened to me, I would have refused medical help believing I just had a stupid and embarrassing accident. That I would be fine. Sadly, now I know that would have be an extremely stupid thing to do.

I place no blame on anyone. I wish this family such healing. My prayers for the pain and loss that they must go through.

 

[Glow]

It seems that any time there is a death considered by the public 'untimely', that many people immediately start in with the the 'woulda, coulda, shoulda'. Human beings don't like to think that they cannot stave off death by taking extraordinary steps to prevent it. In other words, if this happened to her, it could happen to me. Yes, you could have worn a helmet, gone to a different hospital, and the next day get hit by a car while crossing the street. We as humans do not always have control over death, our own and others'. This is what many appear unwilling to accept.

I agree. It helps our own anxiety when we can find a "reason" or place responsibility somewhere. Truth is, accidents happen. They just do. That is why they are called accidents.

 

[SuziQ]

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/03/21/health/21richardson.html?hp

The actress Natasha Richardson, who died on Wednesday from a brain hemorrhage after a fall on a beginner&#8217;s ski slope in Quebec, was not admitted to a hospital until nearly four hours after her accident, according to ambulance dispatch records obtained by the New York Times on Friday.
That is nearly three hours later than the timeline officials at the Mont Tremblant ski resort, about 90 minutes north of Montreal, offered on Tuesday, the day after Ms. Richardson&#8217;s fatal fall.
The first paramedics to arrive were turned away after Ms. Richardson declined treatment, ambulance records show, though they reported seeing the 45-year-old actress briefly from a distance. In that instance, they said they saw her sitting on a stretcher &#8212; not laughing and walking off her fall, as a resort spokeswoman said on Tuesday.
Those discrepancies seemed to introduce new questions about whether Ms. Richardson, who suffered an epidural hematoma &#8212; an accumulation of blood between the brain and the skull &#8212; after her fall, could have been saved had she been treated faster. (more at link)

ETA:
Questioned about the sequence of events, a spokeswoman for Mont Tremblant said on Thursday that the resort would no longer comment on the accident but would cooperate with any investigation.

 

[CyberLaw]

But one thing that people do not understand, is that when NR had a "severe" headache, the blood was already seeping into her brain and the brain was already swelling.

When the brain swells and bleeds it pushes down on the brain stem and causes a person to have problems breathing.

We have a trauma center in my city, it is equipped for Trauma, has the medical staff and highly trained doctors and equipment.

So what is critical is the hour that she was not seen by medical staff, in that hour she could have suffered enough trauma that if she did live, she may have had a very poor quality of life.

So don't blame Canada, not all provinces have air ambulances, like some provinces do.

A recent case in Toronto, a 16 year old died 10 days after he hit his head. the trial is underway as it seems that he may have been in an "altercation" that resulted in a fall. This was 10 days after the fall and this child and his family did seek medical care immediately after the "fall".

So no one can say "with 100% fact, that the delay in medical treatment or hospital treatment could have saved NR life.

I feel that since she showed symptoms an hour after the fall, the bleed in her brain "seemed" pretty bad.

I took a huge tumble when I first learned to ski. I did not have a helmet, ski patrol took me down, advised I go to the hospital, went to the hospital, decided I felt well enough to go home. My friend watched me. But that was my decision not to seek medical care. The same thing could have happened also.

The accident was tragic. But the talk and die head injury is not "new" to doctors and this circumstances is not new.

Rest in Peace Natasha Richardson.

I do hope that provinces make "helmets" mandatory. A child was killed a few weeks ago when his class went skiing, she hit a a tree and died.

Our Premier(Governor) made a comment that everyone should wear a helmet. He has been photographed after this incident "leading" by example and his kids wore helmets skiing and so did he.

 

[Zuckerschnecke]

I knew Canada was going to feel some heat from this story, but I find it misguided. Canada has a terrific healthcare system. Nothing we know indicates that any negligence took place on the part of anyone - ski resort employees OR health care workers.

This was by all accounts a tragic, bizarre accident. Plenty of folks have checked in on this thread to tell of other closed head injuries that have seemed very minor at first but wound up causing a person's death. Several years ago a good friend of mine had a seizure in a movie theatre bathroom and struck his head on the floor when he fell. There wasn't a mark on his head and yet he went into a coma that lasted 3 weeks. Contrarily, my youngest son once hit his head hard enough on a fireplace hearth to bleed like a spouting geyser, require staples, raise a massive goose egg and bruise terribly - but he never lost conscience or even felt dizzy.

As for Natasha not wearing a ski helmet and not wanting help - I'm sure if I were taking lessons on a bunny slope, I wouldn't think a ski helmet necessary and if I felt fine following a spill, I wouldn't want medical help either.

Maybe we will here more about how she hit her head. My continued prayers to the family.

Couple things I'd like to chime in on regarding this. One thing is that it's unfair to say, based on a few individual experiences, that Canada has in inferior health care system to the US. I could go on about the ineptness of the health care (providers) here but I won't. I'll leave it at that.

Secondly, I am an avid snowboarder and I was on a snowboarding trip Tuesday - yesterday, just as all this was happening with Natasha Richardson. It's very sad, I was very nervous the entire time thinking how easy it must be to have this kind of injury. I have to agree with the poster that said she must have taken a very unusual fall, or she was knocked out for a second or something. I don't think we are hearing the whole story or maybe no one saw exactly how she fell. If ski patrol was offering ambulances for every person that fell, or even fell and hit their heads, the mountain would be full of paramedics. And the flat, beginner areas are dangerous. If you have any speed going and are in a flat area, it's very easy to lose your balance and hit your head. Crazy as it sounds, you tend to fall easier on a bit of a slope.

Lastly, these comments about Canadian resorts not be liable etc, is bologna. It's very clear on the back of your lift tickets that they are not liable for injuries etc. I would like to see some facts stating that any guy with a hill in Canada can set up a resort and bring people in. Let's compare that to the Dave McCoy story and Mammoth Mountain and see what we come up with?

RIP, Natasha Richardson. If everyone would show such love and happiness in their eyes like she did.

 

[Marthatex]

Prayers to NR family, husband and her kids.

From some indications, the ski patrol and instructor thought her fall warranted a visit to a doctor and or hospital.

But during the period of lucidity, Natasha thought she was fine. By the time you realize something is wrong, it may already be too late.

Please don't blame the medical system of Canada or the Doctor. You can rapidly decline from this type of injury.

Apparently when she was transferred to Lennox Hill it was not for treatment. It was a place where the family could gather and say goodbye. If there was any chance of recovery, she would have been transferred to a hospital that specializes in brain injury.

When a person has "symptoms" of a brain injury, like bleeding into the brain, it could at that point be "too late" for recovery.

I certainly have no reason thus far to blame the Canadian system. An ambulance was called right away. Do you all have to wait in emergency rooms for hours like we do?

I do wish she could have been helicoptered to the hospital, but her symptoms weren't apparent at first and didn't warrant one I guess. To me it was the distance factor that killed her; the ski resort was too far from top flight medical care. she needed a CT scan immediately.

Just a shame, but honestly it's amazing it doesn't happen more often. I think beginners are more vulnerable to losing their balance and having a bad fall. IMO

When I think of all the times I have gone skiing without a helmet and my kids too; I go "hmm". Can't believe I didn't worry. I hope they do start requiring helmets, especially for little ones.

 

[Trino]

I am an American living in Canada in a rural area about an hour outside of Winnipeg. We have a hospital about 7 miles from our home, but it is only equipped with the basics -- X-ray machine, blood/urine lab, ekg. They recently opened a Cancer Care department where patients can go for Chemo. Anything more serious than that, a patient must be transported by ambulance into Winnipeg-- a drive than can take about an hour to an hour and a half, depending upon the hospital one is being transported to. Once when my husband went into respiratory distress, they had to drive him to Winnipeg accompanied by a doctor because they did not have the equipment to put him on a respirator. Emergency in these small hospitals can mean very basic emergency treatment-- no surgeons, etc. If you live up in Northern Manitoba in a really remote area, you have to be Medi-Vaceed by airplane to the hospital in Winnipeg for anything beyond basic treatment.

The point of what I am saying is that, according to reports in today's NY Times, once Natasha Richardson experienced a severe headache and vomiting, tshe was taken by ambulance to a "small hospital" in St. Agethe, Quebec. She was then "stabilized" and "sent by ambulance to a major medical center 50 miles away in Montreal."

By then, it was probably already too late. Dr. David J. Langer, the director of cerebrovascular neurosurgery at St. Luke's-Roosevelt Hospital in NY city, is quoted in the article as stating "Epidural hematomas do show up in CT scans, and surgery is needed quickly -- ideally within the hour -- to relieve the pressure, remove the clot, and stop the bleeding." Unfortunately, I would doubt the small hospital had a CT scan and by the time they got her to Montreal, it was probably more than 2 hours after the fall had occured.

It's just the way the Canadian system works. I am sure if she had fallen in Vail, Colorado, she would have been taken to Denver for treatment. Vail may have a helicopter to transport her -- in Canada, the medical system does not have funding to offer emergency helicopter transport in small rural areas -- there are just too many smal towns, clinics and hospitals. My prayers go to her and her husband, sons and family.

There are also rural areas in the US just as you describe where hospitals are just the basics. You are correct in assuming if this had happened near Vail, etc., NR may have been transported. However, she refused further medical treatment, so maybe not.

 

[Gracenote]

This wasn't the fault of Canada or the people involved imo, it's just that people die, disease, accidents, murder, freak events, we all go sometime and it never seems fair or right. I have fallen so many times and whacked my head; it's just dumb luck that I never had a serious injury. I will take it more seriously now, though. Also, regarding health care differences, my sister lives in a small town in GA that has no hospital. If you have an emergency it takes about 1/2 hour for an ambulance to arrive and equally long to get to a hospital. I hate it there, but she loves the country. Canada is an extraordinary beautiful place, and part of that is the pristine, remote places that restore the soul and rest the spirit. And the people are without equal.

This is just a sad, untimely death that we struggle to find an explanation for. My mother died suddenly a week after she fell here at home; my oldest sister died of cancer at 31. At least Natasha died in good spirits, she was having fun, she was laughing, and it was quick. I pray that is how I go rather than how my sister did. Still, my prayers are with her children and family; it's never easy to lose someone we love.

 

[Marthatex]

Whoa - I caught this article tonight. Now doctors are saying the fact that Quebec province doesn't have medical helicopters was indeed a factor.

One is quoted as saying Quebec is not set up for this type of trauma even as much as other Canadian cities are; and certainly not as much as the States. (US)

The drive to the two different hospitals took a huge amount of time.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/03/20/kin-friends-gather-for-ri_n_177517.html

 

[JBean]

Whoa - I caught this article tonight. Now doctors are saying the fact that Quebec province doesn't have medical helicopters was indeed a factor.

One is quoted as saying Quebec is not set up for this type of trauma even as much as other Canadian cities are; and certainly not as much as the States. (US)

The drive to the two different hospitals took a huge amount of time.

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2009/03/20/kin-friends-gather-for-ri_n_177517.html

>>Razek said immediate treatment might have helped Richardson but added: "There are so many variables it's hard to speculate what might have been done differently."<<

 

[CyberLaw]

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/bonnie-fuller/why-natasha-richardson-en_b_176665.html

Big question: Was there ever a chance to save Natasha Richardson's life?



If she hadn't insisted that she was fine and walked back to her room, could prompt medical treatment have made a difference?


Since initially there was no indication that Natasha's life was in danger, it's unlikely that she could have been saved. She would have needed to be rushed into the hospital and into a CT scan in a matter of minutes, according to Dr. Sun.


"If she had gone to the hospital and a CT scan indicated that there was bleeding, her skull would have been opened to relieve pressure, and she would have been given medication to relieve the pressure in her brain," he says.


Only then, would there have been a chance that she could pull through.


So, what would have had to happen is in my opinion: NR falls, hits her head, then feeling no symptoms at all, she would have had to be taken by air to a hospital and immediately given a CT scan, operation and medication.


But the "golden hour" is the hour that most likely killed her, as she was bleeding into the brain, but up to an hour did not feel any symptoms.


Or, in the first hour, she is rushed by ambulance to a hospital and a CT scan is done and treatment started.


But, she felt she did not need treatment.....until she did not feel well.


That is "a normal" decision, I probably would have done the same.

 

[southcitymom]

I agree that the only true chance she might have had to be saved would have been to get to a hospital for a CT scan right away. But why would you do that if you felt okay? I wouldn't.

 

[Marthatex]

>>Razek said immediate treatment might have helped Richardson but added: "There are so many variables it's hard to speculate what might have been done differently."<<

Well, let's face it; there's no way to know for sure if things had been different that she could have been saved.

And as CyberLaw points out, since she refused help to begin with, that lost alot of time.

Don't many ski areas have MD's available right at the ski area?

The best case scenario would have been a doctor or paramedic had examined her, realized she had had a serious blow; and then she would have been immediately transferred to appropriate hospital. Ideally by helicopter.

But since she turned away help, and then got very sick an hour later; at that point she needed help really fast. I'm sure she needed surgery to relieve pressure on the brain.

 

[Marthatex]

I agree that the only true chance she might have had to be saved would have been to get to a hospital for a CT scan right away. But why would you do that if you felt okay? I wouldn't.

The ambulance was there. Maybe a paramedic could have explained that just as a precaution it would be better to check it out; these things can be silent.

(There must be a reason the ambulance was called to begin with??)

I'm wondering why this doesn't happen more often - I wonder if she had a tendency to bleed or a weak artery.

 

[southcitymom]

The ambulance was there. Maybe a paramedic could have explained that just as a precaution it would be better to check it out; these things can be silent.

(There must be a reason the ambulance was called to begin with??)

I'm wondering why this doesn't happen more often - I wonder if she had a tendency to bleed or a weak artery.

I hear you Marthatex, but it's up to the patient. I think what happened to her is rare, but it does happen. Obviously, she took a tumble, but if she felt fine, she felt fine. If I took my sons to get a head scan every time they knocked their noggins, I'd be in the ER a few times a month.

I just feel like the only way she could have been helped is if she had felt badly right after or had some immediate symptoms that warranted further investigation. But from what I've read, in these type of cases, when the symptoms start to occur, it's almost always too late. That's one of the reasons they call it "talking and dying."