ADHD Is a Real Disease

[deanws]

:furious:

I typed something out and just hit delete because I don't want to be banned. THANK GOD FOR THE IGNORE BUTTON BECAUSE SOME PEOPLE WHO THINK THEY ARE SO EDUCATED SURE AREN'T.

Oh my dear friend Tennessee, you took the words right out of my mouth!

:clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap: :clap:

 

[Boyzmomee]

disabled????!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! people with adhd are DISABLED NOW???? that right there shows the cultural sterotypes towards this disease. most people with adhd are just intelligent, smart, capable as everyone else. they just have focus issues.

THANK YOU!!!

 

[Jolynna]

I have ADD.

And am and have been fully functional for years.

But, thank heavens for meds and behavior modification. I know what life was like before I got help. I know what life is like now.

ADD and ADHD are not about intelligence or capability. Many with ADD & ADHD are gifted creatively and blessed with an ability to think outside the box. As pedinurse said, it is a focus issue.

My experience is that it can be helped. But, there is no real cure.

My greatest challenge has been to accept myself as I am. And to forgive myself for sometimes falling short and forgetting not to interupt, or procrastinating etc. Unfortunately, you can't just take a pill and have the behavior instantly stop. Although there is a lot of information available offering practical strategies to live life in a more organized way.

 

[CaliKid]

I just want to jump in and say I have two sons who have ADHD. My oldest wasn't diagnosed until several years after he started school, but once he began taking Ritalin, of which he needed a low level, he was so thankful. He knew he needed help with his impulsive behavior and described it as living with uncontrollable urge inside to alway move around. And he could tell when he needed his meds too because they really helped him settle down.

 

[kcksum]

I would like to point out that anyone who takes ritalin and strattera and it has a calming affect on them, needs it because they have an obvious pharmacological imbalance. These drugs are amphetamines, if someone without add and the related dopamine issues takes them, they would be high as a kite and jumping off the walls. Because of the delicate imbalance in a add/adhd patients bio chemistry, these drugs cause the almost OPPOSITE affect of what they would on anyone else. An amphetamine is CALMING and provides focus to them. This above anything proves there is a definate chemical component to the disorder. I think these drugs were and are an excellant breakthrough in recent years for kids who would have been thrown in special ed or labeled as behavioral problems had we not realized their wonderful benefit in helping children. I am all for any medical intervention that improves lives. That's the wonder of medicine and research. Sure it will be abused and misdiagnosed, but you don't throw the baby out with the bath water and declair it un ethical because a few are misdiagnosed.
I commend parents who can take that bold and scary step to start their child on meds if the child needs it....we all want what's best for our kids....no one should judge what that might be unless they've walked in the person's shoes.
I have a 10 yr old son with PTSD because he was the victim of a violent crime, none of us would have survived the past 3 years had it not been for medication now and then. I caught hell from family and friends who had no idea what they were talking about, and who chastized my husband and I for giving him a psychotropic medication. He no longer requires meds, but there was a time when the child couldn't think about sleeping or being in the dark without them. I am so glad the meds were there when we needed them. No one should judge another parents choices, again, we all want what's best for them.

 

[deanws]

I would like to point out that anyone who takes ritalin and strattera and it has a calming affect on them, needs it because they have an obvious pharmacological imbalance. These drugs are amphetamines, if someone without add and the related dopamine issues takes them, they would be high as a kite and jumping off the walls. Because of the delicate imbalance in a add/adhd patients bio chemistry, these drugs cause the almost OPPOSITE affect of what they would on anyone else. An amphetamine is CALMING and provides focus to them. This above anything proves there is a definate chemical component to the disorder. I think these drugs were and are an excellant breakthrough in recent years for kids who would have been thrown in special ed or labeled as behavioral problems had we not realized their wonderful benefit in helping children. I am all for any medical intervention that improves lives. That's the wonder of medicine and research. Sure it will be abused and misdiagnosed, but you don't throw the baby out with the bath water and declair it un ethical because a few are misdiagnosed.
I commend parents who can take that bold and scary step to start their child on meds if the child needs it....we all want what's best for our kids....no one should judge what that might be unless they've walked in the person's shoes.
I have a 10 yr old son with PTSD because he was the victim of a violent crime, none of us would have survived the past 3 years had it not been for medication now and then. I caught hell from family and friends who had no idea what they were talking about, and who chastized my husband and I for giving him a psychotropic medication. He no longer requires meds, but there was a time when the child couldn't think about sleeping or being in the dark without them. I am so glad the meds were there when we needed them. No one should judge another parents choices, again, we all want what's best for them.

Exactly! Good post KC

 

[OneLostGrl]

I would like to point out that anyone who takes ritalin and strattera and it has a calming affect on them, needs it because they have an obvious pharmacological imbalance. These drugs are amphetamines, if someone without add and the related dopamine issues takes them, they would be high as a kite and jumping off the walls. Because of the delicate imbalance in a add/adhd patients bio chemistry, these drugs cause the almost OPPOSITE affect of what they would on anyone else. An amphetamine is CALMING and provides focus to them. This above anything proves there is a definate chemical component to the disorder. I think these drugs were and are an excellant breakthrough in recent years for kids who would have been thrown in special ed or labeled as behavioral problems had we not realized their wonderful benefit in helping children. I am all for any medical intervention that improves lives. That's the wonder of medicine and research. Sure it will be abused and misdiagnosed, but you don't throw the baby out with the bath water and declair it un ethical because a few are misdiagnosed.
I commend parents who can take that bold and scary step to start their child on meds if the child needs it....we all want what's best for our kids....no one should judge what that might be unless they've walked in the person's shoes.
I have a 10 yr old son with PTSD because he was the victim of a violent crime, none of us would have survived the past 3 years had it not been for medication now and then. I caught hell from family and friends who had no idea what they were talking about, and who chastized my husband and I for giving him a psychotropic medication. He no longer requires meds, but there was a time when the child couldn't think about sleeping or being in the dark without them. I am so glad the meds were there when we needed them. No one should judge another parents choices, again, we all want what's best for them.

Excellent post!

 

[CaliKid]

I would like to point out that anyone who takes ritalin and strattera and it has a calming affect on them, needs it because they have an obvious pharmacological imbalance. These drugs are amphetamines, if someone without add and the related dopamine issues takes them, they would be high as a kite and jumping off the walls. Because of the delicate imbalance in a add/adhd patients bio chemistry, these drugs cause the almost OPPOSITE affect of what they would on anyone else. An amphetamine is CALMING and provides focus to them. This above anything proves there is a definate chemical component to the disorder. I think these drugs were and are an excellant breakthrough in recent years for kids who would have been thrown in special ed or labeled as behavioral problems had we not realized their wonderful benefit in helping children. I am all for any medical intervention that improves lives. That's the wonder of medicine and research. Sure it will be abused and misdiagnosed, but you don't throw the baby out with the bath water and declair it un ethical because a few are misdiagnosed.
I commend parents who can take that bold and scary step to start their child on meds if the child needs it....we all want what's best for our kids....no one should judge what that might be unless they've walked in the person's shoes.
I have a 10 yr old son with PTSD because he was the victim of a violent crime, none of us would have survived the past 3 years had it not been for medication now and then. I caught hell from family and friends who had no idea what they were talking about, and who chastized my husband and I for giving him a psychotropic medication. He no longer requires meds, but there was a time when the child couldn't think about sleeping or being in the dark without them. I am so glad the meds were there when we needed them. No one should judge another parents choices, again, we all want what's best for them.

I have family members who constantly put me down for giving meds to my son, claiming I'm trying to turn him into a zombie. For us the Ritalin was a life-saver with both our sons, but I have heard of parents who overdosed their kids because they didn't want to deal with their ADHD issues. These children need to be carefully monitored, and doctors need to listen to the kids as well as the parents.

 

[calus_3]

As for family dissing your decisions.....screw them.

Doing nothing is sometimes not an option nor is whipping them, grounding them, taking away privliges, yelling at them, etc.

If the medications make your child a zombie.....they aren't working right...per my son's doctor.

The only thing that the medications did for our son was to make it so he could sit still and actually focus on the work/task at hand. He was finishing homework in 10 minutes that used to take him HOURS. His grade shot up....he felt better....he was less frustrated....he was less stressed....he was happier....he was succeeding. Now, let's hear someone say that all those things were just behavior problems....

Cal

 

[Boyzmomee]

I would like to point out that anyone who takes ritalin and strattera and it has a calming affect on them, needs it because they have an obvious pharmacological imbalance. These drugs are amphetamines, if someone without add and the related dopamine issues takes them, they would be high as a kite and jumping off the walls. Because of the delicate imbalance in a add/adhd patients bio chemistry, these drugs cause the almost OPPOSITE affect of what they would on anyone else. An amphetamine is CALMING and provides focus to them. This above anything proves there is a definate chemical component to the disorder. I think these drugs were and are an excellant breakthrough in recent years for kids who would have been thrown in special ed or labeled as behavioral problems had we not realized their wonderful benefit in helping children. I am all for any medical intervention that improves lives. That's the wonder of medicine and research. Sure it will be abused and misdiagnosed, but you don't throw the baby out with the bath water and declair it un ethical because a few are misdiagnosed.
I commend parents who can take that bold and scary step to start their child on meds if the child needs it....we all want what's best for our kids....no one should judge what that might be unless they've walked in the person's shoes.
I have a 10 yr old son with PTSD because he was the victim of a violent crime, none of us would have survived the past 3 years had it not been for medication now and then. I caught hell from family and friends who had no idea what they were talking about, and who chastized my husband and I for giving him a psychotropic medication. He no longer requires meds, but there was a time when the child couldn't think about sleeping or being in the dark without them. I am so glad the meds were there when we needed them. No one should judge another parents choices, again, we all want what's best for them.

Execellent post!

It's amazing that there are those chastizing parents for getting medical help for their children.

Would you not treat your child's diabetes, asthma, or cancer?

 

[czechmate7]

Execellent post!

It's amazing that there are those chastizing parents for getting medical help for their children.

Would you not treat your child's diabetes, asthma, or cancer?

I agree...I feel NOT treating your child is a form of child abuse.<~ok, that might be harsh, but I'm trying to make a point. I don't know if it's a "stigma" that parents don't want to have or their children to have, but if a child cannot be treated with alternative methods, for the sake of the child and their ability to learn and function properly, sometimes there are no other choices..

 

[pedinurse]

I agree...I feel NOT treating your child is a form of child abuse.<~ok, that might be harsh, but I'm trying to make a point. I don't know if it's a "stigma" that parents don't want to have or their children to have, but if a child cannot be treated with alternative methods, for the sake of the child and their ability to learn and function properly, sometimes there are no other choices..

I feel that not treating your child is not allowing them to be the best they can be - if they have truely have ADD / ADHD and need treatment. That is my personal opinion (aside from my professional opinion... if any of you notice my nickname above). I would never really tell that to a parent... when we have kids, we all have the right to make our own decisions about them. Not everyone will agree with those.
Yes, some children may really just need some behavior modification and are not really true ADHD children - and those children do not need meds. Many children with ADHD must have and NEED medication therapy to function in society and to learn. Those kids can't even function in their own home settings sometimes this condition can interfer so much in their lives. These kids don't do well in school because they are distracted - some kids may have trouble making friends sometimes too because of their behavior. The parents can get stressed out with the children due to the behavior the child exhibits, and that can effect relationships in the family - between the child and the parents, between the child and siblings too. And I think that is what is saddest about ADHD... especially if the parents choose not to treat them because of their own personal beliefs. Someone above noted that the meds have an opposite effect on true ADHD kids. This seems to be true, doesn't it? People without ADHD get on those drugs, and they are speeding around... but the children with ADHD go down...

You get the kids on the meds... they are attentive, they complete tasks, interact with their families, make friends appropriately. That's really important for kids. Childhood is about learning to be an adult. You can't do that if you're... distracted and living in a fog all the time.

 

[deanws]

I feel that not treating your child is not allowing them to be the best they can be - if they have truely have ADD / ADHD and need treatment. That is my personal opinion (aside from my professional opinion... if any of you notice my nickname above). I would never really tell that to a parent... when we have kids, we all have the right to make our own decisions about them. Not everyone will agree with those.
Yes, some children may really just need some behavior modification and are not really true ADHD children - and those children do not need meds. Many children with ADHD must have and NEED medication therapy to function in society and to learn. Those kids can't even function in their own home settings sometimes this condition can interfer so much in their lives. These kids don't do well in school because they are distracted - some kids may have trouble making friends sometimes too because of their behavior. The parents can get stressed out with the children due to the behavior the child exhibits, and that can effect relationships in the family - between the child and the parents, between the child and siblings too. And I think that is what is saddest about ADHD... especially if the parents choose not to treat them because of their own personal beliefs. Someone above noted that the meds have an opposite effect on true ADHD kids. This seems to be true, doesn't it? People without ADHD get on those drugs, and they are speeding around... but the children with ADHD go down...

You get the kids on the meds... they are attentive, they complete tasks, interact with their families, make friends appropriately. That's really important for kids. Childhood is about learning to be an adult. You can't do that if you're... distracted and living in a fog all the time.

Wonderful post pedi!

 

[Kim Ii]

Absolutely -- these children need to be examined thoroughly to find out the underlying CAUSES as to what is causing the disruptive behavior to occur. But -- a diagnosis by a psychiatrist, with NO PHYSICAL EXAMINATION HAVING OCCURRED, with no lab work, no MRI, etc., then proclaiming said child has a 'brain disorder," SORRY...this is just absolutely not an appropriate (nor should it be considered legal) venue for diagnosing ANYONE, let alone a young child.

I can't stress enough that medical students are not taught to diagnose ANY sort of physical disorder, including those disorders of the brain, using nothing more than a pad of paper, a pen and a few subjective questions. So please, do not misunderstand me when I state the above. I am certainly NOT stating that these children (as perhaps some of these poor Scientology kids) should go WITHOUT TREATMENT. I have stated these children need SOUND, APPROPRIATE MEDICAL DIAGNOSES...PERIOD.

My husband brought up a good point re: some of you who may be misunderstanding where I am coming from here. JUST because a Scientologist states, say for example, "The sky is blue today, " -- IF the sky is blue today, does this make it any less so simply BECAUSE a Scientologist said it was so? Of course not.

I LOATHE the cult, Scientology. Despise it actually. But this does NOT mean that CCHR, or any other person espousing PROPER medical intervention in the diagnosing of these children should somehow be disregarded simply because the Scientology groups ALSO espouse this same thing! While neither my husband nor myself, espouse most of the teachings of Scientology, they've GOT IT RIGHT when it comes to this issue. Now, if some Scientologists take this one degree further and do NOT intervene at all for their children who are obviously suffering, then this makes me truly sad. But I would rather see a child happy and content and properly cared for, sans medication, then see a drugged out, zombie-like child, on Schedule II drugs.

Read up on Kelly O'Meara's articles, and/or Evelyn Pringle's articles. There are PLENTY of medical investigative journalists out there who are trying to get the word out about some of the downright shameful practices SOME in the psychiatric/medical community are using, in the treatment and diagnosing of these children.

YES -- these 'ADHD' children are extremely difficult to work with. YES -- their behavior can and does, cause an untold amount of grief and despair in marriages and families. I know -- we went through the same thing and it almost caused our own marriage to dissolve into divorce on two separate occasions.

The Psychiatrist who diagnosed our son with ADHD, now that we know Ryan is NOT ADHD, should have his license to practice psychiatry taken away from him. I cannot tell you how much grief this man's mis-diagnosis of our son caused us in the way of academic issues, social issues, etc., for Ryan.

It was ONLY until I spoke with DREDF and received sound and common sense advice from one of its representatives, did we FINALLY see some light at the end of this very long tunnel.

 

[Kim Ii]

Here is an article I just found, and I feel it is completely appropriate to post it here.

Here is the link, then a snip:

LINK: http://ahrp.blogspot.com/2007_04_01_archive.html;

AND A SNIP:

..."Testimony by former drug sales reps and two new reports refute doctors' 'holier than thou' denials claiming that their professional judgment cannot be swayed by gifts and favors from pharmaceutical companies. An accumulating body of evidence is tarnishing the reputation of medical doctors whose drug prescribing practices are shown to be mostly (if not entirely) influenced by the drug industry."

"An article in The New England Journal of Medicine, reports the result of a national survey of 3167 physicians in six specialties (anesthesiology, cardiology, family practice, general surgery, internal medicine, and pediatrics) in late 2003 and early 2004. The survey was conducted by a team of Harvard affiliated physicians at Massachusetts General Hospital. They report: "Almost every doctor in the country has some type of relationship with pharmaceutical manufacturers, whose clear goal is to influence physicians to prescribe the company's newest, most expensive drugs. The companies offer physicians everything from scratch pads to trips worth thousands of dollars to attend medical conferences." [1, the article is accessible free of charge at: [Link]

"Most physicians (94%) reported some type of relationship with the pharmaceutical industry: most of these relationships involved receiving food in the workplace (83%) or receiving drug samples (78%). More than one third of the respondents (35%) received reimbursement for costs associated with professional meetings or continuing medical education, and more than one quarter (28%) received payments for consulting, giving lectures, or enrolling patients in trials. Cardiologists were more than twice as likely as family practitioners to receive payments."

"Psychiatrists whose extensive undisclosed financial ties to drug companies have been the subject of front page news reports. [2] [Link] Psychiatrists have repeatedly embarrassed journal editors by failing to disclose their financial ties to industry. (JAMA) [Link] ; [Link] One editor (NEJM) could not find a financially uncompromised psychiatrist to write a review of antidepressants." [Link]

"The inclusion of psychiatrists in the survey would, no doubt, have tipped even further the percentages of financially compromised doctors."

"Ahari notes that unlike the door-to-door vendors of cosmetics and vacuum cleaners, drug reps do not peddle their products directly to paying customers. They increase sales by influencing physicians who control access to prescription drugs. They do so with finely tuned doses of flattery, favors, feigned friendship, gifts and handouts. Those who pay for prescription drugs are bamboozled with slick advertisements but have no clue about what the drugs actually do--they assume their doctor does."

"A report by the General Accounting Office (2006) documented that in 2002 pharmaceutical companies spent $2.6 billion on direct to consumer advertising (DTCA) compared to $18.5 billion on marketing to physicians ($11.9 billion on promotion + $6.6 billion cost of "free" samples) --that's $30,000 per physician annually. In 2005, the amount spent on DTCA doubled: $4.2 billion on DTCA compared to $7.2 billion promoting drugs to physicians plus an unstated amount on "free" samples which in 2004 amounted to $15.9 billion." [3]


SO....NOTE...this survey appeared in THE NEW ENGLAND JOURNAL OF MEDICINE (NOT a Scientologist Magazine/Survey)...

 

[Kim Ii]

There's just so much more out there to prove my point re: the above. There is a book written by a former FDA physician, who spilled the beans on the FDA's safety and ethical/research practices. For the life of me, I just cannot remember the name of either this physician, or the book she wrote, but I'll find it, and when I do, I'll post the link here.

This information ALL ties in with what I am trying to say.

IF most of you could find help for your child/ren, that included a true and thorough physical examination (lab work, allergy testing, toxicities in bloodwork, etc.) and then perhaps found a medical protocol which would enable your child to thus eliminate the underlying biochemical mechanisms which MAY be causing a manifestation of so-called psychiatric/social issues, W/O THE USE OF DRUGS, wouldn't you have to state this would be the optimum vs. simply going to a Psychiatrist and then, ultimately, ending up with perhaps a false diagnosis and a Schedule II prescription drug to use, to boot?

Generation Rescue is a website that wasn't even up and running when we had our issues with Ryan. JB Handley appeared out here on varying news/TV spots, and spoke about his son's ADHD/autistic issues.

I have written and/or spoken with John Breeding, JB Handley, Dr. Fred Baughman, and many others, regarding this topic. I really tried to weigh in on both sides of the argument (pro vs. con/drug usage) and hands down, I came up with the fact that too many kids are on these drugs and quite probably, most of these kids have underlying biomedical issues which haven't even been diagnosed yet.

JMHO, of course, but I am deeply passionate about this. I have seen so many kids in our own school district just drugged out of their ever loving minds, bless their hearts. Are they doing any better than most of the other kids? NO.

If any given child could be best helped to lead a normal life, w/o the use of drugs, that should be the optimum choice. EVEN if a Schedule II drug seems to be helping, it most likely is simply maskinig the true biomedical issues these kids are suffering with. But you've got to understand how vaccines, drugs and other toxicities in our environment all play a part with the issues these kids have.

I've learned an incredible amount of information since I gave birth to our son a little over 14 years ago. Back then, if I even dared to mention, that we no longer vaccinated our son, I was ostracized by the other moms. It was awful.

NOW -- BIG DIFFERENCE in what I am seeing in the way of knowledge, just with the parents out here in the East Bay Area, as to the information they now have re: vaccines, biomedical issues, etc. So...word IS getting out there about all the above -- it just takes time.

 

[Kim Ii]

Well, yet again, that above link didn't go through.

Here it is again: http://ahrp.blogspot.com/2007_04_01_archive.html

 

[Taximom]

I think we get the point.

For now, all the doctors that two of my four children have seen have prescribed medications to help with their issues because we've looked at everything else. The medications have helped tremendously whether they are for ADD or seizures.

In all the years I've had to deal with doctors and specialists, I have yet to meet one that freely handed me a prescription the minute I walked in the door. It takes a lot of documentation, a lot of testing, and a lot of paperwork. By testing I don't just mean questionnaires. One of my children had to have a skin biopsy, and I was asked if she could undergo a muscle biopsy. I couldn't put her through that. If they insist doing that then I'll do it, but not for now.

I'm betting all the parents here discussing this struggled with the idea of medicating their child, probably even after their doctors suggested it. I know I did.

If this is such a problem in your school district then maybe you should present this information to them in a council meeting or PTA meeting.

 

[pedinurse]

Well, yet again, that above link didn't go through.

Here it is again: http://ahrp.blogspot.com/2007_04_01_archive.html

OK, Kim Ii... I think you've tried to pound your point into our heads for long enough. We get the picture. I still don't think that some of us agree with your point of view... at all... though. Here's the thing. This is a hot topic. Just like abortion, ect... there are going to be two sides that have good points to them, and both sides are going to continue on as they did before. I have to say though that I believe that with prudent medical care and with high quality ongoing supervision (and ongoing compliance on the part of the caregiver too) that children who are found to require ADHD medications can take those medications safely and effectively...
These medications do have a place in our society. Just like many other medications that are used every day in our society.

I have to say that personally, what irritates me the most... is that with conditions people don't "see" (ADHD, depression - heck some diseases like fibromyalgia) there can be so much stigma and people who just don't plan don't believe in treating those dieases when treatment can really be needed. This is my opinion is as a person in society. Not as a nurse. I remember growing up, and a neighbor of mine had fibromyalgia. She has died. She for a long time, she was mostly bedridden. She was very sick. I can remember going to block parties and other neighbors chatting about her - what was that disease, was it real... was she just a quack? She was so sick she couldn't even work sometimes, she had to take an early retirement / disability, she never left the house, she really couldn't be social, and ended up passing away at really a very young age. Very very sad. This whole discussion kind of makes me think of that case. Yeah, she did have a real disease.

No, medication alone doesn't "fix" ADHD... but used along with behavior modification, I think that all the cases.... described here even... show that it can do WONDERS!!!

 

[pedinurse]

IF most of you could find help for your child/ren, that included a true and thorough physical examination (lab work, allergy testing, toxicities in bloodwork, etc.) and then perhaps found a medical protocol which would enable your child to thus eliminate the underlying biochemical mechanisms which MAY be causing a manifestation of so-called psychiatric/social issues, W/O THE USE OF DRUGS, wouldn't you have to state this would be the optimum vs. simply going to a Psychiatrist and then, ultimately, ending up with perhaps a false diagnosis and a Schedule II prescription drug to use, to boot?

Kim, are you saying you believe that children who have ADHD, in your personal opinion, should not take prescribed drugs such as ritalin for the treatment of that condition? As a blanket statement? That these drugs, as a whole, SHOULD NOT be prescribed to children for the treatment of ADHD, even though it is thought that they are an effective treatment? I am just wanting to clarify. Or are you just irritated at the use of a psychiatrist? Because multiple people in the thread have discussed the use of doctors with medical practices (vs psychiatric practices) and you keep going back to that.