Allison Baden-Clay, GENERAL CASE DISCUSSION THREAD -#31

[Fuskier]

Still really bothers me about Allison being murdered at home while the children were there. I still have the thought of the possibility of Allison being murdered at the C21 office - (away from nosey neighbours and no close residential ppty there), her body loaded into the Captiva that was backed up to the lift well in the underground carpark. Children could have been left untended at home or with another party there watching over them. I am still not sure it was totally premeditated and planned to occur at that stage but who knows - maybe, just maybe. Guess the thought of children being present and not knowing whether they heard anything or not haunts everyone.

Just my speculation and a thought that remains in the back of my mind.
Woombite

Ditto WOOMBITE. If the children were at home, one wonders what they have seen or heard and whether this has been 'debriefed' in the eight weeks prior to the arrest of the alleged murderer. In addition, the unexplained screams still bother me as they were night piercing screams of someone in imminent danger. The screams heard were a female voice.
Hypothetically, I wonder if Allison could have been placed unconscious in the car which then travelled up around Rafting Ground road. She woke up unexpectedly, tried to escape, was caught - hence the 2 piercing screams and the third muffled scream. Was she murdered around there? Then placed in the car again? Just further speculation. My opinion only, not fact.

 

[J-Diggety]

Still really bothers me about Allison being murdered at home while the children were there. I still have the thought of the possibility of Allison being murdered at the C21 office - (away from nosey neighbours and no close residential ppty there), her body loaded into the Captiva that was backed up to the lift well in the underground carpark. Children could have been left untended at home or with another party there watching over them. I am still not sure it was totally premeditated and planned to occur at that stage but who knows - maybe, just maybe. Guess the thought of children being present and not knowing whether they heard anything or not haunts everyone.

Just my speculation and a thought that remains in the back of my mind.
Woombite

Has there been any suggestion the C21 office is a place of interest? I hadnt heard anything about this scenario anywhere.

I reckon if the great white fool has taken her life, he wouldn't think twice about who was in the house, asleep or not. Amatuer!

 

[Rational]

Hello everyone, how are all you lovely sleuthers today?

Hi Mini and Manni (oops Mani and Minni - so confusing):seeya:

I am glad you both said hello!
Thank you for thinking about us that cannot be in Brissie and :tyou: to all of you for the lovely gesture with the flowers!!!

 

[frustrated detective]

What a lovely post Cyansea.....I think you've described very well what this forum means to all of us. Allison represents all of us in many different ways, be it giving up what would have been a glittering career for her family, or staying with a partner, when you really deserved so much more respect and devotion, because you loved them very much (been there, done that!) etc. etc. Also LOVE the sleuthing going on at the mo.....great stuff - tossing ideas back and forth, providing previous posts and links and relevant articles etc. with quite a few 'funnies' interspersed....it's great reading, thanks everyone!

Love your 'name' Cyansea....hubby and I are are buying a boat when we've sold our houses this year, and I'd been tossing up calling her something related to Allison (as I don't really want MY name on it, as hubby suggests!) I was tossing around variations of Allison's names in my head, and 'A. Dickie' was passed over as not appropriate....then I thought of what had been done to my maiden name when a kid, and wondered what Allison might have had to put up with if her name was called out at roll call as A. Dickie....this is what makes her so very 'real' to us I feel, we relate to her in so many many ways, even silly little thoughts like this! (It crossed my mind that I could always name the yacht after GBC ie. 'A ' :what: *Wozzle slaps herself for being so facetious!*)

Special shout out to Marlywings and those with such extraordinary (and rapid) 'link-ability'...you have no idea how helpful it is to the forum (I, of course, remember all the things you link to.....but how to find them - and the time! - is completely beyond me! I actually wanted to find a 'dinosaur' for my avatar as I feel technologically challenged, but had to settle for 'Scrat' from Ice Age....who is a ridiculous and inept little fellow....but is amusing, means well and tries hard!)

On I go with the reading (wearing blinkers to dishes in sink...bird needing to be put out....dog hair on carpet....pile of washing....recycling bin overflowing....*sigh*.....)

How about calling the boat SUNFLOWER ... ?

 

[Mani]

How about calling the boat SUNFLOWER ... ?

You are giving me the chills - how beautiful is that! :woohoo:

What a beautiful thought

 

[minni]

How about calling the boat SUNFLOWER ... ?

I Love that

 

[Rational]

Rational -thinking of you today and all the members who are upstate, interstate and overseas - sending you all a big hug from Brissie xx

:tyou:

 

[Rational]

I find this post a real worry Angel1. I get what you mean about being annoyed at nosey neighbours, but do you not think that they might have just cared about your welfare?

The only experience I had (many many years ago) with neighbours calling the police, I was sooo grateful that they did. I think I was screaming for help, as my baby daughter was in the house, and my ex was barricading me from re-entering. There wasn't actually any physical violence going down at the time, but it was fast escalating to that point every time I tried to get inside, and there had been some serious threats involved.

The neighbours acted quickly and yelled that they had called the police so he took off, thank goodness. I was very relieved when the police turned up, though they were fairly blase about it, as he hadn't actually hit me or anything. They told me that most threats made are not carried out, which may be true, but at the time, it didn't give me much comfort.

That was the absolute last straw for me. I had actually already broken up with the guy, which is what had started the whole thing. He was supposedly there to retrieve his belongings. It was embarrassing, but I was really glad the neighbours had acted on what they heard.

I am certainly not trying to have a go at you for your post. I just find it really concerning that you'd want to be back with a guy who was violent to you for 6 years. Nobody should ever have to put up with that sort of thing in their life. Please, please take care Angel.

Lauramars
Thank you for that post.

Angel
I read your post yesterday and it upset me and didn't know how to respond, as I was at the same time worried for you and to a certain degree angry that even after reading all the stories on here and the way in which Allison ended her life that you could still think like that.

LauraMars put it beautifully and I hope you know that we are all hoping you will never out yourself in a situation where you willbe treated like that! It is not love, it is violence and no one should have to put up with that.

That's the difficult part about this kind of violence (I refuse to call it domestic violence or family violence as it IMO makes its somehow seem acceptable), and like Allison's mother said that's she wished Allison had talked about what she was dealing with and not kept so much inside.

I am sorry Angel that I did not respond straight away to your post as talking about it is always better than keeping it in, and maybe will allow you to move on. But please know you are never alone.

 

[Nads]

I didn't see any reports of this early on Maigret, just recently, which is why I found it even more strange, but I wonder if I've imagined seeing this, as can't find anything saying similar now.

Of course if it was/is there it could just be dodgy reporting. There are still lots of articles out there saying Gerard said she went for a walk at 10pm the Thursday night. It's hard to know what to believe sometimes with so many different versions of things flying around.

That's because GBC himself gave different versions of what happened, which of course is sus!

Do you mean reports of a police callout that night or the night before? I thought it was a local who reported it to us.

 

[MaxwellSmart]

Good Morning All

thanks to this forum I give extra thanks to the universe, that I live in a fairly cossetted world with no really "icky" stuff landing on our doorstep. There is so much wrong with this world with women bearing the brunt of dysfunctional male behaviour (but as mentioned earlier there are some female bullies who treat men disgracefully). My sister lives in fear of her ex (all three exes actually) so all her day to day decisions are influenced by this. Statistically most threats aren't carried through, but some are - as this site is testament to. It is this "possibility" that the ex might harm the children on the access visit that keeps these women in "line". How can we break this cycle?

In my opinion, if there is disharmony in the family then an outside person should know. I tell my Mum everything and this is at risk of her criticism of my husband, which in itself is a criticism of my choices - and no one wants to admit that they have made a bad decision (I have a great marriage but it suffers from a few issues that are being worked through - same ol' same ol' - money, alcohol and well-meaning but interfering in-laws).

If my sister had told me or my Mum what had been going on in any of her three marriages, then we would have presented a more united family front. but it only "came out" after the event. Our cries of "why didn't you tell us?" were met with a sense of shame that she had felt embarrassed and ashamed.... hard to put into words, but we all want to project to the world that all is ok.

My heart hurts when I think of the BC girls and how they will never have a mum hug again. When my son went to school camp last month all the kids were lined up ready to board the bus and of course working mothers didn't have to luxury of waving them off. I mingled and called out "anyone want a Mum hug?!" and I was swamped by hugs from 10 year olds. A mother's hug is where all is good in the world and you are safe (even at my age!!!).

On a speculative note, poor Allison's last dying thoughts perhaps would have been about whether the murderer was going back to do the same to her girls......... I would have been distraught that I was no longer going to be able to protect my children

Sorry about being such a bummer of a post but it really is in the disguise of a sense of gratefulness that our family unit is good. We often refer to ourselves as the Team - Together Everyone Achieves More. Just like this forum! There - a positive finish!!!

Better put some IMO's and MOO's in....

 

[grannie]

How horrible!! Yes, it is very risky to get involved.

But is it possible to call the police anonymously? I think, it is. If you call from a private number and state that it is an anonymous call, the police will take it. Most programs allow you to call back with a reference number to follow up for reports or add more information.

 

[LauraMars]

That's because GBC himself gave different versions of what happened, which of course is sus!

Do you mean reports of a police callout that night or the night before? I thought it was a local who reported it to us.

Nads I agree that the reason for all the conflicting reports may well be that GBC gave so many different versions to several people.

In regards to the report of a police call out (prior to GBC's call on the Friday morning) I did see the various mentions of it on here, but I also thought I saw or heard one report in MSM that the police had make a short visit on the Wednesday. I was a bit baffled by it, but I could well be wrong. I thought someone here had given a link for this also, but only the once.

 

[grannie]

I am too thanking all those who have gone to the cross to take care of the flowers. Great Australian spirit - that what it is!

 

[J-Diggety]

But is it possible to call the police anonymously? I think, it is. If you call from a private number and state that it is an anonymous call, the police will take it. Most programs allow you to call back with a reference number to follow up for reports or add more information.

The police can still get the "private number " if they have to. The information is still recorded, just not accessible to the general public

 

[LauraMars]

Ditto WOOMBITE. If the children were at home, one wonders what they have seen or heard and whether this has been 'debriefed' in the eight weeks prior to the arrest of the alleged murderer. In addition, the unexplained screams still bother me as they were night piercing screams of someone in imminent danger. The screams heard were a female voice.
Hypothetically, I wonder if Allison could have been placed unconscious in the car which then travelled up around Rafting Ground road. She woke up unexpectedly, tried to escape, was caught - hence the 2 piercing screams and the third muffled scream. Was she murdered around there? Then placed in the car again? Just further speculation. My opinion only, not fact.

Fuskier, I've often wondered if that was the case too, whether Allison was away from the house before actually being killed, either in the car or on foot. I don't think she would have left the girls home though, even if she knew she was in danger, so maybe it's possible she had been put in the car and then tried to escape, hence the screams heard near rafting Ground Rd (if they are in fact related) Those screams have always really bothered me though.

I've always had a strong feeling that she was somehow running or trying to escape, but I don't know if that feeling is in regards to actually physically running on that night, or if it's more that she had finally had enough and was going to leave him.

All MOO

 

[grannie]

GRANNIE: Well this is just so appropriate for both the women and men on this forum who are outraged by Allison's death and who support an end to violence against women. Women need to support women. We also need good men to support the end of violence towards women. What a timely conference. It would be great if websleuthers from this forum could attend just as suggested.

Thanks to all who support the idea. Now, it is 4 weeks away, so anyone who could attend, can you step forward, may be? I am not in QLD, so I won't be able to, but will happily contribute some $$. May be some members from QLD will express their interest, and then one candidate will be randomly picked? It's just one way to go, there always are other ways.

 

[Mountain Misst]

Fuskier, I've often wondered if that was the case too, whether Allison was away from the house before actually being killed, either in the car or on foot. I don't think she would have left the girls home though, even if she knew she was in danger, so maybe it's possible she had been put in the car and then tried to escape, hence the screams heard near rafting Ground Rd (if they are in fact related) Those screams have always really bothered me though.

I've always had a strong feeling that she was somehow running or trying to escape, but I don't know if that feeling is in regards to actually physically running on that night, or if it's more that she had finally had enough and was going to leave him.

All MOO

Forgive me if I'm out of line, however has the possibility of GBC running Allison down in the car been raised? It'd explain the car damage that he attempted to cover up by running into the wall (no brake marks) after the event.

 

[Mothergoose]

Lauramars
Thank you for that post.

Angel
I read your post yesterday and it upset me and didn't know how to respond, as I was at the same time worried for you and to a certain degree angry that even after reading all the stories on here and the way in which Allison ended her life that you could still think like that.

LauraMars put it beautifully and I hope you know that we are all hoping you will never out yourself in a situation where you willbe treated like that! It is not love, it is violence and no one should have to put up with that.

That's the difficult part about this kind of violence (I refuse to call it domestic violence or family violence as it IMO makes its somehow seem acceptable), and like Allison's mother said that's she wished Allison had talked about what she was dealing with and not kept so much inside.

I am sorry Angel that I did not respond straight away to your post as talking about it is always better than keeping it in, and maybe will allow you to move on. But please know you are never alone.

I too was quite affected by that post as I lived with horrific emotional abuse for 5 years with 4 young children to boot. There were many times .....oh how I wished someone HAD called the police. One night it escalated to physical violence and I then decided I was out of there. My children deserved better as did I. I left him the next day with a black eye and bruises all over my body.

Love this quote:-

"There comes a time in your life, when you walk away from all the drama and people who create it. You surround yourself with people who make you laugh. Forget the bad, and focus on the good. Love the people who treat you right, pray for the ones who don't. Life is too short to be anything but happy. Falling down is a part of life, getting back up is living.Being alive is a gift, living life happy is a choice."

Angel It's more probable than not that your neighbors were concerned for your welfare. I wish I'd had neighbors like that when I was in such a situation 30 years ago. I pray you will find peace, happiness and harmony in your life.

 

[louisepiglet]

I have no reason to ring the police but if i ever did have to i would ring 000 because i have no idea what the local number is. I have nothing against the police but i have been in a situation before where the nosey neighbours called the police because my husband and i were arguing. It had nothing to do with them and they would call the police almost every day. It got to the stage where we had to move away because too many troublemakers lived in the street. I put up with domestic violence for almost 6 years and would still do ANYTHING to be back with my ex. I loved him and still do love him more than anything in the world but it was embarrassing having the police turn up all the time because of interfering neighbours.:banghead: :banghead: :banghead:

Not long after we bought our house we replaced the carpet in the lounge room. The guy pulling up the old carpet called us in to have a look at the underlay. There was a huge ( and I mean HUGE) bloodstain in the underlay. When we asked the neighbours if they knew anything about it, they told us about the people who had previously owned the house. Apparently the man had been an extremely violent, jealous, controlling man, but the first our neighbours knew of it was when the wife's parents came one morning, after the husband went to work, to help her move out.
Our neighbours were amazed that they had not an inkling of what was going on and assured her parents that they would have phoned the police had they knew.
Angel 1, I think you were very lucky to have such caring neighbours. If they had not called the police things could have escalated to who knows where.
Hugs

 

[LauraMars]

Forgive me if I'm out of line, however has the possibility of GBC running Allison down in the car been raised? It'd explain the car damage that he attempted to cover up by running into the wall (no brake marks) after the event.

This possibility has been raised Mountain Misst, however the car he crashed near the police station was a friend's car, and has apparently been ruled out. I gather he borrowed it because both the family cars were impounded almost immediately after Allison's disappearance. I think he deliberately crashed that car to avoid going to the police station that first Sunday, as apparently he had a request from police to attend a second time for a more thorough forensic examination. (He had attended on the Saturday and given a DNA sample and had his scratches examined by a police doctor.)

There is/was damage on the front left of the Prado, but someone here reported that he crashed that one the week before she was first reported missing. The person on here that stated this said their friend had actually heard/witnessed this crash (somewhere near GBC's office)

MOO