Allison Baden-Clay - GENERAL DISCUSSION THREAD #40

[Makara]

Alioop, thanks so much for putting your notes together for us, it's very much appreciated. :tyou:

I find it very intriguing that there was internet activity recorded on Allison's phone at 6:31am from the FTP tower and also activity on GBC's phone at 6:32am on the Brookfield tower. IMO this would indicate that someone else had Allison's phone. GBC couldn't be in two places at once or that's exactly what he wants the Police to believe. His phone may have been at Brookfield but he was elsewhere with Allison's phone? OW and NBC were at the house looking after the girls while GBC was off driving around and either one of them could have answered or made a call on GBC's phone. They may have even called his phone themselves to set up an alibi for him. Far fetched I know, but nothing would surprise me with this lot. :furious:

I would love to know what kind of internet activity was recorded on Allison's phone. A FaceTime call, a search for maps? There are a couple of scenario's I can think of right now. Either someone has found Allison's phone, had a play with it and then ditched it or GBC had an accomplice who helped him shortly after Allison was murdered and into the early hours of Friday morning. I'm leaning towards the latter. I also hope that the Police have been able to obtain Nigelaine and OW's phone records. IMO they would be very telling.

MOO.

 

[Fuskier]

OK - just been for a bit of a drive around Fig Tree Pocket.

Yes - there is a large, but not awfully high, cell tower right where MountainMisst said it is - at the junction of the Centenary Highway (M5) and Fig Tree Pocket Rd, on the Kenmore side of the highway, near the playing fields and park. It looks like it has multiple transceivers on it - more than a lot of other towers, which would fit with a combined Telstra and Optus tower. There is also a much smaller cell tower on the actual overpass bridge itself - probably a different provider, eg Vodaphone.

I then took a drive down Fig Tree Pocket (FTP) all the way to the end at Lone Pine, down to the river, along the road past the Pony Club to Mandalay Estate as it used to be called, back up Jesmond Rd to Indooroopilly, then back all the way to Brookfield via FTP Rd again...

<respectfully snipped>

Bottom line - I think Mountain Misst is right, and that the cell tower next to the Centenary Highway/FTP Rd intersection is the FTP cell tower...

Great sleuthing DrWatson and MM. We are appreciative of your extended effort on behalf of WS members. With this information can we speculate how someone wanting to create a decoy with ABC's phone could connect with the internet in FTP at 6.31am? Which tower would it have been is the question?

 

[Amee]

The Courier Mail link Fuskier posted this morning isnt working on page 2. Is it just me or has it gone? I wanted to re-read it

 

[Curiousasacat]

The two different paper thing is strange.

You can still read it here - http://www.news.com.au/national/bri.../story-fndo4ckr-1226537242449?from=public_rss

 

[possumheart]

This is the Courier Mail I purchased this afternoon (cover image attached).

 

[Curiousasacat]

Interesting tweet.

Ashley McDermid&#8207;@AshleyMcDermid

New details emerge from Baden-Clay bail bid documents: Diary entries, mystery marks, even claims from an ex-govt minister. @9NewsBrisbane

 

[DrWatson]

Gbc had find.my friends app on phone but gbc said that app on his phone had never been used. So he lied in histext to Allison. Judge says that was pretty stupid of him to lie. Danny says yes and that gbc thought he may not havehad his phone tested. This is from my post #957 on the previous thread direct from the court room.

I just want to clarify given a post from Doc Watson about this app on their phones, that the police evidence is that GBC told police that the find my friends app on his phone had never been used. So it was inconsistent with his text to Allison. Either way he was caught out in a lie.

Thanks for clarifying that Alioop - yes, caught out indeed, whichever way one reads it!

 

[alioop]

I find it very intriguing that there was internet activity recorded on Allison's phone at 6:31am from the FTP tower and also activity on GBC's phone at 6:32am on the Brookfield tower. IMO this would indicate that someone else had Allison's phone. GBC couldn't be in two places at once or that's exactly what he wants the Police to believe. His phone may have been at Brookfield but he was elsewhere with Allison's phone? OW and NBC were at the house looking after the girls while GBC was off driving around and either one of them could have answered or made a call on GBC's phone. They may have even called his phone themselves to set up an alibi for him. Far fetched I know, but nothing would surprise me with this lot. :furious:

I would love to know what kind of internet activity was recorded on Allison's phone. A FaceTime call, a search for maps? There are a couple of scenario's I can think of right now. Either someone has found Allison's phone, had a play with it and then ditched it or GBC had an accomplice who helped him shortly after Allison was murdered and into the early hours of Friday morning. I'm leaning towards the latter. I also hope that the Police have been able to obtain Nigelaine and OW's phone records. IMO they would be very telling.

MOO.

I think that the police have their theories on Allison's phone connecting with the FTP tower and they are likely along the same lines as your fine theory. However there was no need to make mention of their theory in the bail application as it was not going to affect the outcome. Danny Boyle seemed pretty casual about this issue in court.

 

[STELLA85]

Interesting tweet.

Ashley McDermid&#8207;@AshleyMcDermid

New details emerge from Baden-Clay bail bid documents: Diary entries, mystery marks, even claims from an ex-govt minister. @9NewsBrisbane

from an ex-govt minister. Probably Flegg

 

[DrWatson]

Great sleuthing DrWatson and MM. We are appreciative of your extended effort on behalf of WS members. With this information can we speculate how someone wanting to create a decoy with ABC's phone could connect with the internet in FTP at 6.31am? Which tower would it have been is the question?

I would think that the tower would have been the one I saw at the intersection of Centenary Highway and Fig Tree Pocket road. As far as I could tell - and Mountain Misst's maps suggest also - there are no other cell towers in FTP.

BUT - the area of coverage of that tower would extend 360 degrees all around it, and NOT just to the suburb of FTP. I think that is what the judge was getting at with his comment about the connection not necessarily being from the postcode of Fig Tree Pocket.

As far as the Internet connection goes - I think the iPhone's Location Services use internet data as well as 3G data when available, plus GPS from the satellites. So that's one possibility - that the phone just automatically connected for the location services. Others would be something like checking email on auto, software updates, etc - all those are data services I think, as opposed to 3G call-type connections. And they happen automatically. So a dumped phone that is still switched on would do that.

And PERHAPS - that may explain something that puzzled me right from the outset. You may recall that the police were giving out that Allison's phone was in a radius that seemed way too big for the usual phone location functions, and that puzzled me - it should have been MUCH easier to pinpoint the phone. But if it was ONLY logged on to the FTP tower, and that tower would seem to have a large circle of coverage, then there are a lot of possibilities as to dumping places that would fall into that area of coverage.

The iPhone needs more than one tower to use triangulation for location purposes - but if it was ONLY the FTP tower, then the possible location of the phone would be huge. Not if looking WITH the phone, as you would have the satellite data available as well. But to the phone network, a single tower connection wouldn't pinpoint the phone - only that it was somewhere in the circle of coverage.

Hope all that rambling makes sense....

 

[Crime and punishment]

I didn't get the diary stuff in the NQ edition of the CM either.

 

[Amee]

10.14am: Triangulation of Mrs Baden-Clay's phone showed the handset was possibly in a four-kilometre radius to her home.

3pm: A second triangulation of Mrs Baden-Clay's phone returned the same result. A crime scene was declared at the Baden-Clay home and yard.

Read more: http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/que...d-badenclay-20120626-210bz.html#ixzz2F6cxdZdQ

how far is FTP from the home?

 

[ozazure]

Missing many comments so I apologise if someone has said this - does anyone else think Allison was copying those from a bigger list? Like it was therapy homework and she was detailing the ones that applied to her perhaps? Otherwise it reads very strange.

 

[Amee]

Missing many comments so I apologise if someone has said this - does anyone else think Allison was copying those from a bigger list? Like it was therapy homework and she was detailing the ones that applied to her perhaps? Otherwise it reads very strange.

When I had counselling to help me cope I had to write good and bad things about myself and the ex. I had affirmations pinned to a mirror to convince myself I was an ok person . Thoughts that popped in my head and feelings at the time Id write down. Id hate for anyone to read my diary. Personally I dont find it strange but thats just me. It depends on the therapist I guess they all have their different ways of doing things,
I did have "homework" set each week.

 

[possumheart]

A smart person would have hidden that phone in a taxi with the volume off, to go flat.

 

[STELLA85]

10.14am: Triangulation of Mrs Baden-Clay's phone 210bz.html#ixzz2F6cxdZdQ[/url]

how far is FTP from the home?

About 6ks

 

[Strangeworld]

I got slapped down when I mentioned Olivia being involved in the disappearance by the way she was seen in the interview with GBC stating he was 'just a little bit hurt, but he's ok.'

Also, was told Olivia didn't arrive in Brisbane until the following day after Allison went missing and there was no way she was involved! This is turning out to be quite the family affair.

As for the Dr he saw at Kenmore Clinics. If you don't know her, she is a beautiful Dr and I wonder if GBC tried to work his magic on her?

QUOTE:
#1093 05-03-2012, 08:30 AM
Strangeworld
Registered User Join Date: May 2012
Posts: 317

Through a friend of parents at the school, I was told that GBC's sister dropped the kids at school the day Allison was reported missing. Not necessarily normal or abnormal, given what was happening on that day, but just another piece of the puzzle.

END QUOTE

"Constable Ash said he first saw a woman he now knows to be Baden-Clay's sister Olivia Walton walk three children down the stairs and put them in a car."

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...baden-clays-face/story-e6freoof-1226537344568


The first quote was what I was told very early in the case. Team this with the reports in the papers today (the second quote) and I would say that OW was most definitely here in Brisbane the morning that Alison was reported missing, and to go out on a limb, I would suggest she was most definitely in Brisbane the night before.

 

[Thinking]

When I had counselling to help me cope I had to write good and bad things about myself and the ex. I had affirmations pinned to a mirror to convince myself I was an ok person . Thoughts that popped in my head and feelings at the time Id write down. Id hate for anyone to read my diary. Personally I dont find it strange but thats just me. It depends on the therapist I guess they all have their different ways of doing things,
I did have "homework" set each week.

Yes I didn't really find it strange either - to me some of the entries seemed like notes or points Allison had made of things that were upsetting her - as if she was told that she should write down every issue that she wants to discuss. That in itself can be therapeutic - actually identifying specifically what is hurting you and why you are upset.

She apparently drew lines through the points made - which to me made sense, as she probably went through the list in her discussions/sessions with GBC and crossed through them as she mentioned them. I have done this type of thing in preparation for meetings at work which have the potential to become heated or emotional, as a way of keeping my thoughts in order. It would make little sense to anyone else who read it. Hope this makes sense !

 

[DrWatson]

10.14am: Triangulation of Mrs Baden-Clay's phone showed the handset was possibly in a four-kilometre radius to her home.

3pm: A second triangulation of Mrs Baden-Clay's phone returned the same result. A crime scene was declared at the Baden-Clay home and yard.

Read more: http://www.brisbanetimes.com.au/que...d-badenclay-20120626-210bz.html#ixzz2F6cxdZdQ

how far is FTP from the home?

Fig Tree Pocket phone tower is about 4-5 Km away as the crow (and the phone signal) flies. Further by road though.

But there are closer towers, including at Brookfield. So if Allison's phone HAD been at her home, it would have shown up on about three towers and would have been much easier to locate. I live a VERY short distance from the old BC home, and I can get good location information while indoors - which is done with cell tower triangulation.

I think it should perhaps be pointed out that we could be talking about different things here:

1. the iPhone itself can derive its location, even when indoors with no satellite view, by triangulation from cell towers. That is the phone itself!

2. somebody WITHOUT the iPhone would need to detect the unique pings and codes coming from that particular iPhone and then try to triangulate it from OUTSIDE the phone - if you see what I mean. It's less accurate.

3. the NETWORK can only locate the phone to within a margin of error, and that margin depends on how many cell towers it is connected to at the time. Hence, if her phone was ONLY connected to the FTP tower, then it would leave a large margin of error - the whole area of coverage of that tower.

I suspect from what we've heard is that the police were able to try and apply number 2 above, by using Allison's iPhone ID and trying to locate it from outside the phone. The information we got from the bail hearing was that it had connected to the FTP tower using internet data (eg mail checking or something else on auto presumably) and was on there for about 13 hours till the battery ran flat. Which would be method number 3 above. Those two bits of information don't quite add up....

I think there is more that the police know about this, but they only gave out enough information to prevent bail being granted. No point in playing your whole hand if it's not needed.

I agree with Alioop - they know more than they're letting on.

 

[DrWatson]

I must admit to being a bit puzzled as to WHY Allison's diaries etc have been released to the public? Also those photos of GBC and the scratches.

Wouldn't they be deemed prejudicial? What is the reason for releasing those?