Allison Baden-Clay - GENERAL DISCUSSION THREAD #47

[AAAA]

Gulp! Anyone here go to the hairdresser wearing tracky- daks?
You have to be joking? No way.....!
Sorry the question remains.... anyone here go to the hairdresser wearing .....
Please forgive my conservative outlook. (My hair dresser appointments are a rare and very special treat)
And I believe that all about this is very important.
Not the rare bit, but because this shows that Allison cared about herself.
Not only cared about herself, but she was definitely NOT suicidal.
Because: Who would spend a huge amount on a special hair job, and then commit suicide?
It doesn't add up. Nothing at all adds up in fact.

Ladybird1, I don't for one minute believe the suicide theory either! And as far as trackies at the hairdressers, I go to the same salon and have in five years never seen anyone wearing trackies!

 

[LadyBird1]

Ladybird1, I don't for one minute believe the suicide theory either! And as far as trackies at the hairdressers, I go to the same salon and have in five years never seen anyone wearing trackies!

Hmm Thanks AAAA
Very interesting observation. Wearing Trackie-Dacks and visiting the Hairdressers do NOT go together IMO.
Gee whiz, you dress up, not dress down when you want to look good. I mean you don't wear pyjamas to visit the hairdresser?
Also, you go to a hairdresser because you want to look good. You care about yourself. You care enough about yourself that you spend money (big money) on yourself. (Another matter: this is NOT the stuff of suicidal tendencies)
You go to the Hairdressers and spend big, because.....
Oh and BTW will the kids notice? The gorgeous new fresh look?

 

[they'll get you]

Gulp! Anyone here go to the hairdresser wearing tracky- daks?
You have to be joking? No way.....!
Sorry the question remains.... anyone here go to the hairdresser wearing .....
Please forgive my conservative outlook. (My hair dresser appointments are a rare and very special treat)
And I believe that all about this is very important.
Not the rare bit, but because this shows that Allison cared about herself.
Not only cared about herself, but she was definitely NOT suicidal.
Because: Who would spend a huge amount on a special hair job, and then commit suicide?
It doesn't add up. Nothing at all adds up in fact.

THE BAZAAR thing is GBC knew exactly that Allison was wearing Lorna Jane 3/4 tights and specifically described them to the police!!!
These pants ARE worn by many in their day to day busy activities even to the hairdresser.
I don't like wearing good shirts to the hairdresser due to the dyes. I remember Allison having several colours in her hair including bleach foils.

 

[Tishy]

Sorry to disillusion anyone and maybe I am weird but yes, I have been to hairdresser in trackies; busy day, need to be comfortable running around like a Mad Thing, just squeezing in time for cut and colour; style it myself later before going out.
However.... how likely is that in this case? Not very, is my tip....

 

[Couldbe]

Sorry to disillusion anyone and maybe I am weird but yes, I have been to hairdresser in trackies; busy day, need to be comfortable running around like a Mad Thing, just squeezing in time for cut and colour; style it myself later before going out.
However.... how likely is that in this case? Not very, is my tip....

Agree Tishy.
The point that I meant to emphasize was "that then the other clothing that she had worn prior would surely have been there (or not there) to be examined by Detectives" .....
(a) the other clothing that Allison wore to Hairdresser should have been in the house (maybe in clothes basket) ......
(b) BUT, if she was still wearing it when she was 'killed' and GBC needed to dispose of it, then the Detectives should have noted that clothing wasn't in the house!
(c) So, it was either there / or not there!
(d) ..... if it wasn't there, then what had happened to it? ... a useful piece of evidence in the case!
(e) ... if it was there (where was it?), then did Allison remove it herself; (GBC said that when he last saw her she was wearing the trackie outfit);
(f) .... depending where that previously worn clothing was may be more of an indication of who had removed it!

JMO - So, it was either there / or not there! - that would be another clue to evidence in the truth within GBC's story about what she was wearing/and GBC's memory of the trackie outfit still on Allison.

AAA - Ah yes! the plant matter in her hair ..... good point! I think evidence presented at the Committal said that a plant growing next to the carport was found amongst that 'plant matter'.
I can't seem to find consistent info on where on Allison the plant matter was found ....... it seems that it may only have been in her hair, on her arms and on her body (not necessarily on the clothing; which would be a bit strange) ..... which to me, could mean that she could have been dressed in the trackie outfit following her death.
..... Why no emphasis on plant material caught up in the clothing fabric? Arms!?

 

[Trooper]

I am still happily waiting, rather like Madame de Farge at the guillotine, for this trial. I cant help it.. Mother Theresa I am not. I like it that Our Boy Gerard is still on his backside in remand, too.. that pleases me. His application for bail was a bad time, I couldn't have borne it.

What got me beady eyed about it was that first and only little clip of Gerard and the sweetly bosomed young lady reporter, Gerard skipping out of Olivia's car in a fever to blither... Olivia scrambling to catch up to him and tug on the back of his shirt...you could see right there, in a nanosecond, that He was nuts, She was nuts, and poor Alison was a goner. My hopes were that she was far, far away, with a capable solicitor, but ...

It was a pound to a penny that some other woman would suddenly erupt from the floorboards in a puff of sulphur, like a pantomime, in my most cynical fantasies I did not expect the sheer persistence and territorialism and ruthlessness of Ms Mchugh she was almost a caricature of all the extramarital bonks rolled into one looming parcel .

There are very very odd people on the inner fringe of this hideous murder... the dignity and sanity of Alisons family, the bewildered staff of the franchise, Alisons friends, merely point up the burbling stream of utter rubbish that has been cascading from poor Olivia's mouth, the Pastor husband, the Bwana and wife, the defence lawyer, the business associates, etc.. its like there is one world of normal and the other whirling world of a parallel universe that existed side by side up until that terrible moment...

I wait patiently... time stands still for no man...

 

[marlywings]

AAA - Ah yes! the plant matter in her hair ..... good point! I think evidence presented at the Committal said that a plant growing next to the carport was found amongst that 'plant matter'.
I can't seem to find consistent info on where on Allison the plant matter was found ....... it seems that it may only have been in her hair, on her arms and on her body (not necessarily on the clothing; which would be a bit strange) ..... which to me, could mean that she could have been dressed in the trackie outfit following her death.
..... Why no emphasis on plant material caught up in the clothing fabric? Arms!?

From the committal hearing report...

ALL six plant species found in Allison Baden-Clay's hair and on her body were found in the car port area of her backyard, the court has heard.

But four of those plant species could not have come from the Kholo Creek area at Anstead where her body was found.

Dr Gordon Guymer, director of the Queensland Herbarium, was given samples of plant material found in Allison's hair, arms and around her head to compare to plant species at her home and the Kholo Creek.

Dr Guymer visited both locations and listed the plant species found in each area.

He told the court only two of the plant species found on Allison's body could be found at Kholo Creek.

http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...-of-wife-allison/story-e6freoof-1226600463908[/QUOTE]

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=9064755&postcount=358"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - ***Day 5 -Committal Hearing*** 18th,19,20th March 2013***[/ame]

 

[marlywings]

More re the plants. From bail hearing docs...

Summary of plant matter

View attachment attachment.pdf

 

[Couldbe]

Thank you Marlywings
Unless the report is not all-encompassing, seems plant matter was found only found in Allison's hair, arms and around her head.
I do wonder why none was found stuck somewhere in her clothing or shoes.
Terrible thought, but maybe she was dragged by her feet/shoes, but one would still think the plant matter would have crept in between her trackie pants and the top she was wearing.
Just makes me think that the clothing was placed on Allison later; but still think Detectives would have been interested in the 'other clothing'/and if it was still there.

 

[marlywings]

Interesting reading back through the bail hearing docs. Hard to believe it's almost 12mths since the committal hearing. Even harder to believe it will be two years in April since Allison was murdered

If police retrieved the footage from this CCTV they would know what Allison was wearing at the hairdresser.

From hairdresser's statement...

17. We also have closed circuit television in the salon which I am aware that BM, the owner of the salon can operate.

View attachment attachment (1).pdf

 

[LadyBird1]

More re the plants. From bail hearing docs...

Summary of plant matter

View attachment 40389

Plant matter on hair, arms and head.
(Sounds like a body was dragged possibly unconscious)
Those plants were from 593 Brookfield Road, NOT Kholo Creek.
Lilly-pilly adjacent concrete apron near carport.
Chinese elm (one at back of rear patio, plus others)
Fishbone fern, back of rear patio and others along front concrete drive at front of residence.
Cats claw at front of residence. More at rear patio.
Crepe myrtle at rear patio and along concrete drive at front.
These observations are highly significant IMO.
All species are from the family home. And all are found on hair, arms and head.
And all from get-a-way area.
Sounds more like speedy drag away zone without compunction.

 

[Couldbe]

Plant matter on hair, arms and head.
(Sounds like a body was dragged possibly unconscious)
Those plants were from 593 Brookfield Road, NOT Kholo Creek.
Lilly-pilly adjacent concrete apron near carport.
Chinese elm (one at back of rear patio, plus others)
Fishbone fern, back of rear patio and others along front concrete drive at front of residence.

..... and LadyBird1, chipped tooth could have occurred then too.
Marlywings, in Hairdresser interview, yes note the CCTV comment (but no question actually recorded on what Allison might have been wearing!) Be interesting to have this clarified at the trial. Sounding to me like the Prosecution may be in possession of enough evidence required to put GBC behind bars for a very long time.

 

[Couldbe]

Mr Davis (for Defence) tendered a report to the court on a sampling of wheel arches of the Holden Captiva and clothing of Baden-Clay, including a pair of shoes, which showed no matches with soil samples taken from Kholo Creek.
If the Captiva had been hosed at the house (think I remember some earlier talk of the Captiva being seen across the road at the Showgrounds), there would surely have been the remains of the water left on the ground.
GBC's shoes ....... well did he wear socks with them? / was there any match with soil samples from anywhere?
I can imagine that it is important to find a link between GBC and Kholo Creek area, and his clothing didn't seem to provide that either.
......... did GBC provide the correct clothing/shoes to Detectives? One would think that, as alleged, he was involved in the actions of committing the crime, then he would avoid producing the clothing that he actually wore at the time anyway! Not sure what GBC was wearing when Police arrived, but having shaved etc, he may have also been dressed for work (which would be another odd thing..under the circumstances).

 

[Humdinger]

Mr Davis (for Defence) tendered a report to the court on a sampling of wheel arches of the Holden Captiva and clothing of Baden-Clay, including a pair of shoes, which showed no matches with soil samples taken from Kholo Creek.
If the Captiva had been hosed at the house (think I remember some earlier talk of the Captiva being seen across the road at the Showgrounds), there would surely have been the remains of the water left on the ground.
GBC's shoes ....... well did he wear socks with them? / was there any match with soil samples from anywhere?
I can imagine that it is important to find a link between GBC and Kholo Creek area, and his clothing didn't seem to provide that either.
......... did GBC provide the correct clothing/shoes to Detectives? One would think that, as alleged, he was involved in the actions of committing the crime, then he would avoid producing the clothing that he actually wore at the time anyway! Not sure what GBC was wearing when Police arrived, but having shaved etc, he may have also been dressed for work (which would be another odd thing..under the circumstances).

I recall that there were searches done on skip bins at local shops, but I cannot remember wether this was before or after Allison was found, I tend to think before. So I wonder if this was because of cars being seen on CCTV in that area?
I'm sure he dumped evidence somewhere, just like the phone...

 

[Couldbe]

I recall that there were searches done on skip bins at local shops, but I cannot remember wether this was before or after Allison was found, I tend to think before. So I wonder if this was because of cars being seen on CCTV in that area?
I'm sure he dumped evidence somewhere, just like the phone...

It was reported in the Media (on 11th day but before Allison's had been reported found) that he may have been asked to look at items found by search teams to determine whether they belonged to his wife.

............... I hope our discussions are not pertinent enough to jeopardise this case!

 

[Makara]

In a message posted by BrookieLocal she mentions that Allison was not wearing her walking clothes at the hairdressers.

[ame="http://www.websleuths.com/forums/showpost.php?p=7876968&postcount=447"]Websleuths Crime Sleuthing Community - View Single Post - Australia - Allison Baden-Clay, 43, Brisbane QLD, 19 April 2012 - #3[/ame]

05-06-2012, 02:41 PM

Hi everyone, first time poster but had read all previous threads.
My friend works at the Hair Salon in Kenmore Plaza (for non-locals it is not the shopping centre at the roundabout but about 1km down the road), she told me Allison had her hair done on Thursday evening. All the staff were questioned the following morning. They were asked what Allison's demeanor was, what she said, what was she wearing, what time did she leave. My friend said she was happy and relaxed. She was discussing the conference which she was attending the following day. It was with Pathways, she was training to become a Pathways facilitator (works with small groups of children or one-on-one). My friend also mentioned Allison said the girls were at a sleep-over at the in-laws and she had a "night off". I know this conflicts with other info. She was not wearing her walking clothes. I didn't ask her what time Allison left, I presumed it was before 8pm and that's why the police changed the times, perhaps 8pm was the last time someone else besides GB-C saw her.
The staff were also questioned the Tuesday after Allison's body was found, they were asked more specifically about any marks, bruises or scratches she had on her neck, chest, arms and hands.

BBM:

I recall that the reference to the Pathways conference did cause some confusion with us at the time. We now know that Allison was to attend a real estate conference. That's not to say that she didn't discuss Pathways with her hairdresser and perhaps the hairdresser was confused. I don't think that the hairdresser got it wrong about what Allison was wearing though.

The police would be fully aware of what Allison was wearing when she had her hair done. Whether or not that clothing was confiscated and examined will hopefully be revealed at the trial.

 

[Makara]

Thank you Marlywings
Unless the report is not all-encompassing, seems plant matter was found only found in Allison's hair, arms and around her head.
I do wonder why none was found stuck somewhere in her clothing or shoes.
Terrible thought, but maybe she was dragged by her feet/shoes, but one would still think the plant matter would have crept in between her trackie pants and the top she was wearing.
Just makes me think that the clothing was placed on Allison later; but still think Detectives would have been interested in the 'other clothing'/and if it was still there.

I've always been of the opinion that Allison's body was wrapped in a blanket, a tarpaulin or similar. Plant matter would not adhere to her lower body if this was the case.

 

[Couldbe]

I've always been of the opinion that Allison's body was wrapped in a blanket, a tarpaulin or similar. Plant matter would not adhere to her lower body if this was the case.

Makara, you could be right ....... but I am wondering why her head etc would be left exposed (a bit macabre to want to have her head exposed ... to see her face).

 

[Makara]

Makara, you could be right ....... but I am wondering why her head etc would be left exposed (a bit macabre to want to have her head exposed ... to see her face).

I was thinking Allison's body may have been wrapped so as to confine her arms and legs from flailing around and to make it easier to drag her body to the car. I really don't know the answer, just speculating I guess.

 

[possumheart]

It was reported in the Media (on 11th day but before Allison's had been reported found) that he may have been asked to look at items found by search teams to determine whether they belonged to his wife.

............... I hope our discussions are not pertinent enough to jeopardise this case!

I think that was later explained as an Ipswich Girls Grammar hat on a fence, or I am dreaming ...