Allison Baden-Clay - GENERAL DISCUSSION THREAD #47

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  • #301
  • #302
Alison took an anti malarial drug on their honeymoon in South America. She had a severe reaction to this which caused depression and psychotic episodes.

She was depressed and had panic attacks during the first pregnancy and was under the care of a ( ? Psychiatrist ) Dr George for the second pregnancy. At the time Gerard told Alison it was all in her head and to " get over it "

Alison made comment to Carmel Ritchie that she had spent the last 10 years saying she wasn't depressed.

Alison told Carmel Ritchie that 2 years ago on their wedding anniversary she surprised Gerard and asked him what was wrong with them. He replied he had had enough and wanted to leave. Alison told her she put this down to a mid life crisis.
 
  • #303
Alison went to counselling to basically try and improve herself, and for help with the difference in parenting to Gerard.

The first appointment was at the Spring Hill offffice of Relationships Australia on the 27th march.

Sometime during this appointment Carmel Ritchie said to Alison she was welcome to bring Gerard to an appointment if she wished. If he came , she told her, then she would take him aside for approx 30 minutes by himself and then see them together. Alison thanked her but said she didn't think he would come.

When Carmel Ritcjie saw Alison on the 16th April in the Kenmore office she had Gerard with her.

Carmel took him in to the consulting room by himself. She took a history from him about himself ( as she had done for Alison ) but most of the time was spent convincing him that he needed to allow Alison the time every second day to go over the affair. Gerard kept saying that he thought this was "regressing" ( his word, he used several times )

Carmel said that basically the whole session was taken up with Gerard. When she went to the waiting room to call Alison in she apologised but she said Alison's whole face lit up and she said she "was over the moon" she had spent so long with him.
 
  • #304
I agree with you Strangeworld-
On the opposite page the handwriting changes
the words there, according to police, are Gerard Baden-Clay's handwriting.

The page is a drawing showing the floor plan of his lover's home - sketched for an emotional wife desperate for answers.
An area of "bedroom one" has been circled.
The Crown says the drawing is significant. It is further proof, they say, that Allison and her husband were talking about the affair in the hours before her death.
The defence say the drawing is evidence she became so depressed, she took her own life.
http://www.couriermail.com.au/news/...-she-disappeared/story-e6freoof-1226537242449

Pease excuse me butting (I promised myself not to utter a peep until after Court today)
The drawing showing the floor plan, to me reads like more planted "evidence" by the accused to support the suicide theory. Was supposed to read like this.
"I, ABC, hereby declare that I know exactly what you are up to Mister. And right here in this bedroom; the bedroom belonging to that, that *!@* "piece" you promised me you weren't seeing anymore... you have been deceiving me. Well I DO know! And I hereby leave you this proof that I know. And I am so angry, that I am leaving. Goodbye."

And off she goes in a huff. Whereby something mysterious happens, and she is never seen alive again. Thus absolving him.

Well what GBC didn't take into account was that his own behaviour led others to believe there might have been something more sinister afoot.
The Diary upon examination by experts, was found to have been tampered with. Not all Allison's handwriting.
(Beats me why he didn't deal with it same as the mobile phone) However a bit of "real" hard evidence needed to left around, besides some empty Zoloft boxes.
And surely no-one will be able to tell the difference between Allison's writing and my (or who-ever else's) sketching.
 
  • #305
I thought Gerard was looking well today. He certainly had lost weight sice the committal hearing.
He walked in wearing a dark suit and glasses. He didn't look at the public gallery ( that I saw). He carried a few thick folders/ books in his arms.

I find it really hard to listen to Danny Boyle. He umms and arrhs his way through. Whereas the other side spoke clearly with no stumbling. Peter Shields is a snazzy looking character and I think if things had been different he is probably the sort of person that Gerard would like to hang around with. A smooth character.

There were members of Alison's family in court today. Front row. When proceedings started this morning one family member was quite annoyed with himself that he was too busy talking to look at Gerard when he walked in. He was asking those around him what he looked like. What expression he had on his face.

I saw none of the BC clan. I wonder if the new lawyers have put a stop to OW attending because of the circus she created last time.
 
  • #306
fanbloodytastic wewillgetyou

:yourock:
 
  • #307
Re Ladybirds post

What I took from listening to the counsellor today was that Alison didn't want to leave. She was there to make herself better, to try and change to make Gerard happy. She told the councillor that she took some blame for him having an affair.
 
  • #308
Alison went to counselling to basically try and improve herself, and for help with the difference in parenting to Gerard.

The first appointment was at the Spring Hill offffice of Relationships Australia on the 27th march.

Sometime during this appointment Carmel Ritchie said to Alison she was welcome to bring Gerard to an appointment if she wished. If he came , she told her, then she would take him aside for approx 30 minutes by himself and then see them together. Alison thanked her but said she didn't think he would come.

When Carmel Ritchie saw Alison on the 16th April in the Kenmore office she had Gerard with her.

Carmel took him in to the consulting room by himself. She took a history from him about himself ( as she had done for Alison ) but most of the time was spent convincing him that he needed to allow Alison the time every second day to go over the affair. Gerard kept saying that he thought this was "regressing" ( his word, he used several times )

Carmel said that basically the whole session was taken up with Gerard. When she went to the waiting room to call Alison in she apologised but she said Alison's whole face lit up and she said she "was over the moon" she had spent so long with him.

This 15minute venting is suggestive IMO of being a major part of a motive. I can't see it working for the defence.

The second 'venting' session on the 20th (THE night) would have followed the BBQ at NBC's and also after the conversation between Allison and OW. I think that was around 8:30pm.

Oh my, my, my - pride and lions.
 
  • #309
How could I forget what I thought was the funniest part of the day

Carmel Ritchie told the court that Gerard told her his grandfather was Lord Baden-Powell. Funny part was she almost forgot this and said it to the court almost as an after thought when questioned if the was anything else he had said to her.

I'll bet ol Gerard didn't like that ! :floorlaugh:

He also told her that he looks after his parents. Not sure in what context that is .....
 
  • #310
:winner:
Bloody marvelous Wewillgetyou....


I can see a :trainwreck: coming........
 
  • #311
Pretrial hearing is finished. Only Carmel Ritchie on today. She was a good witness. Softly spoken but very clear in her evidence. She spent most of second session on 16 april 2012 with gbc convincing him if he wanted to save his marriage he had to listen to Allisons pain for 10 to 15 mins every second day until next session. None was ever booked. He didnt want to talk about it as felt that was regressing over the past and he wanted to go forward. No non publicatication order so MSM will provide more details. There were no bombshells, Carmel said both of them said they wanted to work on their marriage. Most of the things Allison told her were as Allison had listed in her diary. Carmel said Allison told her she was over the moon that she had spent most of the hour session with g as the plan was half hour with him then half hour with both.
Thank you Alioop ..... your words that I have bolded spell out to me that Carmel Ritchie had notice that GBC appeared to lack 'empathy'.

Maybe she had quietly, in her head, profiled him as displaying narcissistic characteristics. If a followup visit had ever occurred, she would have been able to glean more about him. I would just imagine that, without just jumping to conclusions early in the piece, she would put 'two & two' together!
 
  • #312
How could I forget what I thought was the funniest part of the day

Carmel Ritchie told the court that Gerard told her his grandfather was Lord Baden-Powell. Funny part was she almost forgot this and said it to the court almost as an after thought when questioned if the was anything else he had said to her.

I'll bet ol Gerard didn't like that ! :floorlaugh:

He also told her that he looks after his parents. Not sure in what context that is .....

From my notes, it was Allison who told Carmel these things in the session on 27 March and he told Carmel on 16 April that he was Vice President of P&C, REIQ and a member of the chamber of commence.
 
  • #313
Alioop

I'm sure it was him who told her. At the beginning of his session when she asked for the snap shot of him in 60 seconds.
That's why I found it so funny, and even had a little giggle. I just thought bloody typical of this family who have to make sure everyone knows they are related to the great Lord Baden- Powell.

Alison's session was more about her.

Happy to be proven wrong though.
 
  • #314
Just remembered that Alison also told Carmel Ritchie that her father thought Gerard was controlling of her.

This came about because Gerard, Toni Mc and Alison's mother were all classed as a certain personality. High achievers etc

Alioop can you please explain that part if possible
 
  • #315
Maybe Allison and GBC both told her about lord BP and that he looked after his parents. It doesnt matter.
Will check my notes on the personality type and I need to google it as I have not heard the word before and dont know how to spell it.
 
  • #316
BN, WWGY and Alioop, THANK YOU.
 
  • #317
Just remembered that Alison also told Carmel Ritchie that her father thought Gerard was controlling of her.

This came about because Gerard, Toni Mc and Alison's mother were all classed as a certain personality. High achievers etc

Alioop can you please explain that part if possible

Ooops butting in again ..... Hard not to....


"Gerard, Toni Mc and Alison's mother were all classed as a certain personality."

You say that again! And they have certainly proved that! ..... As we have all learned of late. Beyond reasonable doubt, too.

And "his grandfather was Lord Baden-Powell!"
Well gee whiz and just fancy that and all!
Isn't that such an impressive piece of information!
Agree with your sense of humour.
(The word "Name dropper" springs to mind.)

Name Dropper: The term often connotes an attempt to impress others.


Name-dropping is used to position oneself within a social hierarchy. It is often used to create a sense of superiority by raising one's status.
By implying (or directly asserting) a connection to people of high status, the name-dropper hopes to raise his or her own social status to a level closer to that of those whose names he or she has dropped, and thus elevate himself or herself above, or into, present company.

From the Urban dictionary;
"A usually vain person who is severely insecure about his/her popularity/image, and must resort to the inclusion of names of the opposite sex and/or popular people who have little/no relevance to the conversation topic in order to achieve a self-gratifying level of social acceptance and/or ego boost. However, attempt to impress others with 'name-dropping' are quite easy to see through, and in turn, the person is seen as a complete w****r."

From me, Is any further proof required as to his character.
 
  • #318
Ooops butting in again ..... Hard not to....


"Gerard, Toni Mc and Alison's mother were all classed as a certain personality."

You say that again! And they have certainly proved that! ..... As we have all learned of late. Beyond reasonable doubt, too.

And "his grandfather was Lord Baden-Powell!"
Well gee whiz and just fancy that and all!
Isn't that such an impressive piece of information!
Agree with your sense of humour.
(The word "Name dropper" springs to mind.)

Name Dropper: The term often connotes an attempt to impress others.


Name-dropping is used to position oneself within a social hierarchy. It is often used to create a sense of superiority by raising one's status.
By implying (or directly asserting) a connection to people of high status, the name-dropper hopes to raise his or her own social status to a level closer to that of those whose names he or she has dropped, and thus elevate himself or herself above, or into, present company.

From the Urban dictionary;
"A usually vain person who is severely insecure about his/her popularity/image, and must resort to the inclusion of names of the opposite sex and/or popular people who have little/no relevance to the conversation topic in order to achieve a self-gratifying level of social acceptance and/or ego boost. However, attempt to impress others with 'name-dropping' are quite easy to see through, and in turn, the person is seen as a complete w****r."

From me, Is any further proof required as to his character.

Thanks LadyBird and you are not butting in. You're contributing to the conversation.
 
  • #319
Thanks LadyBird and you are not butting in. You're contributing to the conversation.

Heh heh! Thanks Makara. Might save alioop having to google up the personality type.
 
  • #320
Thanks Ali. Wow. Absolutely don't want to blame the counsellor, but can you imagine what GBC must have felt like to not only agree to this (obviously he didn't because it took a session to convince him), but what it would have felt like for anyone to have sit and listen like that.

-couples therapy should be that - not just one-way talking
-if you need a whole session to convince a client to do something, why on earth would you do it in this situation. GBC was a client as much as Allison was.
-I think GBC would have been steaming mad to have been forced to agree to something like this
-if the counsellor really thought this was a good idea, it should have been done in the confines of the session. What made her think Allison had the strength and GBC had the restraint for this to work

I really do want to say again I don't blame the counsellor at all for any of this. I just think it was an ill-conceived exercise IMO. Can't wait to read the MSM articles.

Strangeworld, I totally agree with you. I don't want to blame the counsellor either, however I think this was an inappropriate 'homework' exercise to set on the first meeting with GBC - she had seen ABC on 27 Mar 2012 by herself. Maybe this is why the counsellor stood behind the confidentiality clause when she did.

Yes, imagine GBC 'listening to how Allison feels' for even a minute.

ABC who had some psychology training, talked of GBC's choleric temperament. Here's some reading on it.

http://temperaments.fighunter.com/?page=choleric
 
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